M17/M18 - Gort to Tuam [open to traffic]

Sam Russell · 05-06-2019 6:33pm

serfboard wrote: »

It doesn't.

Critics, including those on this thread, could, if they were bothered, look up the road statistics, which can be found here.

And what those will tell you is that eleven thousand vehicles a day are using the M17 (and on Fridays that goes to over fourteen thousand).

So eleven thousand vehicles are using the road every day, but, because we don't see them in the photos, the road is empty ... :rolleyes:

Looking at those statistics, 8,000 on the M17 at Corofin and 11,000 on the old N17 adjacent to that. (The 11,000 figure relates to just North of the M6 at Athenry.) Compares with 40,000 at Dunkettle and 20,000 at Athenry on the East sied of the M6.

Less than 45% of drivers are using the M17 vs those still using the old N17. (8,000 vs 11,000 of 19,000).

South of Ennis its 28,000, and after the Shannon turn off, its 38,000.

The further south you go, the more users. Think how many would be on the M20 from Limerick to Cork if it had been built.

Kevwoody · 05-06-2019 11:36pm

Sam Russell wrote:

The further south you go, the more users. Think how many would be on the M20 from Limerick to Cork if it had been built.

Can we please give this a rest?

Sam Russell · 06-06-2019 9:19am

Consider the topic closed. It is built now and is a good piece of infrastructure.

Lord Glentoran · 06-06-2019 10:02pm

Sam Russell wrote: »

Consider the topic closed. It is built now and is a good piece of infrastructure.

Looks great. Not much wear on it but a nice little earner for those who sold the land, and for those who supplied the materials, and for those who built it. #ModernOutdoorRelief

red bull · 06-06-2019 11:59pm

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

Looks great. Not much wear on it but a nice little earner for those who sold the land, and for those who supplied the materials, and for those who built it. #ModernOutdoorRelief

Is that not true about all infrastructure in Ireland. I'm from Tuam area and travel regularly to both Limerick and Dublin it's a Godsend. I do agree a motorway is needed from Limerick to Cork so we are all connected

JCX BXC · 07-06-2019 12:20am

red bull wrote: »

Is that not true about all infrastructure in Ireland. I'm from Tuam area and travel regularly to both Limerick and Dublin it's a Godsend. I do agree a motorway is needed from Limerick to Cork so we are all connected

I don't want to venture on about the subject particularly as it's been done to death, yes it is great for you and the northwest in general for those who wish to travel south, however it's benefit for Galway-Limerick traffic, arguably the main reason for building the road, is fairly negligible and certainly not a good return for the enormous cost of the motorway. Good example of modern planning. If it has been built even 10km to the west of where it is now it would be much better.

07-06-2019 4:16am

JCX BXC wrote: »

it's benefit for Galway-Limerick traffic, arguably the main reason for building the road, is fairly negligible and certainly not a good return for the enormous cost of the motorway.

Show us the numbers behind that statement so we can all judge

JCX BXC wrote: »

If it has been built even 10km to the west of where it is now it would be much better.

This old chestnut

If it had, as you say, been built 10km closer to the city it would have ended up snarled up with traffic at the city exit. One only needs to look at the several km long tailbacks from Coolagh to the Oranmore exit to see this.

Putting it further out means it acts as it should, as part of the national motorway network and not simply a dual carriageway designed to fail with gummed up junctions due to being too close to the city

AugustusMinimus · 07-06-2019 7:16am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Show us the numbers behind that statement so we can all judge

This old chestnut

If it had, as you say, been built 10km closer to the city it would have ended up snarled up with traffic at the city exit. One only needs to look at the several km long tailbacks from Coolagh to the Oranmore exit to see this.

Putting it further out means it acts as it should, as part of the national motorway network and not simply a dual carriageway designed to fail with gummed up junctions due to being too close to the city

It wouldn’t have got snarled with traffic if they’d built a proper junction like a partially unrolled cloverleaf.

Building it where they did is a shocking error and post build traffic levels clearly demonstrate this.

irishgrover · 07-06-2019 7:54am

AugustusMinimus wrote:

It wouldnâ€™t have got snarled with traffic if theyâ€™d built a proper junction like a partially unrolled cloverleaf.

It does not matter how efficient the end junction if there is no where for the traffic to go. It's not like there is congestion at the junction. The traffic from the junction is hitting an already fully saturated road system

dubhthach · 07-06-2019 11:06am

Lord Glentoran wrote: »

Looks great. Not much wear on it but a nice little earner for those who sold the land, and for those who supplied the materials, and for those who built it. #ModernOutdoorRelief

Sure wasn't Ardnacrusha basically 'Outdoor relief' in the 1920's. Still operational 90 years later, now that's return on investment. It only cost the equivalent to an entire year's of Government expenditure in a period after a civil war which cause huge economic disruption (I imagine there would be blue murder if a modern Gov was to propose equivalent of 2018 spending on one project -- €73.9billion)

Likewise all of these motorways will still be in use (though with patching/maintenance) in the next 50-100 years. If anything with self-driving vehicles they'll probably will end up with lot higher capacity than originally designed for.

m17 · 07-06-2019 7:26pm

The start of the new m18 at gort 06/06/19

m17 · 07-06-2019 11:05pm

Sam Russell wrote: »

Consider the topic closed. It is built now and is a good piece of infrastructure.

This topic will never be closed as I'm still alive

red bull · 08-06-2019 1:16am

It's only starting a long life I hope

Sam Russell · 08-06-2019 10:36am

m17 wrote: »

This topic will never be closed as I'm still alive

The topic I'm referring to is whether it should have been built. It is built so that topic is closed. Of course, M17, I wish you a long life. Perhaps you might post a few images of the M17 when it is busy, if it ever is.

m17 · 13-06-2019 7:04pm

The m6 5 kms form rathmorrisy 23/05/19

13/06/19

road_high · 08-09-2019 12:26am

Really impressed with the new M17- I happened to be up in mayo lately and coming home via the N17/M17 was a boon- great road and really well finished. Just a shame they didn’t extend the Mway all around Tuam rather than cheaper 2+2. Was able to take the N17 and M17 from Claremorris and onto the M6 and back over to Ballinasloe and back down to Kilkenny. Roll on more upgrades as they’re such a transformation

m17 · 08-09-2019 9:38pm

road_high wrote: »

Really impressed with the new M17- I happened to be up in mayo lately and coming home via the N17/M17 was a boon- great road and really well finished. Just a shame they didn’t extend the Mway all around Tuam rather than cheaper 2+2. Was able to take the N17 and M17 from Claremorris and onto the M6 and back over to Ballinasloe and back down to Kilkenny. Roll on more upgrades as they’re such a transformation

It's hard to believe it's open 2 years in 2 weeks time driving tuam to limerick is a god sent

serfboard · 09-09-2019 5:08pm

road_high wrote: »

Just a shame they didn’t extend the Mway all around Tuam rather than cheaper 2+2.

I have less of a problem with that than I do with the goddamned roundabout they put in at the Tuam South exit, forcing traffic travelling @ 120 km/h to slow down to zero in some cases.

It might be justifiable at the northern end where the road is changing from a 2+2 to a 2-lane road but at the Southern end ...

wotzgoingon · 09-09-2019 6:03pm

serfboard wrote: »

I have less of a problem with that than I do with the goddamned roundabout they put in at the Tuam South exit, forcing traffic travelling @ 120 km/h to slow down to zero in some cases.

It might be justifiable at the northern end where the road is changing from a 2+2 to a 2-lane road but at the Southern end ...

I agree, there should have been a fly over.

m17 · 09-09-2019 8:16pm

The m17 09/09/19

It's nearly open 2 years and on L925 on sign

m17 · 27-09-2019 3:54pm

This day 2 years ago just before opening

Truckermal · 27-09-2019 4:38pm

Imagine I spent years going through all those bottlenecks and I've never used the new road yet!

m17 · 27-09-2019 5:14pm

The m17 at corofin 27/09/19

29-09-2019 4:36pm

Full story here https://galwaydaily.com/news/three-weeks-of-motorway-roadworks-begin-tomorrow/

Three weeks of motorway roadworks begin tomorrow

Roadworks on the M17 motorway expected to last for three weeks will get underway on Monday.
Single lane closures on the southbound lane of the M17 motorway between Annagh Hill (Junction 19) and Rathmorrisey Interchange (Junction 18) are planned foe the duration of the works.

The hard-shoulder and Lane 1 will be closed to facilitate new drainage works (between marker posts S 8.0 and S 7.5).

03-10-2019 9:01pm

I didn't realize this was not tolled.

Why is that, when it was a PPP project?

m17 · 03-10-2019 9:35pm

salonfire wrote: »

I didn't realize this was not tolled.

Why is that, when it was a PPP project?

The new ross bypass is also a ppp which is opening in November and that is not tolled

Sam Russell · 03-10-2019 10:15pm

Tolling on low usage motorways is not much use as the tolls do not raise the minimum to satisfy the PPP payback, so the taxpayer stumps up the difference.

This is true of the Waterford toll, the Limerick tunnel, and the M3 one. So why waste money collecting not enough? Plus they are not popular with voters.

L1011 · 04-10-2019 7:27am

There is no taxpayer subvention on Waterford and the M3 is now at a traffic level that is unsubsidised

Sam Russell · 04-10-2019 10:27am

L1011 wrote: »

There is no taxpayer subvention on Waterford and the M3 is now at a traffic level that is unsubsidised

Good to know that. The M17 and M18 could not sustain a toll regime. The Naas dual carriage way, (Irelands first motorway), later to be the M7, was originally to be tolled but that idea was dropped as political suicide.

The Swiss system is better where you buy a carnet which is attached to your windscreen and that entitles the car to use all motorways - and that applies to foreign vehicles as well. It is about €50 and lasts from Nov for 16 months (I think) and penalties are huge.

Having people sit in a little shed collecting pennies is or the birds.

Geuze · 07-10-2019 9:34am

salonfire wrote: »

I didn't realize this was not tolled.

Why is that, when it was a PPP project?

Isn't there a shadow toll on the M17?

m17 · 07-10-2019 9:43am

Geuze wrote: »

Isn't there a shadow toll on the M17?

They are no shadow tolls in ireland there is a few in the UK they more vehicles use it the payments lower

m17 · 07-10-2019 11:31am

Rathmorrisy 27/09/15

27/07/19

dinneenp · 22-10-2019 9:05am

From Claregalway exit to Tuam is fairly bendy. What's the reason for this? Hardly a strategy for reduced speed?
Also, anyone confirm the speed limit on this section-100 or 120?
Thanks,
Pa

BelfastVanMan · 22-10-2019 9:12am

dinneenp wrote: »

From Claregalway exit to Tuam is fairly bendy. What's the reason for this? Hardly a strategy for reduced speed?
Also, anyone confirm the speed limit on this section-100 or 120?
Thanks,
Pa

120. As the signs says.

serfboard · 22-10-2019 11:23am

dinneenp wrote: »

From Claregalway exit to Tuam is fairly bendy. What's the reason for this?

I'm only guessing here, but part of that bendiness comes around Corofin, where they had to do a fair amount of blasting to clear a path for the road. Possibly an alternative would have involved even more work/cost.

Further on, the road skirts around housing, so I'd guess the less CPOing and possible delays in court, the better. Look what's happening with the M20, for God's sake.

In both scenarios above the answer is the same - it's the path of least resistance for the road, either due to ground conditions, or for legal reasons.

m17 · 24-10-2019 6:46pm

Illegal dumping poses flood threat to motorway

Today's tuam herald

m17 · 18-12-2019 8:22pm

As of this morning they have opened the 2 lay bys 1 on the m18 2 kms north of exit 17 and 1 on the m17 2 kms north of exit 19

serfboard · 02-01-2020 8:35pm

The start of the new year is a good time to look at usage on this road.

From 2018 to 2019, traffic on the upper part of the M17 was up by 250 vehicles, or 2.75%, from 8,954 to 9,200.

Meanwhile, traffic on the lower part jumped by 1,000 vehicles, or 9%, from 10,582 to 11,526.

Meanwhile, for the M18, traffic on the upper part (after Kilternan) increased by 800 or so vehicles, a 7.5% increase, from 10,798 to 11,617.

The lower part saw a traffic increase of over 1,000 vehicles, or 8.5%, from 12,404 to 13,464.

Meanwhile the M6 near the Oranmore junction is just shy of 30K vehicles, having seen a 4.3% increase of 1,233 vehicles from 28,753 to 29,986.

Also:

The Connacht Tribune wrote:

The average daily volume of traffic on [Galway] city’s road network is more than 120,000

serfboard · 02-01-2020 8:44pm

serfboard wrote: »

Meanwhile, traffic on the lower part jumped by 1,000 vehicles, or 9%, from 10,582 to 11,526.

By the way, the 2019 number of 11,526 means that the Southern section of the M17 is busier than one of the sections of the M7 (J19->J21).

Admittedly the quietest section, but still ...

irishgeo · 27-01-2020 11:13am

Is there a problem with the surface. Everytime there is hail shower it seems to cause no end of accidents .

27-01-2020 11:48pm

irishgeo wrote: »

Is there a problem with the surface. Everytime there is hail shower it seems to cause no end of accidents .

Yeah, there's hail on the surface and drivers don't adjust their speed to compensate for the little ice marbles between their tyres and the surface

Simples!

flazio · 28-01-2020 7:07am

There's not a lot that can be done to keep motorways up to high speed in hail conditions. It's not the same as snow.

Sam Russell · 28-01-2020 11:44am

flazio wrote: »

There's not a lot that can be done to keep motorways up to high speed in hail conditions. It's not the same as snow.

Or it is the same as snow. It is dangerous to drive fast in either condition.

As an aside, snow should be considered in two categories - snow above minus approx seven and snow below minus seven degrees. The first is very slippery while the second is hard. The driving techniques required are not the same, but keeping a steady low speed and keeping back from the vehicle in front works for both. It is very rare in Ireland to get the second type - but we did get it in 2010.

Reuben1210 · 30-01-2020 1:14am

Sam Russell wrote: »

Or it is the same as snow. It is dangerous to drive fast in either condition.

As an aside, snow should be considered in two categories - snow above minus approx seven and snow below minus seven degrees. The first is very slippery while the second is hard. The driving techniques required are not the same, but keeping a steady low speed and keeping back from the vehicle in front works for both. It is very rare in Ireland to get the second type - but we did get it in 2010.

Centigrade or Fahrenheit because it doesn't really snow below 0 centigrade

wotzgoingon · 30-01-2020 1:28am

Reuben1210 wrote: »

Centigrade or Fahrenheit because it doesn't really snow below 0 centigrade

Wrong if it is damp it can snow at really cold temperatures but if it can get too dry to snow.

Sam Russell · 30-01-2020 11:17am

Reuben1210 wrote: »

Centigrade or Fahrenheit because it doesn't really snow below 0 centigrade

Centigrade. I am talking about the temperature of the snow.

Frozen water, ice or snow, at a temperature just below zero Celsius, will melt under pressure. The pressure exerted by a vehicle will melt snow when it is up to -7 degrees C. That is why ice and snow is slippy at these temperatures, and why ice skaters can skate.

Below minus 7 C, the ice remains frozen and it is like concrete. This is why snowmobiles work.

Bit of physics there. Hope you enjoyed it.

JCX BXC · 30-01-2020 11:28am

Reuben1210 wrote: »

Centigrade or Fahrenheit because it doesn't really snow below 0 centigrade

It can snow up to 4°c, even 5°c in the right conditions. Anyway I'm not sure OP is talking about air temperature, more the temperature of the snow itself.

Sam Russell · 30-01-2020 2:38pm

JCX BXC wrote: »

It can snow up to 4°c, even 5°c in the right conditions. Anyway I'm not sure OP is talking about air temperature, more the temperature of the snow itself.

It is the temperature of the snow. If it snows above zero, the snow will turn to slush. It will only settle when the ground is cold enough, and then it is extremely dangerous with snow on top of slush.

JCX BXC · 30-01-2020 3:25pm

Hail is also a big issue, especially along the section between crusheen and gort. Drivers really struggle to adjust to these conditions.

sondagefaux · 30-01-2020 10:37pm

JCX BXC wrote: »

Hail is also a big issue, especially along the section between crusheen and gort. Drivers really struggle to adjust to these conditions.

Slowing down usually works.

M17/M18 - Gort to Tuam [open to traffic]

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