Arcade & Retro Repairs & Mods, all new recipe, with no added MSG...

o1s1n · 13-08-2014 11:13am

Would be checking voltage first before going to chips.

What's the board? Does it have loads of chips? Might require a little extra voltage to get working.

The Last Bandit · 13-08-2014 11:21am

Get familiar with romident, it will tell you what romset a file corresponds too.

http://romident.coinopflorida.com/

Also you need a eprom eraser and a couple of dead boards make great donors for eproms.

The Mame roms contain the files you'll need to burn, the file name of the rom usually indicates which chip on the board it is. But sometimes the romset holds files for different variants as well.

Looking at the Mame driver source code is handy as well to identify what roms hold what information. For example here the CPS1 driver code
http://mamedev.org/source/src/mame/drivers/cps1.c.html

ROM_START( ghoulsu )
3635 ROM_REGION( CODE_SIZE, "maincpu", 0 )
3636 ROM_LOAD16_BYTE( "dmu_29.10h", 0x00000, 0x20000, CRC(334d85b2) SHA1(89bacc28b7c799c7568420e3de5a99060baa7b0f) )
3637 ROM_LOAD16_BYTE( "dmu_30.10j", 0x00001, 0x20000, CRC(cee8ceb5) SHA1(fc8db1ce0c143dfda0b5989d02d5e5a872e27cd2) )
3638 ROM_LOAD16_BYTE( "dmu_27.9h", 0x40000, 0x20000, CRC(4a524140) SHA1(cebd651293c3570912d5506c1c223c39bcccc802) )
3639 ROM_LOAD16_BYTE( "dmu_28.9j", 0x40001, 0x20000, CRC(94aae205) SHA1(514b3c1b9b0b22300a94229825c3be66332ea5ed) )
3640 ROM_LOAD16_WORD( "dm-17.7j", 0x80000, 0x80000, CRC(3ea1b0f2) SHA1(c51f1c38cdaed77ad715cedd845617a291ab2441) )
3641
3642 ROM_REGION( 0x300000, "gfx", 0 )
3643 ROMX_LOAD( "dm-05.3a", 0x000000, 0x80000, CRC(0ba9c0b0) SHA1(c4945b603115f32b7346d72426571dc2d361159f) , ROM_GROUPWORD | ROM_SKIP(6) )
3644 ROMX_LOAD( "dm-07.3f", 0x000002, 0x80000, CRC(5d760ab9) SHA1(212176947933fcfef991bc80ad5bd91718689ffe) , ROM_GROUPWORD | ROM_SKIP(6) )
3645 ROMX_LOAD( "dm-06.3c", 0x000004, 0x80000, CRC(4ba90b59) SHA1(35bc9dec5ddbf064c30c951627581c16764456ac) , ROM_GROUPWORD | ROM_SKIP(6) )
3646 ROMX_LOAD( "dm-08.3g", 0x000006, 0x80000, CRC(4bdee9de) SHA1(7d0c4736f16577afe9966447a18f039728f6fbdf) , ROM_GROUPWORD | ROM_SKIP(6) )

You can see that rom dmu_29.10h holds data for the main cpu so is most likely related to the game engine and is located on the PCB at grid "29 10h". Whereas dm-05.3a holds graphics data so not much point messing with it if its a sound problem for example.

Optimus Prime · 13-08-2014 11:25am

o1s1n wrote: »

Would be checking voltage first before going to chips.

What's the board? Does it have loads of chips? Might require a little extra voltage to get working.

The board i have is a Mortal Kombat 2, I have two of them, one working one not in the same cab so i dont think its related to the power its getting as the other one wouldnt work either.

The Last Bandit wrote: »

Get familiar with romident, it will tell you what romset a file corresponds too.

Looks like ive a lot of learning to do! ill wait until i get the thing, as i find it easy to learn stuff when i messing about with it.

The eeprom writer you linked to doesnt wipe the roms does it not? can you recommend an eraser?

o1s1n · 13-08-2014 11:28am

keithgeo wrote: »

The board i have is a Mortal Kombat 2, I have two of them, one working one not in the same cab so i dont think its related to the power its getting as the other one wouldnt work either.

Does the board just 100% refuse to boot? So a black screen.

Might just be a broken trace somewhere.

If you have two of the same board then you are in an opportune position if you ever want to check if it's chip issues - just swap them out from the working board one at a time to the broken board. You can then isolate the dodgy chip.

Have you tried reseating the socketed chips? You can get oxidation building up on the legs/contacts which can cause issues.

Optimus Prime · 13-08-2014 11:33am

o1s1n wrote: »

Does the board just 100% refuse to boot? So a black screen.

Might just be a broken trace somewhere.

If you have two of the same board then you are in an opportune position if you ever want to check if it's chip issues - just swap them out from the working board one at a time to the broken board. You can then isolate the dodgy chip.

Have you tried reseating the socketed chips? You can get oxidation building up on the legs/contacts which can cause issues.

Never thought of switching the chips over! Would that damage the working chips if something major was wrong?

There is nothing on screen when i switch it on, there is a light on the board a red one.. but honestly right now i cant remember if that comes on when powered up. ill have to check that again first.

The Last Bandit · 13-08-2014 11:33am

keithgeo wrote: »

The eeprom writer you linked to doesnt wipe the roms does it not? can you recommend an eraser?

You'll need a UV eraser for the Eproms, I got one of these cheap ones and its fine.

Optimus Prime · 13-08-2014 11:35am

The Last Bandit wrote: »

You'll need a UV eraser for the Eproms, I got one of these cheap ones and its fine.

Thanks a lot!

o1s1n · 13-08-2014 11:46am

keithgeo wrote: »

Never thought of switching the chips over! Would that damage the working chips if something major was wrong?

There is nothing on screen when i switch it on, there is a light on the board a red one.. but honestly right now i cant remember if that comes on when powered up. ill have to check that again first.

Yeah, if it's completely blank then it could still be something up with the voltage.

The boards I've had with dodgy chips (but powered up fine) always had something on the screen, just some part of the image was garbled. (so whatever chip had that data or processor handled it was borked)

Worst case scenario, one of the non socketed chips like the processor/RAM could be gone bad.

Actually you know what, a better way of testing your chips would be to put the bad ones into the working board.

If the working board powers up fine as usual, you know all the chips are good in one go without having to test each one.

CathalDublin · 13-08-2014 12:11pm

I've had boards not show any signs of power when a rom or multiple rom's were bad, same when rams were dead, every board's different.
Here's a handy site rom checking your read rom files
http://romident.ki4swy.org/

Optimus Prime · 13-08-2014 10:51pm

The Last Bandit wrote: »

I've a GQ-4X programmer and its decent. Will program most arcade stuff, might have difficult with some oddball PAL & GAL chips but will definitely do the majority of EPROMs you're likely to use.

Hey, quick one, did you buy that from the US? cant seem to find it anywhere in europe for sale, trying to avoid getting stung on import tax.

The Last Bandit · 13-08-2014 10:57pm

I got it from the UK (Ebay), ya you'll probably get hit with tax alright for the US and I assume Canada is as bad.

Stick a wanted ad on J+, someone there might be flogging one ?

Optimus Prime · 13-08-2014 10:59pm

Ill try that thanks a lot

Optimus Prime · 13-08-2014 11:07pm

Hey is this the one?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=310531715847&fromMakeTrack=true&ssPageName=VIP:watchlink:top:en

Its just there is another one listed in the UK that looks that same but for some reason is nearly 400 sterling!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TRUE-USB-GQ-4X-EEPROM-FLASH-CHIP-PROGRAMMER-SUPPORTS-ALL-WILLEM-ZIF-ADAPTERS-/121002488901?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c2c4f7445

CathalDublin · 13-08-2014 11:09pm

That's the one I've got, burning anything I throw at it, that one for €400 is the same, I'd imagine the seller has no more in stock and is avoiding the relisting fees

The Last Bandit · 13-08-2014 11:11pm

keithgeo wrote: »

Hey is this the one?

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=310531715847&fromMakeTrack=true&ssPageName=VIP:watchlink:top:en

Its just there is another one listed in the UK that looks that same but for some reason is nearly 400 sterling!

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TRUE-USB-GQ-4X-EEPROM-FLASH-CHIP-PROGRAMMER-SUPPORTS-ALL-WILLEM-ZIF-ADAPTERS-/121002488901?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c2c4f7445

Yep that's the one. Fair play to yer man if he gets 400 for it !!!

Optimus Prime · 13-08-2014 11:19pm

haha ill send him a message that cant be right!

Optimus Prime · 14-08-2014 9:27pm

He got back to me anyways and you where right they where out of stock, but he got more back in today and reduced down the price to £79 with free shipping. so just bought one, i bought the eeprom eraser too thanks a lot for the info.

I just bought WWF Wrestlefest off ebay, working with a graphics issue for 17euro including delivery, so ill practice trying to fix that when it arrives!

Loved that game in the arcade too so it was on my list of Gets!

Steve X2 · 14-08-2014 9:40pm

Can I phoenix my CPS2 games with one of those?

I'd send them off to Razoola to be done but I've a load of them and it'd cost a fortune to get them all done. If this did the job I could slowly work my way through them myself.

Steve X2 · 14-08-2014 10:26pm

Is the Antex XS25 Soldering Iron any good? I need to do some soldering and am ordering some Raspberry Pi bits and they also sell these for £20 sterling.

Worth getting?

The Last Bandit · 14-08-2014 10:47pm

That's a pretty high thermal capacity iron , very good for tinning cables or working on larger components attached to ground planes. Very good general purpose iron.
But you may be better off with the CS18, not as hot so less like to overheat components and its a slightly smaller iron and I find it a lot more comfortable to use on tighter fine pitch stuff.

No harm in getting both

Doge · 15-08-2014 7:41am

Steve SI wrote: »

Is the Antex XS25 Soldering Iron any good? I need to do some soldering and am ordering some Raspberry Pi bits and they also sell these for £20 sterling.

Worth getting?

Have you not got one already?

This is a 60w soldering station and its cheaper than the antex one you linked to....

http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/uh_viewItem.asp?idProduct=32515

CathalDublin · 15-08-2014 9:26am

I find the antex irons great, I've the 15,18 and 25w versions, the tips are excellent and really easy to work with too, although the xs25 tends to burn the tips pretty quickly if they are left on for more than about 5minutes.

Myrddin · 15-08-2014 9:27am

CathalDublin wrote: »

I find the antex irons great, I've the 15,18 and 25w versions, the tips are excellent and really easy to work with too, although the xs25 tends to burn the tips pretty quickly if they are left on for more than about 5minutes.

Same here, have used small watt Antex irons for years & they've served me extremely well. From building superguns to console modding, they're perfect for the job

CathalDublin · 15-08-2014 9:40am

When I worked in Peats(components) back in the day almost every time I seen someone make a balls of soldering something they'd used a cheap soldering iron from the pound shop with this great big ass chrome tip on it.
We'd have people come in, be recommended the Antex cs18 Iron for £25-£30 at the time, the buyer would return shortly after the sale saying they found this one in the pound shop across the road and want to return the our "expensive" one, the next day they'd come back with their tail between their legs and a destroyed circuit board looking for advice on how to fix it

Steve X2 · 15-08-2014 9:48am

I've gone for the XS25 from that site with a bunch of accessories. It'll be fine for what I need to do next week. My old one is a heap of crap so this has to be better:)
If I need a lower power one I can get it later.
I just need to do a bit of soldering on the raspberry pi and some extra boards for it but its not super fine soldering. I might need the lower power version for the Sega Nomad and Game Gear mods I've planned.

Jack burton · 15-08-2014 9:53am

Need a new one myself, need it for general use aswell as pinball machine. Antex cs18 the way to go?

Myrddin · 15-08-2014 9:54am

Jack burton wrote: »

Need a new one myself, need it for general use aswell as pinball machine. Antex cs18 the way to go?

Have you paid your dues Jack?

Jack burton · 15-08-2014 9:56am

Yes sir, the check is in the mail! *takes a bit out of an savage looking roll*

The Last Bandit · 15-08-2014 9:59am

Jack burton wrote: »

Need a new one myself, need it for general use aswell as pinball machine. Antex cs18 the way to go?

Probably not, I'd imagine a lot of the pinball stuff would be electromechanical stuff like solenoids & relays so you'd be better off with a hotter iron like the XS25 for that.

Jack burton · 15-08-2014 10:02am

The Last Bandit wrote: »

Probably not, I'd imagine a lot of the pinball stuff would be electromechanical stuff like solenoids & relays so you'd be better off with a hotter iron like the XS25 for that.

Yeah? I thought id be grand since I'd just have to solder any new parts through the connectors already on them

eg

Sure I'll go for the hotter one, thanks

MrVestek · 15-08-2014 10:03am

CathalDublin wrote: »

When I worked in Peats(components) back in the day almost every time I seen someone make a balls of soldering something they'd used a cheap soldering iron from the pound shop with this great big ass chrome tip on it.
We'd have people come in, be recommended the Antex cs18 Iron for £25-£30 at the time, the buyer would return shortly after the sale saying they found this one in the pound shop across the road and want to return the our "expensive" one, the next day they'd come back with their tail between their legs and a destroyed circuit board looking for advice on how to fix it

When did you work in Peats just out of curiosity? Former Peats veteran here too.

CathalDublin · 15-08-2014 10:26am

2000/1ish-2002 upstairs in the old building next store to Bennys

Optimus Prime · 15-08-2014 3:16pm

Hey Couple more questions on the GQ-4X, ive been looking at a couple of vids on youtube on how to use it.

Seems to have an erase button on it for erasing the stuff on the chips, does the UV drawer do a better job or erasing them or something?

Also it mentions on the vid that some chips require you plug in an external psu for extra power, I dont think that comes with it, any ideas whats needed there, is this thing running off US power or will an adapter from here work?

Thanks

The Last Bandit · 15-08-2014 3:23pm

You've different types of programmable ROMs'.

EEPROM - electrically erasable: These ones can be wiped using the programmer
EPROM - UV erasable: These ones can only be erased with UV light and have the little glass windows on them.

EPROM are much cheaper so that's what you are most likely to find on PCB's.

It takes a 9V DC supply, can't remember the jack size or polarity off hand but I've used an console power supply on mine before. Possibly Megadrive or Jaguar one ?

Optimus Prime · 15-08-2014 3:24pm

The Last Bandit wrote: »

You've different types of programmable ROMs'.

EEPROM - electrically erasable: These ones can be wiped using the programmer
EPROM - UV erasable: These ones can only be erased with UV light and have the little glass windows on them.

EPROM are much cheaper so that's what you are most likely to find on PCB's.

It takes a 9V DC supply, can't remember the jack size or polarity off hand but I've used an console power supply on mine before. Possibly Megadrive or Jaguar one ?

aha thanks, always wondered what those windows where for! Makes sense.

Thats grand, sure ill have a read of the instructions when it arrives might say what supply it needs in there.

o1s1n · 15-08-2014 3:35pm

I used to call them EEPROMs, but then noticed everyone else was saying EPROMS - so dropped an 'E'.

Didn't know there were two different types

MrVestek · 15-08-2014 3:36pm

CathalDublin wrote: »

2000/1ish-2002 upstairs in the old building next store to Bennys

Ahh, I was circa 2004 / 2006. Just missed ya by a year or two!

If you ever turn up at a beers I'm sure we could have some very... interesting conversations about the place. :P

Star Lord · 15-08-2014 3:58pm

o1s1n wrote: »

...so dropped an 'E'.

CathalDublin · 15-08-2014 4:20pm

is eeprom not eprom no matter how many e's you're on?

Steve X2 · 15-08-2014 4:23pm

o1s1n wrote: »

- so dropped an 'E'.

CiDeRmAn · 15-08-2014 5:07pm

Steve SI wrote: »

Some see that and think "Scooooteeeerrr!"
I'm that bit older so it's "Aceeeiiiddd!"

Star Lord · 15-08-2014 5:35pm

CiDeRmAn wrote: »

Some see that and think "Scooooteeeerrr!"
I'm that bit older so it's "Aceeeiiiddd!"

o1s1n · 16-08-2014 11:08pm

I've had a new 72 pin connector for my nes for 4 years now, but never got around to installing it due to not having any screwdrivers long enough to open the NES up.

That changed this evening.

Was in Aldi buying some cheapo beers and they were selling extra long screwdrivers. Finally! Time to get my NES going again.

Opened her up, popped the new 72 pin in. Really easy to do.

Reassembled it, noticed two extra screws. WTF?

Then looked over on the sofa and saw the shielding. God damn it!

Back out come the screws...

Optimus Prime · 17-08-2014 12:08am

haha ive done that before with a NES Myself!!

I just bought a bootleg bubble bobble off ebay to go with wwf wrestlefest to try out on the eprom writer. it has no sound, im going to try put those Bubble Bobble redux roms on it to make it play like the original, the price of bootleg BBs has gone up since the Redux was released.

o1s1n · 17-08-2014 3:54pm

Hah! Yeah there's that moment where you just think about flinging the shielding in the bin :pac:

The sound gone on that board is probably just bad caps around the sound amp, seems to be a common fault on a lot of bootleg boards.

CathalDublin · 17-08-2014 9:28pm

keithgeo wrote: »

haha ive done that before with a NES Myself!!

I just bought a bootleg bubble bobble off ebay to go with wwf wrestlefest to try out on the eprom writer. it has no sound, im going to try put those Bubble Bobble redux roms on it to make it play like the original, the price of bootleg BBs has gone up since the Redux was released.

I picked up a BB Bootleg for €50 on ebay last month, still having trouble with it, not sure if its the redux roms or the other roms but I'm getting reboots, thought I eventually had it fixed but just reached level 30 a few mins ago and another reboot. Think I'm going to have to reprogram every rom on the dam thing. Let us know how you get on.

Optimus Prime · 17-08-2014 9:59pm

well i havent a clue what im at so this will be a starting point for me.. didnt realise i might have to fix caps though.. doh.. im not good at soldering.

CathalDublin · 18-08-2014 8:09am

keithgeo wrote: »

well i havent a clue what im at so this will be a starting point for me.. didnt realise i might have to fix caps though.. doh.. im not good at soldering.

The BB Bootlegs are pretty bulletproof, my last one was missing a tonne of traces around the sound area and still worked.
I used the Aladar roms

Optimus Prime · 18-08-2014 10:03am

is it possible its eprom\eeprom thats causing the sound issues, or would it always be a cap?

Ive gone a bit mad over the weekend, ive bought 3 pcbs i always wanted.

1. Bubble Bobble Bootleg, with no sound. Ill put those roms on it.
2. WWE Wrestlefest, Graphics problem, looks minor.
3. Sunset Riders, Listed as for repair, but the auction was updated to say its working.

CathalDublin · 18-08-2014 10:16am

keithgeo wrote: »

is it possible its eprom\eeprom thats causing the sound issues, or would it always be a cap?

Ive gone a bit mad over the weekend, ive bought 3 pcbs i always wanted.

1. Bubble Bobble Bootleg, with no sound. Ill put those roms on it.
2. WWE Wrestlefest, Graphics problem, looks minor.
3. Sunset Riders, Listed as for repair, but the auction was updated to say its working.

Totally possible, could also be seller hasn't got the -5v connected or the amp itself could be dead.

Arcade & Retro Repairs & Mods, all new recipe, with no added MSG...

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