UK licence after Brexit

sunnysoutheast · 23-02-2019 12:16am

Blisterman wrote: »

For UK Residents in Ireland, will a UK licence along with international driving permit issued by the UK, allow me to keep driving when I'm in Ireland?

As I understand it, no.

You will need to exchange if a no deal Brexit as things stand.

sunnysoutheast · 23-02-2019 12:23am

Isambard wrote: »

as I understand it, if you get points but have a foreign license, they are allocated to a virtual license and are added to your Irish license should you ever get one.

Points are applied to an Irish "driving record" and expire after the usual period. They have to be declared to Insurance etc. but only in Ireland. This changed a few years ago.

I'm not sure what happens with the previous "ghost licence" process.

sunnysoutheast · 23-02-2019 12:34am

pawdee wrote: »

I don't know if this is in the right place but here's my question anyway.......

I've been driving on a UK license here in the ROI for the last 21 years or so. When I moved back from the UK in 1998 I went to my local Motor Tax office with form filled and cheque written ready to exchange for an Irish license. The lady in the office told me I'd be mad to change as my UK license is valid until I'm 70. So off I went and motored away since.

I presume that once the UK leave the EU my license is no longer valid? Does anyone know anything about this? Thanks in advance!

Is the address on your GB license still current, i.e. can you receive post there?

portcrap · 23-02-2019 12:49am

What’s to stop anyone holding a Uk licence and resident in Ireland doing the irish test and getting an irish licence while holding on to the UK one? Having both would suit me as I travel between both countries and may switch resident status between both countries over the next few years.

listermint · 23-02-2019 12:52am

portcrap wrote: »

What’s to stop anyone holding a Uk licence and resident in Ireland doing the irish test and getting an irish licence while holding on to the UK one? Having both would suit me as I travel between both countries and may switch resident status between both countries over the next few years.

Nothing

Charles Babbage · 23-02-2019 2:45am

seamus wrote: »

At the moment that's uncertain.

It's most likely that the UK licence will be added to the special list along with Switzerland and Australia, that will allow you to drive here for up to a year before you have to swap it. But that hasn't been done yet, and probably won't be done before Brexit.

So if you were to move here in April, chances are you'll have to start from scratch in order to comply with the law.

Surely the year aspect is not related to the swappability of the licence, it is related to your establishing your residence here. UK licences will simply be recognised, as they were long before Swiss ones ever were. This will be the least complex thing.

Del2005 · 23-02-2019 3:04am

sunnysoutheast wrote: »

Points are applied to an Irish "driving record" and expire after the usual period. They have to be declared to Insurance etc. but only in Ireland. This changed a few years ago.

I'm not sure what happens with the previous "ghost licence" process.

They create a virtual Irish licence for non Irish licence holders. As its a virtual licence the points are associated with it but can't be applied as the licence isn't valid. So in theory they should be added to your Irish licence when you transfer regardless of how long ago you committed the offence but in practice it appears that they just disappear when you change to an Irish licence

monkeynuz · 23-02-2019 5:03am

MascotDec85 wrote: »

I’m in the same boat. Here 18 years, still on my UK licence and also an ADI. In theory, on the 29th March my ability to work as a driving instructor would end.

My local MEP is Mairead McGuinness. She’s vice-president of the European Parliament. I contacted her regarding this recently and she said she’ll ask the Commission.

My understanding is this until I hear otherwise:
I’ve various categories including C1, D1 etc etc. these don’t expire until 2045. If I exchange it for an Irish licence i have to get a medical every 5 years to keep the categories active rather than the 10 years that currently exist.

If your c1/d1 was automatically added to your licence like mine was (I got full Licence in 1993) then you can’t transfer them unless you take a test.

Bogwoppit · 23-02-2019 5:41am

Del2005 wrote: »

They create a virtual Irish licence for non Irish licence holders. As its a virtual licence the points are associated with it but can't be applied as the licence isn't valid. So in theory they should be added to your Irish licence when you transfer regardless of how long ago you committed the offence but in practice it appears that they just disappear when you change to an Irish licence

I got a letter 3 years after getting points saying that they’d expired and were gone from my record.

MascotDec85 · 23-02-2019 8:49am

portcrap wrote: »

What’s to stop anyone holding a Uk licence and resident in Ireland doing the irish test and getting an irish licence while holding on to the UK one? Having both would suit me as I travel between both countries and may switch resident status between both countries over the next few years.

They’d be starting from scratch. Theory Test, 12 EDT lessons and N plates thereafter

MascotDec85 · 23-02-2019 8:51am

donkey balls wrote: »

Its an EU directive regarding the 5 years on the truck & bus license regardless of what country you reside in, As for swapping licenses with other countries or people from EU countries coming to work here.
It has always been the case that a driver may use their foreign license up to 12 months before having to exchange it to an Irish one, Although there was something in the legislation regarding UK issued licenses that were exempt from it.

Why is it that my truck entitlements don’t expire til 2045 on my UK licence then?

MascotDec85 · 23-02-2019 8:52am

monkeynuz wrote: »

If your c1/d1 was automatically added to your licence like mine was (I got full Licence in 1993) then you can’t transfer them unless you take a test.

I thought that too but I know others that transferred. I passed mine in 93 too

Wishbone Ash · 23-02-2019 9:46am

portcrap wrote: »

What’s to stop anyone holding a Uk licence and resident in Ireland doing the irish test and getting an irish licence while holding on to the UK one? Having both would suit me as I travel between both countries and may switch resident status between both countries over the next few years.

My brother did that many years ago - although the other way around. He had a ROI licence and also did the test in NI to get a UK licence. (His rationale wasn't for completely legit reasons though!)

MascotDec85 wrote: »

They’d be starting from scratch. Theory Test, 12 EDT lessons and N plates thereafter

Leaving aside the theory test and the 12 lessons, I presume they could continue driving on their UK licence for a couple of years unaccompanied and without L/N plates while they run down the clock on their ROI licence? Or am I missing something?

MascotDec85 · 23-02-2019 9:53am

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

My brother did that many years ago - although the other way around. He had a ROI licence and also did the test in NI to get a UK licence. (His rationale wasn't for completely legit reasons though!)

Leaving aside the theory test and the 12 lessons, I presume they could continue driving on their UK licence for a couple of years unaccompanied and without L/N plates while they run down the clock on their ROI licence? Or am I missing something?

Why are we all running around trying to exchange our UK licences? We’re being told it will no longer be valid in the event of a No Deal.
Unless you were exchanging the UK licence you’d effectively be a first time learner permit holder in Ireland and be treated like anyone else.

My personal situation as a driving instructor, here in Ireland on a UK licence I’d be basically mate jobless. I couldn’t continue as an ADI and have to go through the whole process. It’s mental.

Wishbone Ash · 23-02-2019 9:59am

MascotDec85 wrote: »

Why are we all running around trying to exchange our UK licences? We’re being told it will no longer be valid in the event of a No Deal...

Sorry I was thinking of a resident of the UK who drives a lot in the ROI - e.g someone living across the border who works in the ROI and who wishes to have both licences.

stefanovich · 23-02-2019 10:01am

Isambard wrote: »

another thing to bear in mind whilst you rush off to swap your license, I guess your new Irish license will bear all the points you built up on your "ghost" Irish license over the years.

That **** is a myth.

ASOT · 23-02-2019 10:13am

For anyone changing there license actually go to an NDLS centre rather than booking an appointment on the day, as sometimes it says there isn't an appointment for ages. They see a certain number of people on the day through a ticket system so as long as your there when it opens and have the time you'll be seen.

mdebets · 23-02-2019 10:19am

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Sorry I was thinking of a resident of the UK who drives a lot in the ROI - e.g someone living across the border who works in the ROI and who wishes to have both licences.

In this case, you can't get an Irish licence. You have to be resident in Ireland to get one.

BigAl81 · 23-02-2019 10:22am

I wonder can we drive in the north of Ireland in the event of a no deal Brexit on an Irish licence??

Wildly Boaring · 23-02-2019 10:31am

stefanovich wrote: »

That **** is a myth.

The ghost licence itself is not a myth.

I was driving on my UK licence and they attributed the point I got to a ghost.

You are correct that it is not then put onto your new Irish licence.

Seem to just sit on the ghost licence until they expire. My new Irish licence is clean

sunnysoutheast · 23-02-2019 10:44am

Del2005 wrote: »

They create a virtual Irish licence for non Irish licence holders. As its a virtual licence the points are associated with it but can't be applied as the licence isn't valid. So in theory they should be added to your Irish licence when you transfer regardless of how long ago you committed the offence but in practice it appears that they just disappear when you change to an Irish licence

I don't know how many times this has come up on this forum but this changed a few years ago, the process is that they are added to an RSA "driving record", take affect and expire in the usual way. Any additional points leading to a ban etc. only apply to Ireland. They need to be declared for insurance purposes. It's all described online.

It is also why I was asking the other poster about whether their UK license address is still valid as all FCPNs and communication go through that. There is also a specific offence in UK now of having out of date address details on your licence, although it's not invalidated as such.

The older "ghost licence" process wasn't as rigidly enforced as far as I'm aware.

Isambard · 23-02-2019 10:50am

BigAl81 wrote: »

I wonder can we drive in the north of Ireland in the event of a no deal Brexit on an Irish licence??

yes of course, on the same basis as any foreign visitor. You may well have to get a IDP though

23-02-2019 11:13am

R.O.R wrote: »

Printed the form out and have an appointment booked for the 12th March.

Never use any other categories except for B, so not really bothered about losing them.

Do you need a PSC to speed this up? Only photo ID I have is my (UK) passport. UK Drivers licence is the really old A4 paper one.

The PSC makes things easier but you can still do it without it just a long list of stuff you will have to produce.

It’s worth getting the PSC anyway though I’ve actually been surprised about how often it’s been handy for proof of ppsn etc.

donkey balls · 23-02-2019 11:14am

MascotDec85 wrote: »

Why is it that my truck entitlements don’t expire til 2045 on my UK licence then?

It is the same with the old Irish paper licence I got 10 years rather than 5 with the introduction of the card licence, When I was a transport manager I maid all our drivers who were on EU licences exchange them for Irish ones.
The only way of knowing if their driving on legit licence and we found two bogey licence, Look at the DVLA website and it has a section regarding the medical for truck and bus drivers.

rubberdungeon · 23-02-2019 11:25am

BigAl81 wrote: »

I wonder can we drive in the north of Ireland in the event of a no deal Brexit on an Irish licence??

The UK's Department for Transport has issued advice to motorists.

https://www.rte.ie/news/brexit/2019/0222/1032152-brexit-drivers-licences/

MascotDec85 · 23-02-2019 11:31am

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

Sorry I was thinking of a resident of the UK who drives a lot in the ROI - e.g someone living across the border who works in the ROI and who wishes to have both licences.

They can’t do that though unless they are resident in RoI. And if they did have an address they’d still need to go through due process.

MascotDec85 · 23-02-2019 11:32am

donkey balls wrote: »

It is the same with the old Irish paper licence I got 10 years rather than 5 with the introduction of the card licence, When I was a transport manager I maid all our drivers who were on EU licences exchange them for Irish ones.
The only way of knowing if their driving on legit licence and we found two bogey licence, Look at the DVLA website and it has a section regarding the medical for truck and bus drivers.

I’m on my second UK card licence

donkey balls · 23-02-2019 11:36am

MascotDec85 wrote: »

I’m on my second UK card licence

So once a person passes there test in the UK that's it no more medicals needed right up to 65 years of age,Even if they are driving trucks /bus.

MascotDec85 · 23-02-2019 11:52am

donkey balls wrote: »

So once a person passes there test in the UK that's it no more medicals needed right up to 65 years of age,Even if they are driving trucks /bus.

Tbh I’m not sure regarding those that drive them for a living but I’ve never had to have any sort of medical. I’ve C1, C1E, D1 and D1E valid from 1993 until 2045

donkey balls · 23-02-2019 11:57am

MascotDec85 wrote: »

Tbh I’m not sure regarding those that drive them for a living but I’ve never had to have any sort of medical. I’ve C1, C1E, D1 and D1E valid from 1993 until 2045

Ah my Bad I thought you had C and D licence, Was it the case that people who took their driving test in a car were giving the C1 as well when they passed.

23-02-2019 12:47pm

MascotDec85 wrote: »

They can’t do that though unless they are resident in RoI. And if they did have an address they’d still need to go through due process.

I would say the only hurdle would be a pps number, other than that what checks are there? It’s not that difficult for someone to get a ppsn once they have an address.

It’s also claimed that you can’t renew a license if you aren’t resident but I know a number of people who have done it while back visiting home on holiday.

mdebets · 23-02-2019 12:57pm

Mateo Mammoth Mask wrote: »

I would say the only hurdle would be a pps number, other than that what checks are there? It’s not that difficult for someone to get a ppsn once they have an address.

It’s also claimed that you can’t renew a license if you aren’t resident but I know a number of people who have done it while back visiting home on holiday.

Just because something can be done because someone doesn't do the proper checks doesn't make it legal. And it might be even ok at checkpoints, but I could imagine that insurance companies might see it differently if you have an accident and it turns out you were driving on a licence you are not entitled to.

23-02-2019 1:02pm

mdebets wrote: »

Just because something can be done because someone doesn't do the proper checks doesn't make it legal. And it might be even ok at checkpoints, but I could imagine that insurance companies might see it differently if you have an accident and it turns out you were driving on a licence you are not entitled to.

Even if they found out (which they woundnt) why would they care about some technicalities on residency. They don’t even care if you are driving on expired licenses etc despite some people thinking otherwise.

Wishbone Ash · 23-02-2019 2:18pm

mdebets wrote: »

... insurance companies might see it differently if you have an accident and it turns out you were driving on a licence you are not entitled to.

What determines which licence you are driving on if you hold two? I can't see it being a problem with insurance companies.

donkey balls · 23-02-2019 2:49pm

This thing of holding two licences cannot be done,For example a person with a EU or non EU licence which is accepted here in Ireland.
If they exchange the licence to an Irish one they have to surrender their home country one while this happens the licence authority here will get in contact with the country of issuing Authorithy to verify the licence details.
As for being a residence here in order to renew the licence, That cannot be policed I know lads working abroad who still have their Irish licence.
All you need is an Irish address your old Licence etc.

Wishbone Ash · 23-02-2019 3:28pm

donkey balls wrote: »

...If they exchange the licence to an Irish one they have to surrender their home country one while....

I'm referring to a scenario where a person doesn't exchange their licence but starts at the beginning in the second country - learner permit, test etc and obtains a licence for that country also (as my brother has done).

donkey balls · 23-02-2019 3:34pm

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

I'm referring to a scenario where a person doesn't exchange their licence but starts at the beginning in the second country - learner permit, test etc and obtains a licence for that country also (as my brother has done).

Absolutely nothing wrong with going through the process again from start and obtaining another driving licence.

Isambard · 23-02-2019 3:35pm

nothing wrong as you say, but bear in mind (in the UK at least) it's an offense not to have your current address on your license.

nomdeboardie · 23-02-2019 3:59pm

Isambard wrote: »

nothing wrong as you say, but bear in mind (in the UK at least) it's an offense not to have your current address on your license.

I assume this means that if a UK licence-holder who has been living in Ireland for many years then drives while on holiday in the UK they could be in trouble if stopped by police (even before Brexit)? Anyone reading been in this situation?

Also, if the licence is exchanged for an Irish one, and in the process is sent back to the UK DVLA, I assume they (the DVLA) don't start asking questions about when the holder left the UK address on the document?

donkey balls · 23-02-2019 5:21pm

I don't see a problem with either the DVLA or NDLS in questioning someone habitual residence, One thing though regarding the insurance companies is if you declare a full Irish licence and involved in a tip and you have a UK or euro one they might try and get out of paying out.

nomdeboardie · 23-02-2019 5:40pm

donkey balls wrote: »

I don't see a problem with either the DVLA or NDLS in questioning someone habitual residence, One thing though regarding the insurance companies is if you declare a full Irish licence and involved in a tip and you have a UK or euro one they might try and get out of paying out.

Hopefully, (though not sure about the hypothetical situation I mentioned re driving temporarily again in the UK). I've always declared my licence to be UK and never had it questioned by insurance companies - first company took a copy, and I've given licence number when asked when moving to new companies etc. I was told once or twice that the premium would be a bit cheaper or that I could gat an older car covered if my licence were Irish, I think, so I realise that was already a consideration (before Brexit).

donkey balls · 23-02-2019 6:13pm

I'm not saying there is anything wrong with having a UK licence and it's normally a question asked by insurance companies.

23-02-2019 6:47pm

donkey balls wrote: »

I don't see a problem with either the DVLA or NDLS in questioning someone habitual residence, One thing though regarding the insurance companies is if you declare a full Irish licence and involved in a tip and you have a UK or euro one they might try and get out of paying out.

The Irish companies don’t really care if it’s irish or UK, in fact many companies just have “full irish/UK” on their drop down. Other EU licenses are different.

Isambard · 23-02-2019 7:49pm

Mateo Mammoth Mask wrote: »

The Irish companies don’t really care if it’s irish or UK, in fact many companies just have “full irish/UK” on their drop down. Other EU licenses are different.

may change with Brexit though...

23-02-2019 8:40pm

Isambard wrote: »

may change with Brexit though...

Definitely I’d say....

sunnysoutheast · 23-02-2019 8:59pm

nomdeboardie wrote: »

I assume this means that if a UK licence-holder who has been living in Ireland for many years then drives while on holiday in the UK they could be in trouble if stopped by police (even before Brexit)? Anyone reading been in this situation?

Also, if the licence is exchanged for an Irish one, and in the process is sent back to the UK DVLA, I assume they (the DVLA) don't start asking questions about when the holder left the UK address on the document?

Don't think so, my wife exchanged her UK licence with no issue and the address was way out of date.

My cousin in the UK was involved in an RTA and the cop at the scene gave him the third degree because the address on his licence was out of date, threatened him with prosecution etc. for it. It can be a fairly big fine I think. I guess it would only be an issue if you're involved in an incident/stopped though. Seems to be the question they ask "Is this address still current?" as the Garda who gave me the speeding ticket in 2015 asked the same thing. He also asked what football team I supported (I don't really) and it was the same as the one he supported so there was some rapport there I thought. Still got the FCPN through though.

wonski · 23-02-2019 9:11pm

sunnysoutheast wrote: »

Don't think so, my wife exchanged her UK licence with no issue and the address was way out of date.

My cousin in the UK was involved in an RTA and the cop at the scene gave him the third degree because the address on his licence was out of date, threatened him with prosecution etc. for it. It can be a fairly big fine I think. I guess it would only be an issue if you're involved in an incident/stopped though. Seems to be the question they ask "Is this address still current?" as the Garda who gave me the speeding ticket in 2015 asked the same thing. He also asked what football team I supported (I don't really) and it was the same as the one he supported so there was some rapport there I thought. Still got the FCPN through though.

It's like saying you won't have an issue driving without license unless stopped or being involved in rta. Or drink driving.

It's technically correct, but shows that there is an issue at the same time.

sunnysoutheast · 23-02-2019 9:14pm

wonski wrote: »

It's like saying you won't have an issue driving without license unless stopped or being involved in rta. Or drink driving.

It's technically correct, but shows that there is an issue at the same time.

As I understand it the licence itself is still valid, but the specific offence is having an out-of-date address on it.

23-02-2019 9:42pm

Sure how is it even defined or proven what your address is? My address for everything, bank, license, bills, revenue, car VLC etc is my home house never changed anything since I was born basically (obviously many things I didn’t have when I was born but the point I’m making is clear). I actually live there most of the time now again but for about 8 of the last 10 years I’ve been in a few different house shares/address and only at home maybe 2/3 weekend a month. Fact is I’d struggle to prove I lived anywhere but at home even though I was only there at weekends and holidays really.

I think the key is if you have access to the address or not really.

wonski · 23-02-2019 9:53pm

sunnysoutheast wrote: »

As I understand it the licence itself is still valid, but the specific offence is having an out-of-date address on it.

Oh it is valid, but I rather have a license that will let me drive without being worried about being stopped. Chances are low though if you don't do anything stupid.

UK licence after Brexit

Comments