Trump/US to recognise Jerusalem as Isreal's capital

9or10 · 07-12-2017 11:43am

During a lull in a White House dinner, Melania Trump leaned over to chat with Secretary of State, Tillerson.

"I bought Donald a parrot for his birthday. That bird is so smart, Donald has already taught him to say over two hundred words!"

“Very impressive," said Tillerson, "but, you do realize he just speaks the words. He doesn't really understand what they all mean.”

"Oh, I know", replied Melania, “but neither does the parrot."

JMNolan · 07-12-2017 11:46am

Deise Vu wrote: »

enraging a billion muslims?

Talk about stereotyping

server down · 07-12-2017 11:47am

Billy86 wrote: »

You seem to be conveniently forgetting the drone strikes have gone way up since Trump came into office, are killing more civilians, and they want to use more again - on top of other symbolic bombings like dropping the largest non-nuclear bomb in world history on Afghanistan only a few months ago.

They are all war criminals. That said the destruction of Libya takes the cake.

suicide_circus · 07-12-2017 11:52am

Stupid, inflammatory and unnecessary decision. That saI'd, it is important that we are not dissuaded from doing or saying things under the threat of violence from extremists, constantly hostages to the rage of those who look for any excuse for barbarity.

Billy86 · 07-12-2017 11:54am

server down wrote: »

They are all war criminals. That said the destruction of Libya takes the cake.

Iraq was far more damaging than Syria I reckon, and a real start point. The whole situation has been a clusterf*** for the last 14 years but claiming what Trump has been doing in the region is "a step up from Obama and Hillary bombing the $h1t out of it" is entirely incorrect when Trump has been bombing the sh*t out of it at a higher rate again.

Elmer Blooker · 07-12-2017 11:55am

9or10 wrote: »

During a lull in a White House dinner, Melania Trump leaned over to chat with Secretary of State, Tillerson.

"I bought Donald a parrot for his birthday. That bird is so smart, Donald has already taught him to say over two hundred words!"

“Very impressive," said Tillerson, "but, you do realize he just speaks the words. He doesn't really understand what they all mean.”

"Oh, I know", replied Melania, “but neither does the parrot."

According to the Guardian quoting "senior sources" the parrot is speaking Russian!

Gatling · 07-12-2017 12:12pm

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

According to the Guardian quoting "senior sources" the parrot is speaking Russian!

That's just Donald on a daily basis

c_man · 07-12-2017 12:52pm

The whole Palestinian thing is a lost cause. It's so sad but that's the reality.

From Trump's POV, he's keeping a campaign promise, showing support for an ally, shoring the base and keeping himself in the headlines. What's not to like.

Varik · 07-12-2017 1:05pm

Mods seem to have deleted a few of the more anti-semitic posts from last night, not before a good few thanks were giving by who you'd expect.

suicide_circus · 07-12-2017 1:09pm

c_man wrote: »

The whole Palestinian thing is a lost cause. It's so sad but that's the reality.

From Trump's POV, he's keeping a campaign promise, showing support for an ally, shoring the base and keeping himself in the headlines. What's not to like.

And creating a handy distraction from his possibly treasonous russian connections currently under investigation.

Pero_Bueno · 07-12-2017 1:13pm

All the mentally ill left blaming Trump - but the scumbags burning american flags and chanting death to USA/Israel on the streets - they're just grand.

Hector Bellend · 07-12-2017 1:48pm

Why has this decision been made now? What's the logic?

Guy Sajer · 07-12-2017 1:56pm

On one hand we are told to not let terrorism win and to continue normality, on the other when it comes to Trumps decision we are complaining that it will escalate violence.

Can people who use phrases like "open the gates of hell" really be trusted with peace anyway.

Odhinn · 07-12-2017 2:00pm

Ipso wrote: »

Yes self rule is better, but I don't get the romanticisation of groups that would be hell to live under.
What has violent action gotten so far? If anyone thinks that Israel is not going to respond to violent action with a sh1t load more violent action then you must have been away for the last while. Hamas/Hezzbolah don't give a sh1t what happens to the ordinary Palestinian, they are pawns. The alternative to violent action may not get them any further but it will be less destructive.

You still haven't given the peaceful alternative.

jimbob1977 wrote:

It's much ado about nothing, if you peel away the political outrage.

'Its not much of a disaster if you forget about the disaster'

Wailin wrote:

He's in politics, advised by politicians and military commander's

.

There's no evidence he's listening to them, unfortunately.

Hector Bellend wrote:

Why has this decision been made now? What's the logic?

He's playing to a section of his own electorate (best guess) and thinking long term consequences be damned.

07-12-2017 2:03pm

c_man wrote: »

From Trump's POV, he's keeping a campaign promise, showing support for an ally, shoring the base and keeping himself in the headlines. What's not to like.

In fairness, if it was a campaign promise, the time for outrage was back then. He can hardly be blamed for sticking by a promise made pre election.

Odhinn · 07-12-2017 2:10pm

Deleted User wrote: »

In fairness, if it was a campaign promise, the time for outrage was back then. He can hardly be blamed for sticking by a promise made pre election.

In this case, he can.
http://dailycaller.com/2017/12/06/flashback-all-the-times-past-presidents-promised-to-move-us-embassy-to-jerusalem/

Of course they shouldn't have been making it an election issue either.

A Little Pony · 07-12-2017 2:12pm

Zebra3 wrote: »

Berserker wrote: »

Nope, they could call for peaceful protest as a response to this. They've called for a "day or rage".

Peaceful protest by Palestinians has resulted in them being shot, arrested and tortured, beaten by the occupying Israeli terrorist forces.

And has resulted in the continued ethnic cleansing of them from their homeland.

Remember Israel is a colonial settler state founded by European jews who have been forcing out the native population since 1948.

Jews settled in the area 3 thousand years ago. How far back do you want to go? Reality is it is now Israel's and they will do with it what they seem fit.

Hector Bellend · 07-12-2017 2:16pm

Odhinn wrote: »

You still haven't given the peaceful alternative.

'Its not much of a disaster if you forget about the disaster'

.

There's no evidence he's listening to them, unfortunately.

He's playing to a section of his own electorate (best guess) and thinking long term consequences be damned.

But isnt there a medium and long term component to all decisions of this nature

Odhinn · 07-12-2017 2:21pm

Hector Bellend wrote: »

But isnt there a medium and long term component to all decisions of this nature

There should be - this is Trump, however.

Zebra3 · 07-12-2017 3:31pm

c_man wrote: »

The whole Palestinian thing is a lost cause. It's so sad but that's the reality.

From Trump's POV, he's keeping a campaign promise, showing support for an ally, shoring the base and keeping himself in the headlines. What's not to like.

How about being in breach of international law? Then again that’s not something the American/Israeli terror fanboys worry about.

A Little Pony wrote: »

Jews settled in the area 3 thousand years ago. How far back do you want to go? Reality is it is now Israel's and they will do with it what they seem fit.

So you have no issue with colonial terrorists ethnicly cleansing the natives?

c_man · 07-12-2017 3:49pm

Zebra3 wrote: »

How about being in breach of international law? Then again that’s not something the American/Israeli terror fanboys worry about.

Well you answered your own question then

Is it a violation of international law to move their embassy there? Why? As far as I recall it's only East Jerusalem that's "up in the air"

A Little Pony · 07-12-2017 3:55pm

Zebra3 wrote: »

c_man wrote: »

The whole Palestinian thing is a lost cause. It's so sad but that's the reality.

From Trump's POV, he's keeping a campaign promise, showing support for an ally, shoring the base and keeping himself in the headlines. What's not to like.

How about being in breach of international law? Then again that’s not something the American/Israeli terror fanboys worry about.

A Little Pony wrote: »

Jews settled in the area 3 thousand years ago. How far back do you want to go? Reality is it is now Israel's and they will do with it what they seem fit.

So you have no issue with colonial terrorists ethnicly cleansing the natives?

Sure I'm a planter myself, that would be hypocritical.

Dr. Kenneth Noisewater · 07-12-2017 3:59pm

As I said before, if Turkey are telling you something is a bad idea, then its probably an absolutely f*cking mental idea.

end of the road · 07-12-2017 4:45pm

...__... wrote: »

Are you mixing up what the Arabs tried to do TO Israel in 1967?
The Palestinians and Jordanians (who controlled Jerusalem then btw) fully supported Nasser in trying to wipe Israel off the map then,
Instead of trying for Peace they went for war.

They lost.

no, i'm definitely not mixing up israel's action plan with the 1967 war. israel were involved in ethnic cleansing before 1967 anyway and had a plan to take over the palestinian territories that remained outside the 1948 border.
there was always going to be a war, however israel were going to instigate it at some stage. it's just the others got there first and as you said lost. however israel were forced to give back some of the territory they stole.

A Little Pony wrote: »

Jews settled in the area 3 thousand years ago. How far back do you want to go? Reality is it is now Israel's and they will do with it what they seem fit.

only land within the 1948 border is israel's. anything outside that is belonging to the palestinians and other countries.

Stacksofwacks · 07-12-2017 4:56pm

he does what he wants, he does what he wants, he grabs them by the pussy, he does what he wants

tayto lover · 07-12-2017 6:59pm

Trump is a dangerous gobshyte.
Israel is a regional bully and will welcome his action.

Berserker · 07-12-2017 7:06pm

tayto lover wrote: »

Trump is a dangerous gobshyte.
Israel is a regional bully and will welcome his action.

Nothing overly dangerous about this decision. Last time I checked he didn't declare war or threaten them. It's a crazy call alright but it was one of his election promises and we all know that he delivers on them. The only bully I can see today is Hamas, calling for an uprising and claiming that this is a declaration of war.

tayto lover · 07-12-2017 7:22pm

Berserker wrote: »

Nothing overly dangerous about this decision. Last time I checked he didn't declare war or threaten them. It's a crazy call alright but it was one of his election promises and we all know that he delivers on them. The only bully I can see today is Hamas, calling for an uprising and claiming that this is a declaration of war.

The only people in danger are the entire Palestinian population and maybe an odd Israeli settler.
The bigger bully always wins.

ronnie085 · 07-12-2017 7:27pm

Berserker wrote: »

tayto lover wrote: »

Trump is a dangerous gobshyte.
Israel is a regional bully and will welcome his action.

Nothing overly dangerous about this decision. Last time I checked he didn't declare war or threaten them. It's a crazy call alright but it was one of his election promises and we all know that he delivers on them. The only bully I can see today is Hamas, calling for an uprising and claiming that this is a declaration of war.

What do you want them to do, negotiate with a US administration that is renaging on deals all over the place or Israel who break UN resolutions for fun and don't particularly recognise international law, squeezing the Palestinians with illegal land grabs.

Berserker · 07-12-2017 7:40pm

ronnie085 wrote: »

What do you want them to do, negotiate

Well, it's either that or take another hiding from the Israeli forces.

Zebra3 · 07-12-2017 7:41pm

ronnie085 wrote: »

What do you want them to do, negotiate with a US administration that is renaging on deals all over the place or Israel who break UN resolutions for fun and don't particularly recognise international law, squeezing the Palestinians with illegal land grabs.

A lot of people don’t view the Palestinians as humans so just don’t care about them or can’t even see them at all.

server down · 07-12-2017 7:49pm

A Little Pony wrote: »

Sure I'm a planter myself, that would be hypocritical.

The whole ulster unionist fetishing on Israel is not reciprocated. Let me tell you.

A Little Pony · 07-12-2017 7:52pm

server down wrote: »

A Little Pony wrote: »

Sure I'm a planter myself, that would be hypocritical.

The whole ulster unionist fetishing on Israel is not reciprocated. Let me tell you.

I certainly wouldn't be on the street with placards on the issue for either side, I just admire Jewish history. Hope the Jews prosper in Israel for the foreseeable future.

tayto lover · 07-12-2017 7:58pm

A Little Pony wrote: »

I certainly wouldn't be on the street with placards on the issue for either side, I just admire Jewish history. Hope the Jews prosper in Israel for the foreseeable future.

Well they'll never face charges for war crimes as long as people like Trump exist.
Doesn't mean they didn't commit them though.

end of the road · 07-12-2017 7:59pm

Berserker wrote: »

Well, it's either that or take another hiding from the Israeli forces.

they will be taking another hiding from the israely forces anyway.

Odhinn · 07-12-2017 8:04pm

Berserker wrote: »

Nothing overly dangerous about this decision. Last time I checked he didn't declare war or threaten them. It's a crazy call alright but it was one of his election promises and we all know that he delivers on them. The only bully I can see today is Hamas, calling for an uprising and claiming that this is a declaration of war.

In the light of a near 50 year occupation, thats beyond a joke.

Chrongen · 07-12-2017 8:39pm

The_Valeyard wrote: »

Its an unbelievably stupid decision.

Its as if Trump thought "how else can we fcuk up the Middle East"

This has nothing to do with Trump. Most American politicians couldn't find their arse with both hands and a map, let alone Israel. Recently 4 American soldiers were killed and several wounded in NIGER. Not a single Congressman/woman had a clue where Niger was or even that there are 1000 American troops operating there.

Trump assigned his clueless but minted son-in-law to be his Middle East "expert" FFS!

Whoever is pulling Trump's strings in order to effect this retarded decision is looking for even more American-inspired havoc in the Middle East to boost the profit line.

Chrongen · 07-12-2017 8:47pm

jojofizzio wrote: »

Some talking head on some talk show at the weekend saying “it’s inly a matter of time til he’s impeached “...based on the Mike Flynn claims about Russian links and the involvement of his son-in-law,saying there’s no way he’ll get away with denying knowledge of the above”...we’d never be that lucky would we??

There is no WAY that Trump will be impeached. He is PERFECT for those that control US foreign and domestic policy.

Look at the tax bill that was put through last weekend. That will strip millions of their retirements and pave the way for guting Social Security and Medicare. The Gazillionaires who control the US government are loving it.

pitifulgod · 07-12-2017 8:50pm

Chrongen wrote: »

There is no WAY that Trump will be impeached. He is PERFECT for those that control US foreign and domestic policy.

Look at the tax bill that was put through last weekend. That will strip millions of their retirements and pave the way for guting Social Security and Medicare. The Gazillionaires who control the US government are loving it.

There's an ongoing investigation into him that appears to be making considerable progress, the Democrats are likely to make substantial gains in midterms. That will likely lead to impeachment proceedings so the odds of a successful impeachment are becoming increasingly more likely.

Chrongen · 07-12-2017 9:04pm

ceadaoin. wrote: »

Is pence any better though? Im not sure he is

Ah, that great old bipolar argument...."Let's accept smallpox because leprosy is so much worse"

A Little Pony · 07-12-2017 9:10pm

pitifulgod wrote: »

Chrongen wrote: »

There is no WAY that Trump will be impeached. He is PERFECT for those that control US foreign and domestic policy.

Look at the tax bill that was put through last weekend. That will strip millions of their retirements and pave the way for guting Social Security and Medicare. The Gazillionaires who control the US government are loving it.

There's an ongoing investigation into him that appears to be making considerable progress, the Democrats are likely to make substantial gains in midterms. That will likely lead to impeachment proceedings so the odds of a successful impeachment are becoming increasingly more likely.

What progress? I haven't seen any progress which will lead to impeachment proceedings. As already said, the people he needs to please are happy with him and that's all Trump is concerned about.

wes · 07-12-2017 9:11pm

It should be noted that the 2 state solution is dead at this point. Trump put the final in the coffin. Also, maybe we can finally stop pretending that the US is an honest broker in this conflict. The US involvement in the "peace process" is one of the reasons it's dead now.

pitifulgod · 07-12-2017 9:20pm

A Little Pony wrote: »

What progress? I haven't seen any progress which will lead to impeachment proceedings. As already said, the people he needs to please are happy with him and that's all Trump is concerned about.

Considerable amount of communications with Russia that they denied ever happening. 3 people from his campaign, 1 of which was in his administration have been indicted. All our cooperating with the investigation and informing on Trump, they've made deals with Mueller. It looks likely that his son-in-law will also be indicted.

As of today, it has come out that Trump Jnr is claiming attorney client privilege in relation to what he told his father about the meetings with Russia. Flynn also apparently told the Russians that they would tear up the sanctions. This meeting was upon the request of Jared Kushner. For people who had zero contact with Russia, they had a considerable amount of communication at all levels of the administration before they even entered the white house.

They're also going through his finances at the moments. This is just from a few months of investigation. Eg Watergate took two years. All of the above would have been claimed as 'fake news', the investigation was a 'nothing burger' however that does not seem to be the case. Mueller did the Enron investigation, he's the very best and he doesn't seem to believe this is a 'nothing burger'.

Chrongen · 07-12-2017 9:44pm

dxhound2005 wrote: »

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/19/world/middleeast/jerusalem-us-embassy-trump.html

In 1995, Congress passed a law declaring Jerusalem to be Israel’s capital and requiring the embassy be moved there by 1999 — or else the State Department building budget would be cut in half. But the law included a provision allowing presidents to waive its requirement for six months if they determined it was in the national interest. So every six months, Mr. Clinton, Mr. Bush and eventually President Obama signed such waivers, fearing a violent response in the Arab world if the embassy moved.

Putting off the decision of Congress for 22 years has not stopped the violence. So implementing it now will not make any difference.

Oh yes it fucking will.

And who gives the US the right to determine what country declares it's capital?

The Americans still refer to Ho Chi Minh City as "Saigon" in a fit of childish pique.

No nation on EARTH recognises Jerusalem as the capital of Israel, but I suppose they don't count, right?

The muppet who sits in the White House hasn't a clue what he is on about but his handler do and they are elated. This is what's happening now:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-42265337

Hande hoche! · 07-12-2017 9:46pm

pitifulgod wrote: »

There's an ongoing investigation into him that appears to be making considerable progress, the Democrats are likely to make substantial gains in midterms. That will likely lead to impeachment proceedings so the odds of a successful impeachment are becoming increasingly more likely.

Wouldn't surprise me in the least if the Democrats make a mess of midterms.

Berserker · 07-12-2017 9:58pm

end of the road wrote: »

they will be taking another hiding from the israely forces anyway.

If they opt for peaceful negotiations they won't. The financial benefits of conflict are too good for Hamas, unfortunately.

Chrongen · 07-12-2017 9:58pm

Deleted User wrote: »

In fairness, if it was a campaign promise, the time for outrage was back then. He can hardly be blamed for sticking by a promise made pre election.

Did the Palestinians or YOU for that matter have a decision in whether he or the american administration implemented that "promise"?

So if an idiot campaigns on a variety of pledges, one of which is "I'm going to kill all Nepalese people" and his crew vote him in anyway and then he decides to bomb Kathmandu, are you going to say that THEY should have spoken up?

Wanderer78 · 07-12-2017 10:00pm

pitifulgod wrote: »

Considerable amount of communications....

all good points but its important to note, the american political system operates in mysterious ways, sensible and lawfully right decisions dont always prevail, particularly when it comes to the well being of the majority.

end of the road · 07-12-2017 10:17pm

Berserker wrote: »

If they opt for peaceful negotiations they won't. The financial benefits of conflict are too good for Hamas, unfortunately.

nope. even if they opt for peaceful negotiations israel will still continue it's ethnic cleansing program. in fact, peaceful negotiations will give israel carte blanche to step it up. we are dealing with one of the biggist terrorist states, and the most prolific breacher of international law in the world.

Berserker · 07-12-2017 10:28pm

end of the road wrote: »

nope. even if they opt for peaceful negotiations israel will still continue it's ethnic cleansing program. in fact, peaceful negotiations will give israel carte blanche to step it up. we are dealing with one of the biggist terrorist states, and the most prolific breacher of international law in the world.

Oh, Israeli bad, Palestinian good. It's that simple, is it?

Trump/US to recognise Jerusalem as Isreal's capital

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