Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi all! We have been experiencing an issue on site where threads have been missing the latest postings. The platform host Vanilla are working on this issue. A workaround that has been used by some is to navigate back from 1 to 10+ pages to re-sync the thread and this will then show the latest posts. Thanks, Mike.
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

Election Posters

2»

Comments

  • #52
    ixoy
    Moderators, Entertainment Moderators Posts: 17,994 Mod ✭✭✭✭ixoy


    Out of curiosity, I counted the number of posters that I passed or could see on a 6km walk into town from Killester this morning...
    530..


  • #53
    De Bhál
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,940 ✭✭✭De Bhál


    i hate the sight of them


  • #54
    irlirishkev
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,505 ✭✭✭irlirishkev


    Walking down James's Street from Thomas Street this morning, on my way to the Luas. I pass a lot of lamp-posts. Every.Single.One as far as my eye could see had these posters up. Same candidates (none of whom I can picture or name now), same positions, on each pole.

    My heart sank when I saw them this morning.

    They're a f*cking eyesore.


  • #55
    Remind me
    Registered Users Posts: 871 ✭✭✭Remind me


    TallGlass wrote: »

    Where can I get a definitive list of candidates in my area not doing this? They'll get my vote, don't care who they are, they'll get it.

    That's why they put them up - If they don't, people with little interest wouldn't even know an election was happening, because they are up there is a greater chance of them voting.


  • #56
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,869 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Dub Ste wrote: »
    I hate these things with a passion.

    it's not just the fact that look awful, it's what they leave behind when they take them down, the plastic ties wraps.
    Lamposts where I live still have them on from the last round of elections, and it looks awful.

    They should be colour coded. Every party/ candidate should be allocated a colour, and when they are taken down, if there are any left, they should be fined for each one that is left.
    Don't particularly care how much it would cost them to do this, but it's better than leaving them.

    I was thinking of taking photos of the poles near me when the posters are up, then again after they've been removed when just the ties are still there, and emailing all the candidates whose face are in the first photo, asking them to ensure their ties had been removed.


  • #57
    Caranica
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,145 ✭✭✭✭Caranica


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    I was thinking of taking photos of the poles near me when the posters are up, then again after they've been removed when just the ties are still there, and emailing all the candidates whose face are in the first photo, asking them to ensure their ties had been removed.

    It's actually next to impossible to remove a poster without taking down the cable tie, unless the poster is very thin and of poor quality. What drives me crazy is a pool of cut cable ties at the bottom of the pole where they're just left behind.


  • #58
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 5,869 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Caranica wrote: »
    It's actually next to impossible to remove a poster without taking down the cable tie, unless the poster is very thin and of poor quality. What drives me crazy is a pool of cut cable ties at the bottom of the pole where they're just left behind.
    I respectfully disagree. Here's one lamppost in Killester/Donnycarney, photo taken June of last year with a number of ties still on it:


    https://www.google.ie/maps/@53.3754567,-6.2190399,3a,50y,263.24h,110.76t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sxq_qTapLDU7azNj8a9DI-g!2e0!7i16384!8i8192




    And again, just up the road:


    https://www.google.ie/maps/@53.3758213,-6.2181625,3a,32.9y,163.54h,98.38t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sgXtFOm1hMX3fv-EXeCOLRQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192


  • #59
    OldGoat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,637 ✭✭✭✭OldGoat


    Remind me wrote: »
    That's why they put them up - If they don't, people with little interest wouldn't even know an election was happening, because they are up there is a greater chance of them voting.
    If those who are not interested in voting just turn up because of a face on a pole then perhaps we would be better off if the only people who voted are those actually interested in the outcome irrespective of faces.

    I'm older than Minecraft goats.



  • #60
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    OldGoat wrote: »
    If those who are not interested in voting just turn up because of a face on a pole then perhaps we would be better off if the only people who voted are those actually interested in the outcome irrespective of faces.
    That would probably leave a turnout of well under 40%. Most people really don't care about politics but some will do their civic duty anyway.


  • Advertisement
  • #61
    Remind me
    Registered Users Posts: 871 ✭✭✭Remind me


    OldGoat wrote: »
    If those who are not interested in voting just turn up because of a face on a pole then perhaps we would be better off if the only people who voted are those actually interested in the outcome irrespective of faces.

    Face on a pole leads to a bit of research


  • #62
    Caranica
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,145 ✭✭✭✭Caranica


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    I respectfully disagree. Here's one lamppost in Killester/Donnycarney, photo taken June of last year with a number of ties still on it:


    https://www.google.ie/maps/@53.3754567,-6.2190399,3a,50y,263.24h,110.76t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sxq_qTapLDU7azNj8a9DI-g!2e0!7i16384!8i8192




    And again, just up the road:


    https://www.google.ie/maps/@53.3758213,-6.2181625,3a,32.9y,163.54h,98.38t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sgXtFOm1hMX3fv-EXeCOLRQ!2e0!7i16384!8i8192

    Not necessarily from election posters. How about circuses, meetings, church collections, pantomimes, gaa matches etc. Those posters tend to be much lighter.


  • #63
    howiya
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,324 ✭✭✭howiya


    Some amount of posters below the 2.3m height requirement in my area. If a politician or their staff can't handle such a simple job as putting up a poster at the correct height how can they be trusted with the tougher decisions they'll face in office


  • #64
    Caranica
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,145 ✭✭✭✭Caranica


    howiya wrote: »
    Some amount of posters below the 2.3m height requirement in my area. If a politician or their staff can't handle such a simple job as putting up a poster at the correct height how can they be trusted with the tougher decisions they'll face in office

    Report them on www.fixmystreet.ie A litter fine is cheaper than an insurance claim


  • #65
    SATSUMA
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 706 ✭✭✭SATSUMA


    I was driving to work early this morning there was the one candidate on every single lamp post both sides of the road. They must have started at 12.01. Very irritating im not voting for her says I. By the evening she had many friends also tied to said posts. Now i can't even remember which one the irritating one was! They've all merged into one photoshopped mess. Ugh.


  • #66
    OldGoat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,637 ✭✭✭✭OldGoat


    Remind me wrote: »
    Face on a pole leads to a bit of research
    If posters on poles were the only way a candidate can get people to look at their manifesto then you might have a point. However there are numerous ways, less intrusive ways, less polluting ways, less contentious ways for them to do so.

    A poll has been cited by various politicians and groups, the 2018 Claire Byrne Live/Amárach Research poll. Over 70% of respondents have said they want rid of posters. More and more councillors and politicians are realising that the public are overwhelmingly not in favour of posters.
    https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/fine-gael-election-candidate-calls-for-poster-ban-ahead-of-poll-894540.html

    Meanwhile other councillors and politician flout the guidelines in what can only been seen as unfair and self serving gestures.
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/dublin-city-council-investigating-early-election-posters-1.3870438

    The Journal has run it's own poll (undoubtedly taking it's cue from Boards again :) ) The poll currently stands at 88% or respondents in favour of banning the posters. Even when taken with a pinch of salt that is a huge percentage.

    I'm older than Minecraft goats.



  • Advertisement
  • #67
    the_pen_turner
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,524 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    There should be a place in each village where they are erected. If there are 10 candidates then there should only be 10 posters. Find a nice wall in a high traffic area and screw a few timbers to it and mount the posters to that.
    No need for all those posters. Complete waste and serve very little purpose


  • #68
    Remind me
    Registered Users Posts: 871 ✭✭✭Remind me


    OldGoat wrote: »
    If posters on poles were the only way a candidate can get people to look at their manifesto then you might have a point. However there are numerous ways, less intrusive ways, less polluting ways, less contentious ways for them to do so.

    A poll has been cited by various politicians and groups, the 2018 Claire Byrne Live/Amárach Research poll. Over 70% of respondents have said they want rid of posters. More and more councillors and politicians are realising that the public are overwhelmingly not in favour of posters.
    https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/fine-gael-election-candidate-calls-for-poster-ban-ahead-of-poll-894540.html

    Meanwhile other councillors and politician flout the guidelines in what can only been seen as unfair and self serving gestures.
    https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/dublin-city-council-investigating-early-election-posters-1.3870438

    The Journal has run it's own poll (undoubtedly taking it's cue from Boards again :) ) The poll currently stands at 88% or respondents in favour of banning the posters. Even when taken with a pinch of salt that is a huge percentage.

    Guarantee that poll saying 70% are people who know the election is on.

    People with little interest would not have a clue without the posters or possibly bumping into a candidate at the shops.

    People interested in politics will look up other methods such as social media.

    Candidates looking to get elected don’t care if it is a person that doesn’t have a clue about them but sees their mug on a poster and gives them number 1.

    I would be in favour of banning the posters, especially because the lamppost outside my house has 3 on it already!! But I have an interest in politics so will look up and do my research but the majority won’t.


  • #69
    Remind me
    Registered Users Posts: 871 ✭✭✭Remind me


    the_pen_turner wrote: »
    There should be a place in each village where they are erected. If there are 10 candidates then there should only be 10 posters. Find a nice wall in a high traffic area and screw a few timbers to it and mount the posters to that.
    No need for all those posters. Complete waste and serve very little purpose

    This I agree with, similar to what someone said earlier about the Netherlands


  • #70
    OldGoat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,637 ✭✭✭✭OldGoat


    Remind me wrote: »
    Guarantee that poll saying 70% are people who know the election is on.

    People with little interest would not have a clue without the posters or possibly bumping into a candidate at the shops.
    I think your polling cards arriving in the post would be clue enough that there is an election on the way.

    I'm older than Minecraft goats.



  • #71
    Remind me
    Registered Users Posts: 871 ✭✭✭Remind me


    OldGoat wrote: »
    I think your polling cards arriving in the post would be clue enough that there is an election on the way.

    The polling cards that could arrive days before?

    I didn’t receive a polling card for the presidential election but I am on the register and have been since I was 18. Many friends in their early 30’s renting and their polling cards go to their home address.

    Most people. Including me don’t want the posters but they are known to work so until banned will be used.


  • Advertisement
  • #72
    OldGoat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,637 ✭✭✭✭OldGoat


    Remind me wrote: »
    The polling cards that could arrive days before?

    I didn’t receive a polling card for the presidential election but I am on the register and have been since I was 18. Many friends in their early 30’s renting and their polling cards go to their home address.

    Most people. Including me don’t want the posters but they are known to work so until banned will be used.
    Yet the vast majority of people do get their cards just fine and have time enough to do a bit of research if they wish to.

    I'm older than Minecraft goats.



  • #73
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,136 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    OldGoat wrote: »
    I think your polling cards arriving in the post would be clue enough that there is an election on the way.
    Most people couldn't tell you where their polling cards are or they may arrive late are so no they are not.


  • #74
    Captain Flaps
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,834 ✭✭✭Captain Flaps


    TallGlass wrote: »
    there are countless environmentally friendly ways to contact me and tell me what you've done, rather than post your mug up everywhere with your name.

    Not trying to be smart because I hate posters, but...like what? I don't want to be doorstepped, I think leaflets are worse than posters and they're not allowed phone or email me without consent. What else is left?


  • #75
    ArmaniJeanss
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,513 ✭✭✭✭ArmaniJeanss


    It was said earlier that Germany doesn't have election posters on lamp-posts/poles.
    It might be so in certain regions, but this article has a streetscape of Berlin that looks very like Dublin.

    https://www.npr.org/sections/parallels/2017/09/23/552583400/in-german-election-campaign-posters-are-more-important-than-tv-ads?t=1556182158286


  • #76
    OldGoat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,637 ✭✭✭✭OldGoat


    is_that_so wrote: »
    Most people couldn't tell you where their polling cards are or they may arrive late are so no they are not.
    If people lost their cards is of no consequence to the point at hand, that point being that they know of an election.
    As for cards arriving late I'd be interested in seeing the numbers on that. Is there any evidence of systematic failures in delivering polling cards to the registered addresses in a timely fashion?

    I'm older than Minecraft goats.



  • #77
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    Remind me wrote:
    Most people. Including me don’t want the posters but they are known to work so until banned will be used.


    Actually I don't think they do, considering the environmental implications and the assumed waste of money I think they annoy people more. One candidate I know of has refused to put up posters but engages on the doorstop is getting good traction online and will get a vote from me based on his stance and local policies.


  • #78
    Remind me
    Registered Users Posts: 871 ✭✭✭Remind me


    OldGoat wrote: »
    Yet the vast majority of people do get their cards just fine and have time enough to do a bit of research if they wish to.

    Don't disagree but a candidate will look for any means possible to get elected and posters, currently, are part of that.

    There was a massive reduction in number of posters used during the Presidential election on the back of Gallagher not using them in 2011 a few followed suit but there is a much smaller pool of candidates for a Presidential election and a much bigger platform to be seen.


  • #79
    OldGoat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,637 ✭✭✭✭OldGoat


    Remind me wrote: »
    Don't disagree but a candidate will look for any means possible to get elected and posters, currently, are part of that.
    Herein lies the problem. The only ones who can stop the posters being used are the elected but the elected want the posters despite the wishes of the majority* of the populace. :)

    * I know, I've only mentioned two vox pop polls showing this but they are the only polls that I can find.

    I'm older than Minecraft goats.



  • #80
    expectationlost
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,994 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    can anyone find this video on facebook? Dublin Councillor apologises following 3am incident that 'frightened the life' out of 84-year-old woman https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-news/dublin-councillor-apologises-following-3am-16173869


  • #81
    Marcusm
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,447 ✭✭✭✭Marcusm


    Pembroke electoral area is plastered with unlawfully hung posters, mostly Fine Gael with FF in second place. I guess Fine Gael (esp for James Geoghegan and Paddy McCartan) and Fianna Fáil were later at putting up posters. Some are on traffic barriers and trainings obscuring traffic signs, a road traffic offence not just a littering one. The rest are well below 2.3m with a significant number either at the bottom of the pole or within 1m of the ground.

    This is disgraceful. Passing over Milltown Brudge it’s amazing how few posters are up.


  • Advertisement
  • #82
    jrmb
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 706 ✭✭✭jrmb


    Remind me wrote: »
    This I agree with, similar to what someone said earlier about the Netherlands
    The same in France, and when there's a national election each candidate gets a "5 minutes to convince" slot on TV and radio.

    Maybe an electoral commission could organise something like this on placards and online. You could type your Eircode into a central website and be presented with a portfolio of the people running in each poll. Then you could contact the candidates and watch/read as much or as little about them as you like.


  • #83
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,488 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    OldGoat wrote: »
    Herein lies the problem. The only ones who can stop the posters being used are the elected but the elected want the posters despite the wishes of the majority* of the populace. :)
    Not being smart, but the 'wishes of the majority' in opinion polls means SFA. Most people haven't given the matter any thought or any discussion. They haven't read through the pros and cons. The opinions expressed in the polls are knee jerk reactions, which are not a sound basis for public policy.

    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    One candidate I know of has refused to put up posters but engages on the doorstop is getting good traction online and will get a vote from me based on his stance and local policies.
    Existing Councillor or new candidate?


    Here's a broader perspective on the issue: https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/election-historian-unapologetic-in-his-defence-of-posters-1.3871686


  • #84
    Plumbthedepths
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    AndrewJRenko wrote:
    Existing Councillor or new candidate?


    The son of an existing councillor, so I suppose he has name recognition to a degree. I'm well into my 40's and despise these posters and regularly report any below the minimum height or on ESB poles. I don't vote based on the face I see littering the environment. I actually refuse to vote for them. Funnily enough the same ones who litter the poles are rarely willing to engage on the doorstep.


  • #85
    TallGlass
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,935 ✭✭✭TallGlass


    Out walking tonight, about 5KM, 5/6 posters on the ground, some in front gardens. Noticed one blocking a road sign, wasn't the wind, literally put over the road sign (Wouldn't be surprised if it was done intentionally by another party).

    One or two clearly breaking the height rule consistently/intentionally, mind you nothing dangerous to me, might poke someone in the eye/face if you where not paying attention or blind. Zero attention paid to the ESB asking people not to post these things on the same poles as ESB lines.

    I'd say people wouldn't be half bothered if these people putting them up followed the rules.

    Funny how some posters here are reminding us that they are to signal an election is taking place, yet by the same token, there is zero posters about the referendum that is also taking place (not that I am complaining about it either).


  • #86
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,488 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Plumbthedepths wrote: »
    The son of an existing councillor, so I suppose he has name recognition to a degree..
    Post back after the election and let us know how he got on.


  • #87
    rubadub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,382 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    is_that_so wrote: »
    How would you know there was an election and who's running?

    are you taking the piss?! loads of alternatives, they can advertise like any other entity/company can -some do using bus stop adverts or on those solar power bins.

    if there was no tradition of election posters, here or anywhere, and some politician asked permission for them to go up, even supplying an honest photoshoped impression of what it will look like as.

    0_CC-POSTER90185458.jpg
    Note the ones deliberately designed to mimic statutory road signs.

    image.jpg

    image.jpg

    oh a roudabout, perfect place to distract drivers.
    election%20posters%20kerry%203.jpg

    D5Fk8krUwAEw1Bt.jpg:large
    They would be fcuking torn apart, ridiculed, probably even calls for resignation for such an utterly idiotic and highly dangerous idea!


  • #88
    LorelaiG
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 699 ✭✭✭LorelaiG


    rubadub wrote: »
    are you taking the piss?! loads of alternatives, they can advertise like any other entity/company can -some do using bus stop adverts or on those solar power bins.

    Some candidates cannot afford to advertise alternatively on bus shelters etc. For instance, and this isn't in Dublin City but Fingal so I'm not sure if there's a huge difference elsewhere.

    The local FG candidate has a poster on literally every lamp post around here, on both sides of the road. Whereas the 'smaller' party candidates such as Solidarity, Soc Dems, the Inds have very few. So you can imagine what it would be like if it was bus shelters only etc.


  • #89
    rubadub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,382 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    LorelaiG wrote: »
    . So you can imagine what it would be like if it was bus shelters only etc.
    Yeah, it would be great, no schoolchildren put at risk by been masked by posters at traffic lights which are obscured to cars by posters. No leftover cable ties jutting out into cycletracks at eye height waiting to hit somebody on a bike. None in the rivers, blowing onto windscreens etc.

    They should just have a single booklet organized by the government giving all equal space, this would be posted out to all households which have somebody registered to vote.

    If you want to make it fair then ban any other advertising, no pamphlets in doors or advertising on bus stops. But I think that is too far. As I said before if there was no tradition of posters and it was suggested today, with honest predictions of what will happen, there is no way in hell it would be approved. It is pure madness what is being tolerated -simply because people have grown accustomed to it. They have proven time after time that they cannot behave responsibly, disobeying ESB warnings, creating electrical & fire hazards, pure scumbags.


  • #90
    OldGoat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,637 ✭✭✭✭OldGoat


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    Not being smart, but the 'wishes of the majority' in opinion polls means SFA. Most people haven't given the matter any thought or any discussion. They haven't read through the pros and cons. The opinions expressed in the polls are knee jerk reactions, which are not a sound basis for public policy.]
    As I said in my post there are only two available vox pop polls and both of them show a vast majority in favour of banning the posters. If you can find me any better polls then I'll happily take a look at them.

    It also seems a bit misconstrued to dismiss the polls as 'kneejerk' when the article you point too is basically saying that people only vote in a kneejerk reaction to seeing the face on the poles.

    "Posters work, you can show people what you look like and who you’re standing for." - No policy, no manifesto, just a face and a party name.

    “Face recognition is important, especially for new candidates." Why? Do voters only judge people by their appearance? If this is the case then perhaps having a faceless leaflet with just policy would produce produce more informed voting choice.

    There seems to be two big reasons for perpetuating in this redundant form of politicking, new candidates get a chance and it informs people that a vote is about to occur. On the first point I say that removing all the posters levels the playing field even more such that some candidates having more funding clout then others do not get an unfair advantage. Policy debate would be a better way of removing an incumbent or defend a seat.
    The second point of informing voters that a vote is on the way is already covered with the arrival of polling cards to registered voters, for those who profess to having no other source of local news.


    I understand that Mr. Kinsella is a bit upset that people are trying to get posters banned. It has after-all been his hobby of 40 years to collect them. I too would defend my hobby if people tried to dismiss it as bunkum.

    I'm older than Minecraft goats.



  • Advertisement
  • #91
    LorelaiG
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 699 ✭✭✭LorelaiG


    rubadub wrote: »
    Yeah, it would be great, no schoolchildren put at risk by been masked by posters at traffic lights which are obscured to cars by posters. No leftover cable ties jutting out into cycletracks at eye height waiting to hit somebody on a bike. None in the rivers, blowing onto windscreens etc.

    They should just have a single booklet organized by the government giving all equal space, this would be posted out to all households which have somebody registered to vote.

    If you want to make it fair then ban any other advertising, no pamphlets in doors or advertising on bus stops. But I think that is too far. As I said before if there was no tradition of posters and it was suggested today, with honest predictions of what will happen, there is no way in hell it would be approved. It is pure madness what is being tolerated -simply because people have grown accustomed to it. They have proven time after time that they cannot behave responsibly, disobeying ESB warnings, creating electrical & fire hazards, pure scumbags.

    I get the hazards of posters from a safety point of view. I get it but my point is, the bigger candidates have better means to advertise so I think it needs to be an outright ban of any pole/shelter etc advertising and possibly do as you say. Although it's funny because the ref com books never seem to make it to my house yet my neighbour always gets one, and yes I am registered to vote.


  • #92
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 29,488 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    rubadub wrote: »

    If you want to make it fair then ban any other advertising, no pamphlets in doors or advertising on bus stops.
    Except that doesn't make it fair - that gives a distinct advantage to more established candidates over new candidates, as their faces would be better known. It would also give an advantage to wealthier candidates who can pay for commercial advertising on bus shelters and in local papers over community candidates who couldn't afford this.


    Do we really want to be the best democracy money can buy?


  • #93
    rubadub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,382 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    It would also give an advantage to wealthier candidates who can pay for commercial advertising on bus shelters and in local papers over community candidates who couldn't afford this.
    you were quoting me saying this any other advertising would not be allowed. I did go on to say this might be a step to far but I now think it is not, for the very reasons you and others gave.
    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    Do we really want to be the best democracy money can buy?
    No -If I was a new candidate I would welcome my suggestions, a singular government issued booklet giving equal space in it to all candidates. No other form of advertising allowed like shelters or papers (seeing as some oddballs appear to be ticking a box like its a police lineup or something),. They might find some way to circumvent the law, like this new "public meeting" exploitation, but I think it is great that they are revealing themselves as basically law breakers, obviously going against the intent of the law. With this exploitation they can have posters up 365 days of the year.

    People keep harping on about how posters "work", if some people are so idiotic that they studies are showing they truly do go into polling station and vote thinking number 1 means whose posters I have seen most than this crazy practice needs protecting against! not using this madness as a bloody defense for it!

    At the moment many candidates are showing their complete and utter disrespect for the community, the council safety rules and for the ESB safety rules, which I think have been in place for over a decade now. It is fantastic that they are openly confessing how bad they are, if they do this publicly and are seemingly proud of it, then christ knows what rules, regulations and laws they will be breaking behind closed doors.

    I had started a thread encouraging people to out them in my area, and name & shame them on their twitter accounts. The ESB have great interest on twitter and do appear to have removed some hazardous posters https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057976335


  • #94
    expectationlost
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,994 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    rubadub wrote: »
    you were quoting me saying this any other advertising would not be allowed. I did go on to say this might be a step to far but I now think it is not, for the very reasons you and others gave.


    No -If I was a new candidate I would welcome my suggestions, a singular government issued booklet giving equal space in it to all candidates.
    that would be very complicated and expensive for the local elections for the government, would the gov increase candidate registration fee to cover it?


  • #95
    OldGoat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,637 ✭✭✭✭OldGoat


    expectationlost wrote: »
    that would be very complicated and expensive for the local elections for the government, would the gov increase candidate registration fee to cover it?
    A quoted estimate of the number of posters for one candidate is 600. An estimate for the price of each poster is €5.00. Lets be conservative and estimate 400 posters at €2.5 for each candidate. I think that might cover the costs and then some.

    EDIT: Adding a link.
    An article from a couple of years ago estimating the numbers - https://www.thejournal.ie/poster-costs-election-2016-2587221-Feb2016/

    I'm older than Minecraft goats.



  • #96
    L1011
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 69,588 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    OldGoat wrote: »
    A quoted estimate of the number of posters for one candidate is 600. An estimate for the price of each poster is €5.00. Lets be conservative and estimate 400 posters at €2.5 for each candidate. I think that might cover the costs and then some.

    So candidates who don't currently poster at all would be required to pay as if they did? Would be one way of reducing some of the loons, admittedly, but would fail any test of basic democracy.


  • Advertisement
  • #97
    rubadub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,382 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    expectationlost wrote: »
    that would be very complicated and expensive for the local elections for the government, would the gov increase candidate registration fee to cover it?
    I believe the candidates all already have an allowance of 1 leaflet in the post, so it would save on postage of all of them by just sending 1, the candidates currently pay for production of their own leaflet and it would likely be cheaper to chip in an pay towards a complete booklet if they had to.

    The government would save a fortune on cleanup. Loads of dangerous posters have been removed on my commute, presumably by the council and I have not heard of the parties having to pay for it. Then they will also have to clean up all the left over cable ties that the parties leave behind too when the posters do have to officially be taken down. The ESB have to spend money assessing all the poles for damage, many have been removed from poles and new ones go up, so it can be mulitple checks per election.

    And of course it is NOT just election time anymore. They have given themselves the right to have what are in effect election posters up 365 days a year now, just but having "public meeting" in tiny writing somewhere on them.


  • #98
    OldGoat
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,637 ✭✭✭✭OldGoat


    L1011 wrote: »
    So candidates who don't currently poster at all would be required to pay as if they did? Would be one way of reducing some of the loons, admittedly, but would fail any test of basic democracy.
    I dearly wish that just putting a cash price on running for office would rule out the loonies, but sadly they seem to be better funded these days. :)
    Candidates already have to stump up money to be eligible to run. Is that undemocratic in your view too?

    Any candidate currently not using posters is doing so for one of two likely reasons. 1, they are standing on a green issue or 2, they cannot afford to poster at the same rate as the larger better funded parties.
    In the first case I assume the candidate would be happy to see all posters removed. In the second case the poor of pocket candidates would be on a level par with the better funded candidates thus equalling them.
    It seems to me that both cases would favour the idea of a single publication.

    I'm older than Minecraft goats.



  • #99
    expectationlost
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,994 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    OldGoat wrote: »
    A quoted estimate of the number of posters for one candidate is 600. An estimate for the price of each poster is €5.00. Lets be conservative and estimate 400 posters at €2.5 for each candidate. I think that might cover the costs and then some.

    EDIT: Adding a link.
    An article from a couple of years ago estimating the numbers - https://www.thejournal.ie/poster-costs-election-2016-2587221-Feb2016/
    ...for the government...


  • #100
    expectationlost
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,994 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    OldGoat wrote: »
    I dearly wish that just putting a cash price on running for office would rule out the loonies, but sadly they seem to be better funded these days. :)
    Candidates already have to stump up money to be eligible to run. Is that undemocratic in your view too?

    Any candidate currently not using posters is doing so for one of two likely reasons. 1, they are standing on a green issue or 2, they cannot afford to poster at the same rate as the larger better funded parties.
    In the first case I assume the candidate would be happy to see all posters removed. In the second case the poor of pocket candidates would be on a level par with the better funded candidates thus equalling them.
    It seems to me that both cases would favour the idea of a single publication.
    if you ban all other commercial political advertising


  • #101
    expectationlost
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,994 ✭✭✭✭expectationlost


    rubadub wrote: »
    I believe the candidates all already have an allowance of 1 leaflet in the post
    for the locals?


  • Advertisement
Advertisement