Where would you go next...

drunkmonkey · 29-11-2015 9:11pm

How abou this http://www.driving.ie/used-cars/BMW/5-Series/530-D/43713953972050240/

I'm not changing for another year but if I was changing now I'd be buying that.

vintagevrs · 29-11-2015 9:13pm

Or....what he said :->

MarkN · 29-11-2015 10:04pm

vintagevrs wrote: »

That really isn't true.

It pretty much is. Just going on the simple monthly cost, assuming you have a deposit, it can be very close at the very least.

There are some exceptions, I looked at a 2011 520d on Fri, it's €31,000. If I put €5,000/6000 deposit in, it was around €560 per month on 7% APR. But you can currently buy a new 520d with 3.9% so you have to spend €60,000, only actually pay off probably 50% of that in the PCP deal but it would still be a good bit dearer per month unless I had €10-18,000 to sink into it in a deposit. Personally, I think the sacrifices in saving that amount only to put it into a depreciating asset is a bit mad but I could go into a VW dealer with the much lower rate and cheaper car and have a brand new Golf GTI for less per month than a 4 year old 520d. Similarly if you're buying a new car for 50k but a used model that's a year old is 42k, you'll still probably be able to buy the newer one for less as manufacturers traditionally only do the lowest rates on brand new cars.

carsfan · 29-11-2015 10:20pm

MarkN I understand your point but if you buy the used car you will own it once it is paid off and if you keep it you aren't making any more payments. With the new car you own nothing after the 3 years and have to come up with the gfv or start new pcp and hence keep paying out.
Really depends on what you want and whether shelling out each month bothers you or not.

vintagevrs · 29-11-2015 10:37pm

Fellas, you can not buy a new car for less money than a 2 to 3 year old car of same make/spec. You may well be able to pay the same monthly repayments but those are very different things.

The finance rate on the older car will be higher but it does not off set the depreciation you will be hit with on the new car.

However, where this can come close is with a pre reg demo car with 1000km on the clock. The dealer can't offer the lowest finance rate as it's not a "new" car so the small saving made from buying the demo can be offset by the lower finance rate if the cost of the car is high enough. 4% apr difference on a 50K car could be around 3 to 4 thousand euro. Meaning buying the demo makes little sense. Not the same with a 2 to 3 year old car though.

MarkN · 29-11-2015 10:52pm

vintagevrs wrote: »

Fellas, you can not buy a new car for less money than a 2 to 3 year old car of same make/spec. You may well be able to pay the same monthly repayments but those are very different things.

The finance rate on the older car will be higher but it does not off set the depreciation you will be hit with on the new car.

That's true but I did say in my last post that taking the simple monthly cost, you can do it for the same. That of course doesn't factor in depreciation. I suppose the whole point of PCP is you don't really have to worry about depreciation.

You're right Carsfan - you can also refinance the GFV though if you wish to keep the car in which case you would eventually own it, not sure if that route would work out dearer than a traditional 60 payment hire purchase though. Personally, ownership of the car doesn't bother me. Any new car I've bought I've never kept it long enough to own it outright so PCP wouldn't be any different in my case.

bazz26 · 29-11-2015 11:19pm

On a side note 31k for a 2011 F10 is nuts unless it's a 530d/535d.

MarkN · 29-11-2015 11:24pm

bazz26 wrote: »

On a side note 31k for a 2011 F10 is nuts unless it's a 530d/535d.

BMW main dealer, you know yourself :rolleyes:

bazz26 · 29-11-2015 11:41pm

True that.

carsfan · 30-11-2015 11:47am

How about the new model A4 saloon or avant on a pcp?
Comes with a 3.0 tdi Quattro for low fifties I think.
Quick and economical and will be sought after second hand so should keep some value.

MarkN · 30-11-2015 12:51pm

I do like an estate these days - in the right car of course. My main worry with an Audi is the lack of RWD. Visually though they are on the money with a lot of the new stuff. The new A4 was inside T2 in Dublin the other night and it looked well in grey with kind of think spoke alloys. Obviously if they're doing lower rate PCP than BMW then they have to be considered.

Big Nasty · 30-11-2015 2:33pm

Avant Quattro FTW!

macjohn · 20-12-2015 8:49pm

OP - did you buy after? Was following the thread with interest.

I am in a similarish situation, in that am very fond of my current 2010 F10 and may replace it with similar( but wouldn't consider the a4 ) . However, for my circumstances the BMW pcp doesn't seem to work as very little between the gmfv and the actual future value.
So looking at trading in my 2010 F10 now but in three years time would have to come up with another large cash deposit. (Anyways I think your originally thread got derailed with talk of pcp and here I am doing it again!!)

Anyways like yourself looking at options - did you or others consider the new model XF. Its seems to get positive reviews.
Seems like the highest spec "Portfolio is coming in under €50k so with a few extras probably a few grand cheaper than the F10.

(I took the XF figure from here http://www.independent.ie/life/motoring/car-news/jaguars-new-xf-saloon-leads-charge-of-light-brigade-34167700.html )

drunkmonkey · 20-12-2015 9:29pm

New E class on the way as well,

One car we've forgot about is the Ghibli but I'd dread to think of the VRT on a used one.

New 5 series should be revealed in 2016 as well, wonder will it hurt resale values.

macjohn · 20-12-2015 10:37pm

drunkmonkey wrote: »

New E class on the way as well,

One car we've forgot about is the Ghibli but I'd dread to think of the VRT on a used one.

New 5 series should be revealed in 2016 as well, wonder will it hurt resale values.

I think the new 5 series is revelled late next year but wont be available until 2017.
Aesthetically expecting it will link with the 3 and 7 with stuff like
- the headlights going right into the grill
- the new type screen for the nav like what is on the 3 and 7
- gesture controls

Dont know about the underpinnings. Expect significant enough developments around the handling/dealing with poor road conditions.

Dont think it will be a revolutionary change like from the e63 to the f10 so it may not overly hurt resale values of the F10

Donnelly117 · 20-12-2015 10:43pm

I think the Jag XF sportbrake is a fantastic looking machine! Not really sure what engines it cones with though!

drunkmonkey · 20-12-2015 10:45pm

That screen sticking out of the dashboard? Not sure I like the new nose at all, it's going a bit like Toyotas, the current 7 series looks like a brute in comparison.

macjohn · 20-12-2015 10:55pm

drunkmonkey wrote: »

That screen sticking out of the dashboard? Not sure I like the new nose at all, it's going a bit like Toyotas, the current 7 series looks like a brute in comparison.

Ya, afraid so - its only conjecture yet though.
I have read that the marketing people feel the screen sticking out is a more sleek/mod look and that the "in dash" is now a dated look!!!

Thats gas I have often thought that about the new 7. Looks a pure brute from the front.
Hope the replacement 5 wont be as bad.

carsfan · 20-12-2015 11:30pm

I've seen spy shot photos of the interior of the forthcoming 5 series and it does have the screen the same as the new 7.
I also think you can tell exactly what the car will look like from the new 7 as it will be a smaller version of it. I think they are aiming to cut a lot of weight from it and I expect 520d will continue to be the big seller here.

bazz26 · 20-12-2015 11:59pm

I have an F10 520d and it is a heavy car, the current trend is to make cars shed kg to increase fuel efficiency. I expect the F10's replacement to weigh a lot less.

I'll be changing mine sometime in 2016 and am still debating what to replace it with.

MarkN · 02-01-2016 2:26am

Hi Macjohn - not yet no. I may move mid 2016 so was starting to look around basically.

Got a quote for a new F10 with nice spec and it was basically €720 per month AFTER giving a €9,000 deposit. Then to change in 3 years to the new model 5 series I would need to give €3000 deposit to keep the repayments the same. That was based on the 3.9% current rate. Just far more than I'm willing to commit to these days, I've had an M3 that was more than my mortgage every month but I'm not a single 20 something anymore so for now anyway, I think me and BMW will only happen if I stick with used.

carsfan · 02-01-2016 11:04am

Was that f10 a 520d or something more powerful?
Did you get a figure for a 4 gran coupe?

MarkN · 02-01-2016 12:08pm

520d yep. Didn't get a quote on this occasion for the 4 but I did in the summer and an SE with auto and 19s was €726 with a deposit of 5k but I think that was with the discounted rate they were doing at the time on the 4. It would seem it's a significantly cheaper cost per month to buy a new Audi at the moment versus BMW.

drunkmonkey · 02-01-2016 2:36pm

It's a lot to be putting out over month for a new one and a new one just around the corner.

Mark you seem to know a bit about them what do you think that's worth http://www.driving.ie/used-cars/BMW/5-Series/530-D/43713953972050240/ I linked to it earlier on.
I've a 07 530d Se with only 108mls on it, finding it hard to justify jumping 4 years and spending the bones of 25k with my own. Is that car way over valued?

bazz26 · 02-01-2016 3:27pm

F10 530ds are rare here and as such asking silly money. Main dealers are still looking for around the 50k mark for 3 year old examples. While the 530d is obviously superior to a 520d it's very hard to justify the 10k or more premiums being asked for them over a similar 520d.

carsfan · 02-01-2016 3:42pm

The strength of sterling makes it less viable to import one of these which makes the 530d a rarer car here and as such dealers ask silly money for them. Over here that are an enthusiasts car as opposed to the Everyman 520 so they know they will get a buyer.

With regard to markn's quote for a 520d new, I presume that is 3.9 per cent they are advertising ? It is a lot of money to shell out every month to use what is admittedly a nice car but not special enough to justify in my opinion. A loan to buy a 2 year old one would make more sense if that is what you were after.

MarkN · 02-01-2016 5:20pm

drunkmonkey wrote: »

It's a lot to be putting out over month for a new one and a new one just around the corner.

Mark you seem to know a bit about them what do you think that's worth http://www.driving.ie/used-cars/BMW/5-Series/530-D/43713953972050240/ I linked to it earlier on.
I've a 07 530d Se with only 108mls on it, finding it hard to justify jumping 4 years and spending the bones of 25k with my own. Is that car way over valued?

25k and your own, I don't know if I'd do that myself. It's not that the price is particularly bad, there's plenty of dealers looking for that money for a 2011 520d and you'd be getting a 530 but for me, it would need to be a 535 to think about it in more detail.

That particular garage seems to sit on stock for a very, very long time. They had (might still have) a 635d for what seemed like over a year so maybe if you went and offered what you think is your best price it would be worth a shot. I will say that the F10 is a nicely evolved car from the E60 having owned both.

drunkmonkey · 02-01-2016 11:42pm

There are no 535d's haven't seen one come up in a long time, my 530d has buckets of power standard mode not to mention when flicking it into sport. Hard enough trying to get through a 50km zone as it is.
Yea that cars been sitting there a long time, surprised considering what it is, maybe the €500 tax is putting people off..

bazz26 · 03-01-2016 2:29pm

I don't think it's the tax that's putting people off, I think just that the market for these cars is small, your average Irish motorist just doesn't see the need for a 3.0 litre engine.

I'd say this low mileage 535d is probably being traded against a new one, main dealer so expect mental money on it:

http://www.driving.ie/used-cars/BMW/5-Series/535d-M/201814507842983540/

carsfan · 03-01-2016 3:16pm

I reckon Morrisons will want 40k odd for that 535d
mad but they will price it high as they can afford to wait even if they eventually come down a bit.

drunkmonkey · 03-01-2016 4:26pm

There trade in values are horrendous, priced mine against a 2012 520d m sport and they were allowing me 3k as a trade in, that's for a mint 07 530d, LCI, which had 102k on the clock with a full Bmw service history and no discount off the sticker price on the 2012, he seemed more interested in pcp, don't think he figured out I was trying to buy a car off him, was even offering pcp on the 2012. Told him numerous times pcp won't suit with my mileage but he just wasn't getting it.

carsfan · 03-01-2016 5:12pm

In effect they were offering you zero for your car as they have a large margin in second hands and they give up Some of that to value your trade in. They would never retail your car themselves because of its age regardless of its history or condition and would sell it on in the trade. They know they can get top money for used 520 d models so wouldn't try too hard to do a deal I would guess.
Defo better selling yourself in that instance

MarkN · 03-01-2016 11:04pm

3k?! I'll give you 4

drunkmonkey · 04-01-2016 3:30pm

carsfan wrote: »

I reckon Morrisons will want 40k odd for that 535d

38.5k

drunkmonkey · 04-01-2016 3:30pm

MarkN wrote: »

3k?! I'll give you 4

Put another 6 with it:)

carsfan · 04-01-2016 5:47pm

I wasn't far off with my guesstimate. Presume you get a bmw premium 2 year warranty for that.
Are you interested?

drunkmonkey · 04-01-2016 6:38pm

carsfan wrote: »

I wasn't far off with my guesstimate. Presume you get a bmw premium 2 year warranty for that.
Are you interested?

It's too far of a stretch for an 11, the 530d above would be of more interest.
Wonder when's the best time to buy, I presume over the next couple of months there will be a good lot of 11/12 stock arriving back in showrooms. Has to be more than 2 x 2011 3.0L msports in the country.

carsfan · 11-01-2016 3:01pm

Morrisons have that 2011 535d up on carzone for 39995 now.
I've noticed that a couple of secondhand cars I was looking at have actually gone up in price in the last few weeks, a 3 year old merc cls and another 5 series.
Must be a lack of good stock out there,

drunkmonkey · 11-01-2016 8:06pm

There's another 535 in tractor motors in blanch for €7000 less than morrisons.

MarkN · 11-01-2016 9:48pm

It's POA now!

drunkmonkey · 12-01-2016 7:41pm

MarkN wrote: »

It's POA now!

32,999

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/bmw-5-series-535d-m-sport/11236799

I thought it was on driving.ie but it's not there now, did you buy it?:)

Just noticed the roof and bonnet are carbon wrapped, ohh and those alloys, who was driving this, el chapo?

carsfan · 12-01-2016 10:24pm

Those "modifications" would make me worry a little as to the life the car may have had.
Have you thought about an A6 Quattro 3.0 tdi?
There are a few for sale 2013 / 2014. Would be a lovely subtle performance car that can pretty much do it all.

MarkN · 12-01-2016 11:12pm

Love the look of the A6 with the black edition spec. I may well venture to the dark (Audi) side for the next car alright. Must test drive one because I haven't before. Guy I know has a 2015 A6 Avant S-Line, 20" wheels, it looks the business.

bazz26 · 13-01-2016 12:26am

Quattro is now available on the 2.0 TDi now too.

MarkN · 13-02-2016 10:57pm

Test drove this today. I haven't driven the MK7 GTI but regardless, I was surprised at how different I imagine the power delivery is in this. Brutal is the only word

Even with 5K down for a new one, it's still €787 per month on PCP and I feel it's a a bit too much.

http://www.carzone.ie/used-cars/volkswagen/golf/used-2016-161-volkswagen-golf-r-2-0ts-dublin-fpa-200914549452523880

colm_mcm · 13-02-2016 11:10pm

those seats

vintagevrs · 13-02-2016 11:12pm

That monthly rate looks to be too high to me.

5000+(36*787)+17000ish(GFMV)= €50,332

Maybe you ticked plenty of options!

MarkN · 13-02-2016 11:32pm

vintagevrs wrote: »

That monthly rate looks to be too high to me.

5000+(36*787)+17000ish(GFMV)= €50,332

Maybe you ticked plenty of options!

781 PM actually, I just checked again. Sunroof and a few other bits but nothing crazy. Cost of credit 1600/1700 so the figures are the right ones. Just seems high. Super fun to drive though!

vintagevrs · 13-02-2016 11:35pm

Yeah my initial reaction was they were high, but as you say look spot on. I would have loved a sunroof but couldn't justify the expense. They look the business.

carsfan · 14-02-2016 12:10am

Any extras like sunroof, leather etc. push the monthly payment up a lot as they do not add anything to the gfv and are paid for in full over the 3 year pcp period.
I think white suits the gti better than the R but I love those pretoria alloys.

Where would you go next...

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