Bank of Ireland shares

BrokenArrows · 24-06-2016 9:00am

alb wrote: »

Bought some yesterday at .22

I hope you cashed out on your 10%

BrokenArrows · 24-06-2016 9:00am

popa smurf wrote: »

The bit I don't understand who would go out and sell shares today

Fear of it getting worse.

alb · 24-06-2016 12:13pm

BrokenArrows wrote: »

I hope you cashed out on your 10%

It was more like 20% by the end of yesterday, but unfortunately I didn't sell. Was always prepared to hold longer term if the vote was 'leave'.

Hollister11 · 24-06-2016 3:13pm

Where is the safest or most reputable place the buy shares ?

BOI shares are down to .20c I wan't some of that action.

24-06-2016 4:41pm

alb wrote: »

It was more like 20% by the end of yesterday, but unfortunately I didn't sell. Was always prepared to hold longer term if the vote was 'leave'.

It's only a loss if your sell, the current price is as meaningless as the 10% gain you made a few days ago in a single day

daheff · 24-06-2016 5:12pm

Augeo wrote: »

It's only a loss if your sell, the current price is as meaningless as the 10% gain you made a few days ago in a single day

Not if you are leveraging your equity like some trading houses do.

Also some investors are more disciplined in their trading. They will close a position based off a movement of X%, or some who will only buy shares if the stock is part of a specific index (eg fund managers). If a price drops and the stock falls out of the index, then the fund manager would sell the stock, regardless of whether its a loss or a profit for them.

24-06-2016 5:39pm

daheff wrote: »

Not if you are leveraging your equity like some trading houses do.

Also some investors are more disciplined in their trading. They will close a position based off a movement of X%, or some who will only buy shares if the stock is part of a specific index (eg fund managers). If a price drops and the stock falls out of the index, then the fund manager would sell the stock, regardless of whether its a loss or a profit for them.

Cheers

I'm pretty sure none of that applies to alb, who my post referred to.

StyleKillah · 26-06-2016 9:08pm

As Bank Of Ireland is nearly a penny stock is it a good long term investment or is everyone treating it like a penny stock to try and get quick and big returns? I'm worried about the liquidity of it if something happened and needed to sell!

Morningstar surprisingly puts it nearly at a buy at 3.7/5

I'm considering it because of talks they will begin dividends next year with nearly a 5% yield.

BrokenArrows · 27-06-2016 9:42am

down another 16% to 0.18

Grecco · 27-06-2016 10:05am

BoI is still a very risky stock, the UK will no longer have to prop up any more of these EU zombie banks. It now looks like another financial crises is developing.

ranger4 · 27-06-2016 2:59pm

18c support well and truly broke, next support range 0.1630 however i expect sp to retrace to 0.15 soon.

draiochtanois · 27-06-2016 4:36pm

This post has been deleted.

P_Cash · 27-06-2016 4:42pm

Half of the balance sheet is in £ hence slide

draiochtanois · 27-06-2016 4:43pm

This post has been deleted.

BrokenArrows · 27-06-2016 5:35pm

P_Cash wrote: »

Half of the balance sheet is in £ hence slide

Even if that were true the £ has only slid by 7.5%. BOI is down about 35%.
Im keeping an eye to see what it does.

draiochtanois · 27-06-2016 5:37pm

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Roonbox · 27-06-2016 6:03pm

All European banks are taking a hammering.
There may be a visit to the 2009 lows here for B Of I

Hollister11 · 27-06-2016 6:05pm

Is there a minimum amount you have to spend when buying shares,

BrokenArrows · 27-06-2016 6:15pm

Hollister11 wrote: »

Is there a minimum amount you have to spend when buying shares,

In theory no. But in practice you need to buy enough so that the fees involves in buying/selling makes profit obtainable and reasonable.

For example it might cost you €50 in fees to buy and sell.
So if you buy €100 worth of shares you need to make 50% just to break even. But if you buy €5000 worth of shares you just need to make 1% to break even.

iamfromcork · 27-06-2016 8:32pm

If they hit under .10 I'll be buying again. Sold at .34 the last time but it was by chance as i wanted to invest in something else.

iainBB · 27-06-2016 8:44pm

Stay well away from
one penny stock
. two banks.
And three Irish stock right now.

We are at the beginning of a bear market now. It could swing back to bull but stay out or be very short in them.

lucky john · 28-06-2016 12:07am

BrokenArrows wrote: »

Even if that were true the £ has only slid by 7.5%. BOI is down about 35%.
Im keeping an eye to see what it does.

Its about 40% turnover and 16% profit. bank holds about 9 billion UK government bonds as well . In H1 a 7% drop in stg rate took 3billion euro from the banks deposit base.
Markets seem to be pricing in a UK and possible EU implosion.

Amirani · 29-06-2016 11:05pm

P_Cash wrote: »

Half of the balance sheet is in £ hence slide

40% of balance sheet but 50% of resi mortgages.

Amirani · 29-06-2016 11:07pm

draiochtanois wrote: »

What is your source for that?

Annual report always useful. Any of the rating agencies/investor research would call it out too if you have access.

newacc2015 · 30-06-2016 10:57pm

It is weird how stocks have been rallying for 3 days on the probably of the UK not actually leaving the EU, while the share price of BOI has flat lined. Two directors brought shares at 19 cent each on Wednesday, so maybe there is some chance of a rally

BOE is expecting to cut their interest rates in Q3, so having £9bn in bonds isnt entirely a bad thing as the bonds will rise in value.

iainBB · 30-06-2016 11:01pm

newacc2015 wrote: »

It is weird how stocks have been rallying for 3 days on the probably of the UK not actually leaving the EU, while the share price of BOI has flat lined. Two directors brought shares at 19 cent each on Wednesday, so maybe there is some chance of a rally

BOE is expecting to cut their interest rates in Q3, so having £9bn in bonds isnt entirely a bad thing as the bonds will rise in value.

Stock are up the last 3 day due artificial government intervention QE . promising federal rates unchanged. And bond buying.

But banks are a different story.

Hollister11 · 30-06-2016 11:02pm

So over the next 2-3 years should these shares go up or down.

Francie Barrett · 01-07-2016 8:55am

newacc2015 wrote: »

Two directors brought shares at 19 cent each on Wednesday, so maybe there is some chance of a rally

More shares bought on Thursday.

Personally while I don't own Bank of Ireland, I did buy other bank shares this week (I have them coming out of my ears now). Bank of Ireland looks cheap, but I think there are others out there that can give a 100% return. Having said that, as a tactical trade, Bank of Ireland could be worth looking at.

Bank of Ireland should earn about €800-€900M for 2016 with market cap of €6bn. Current environment is awful, but surely if you bought now and hung on for 10x earnings, you could potentially get out of this in maybe 6 months time with a 50% profit when all the Brexit thing dies down.

If you had a long term view (2 years+), you could buy now with the expectation that dividends will be back by the end of that period. You could be looking at a 10% dividend yield on a purchase price of today at that point.

iainBB · 01-07-2016 7:29pm

Don't buy because it's cheap now. It's cheap for a reason. There are better returns else where for your hard earned cash.

YES it will go up but way to slow for my money.

The question is not will the go up or down but how fast will i get an return and the answer is way to slow.
2 year return I would want and get 15% and 25% return before tax. I will not get that from the bank.

Avoid irish banks and invest in good companies or funds. For faster return.

Islander13 · 01-07-2016 9:51pm

iainBB wrote: »

Don't buy because it's cheap now. It's cheap for a reason. There are better returns else where for your hard earned cash.

YES it will go up but way to slow for my money.

The question is not will the go up or down but how fast will i get an return and the answer is way to slow.
2 year return I would want and get 15% and 25% return before tax. I will not get that from the bank.

Avoid irish banks and invest in good companies or funds. For faster return.

What absolute drivel

iainBB · 01-07-2016 9:55pm

Islander13 wrote: »

What absolute drivel

Ha which bit?

iainBB · 01-07-2016 10:22pm

Buying high risk penny stock is a good idea?
Buying banks linked to EU / UK dept risk
Buying because the look cheap.
Buy and hold and hope for 2 plus year you get a return?
Buy stock you have no idea about?

Investment is about planing knowing you area. Buy good companies on the up, new products Growth. Change of management etc.
Technical analysis is good and sales and QR/QR EPS up.

Putting 10k for example into bank of Ireland for 2 year on a wing and pray is madness.
Put it into a wide spread high divided yield etf/etn if you don't know what you are doing and I guess you don't based on the question.

Grecco · 02-07-2016 6:16pm

iainBB wrote: »

Buying high risk penny stock is a good idea?
Buying banks linked to EU / UK dept risk
Buying because the look cheap.
Buy and hold and hope for 2 plus year you get a return?
Buy stock you have no idea about?

Investment is about planing knowing you area. Buy good companies on the up, new products Growth. Change of management etc.
Technical analysis is good and sales and QR/QR EPS up.

Putting 10k for example into bank of Ireland for 2 year on a wing and pray is madness.
Put it into a wide spread high divided yield etf/etn if you don't know what you are doing and I guess you don't based on the question.

Fair points but I think you are being overly negative towards BOI
Every Bank has Debt, that`s the business get over it.
Market cap of under 6 billion yet they will have an operating profit over 1.2 billion this year.
Bad loan book isnt looking anywhere near as bad as first thought, many of these bad loans are now performing.
The cherry on the cake now is it looks like there maybe a second Brexit referendum in the UK. Forget the doom stayers and Don`t miss this opportunity.

Francie Barrett · 02-07-2016 8:40pm

iainBB wrote: »

Buying high risk penny stock is a good idea?

A share price isn't really an indication of quality.

iainBB wrote: »

Buying banks linked to EU / UK dept risk

The hit to sterling and the coming blip for the UK economy doesn't justify the collapse of the share price in my opinion.

iainBB wrote: »

Buying because the look cheap.

Well you hardly want to buy them when they look dear!

iainBB wrote: »

Buy and hold and hope for 2 plus year you get a return?

Yep. I think this one is worth book value of 27c and reckon at some point in the next 2 years, the share price will match that number. Excluding dividends, that's a 50% return.

Grecco · 02-07-2016 9:30pm

Francie Barrett wrote: »

. Excluding dividends, that's a 50% return.

Dividends from this bank will be significant over the next 5 years, in fact they are going to be a source of public anger as they milk the public for more profits.
Good for share holders though

newacc2015 · 03-07-2016 10:22am

iainBB wrote: »

Buying high risk penny stock is a good idea?
Buying banks linked to EU / UK dept risk
Buying because the look cheap.
Buy and hold and hope for 2 plus year you get a return?
Buy stock you have no idea about?

Investment is about planing knowing you area. Buy good companies on the up, new products Growth. Change of management etc.
Technical analysis is good and sales and QR/QR EPS up.

Putting 10k for example into bank of Ireland for 2 year on a wing and pray is madness.
Put it into a wide spread high divided yield etf/etn if you don't know what you are doing and I guess you don't based on the question.

It is only a penny stock, as it is the way the shares are structured from the state investment in it. Do you think BOI should merge 100 for 1 new share to have a more 'feel good' factor for investors like you?

Do you know what country has the most profitable new mortgages in Europe? Dodgy holes like Slovakia? Czech Republic? Poland? No it is Ireland by a fair bit. Irish banks are being compensated for 'risk' more so than banks in far riskier countries. Ireland has the lowest interest rates on deposits in Europe. We have some of the most expensive car loans and SME loans in Europe. Banking is highly profitable in Ireland

BOI is one of the few banks in Europe, that has tidied up with their balance sheet. Banks in Italy, Austria and Spain have yet to deal with a ton of bad loans on their book. BOI does not have that problem

Growth of a bank stock with new products? Do you understand what banking is? It is not like Apple where they can change the industry with a new product. BOI and AIB basically have a duopoly on banking in Ireland. A monopoly should be trading more than a PE of 7. Even higher risk US regional banks have a PE of about 20-25.

intellectual dosser · 06-07-2016 9:13am

Im not big into following or understanding markets but I do have some BOI shares and have watched them fall from high 30's to dipping just under 17 this morning (Got in low 20's two years ago).

The news on the UK economy yesterday was fairly startling, its going to take banks in London months to raise the cash to pay investors who want their money out. What is this going to trigger? It does have a shuddering familiarity to it.

So my dilema is, do I sell now at a roughly 25% loss or risk it all and hope for the best.

draiochtanois · 06-07-2016 9:28am

This post has been deleted.

Hollister11 · 06-07-2016 5:19pm

Closed at.16c

Roonbox · 06-07-2016 6:02pm

intellectual dosser wrote: »

Im not big into following or understanding markets but I do have some BOI shares and have watched them fall from high 30's to dipping just under 17 this morning (Got in low 20's two years ago).

The news on the UK economy yesterday was fairly startling, its going to take banks in London months to raise the cash to pay investors who want their money out. What is this going to trigger? It does have a shuddering familiarity to it.

So my dilema is, do I sell now at a roughly 25% loss or risk it all and hope for the best.

Markets are forward looking and the info that you have is widely available and so already priced in.
Buy low and sell high.
It sounds easy but its not.

Hollister11 · 02-08-2016 2:23pm

Trading at 16 cent atm.

BrokenArrows · 02-08-2016 3:13pm

Hollister11 wrote: »

Trading at 16 cent atm.

Id love to invest, but i live in the UK so i just know any profits will be destroyed when the GBP recovers against the euro. I dont see the GBPEUR going much below 1.18. So its only downside for me.

daheff · 02-08-2016 4:45pm

BrokenArrows wrote: »

Id love to invest, but i live in the UK so i just know any profits will be destroyed when the GBP recovers against the euro. I dont see the GBPEUR going much below 1.18. So its only downside for me.

well do you think that the BOI share price will underperform vs GBP recovery?

I see well over 100% (medium term) price increase for BOI (it was priced as high as 38c last july 15) -I dont see that recovery for GBP (if any recovery over the next 2-3 years!).

newacc2015 · 02-08-2016 10:16pm

I think there is a lot of irrational fear regarding the bank. The bank loan book is pretty decent compared to many European banks. It got real a long time ago and start cutting impaired loans. Where as German and Italian banks are pretending all the **** on their books is still golden. Look at Italian banks, they have no real future. Italy is turning into Japan ie a stagnating Europe with no real future. At least BOI has the potential to lend in the fastest growing economy in Europe

Like consumer borrowing has risen for the first time in nearly a decade this quarter in Ireland. BOI has the potential to be great in the near time. The markets are just spooked.

A few on the board brought shares at 19c after Brexit, so they obviously believe in BOI rising in the medium term

BrokenArrows · 09-08-2016 10:09am

BrokenArrows wrote: »

Id love to invest, but i live in the UK so i just know any profits will be destroyed when the GBP recovers against the euro. I dont see the GBPEUR going much below 1.18. So its only downside for me.

Im an idiot!!! Haha.

daheff · 09-08-2016 3:25pm

BrokenArrows wrote: »

Im an idiot!!! Haha.

nah. everybody needs to bounce ideas around with others...thats what this forum is for. :cool:

Sometimes what you think is brilliant others can pick a gaping hole in that you missed.

Grecco · 31-08-2016 5:35pm

Market has gone Bullish on BOI again. I can see this heading back over the 30s again before long

DeiseMan4 · 31-08-2016 5:45pm

25 years? Put it in the S&P 500. Look at the CAGR (~10%), really high. Use dollar-cost averaging and by putting it into a retirement fund like Davy or Vanguard (Recommend) where it rolls-over and you can't take it out you are set!

daheff · 01-09-2016 1:49pm

Grecco wrote: »

Market has gone Bullish on BOI again. I can see this heading back over the 30s again before long

about time... :cool:

01-09-2016 8:42pm

...... recovery from the 16c post Brexit vote low to 20c ..... correction to an overreaction. Probably see over 25c this side of Christmas.

Bank of Ireland shares

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