Recommend electric folding scooter for end of commute (Mod Note Post #1)

goz83 · 17-05-2018 12:40am #1

Mod Note: I've discussed with site admins, due to the current legal situation recommendations cannot be made for use of electric scooters on public roads in Ireland, but can be made for use on private property. However, we will allow discussion of e-scooters for purchase for use on private property, and other jurisdictions such as France/Germany where they are legal for use. This restriction will be lifted as soon as the legal situation changes, which will hopefully be soon.

I was thinking of getting one of those xiaomi m365 folding scooters to cover the last 5 kilometres of the journey as I come into the city and traffic gets mad. I am looking for peoples experiences with them.

I understand they are in a bit of a legal grey area, but you need to push this scooter to get going, so technically it doesn’t operate on mechanical power alone which is what the rsa site mentions as the definition of an mpv.

I’ll be travelling about 15km each way from urban to city. Due to a back injury, I can’t spend an hour stuck in traffic twice per day. I can’t tolerate public transport and it would be much more expensive (over €100 per month, compared to about €5 per month in my Leaf and m365).

So, my plan would be to drive about 10km and park the car before hitting the city centre. Parking would be free as I would be well outside the cc. I would then scoot the rest of the way to my destination and do the reverse on my return journey. I wouldn’t be stuck in traffic for too long and the range of the scooter should easily cover the return journey without destination charging. The scooter will cost around €400 to buy and claims 30km per charge...I am expecting 15.

What do you think?

ED E · 17-05-2018 12:47am

Add the points up for driving a totally undocumented vehicle and then decide if you want to gamble that you don't meet an RPU Garda that's up on the statute.

jimmycrackcorm · 17-05-2018 1:03am

ED E wrote: »

Add the points up for driving a totally undocumented vehicle and then decide if you want to gamble that you don't meet an RPU Garda that's up on the statute.

Under what SI exactly?

unkel · 17-05-2018 1:45am

Sounds like a pain driving 10km, then finding (free) parking. Then getting the scooter out for the next 5 km. And all of it in reverse back home in the evening.

Is there no bigger range EV 2 wheeler out there that can do the whole return commuting trip from your home?

Del2005 · 17-05-2018 1:55am

goz83 wrote: »

I was thinking of getting one of those xiaomi m365 folding scooters to cover the last 5 kilometres of the journey as I come into the city and traffic gets mad. I am looking for peoples experiences with them.

I understand they are in a bit of a legal grey area, but you need to push this scooter to get going, so technically it doesn’t operate on mechanical power alone which is what the rsa site mentions as the definition of an mpv.

I’ll be travelling about 15km each way from urban to city. Due to a back injury, I can’t spend an hour stuck in traffic twice per day. I can’t tolerate public transport and it would be much more expensive (over €100 per month, compared to about €5 per month in my Leaf and m365).

So, my plan would be to drive about 10km and park the car before hitting the city centre. Parking would be free as I would be well outside the cc. I would then scoot the rest of the way to my destination and do the reverse on my return journey. I wouldn’t be stuck in traffic for too long and the range of the scooter should easily cover the return journey without destination charging. The scooter will cost around €400 to buy and claims 30km per charge...I am expecting 15.

What do you think?

There is no gray area they are a mechanically propelled vehicle and would require a licence, tax and insurance if they could be made road legal.

beauf · 17-05-2018 2:39am

Get a proper petrol scooter or electric bike. You'll do 15k in about 15-25 mins.

homer911 · 17-05-2018 8:58am

beauf wrote: »

Get a proper petrol scooter or electric bike. You'll do 15k in about 15-25 mins.

More like 40-45 on a legal ebike

elperello · 17-05-2018 9:06am

Would your back problem preclude use of a folding bicycle?
5k is not that far and a good quality folding bicycle might be a solution.

grogi · 17-05-2018 9:39am

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

Under what SI exactly?

Driving a mechanically propelled vehicle without insurance?

ted1 · 17-05-2018 10:27am

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

ED E wrote: »

Add the points up for driving a totally undocumented vehicle and then decide if you want to gamble that you don't meet an RPU Garda that's up on the statute.

Under what SI exactly?

It’s classified the same as a car.

beauf · 17-05-2018 10:37am

homer911 wrote: »

More like 40-45 on a legal ebike

Thats 12-14 mph (20-22 kmh) Which is slower than someone on a regular bicycle. On a electric bicycle you will be faster. Even allowing for traffic, and lights etc.

In utility cycling there is a large variation; an elderly person on an upright roadster might do less than 10 km/h (6.2 mph) while a fitter or younger person could easily do twice that on the same bicycle. For cyclists in Copenhagen, the average cycling speed is 15.5 km/h (9.6 mph).[10]

On a racing bicycle, a reasonably fit rider can ride at 40 km/h (25 mph) on flat surface.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bicycle_performance

http://www.machinehead-software.co.uk/bike/speed_distance_time_calc.html

Even when decently unfit I could do 14k in about 40~50 downhill/uphill on my bicycle.

Bigus · 17-05-2018 11:12am

Electric bike for the whole journey might fix your back too, my mid 50's mate has fixed his long term back problems by strengthening core muscles through cycling.

goz83 · 17-05-2018 12:37pm

ED E wrote: »

Add the points up for driving a totally undocumented vehicle and then decide if you want to gamble that you don't meet an RPU Garda that's up on the statute.

I'm not convinced that the model I am looking at is considered an mpv if going by what the RSA state here.

What is the law on e-bikes / pedelecs / battery powered scooters?
Regardless of the type of bike, the rule is as follows: If it can be powered by mechanical or electrical power alone (i.e. it can go without you pedalling or scooting it) then it is considered to be a mechanically propelled vehicle (MPV). Under Road Traffic Law, if an MPV is used in a public place it is subject to all of the regulatory controls that apply to other vehicles. Therefore, it must be
roadworthy, registered, taxed and insured. The driver of the vehicle must hold the appropriate driving licence and is obliged to wear a crash helmet.

The m365 can't go unless you scoot it first. Other models can go without any aid from the user, which would make them mpv's.

Del2005 wrote: »

There is no gray area they are a mechanically propelled vehicle and would require a licence, tax and insurance if they could be made road legal.

See above. Not saying some jobsworth Garda won't disagree with that interpretation, but I also think it is very unlikely that they will pull over an adult on one of these doing around 15kmph. You'd really want to be acting the maggot to attract attention from them.

unkel wrote: »

Sounds like a pain driving 10km, then finding (free) parking. Then getting the scooter out for the next 5 km. And all of it in reverse back home in the evening.

I don't see it that way. I would drive until I get to where the traffic becomes bad and park up. I could then scoot the rest of the way...much faster than being stuck in cc traffic and much kinder on my back. I have free parking in the city anyway, but I would prefer to leave the car somewhere outside the cc and go from there. The only pain is when I arrive at my destination, where do I leave the scooter.....but that's a minor issue I will figure out. Maybe reception will hold it for me.

unkel wrote: »

Is there no bigger range EV 2 wheeler out there that can do the whole return commuting trip from your home?

Yes, but I don't like any of them and I think they will attract more attention. The M365 looks very like a regular kids scooter, but in adult size. It's not flashy with big tyres or any of that. Plus, they also usually don't require a push start, which makes them an mpv by definition. I also don't want to spend more than €500 on one.

beauf wrote: »

Get a proper petrol scooter or electric bike. You'll do 15k in about 15-25 mins.

I am not interested in the petrol ones. Far too noisy and guaranteed to get you lifted very quickly in the city. I also prefer electric powered vehicles in general....hence the posting here. I don't like cycling....even if the e-bike was fully electric, I just don't like cycling. I find it very uncomfortable to sit on a bicycle since my back injury. Maybe in time that will change. I considered an e-scooter, but the cost, plus tax, insurance etc made it a non-runner.

n97 mini · 17-05-2018 2:08pm

Electric bicycles where the motor assists the cyclist (i.e. making pedalling easier, but still required) are specifically allowed. That's a new-ish law, and again, it's specifically bicycles.

Scooters which can propel themselves unaided are unfortunately considered mechanically propelled vehicles. The one you're thinking of can, once you start it. Just like a motorbike, which requires an action from the rider to start it, but once started can propel itself.

Worth a read:
https://www.magireland.org/2015/news-media/warning-on-bicycle-engines-electric-scooters/

goz83 · 17-05-2018 3:02pm

n97 mini wrote: »

Electric bicycles where the motor assists the cyclist (i.e. making pedalling easier, but still required) are specifically allowed. That's a new-ish law, and again, it's specifically bicycles.

Scooters which can propel themselves unaided are unfortunately considered mechanically propelled vehicles. The one you're thinking of can, once you start it. Just like a motorbike, which requires an action from the rider to start it, but once started can propel itself.

Worth a read:
https://www.magireland.org/2015/news-media/warning-on-bicycle-engines-electric-scooters/

I had come across a similar article which pointed to RSA site. The point I am making is that the scooter does not propel itself at first. You need to turn the power on and then manually propel it before it will engage. That's not quite the same as starting a motorbike engine...even when using a kick starter. The fact is that they are propelled from a stationary position under the power of the motor alone.

Anyway...putting all that aside.... are there instances of these electric scooters being confiscated from adults and has anyone been given points or given a court date?

beauf · 17-05-2018 3:19pm

goz83 wrote: »

...What do you think?

https://extra.ie/2017/07/28/news/irish-news/gardai-warn-scooter-tax-insurance

I think the solution is some form of cycling. Even if you hate it.

n97 mini · 17-05-2018 3:26pm

goz83 wrote: »

I had come across a similar article which pointed to RSA site. The point I am making is that the scooter does not propel itself at first. You need to turn the power on and then manually propel it before it will engage. That's not quite the same as starting a motorbike engine...even when using a kick starter. The fact is that they are propelled from a stationary position under the power of the motor alone.

Ok, put it like this. In certain circumstances the scooter can propel itself entirely unaided. I think that's a deal-breaker.

goz83 wrote: »

Anyway...putting all that aside.... are there instances of these electric scooters being confiscated from adults and has anyone been given points or given a court date?

I very much doubt either has ever happened.

beauf · 17-05-2018 3:28pm

goz83 wrote: »

I had come across a similar article which pointed to RSA site. The point I am making is that the scooter does not propel itself at first. You need to turn the power on and then manually propel it before it will engage. That's not quite the same as starting a motorbike engine...even when using a kick starter. The fact is that they are propelled from a stationary position under the power of the motor alone.

Anyway...putting all that aside.... are there instances of these electric scooters being confiscated from adults and has anyone been given points or given a court date?

https://www.thesun.ie/news/1319836/gardai-seize-electronic-scooter-and-owner-now-faces-prosecution-for-having-no-licence-or-insurance/

...does not require pedalling or scooting for propulsion, then the scooter is considered to be a mechanically propelled vehicle (MPV)...

How you start it is irrelevant.

http://irishcycle.com/2017/05/27/gardai-warn-bikes-with-petrol-engines-attached-are-low-powered-motorcycles/

If a vehicle has a source of power which only aids a vehicle’s manual propulsion and cannot propel the vehicle on its own, then the vehicle is not an mpv for the purposes of the 1961 Act. Into this category would fall an electrically-assisted bicycle. This is because the vehicle stops when the pedalling stops,” said Sergeant Frawley.

He added: “In relation to the electric units, electrically assisted pedal cycles are commonly referred to as ‘pedelecs’ to describe bicycles with electric motors or batteries too small to drive them without pedalling. Their speed is limited to 25km per hour and the motor cuts out if pedalling ceases. In contrast, mopeds can move without assistance of pedals. For guidance, if an electric bike can be operated without pedalling, it is a moped, ie a low-powered motorcycle and is subject to motor tax.”

Del2005 · 17-05-2018 3:34pm

goz83 wrote: »

I had come across a similar article which pointed to RSA site. The point I am making is that the scooter does not propel itself at first. You need to turn the power on and then manually propel it before it will engage. That's not quite the same as starting a motorbike engine...even when using a kick starter. The fact is that they are propelled from a stationary position under the power of the motor alone.

Anyway...putting all that aside.... are there instances of these electric scooters being confiscated from adults and has anyone been given points or given a court date?

My bike can be started by pushing it. Its still an MPV once it can propel itself.

Unfortunately at this moment the Gardai are completely ignoring people using these types of MPV on the road. But it'll just take 1 incident and they will, do you want to be the first convicted? Because you'll loose your licence and have a nice phone number for insurance quotes.

ted1 · 17-05-2018 3:49pm

goz83 wrote: »

ED E wrote: »

Add the points up for driving a totally undocumented vehicle and then decide if you want to gamble that you don't meet an RPU Garda that's up on the statute.

I'm not convinced that the model I am looking at is considered an mpv if going by what the RSA state here.

What is the law on e-bikes / pedelecs / battery powered scooters?
Regardless of the type of bike, the rule is as follows: If it can be powered by mechanical or electrical power alone (i.e. it can go without you pedalling or scooting it) then it is considered to be a mechanically propelled vehicle (MPV). Under Road Traffic Law, if an MPV is used in a public place it is subject to all of the regulatory controls that apply to other vehicles. Therefore, it must be
roadworthy, registered, taxed and insured. The driver of the vehicle must hold the appropriate driving licence and is obliged to wear a crash helmet.

The m365 can't go unless you scoot it first. Other models can go without any aid from the user, which would make them mpv's.

Del2005 wrote: »

There is no gray area they are a mechanically propelled vehicle and would require a licence, tax and insurance if they could be made road legal.

See above. Not saying some jobsworth Garda won't disagree with that interpretation, but I also think it is very unlikely that they will pull over an adult on one of these doing around 15kmph. You'd really want to be acting the maggot to attract attention from them.

unkel wrote: »

Sounds like a pain driving 10km, then finding (free) parking. Then getting the scooter out for the next 5 km. And all of it in reverse back home in the evening.

I don't see it that way. I would drive until I get to where the traffic becomes bad and park up. I could then scoot the rest of the way...much faster than being stuck in cc traffic and much kinder on my back. I have free parking in the city anyway, but I would prefer to leave the car somewhere outside the cc and go from there. The only pain is when I arrive at my destination, where do I leave the scooter.....but that's a minor issue I will figure out. Maybe reception will hold it for me.

unkel wrote: »

Is there no bigger range EV 2 wheeler out there that can do the whole return commuting trip from your home?

Yes, but I don't like any of them and I think they will attract more attention. The M365 looks very like a regular kids scooter, but in adult size. It's not flashy with big tyres or any of that. Plus, they also usually don't require a push start, which makes them an mpv by definition. I also don't want to spend more than €500 on one.

beauf wrote: »

Get a proper petrol scooter or electric bike. You'll do 15k in about 15-25 mins.

I am not interested in the petrol ones. Far too noisy and guaranteed to get you lifted very quickly in the city. I also prefer electric powered vehicles in general....hence the posting here. I don't like cycling....even if the e-bike was fully electric, I just don't like cycling. I find it very uncomfortable to sit on a bicycle since my back injury. Maybe in time that will change. I considered an e-scooter, but the cost, plus tax, insurance etc made it a non-runner.

Your interpretation is wrong. In electric bikes if you stop pedalling the engine cuts out.

With the scooter once you push off , the engine continues. That’s the difference.

homer911 · 17-05-2018 4:00pm

There's an older gent who I see on the N11, lives somewhere in the Stillorgan area, cycles a black pedelec with a mirror on the end of his right handlebar - the bike is completely illegal and I'm waiting for the day the Guards pounce on him - he powers uphill at about 40Kmh with very little effort - don't know whether to be jealous of him, or to just think that he is nuts!

Calahonda52 · 17-05-2018 5:48pm

ted1 wrote: »

Your interpretation is wrong. In electric bikes if you stop pedalling the engine cuts out.

With the scooter once you push off , the engine continues. That’s the difference.

Exactly: I think the OP only sees what he wants to see

homer911 wrote: »

There's an older gent who I see on the N11, lives somewhere in the Stillorgan area, cycles a black pedelec with a mirror on the end of his right handlebar - the bike is completely illegal and I'm waiting for the day the Guards pounce on him - he powers uphill at about 40Kmh with very little effort - don't know whether to be jealous of him, or to just think that he is nuts!

He may well have insurance, I am looking at one and its recommended for PL reasons.

peaceboi · 17-05-2018 6:29pm

Another option would be to get the electric bike from Halfords through bike to work scheme, there's 1000eur priced one for sale. Says 30 miles on single charge. But don't know if advertised miles is achievable in real world ?ðŸ€”

Del2005 · 17-05-2018 9:34pm

Calahonda52 wrote: »

He may well have insurance, I am looking at one and its recommended for PL reasons.

Unless it's got a VLC and registration plate it can't be insured and with our insurance companies even then you can struggle, try getting insurance for a road legal quad.

goz83 · 17-05-2018 9:35pm

ted1 wrote: »

Your interpretation is wrong. In electric bikes if you stop pedalling the engine cuts out.

With the scooter once you push off , the engine continues. That’s the difference.

What a shame. I'd get insurance if it was reasonable/possible, but it would not be possible to get any insurance for one of those. I tried to insure a road Quad years ago which was road legal in Sweden...taxed, insured the whole lot. No hope over here unless you are using it on farm land. Looks like I'll just be another single occupant in a car, adding to the congestion in the cc.

Calahonda52 wrote: »

Exactly: I think the OP only sees what he wants to see

Not quite Cala. Was more hoping that the technicality would stick.

ted1 · 17-05-2018 10:08pm

goz83 wrote: »

ted1 wrote: »

Your interpretation is wrong. In electric bikes if you stop pedalling the engine cuts out.

With the scooter once you push off , the engine continues. That’s the difference.

What a shame. I'd get insurance if it was reasonable/possible, but it would not be possible to get any insurance for one of those. I tried to insure a road Quad years ago which was road legal in Sweden...taxed, insured the whole lot. No hope over here unless you are using it on farm land. Looks like I'll just be another single occupant in a car, adding to the congestion in the cc.

Calahonda52 wrote: »

Exactly: I think the OP only sees what he wants to see

Not quite Cala. Was more hoping that the technicality would stick.

Pop into greenaer off Pearse Street and test drive One of their electric bikes

jsd1004 · 18-05-2018 6:43am

Is every kid on a hoverboard breaking the law in a park/footpaths etc.

ted1 · 18-05-2018 7:02am

jsd1004 wrote: »

Is every kid on a hoverboard breaking the law in a park/footpaths etc.

Yes

https://www.google.ie/amp/www.thejournal.ie/ireland-self-balancing-scooter-2382939-Oct2015/?amp=1

Calahonda52 · 18-05-2018 8:00am

ted1 wrote: »

Pop into greenaer off Pearse Street and test drive One of their electric bikes

They have two A2B KUO foldables, the more expensive is a throttle assisted version, and they will advise you to take out insurance for using it

http://www.greenaer.ie/product/a2b-kuo-folding-ebike/ this one is the pedelec

OP: How about
https://www.revenue.ie/en/employing-people/what-constitutes-pay/items-not-treated-as-pay/provision-of-bicycles-for-directors-and-employees.aspx

ted1 · 18-05-2018 8:27am

Calahonda52 wrote: »

ted1 wrote: »

Pop into greenaer off Pearse Street and test drive One of their electric bikes

They have two A2B KUO foldables, the more expensive is a throttle assisted version, and they will advise you to take out insurance for using it

http://www.greenaer.ie/product/a2b-kuo-folding-ebike/ this one is the pedelec

OP: How about
https://www.revenue.ie/en/employing-people/what-constitutes-pay/items-not-treated-as-pay/provision-of-bicycles-for-directors-and-employees.aspx

I actually meant their regular e bikes. With only 15kmits hardly worth taking the car at all.

grogi · 18-05-2018 10:00am

Del2005 wrote: »

But it'll just take 1 incident and they will, do you want to be the first convicted? Because you'll loose your licence and have a nice phone number for insurance quotes.

I will grow very old before that happens. There are serial f$$$$rs being caught driving cars without insurance and while being banned. And NOTHING happens to them, they constantly get a snap on the hand and that's it.

You seriously thing that anything will be done to one scooting on m365?

beauf · 18-05-2018 10:24am

That is true. Nothing will happen.

But considering the state of paths, cycle tracks and roads, and the distance. Its far more suited to cycling than a scooter.
Besides, scooting is probably going to a lot more strain and stress on a back physically than cycling. You might as well be skateboarding. (yes I know of Casey and the Boosted Boards etc).

I think its one of things you'll have to try. I had a back injury and struggled to get to work on trains. I just ended up going in early or late and just driving or working from home.
I use a folding bike occasionally, but the risk of lifting it fractionally awkwardly, and doing my back again, and also with the overcrowding on the train, it became too much hassle.
I just drive to the station now and walk the other end.

goz83 · 18-05-2018 10:42am

ted1 wrote: »

Pop into greenaer off Pearse Street and test drive One of their electric bikes

Thanks for the suggestion ted1. I should at least be open to an e-bike, but I had set my budget at €500 and really don't want to spend more. Looking at some of those bikes, I would be better off getting an electric moped and forking out for the insurance. I have a license for mopeds and sure my B license covers me anyway, as I got mine in 06.

beauf wrote: »

That is true. Nothing will happen.

But considering the state of paths, cycle tracks and roads, and the distance. Its far more suited to cycling than a scooter.
Besides, scooting is probably going to a lot more strain and stress on a back physically than cycling. You might as well be skateboarding. (yes I know of Casey and the Boosted Boards etc).

I think its one of things you'll have to try. I had a back injury and struggled to get to work on trains. I just ended up going in early or late and just driving or working from home.
I use a folding bike occasionally, but the risk of lifting it fractionally awkwardly, and doing my back again, and also with the overcrowding on the train, it became too much hassle.
I just drive to the station now and walk the other end.

This is more or less what I was thinking beauf. I reckon the likelihood of being pulled over is very, very slim.

I do have some concern about my back using one of these, but I know short distance I would be fine.

Cycle commuting just doesn't appeal to me at all. The roads are simply not safe enough imo and it's stressful. Then as you say, it only takes one out of place movement when lift, or folding the bike and bam, you're out of action. It's even happened me when lifting the stroller from the boot.

I'm sort of put off the idea of scooting now. It seemed like a good idea and a great way to avoid congestion. The M365 is a far cry from that yoke in the article....which is exactly what I was not looking for...big fat tyres, flashy colours, stands out like a priest at a kids party.

Back to the drawing board so. Maybe leaving earlier is the answer, but that will throw up other problems, such as not being able to drop the kids off.

grogi · 18-05-2018 10:59am

goz83 wrote: »

Thanks for the suggestion ted1. I should at least be open to an e-bike, but I had set my budget at €500 and really don't want to spend more. Looking at some of those bikes, I would be better off getting an electric moped and forking out for the insurance. I have a license for mopeds and sure my B license covers me anyway, as I got mine in 06..

With bike to work scheme, the cost for you is around half of the list price... So a 1000 bike will render you €500 poorer... They have those Dutch style foldable bikes too, you'd for one in the trunk easily.

beauf · 18-05-2018 11:24am

It would be torture doing 5k not on a road. Pavement and junction design and pedestrian flow is so bad here.
The danger of cycling is over stated, usually by those who don't do it. You can pick a quieter route and stay off the roads you don't like.
Cycling is one of these things like swimming which is low impact. Its usually a good recovery from injury.
Which is why I say cycling the 15k on a full sized electric bike would just probably be the easiest route, and no lifting a heavy folding bike. (A non electric folder would be lighter.)

But you have to want to do it. Most people find it fun and easier. If you are dead set against it though, I think you will reasons not to do it all the time.

dr.fuzzenstein · 18-05-2018 12:03pm

It is sad how in Ireland specifically this sort of thing is being made near impossible by fcuked up regulation.
And if one wanted to be complaint, the mountain of red tape would be insurmountable.
In most other countries small scooters are included in the car license, you then buy a small numberplate for a hundred bucks, slap it on and away you go.
It seems like Irish politicians don't want to know about an actual, viable alternative to the car.

Del2005 · 18-05-2018 5:51pm

grogi wrote: »

I will grow very old before that happens. There are serial f$$$$rs being caught driving cars without insurance and while being banned. And NOTHING happens to them, they constantly get a snap on the hand and that's it.

You seriously thing that anything will be done to one scooting on m365?

Just because we have a cohort of scumbags, and their incestuous solicitors, who don't care about our laws doesn't mean that getting caught committing an offence won't have serious consequences for the majority of people. Do you think that the Gardai should stop doing DUI checks because some people regularly DUI after being banned?

All it would take is to hit a person or vehicle or meet a clued up Garda and the majority of people would be seriously affected. You'd be taking this risk every time you are on it.

goz83 · 18-05-2018 8:16pm

grogi wrote: »

With bike to work scheme, the cost for you is around half of the list price... So a 1000 bike will render you €500 poorer... They have those Dutch style foldable bikes too, you'd for one in the trunk easily.

I'm not employed. I've been self employed for years and I am now a student having decided to study something different.

Del2005 wrote: »

All it would take is to hit a person or vehicle or meet a clued up Garda and the majority of people would be seriously affected. You'd be taking this risk every time you are on it.

You do realise that the M365 is not fast, yeah? It does something like 25kmph max. I wouldn't even go that fast on it. The cruise control function was another thing I was really interested in. Set it to around 15kmph and take it easy.

Del2005 · 19-05-2018 4:48am

goz83 wrote: »

I'm not employed. I've been self employed for years and I am now a student having decided to study something different.

You do realise that the M365 is not fast, yeah? It does something like 25kmph max. I wouldn't even go that fast on it. The cruise control function was another thing I was really interested in. Set it to around 15kmph and take it easy.

When people can get €60k for hitting their leg off a table leg, hitting someone when illegal using an MPV would be expensive and that's not even counting the driving ban snd points.

ted1 · 19-05-2018 8:05am

Del2005 wrote: »

goz83 wrote: »

I'm not employed. I've been self employed for years and I am now a student having decided to study something different.

You do realise that the M365 is not fast, yeah? It does something like 25kmph max. I wouldn't even go that fast on it. The cruise control function was another thing I was really interested in. Set it to around 15kmph and take it easy.

When people can get €60k for hitting their leg off a table leg, hitting someone when illegal using an MPV would be expensive and that's not even counting the driving ban snd points.

Generally if there’s no insurance , the person won’t get sued as the solicitor knows that they won’t have the funds to pay. I.e they chase the money.

In that case the MIBI would be paying the claim.

elperello · 19-05-2018 8:41am

Would an electric scooter come under the remit of MIBI?
https://www.mibi.ie/about-us.8.html

ted1 · 19-05-2018 9:05am

elperello wrote: »

Would an electric scooter come under the remit of MIBI?
https://www.mibi.ie/about-us.8.html

Is imagine so, it’s classed as a MPV.

beauf · 19-05-2018 9:26am

Someone with a bad back won't be long giving up on a scooter.

19-05-2018 2:39pm

As usual , someone wants to get something and the boards.ie police want to point out the legalities of it, so what if he wants to get this scooter what is it to people here ?

Anyway, I would say get a 2nd hand lightweight normal bike such as a giant and you'll even be able to pedal faster than 15 Mph.

goz83 · 19-05-2018 3:06pm

Deleted User wrote: »

As usual , someone wants to get something and the boards.ie police want to point out the legalities of it, so what if he wants to get this scooter what is it to people here ?

Anyway, I would say get a 2nd hand lightweight normal bike such as a giant and you'll even be able to pedal faster than 15 Mph.

I suppose knowing the status of the scooter with regard to the law is important, but I have been clear that I don't want to spend more than €500...which rules out any decent e-bike. Plus I don't want to cycle commute.

I had a Giant bike, but I can't comfortably cycle anymore for any meaningful distance. It was a brand new hybrid model i GOT IN 2014 a couple of weeks before I was injured. I gave it to my BIL because his bike was stolen.

I am improving, but recovery is slow in some areas. I have a nice Carrera bike from halfords now and can do short distances, but after 4-5klms, I start getting progressively sore.....and that's with taking it easy.

19-05-2018 3:50pm

Hmm, then if normal bike is out I suppose normal ebike is out because they're heavy ?

What's the weight of this scooter ?

One word of caution, if you do get it do not charge or keep it in the house, at the very least charge it in the kitchen with a smoke alarm, these batteries can be volatile, the same goes for ebikes, hover boards etc. Luckily most ebikes have removable batteries. Even sitting there they can combust and burn the house down as rare as it might be it does happen.

19-05-2018 4:00pm

As for riding it in the city, it's a mental place for traffic with no suitable lanes for cyclists what so ever you'd have to share with cyclists which at 15 mph I don't see a big deal because a fit cyclist on a light bike is capable of cycling over 20 Mph anyway.

Regards getting sued, well you can be sued for hitting someone on a normal bike anyway.

goz83 · 19-05-2018 4:40pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Hmm, then if normal bike is out I suppose normal ebike is out because they're heavy ?

What's the weight of this scooter ?

One word of caution, if you do get it do not charge or keep it in the house, at the very least charge it in the kitchen with a smoke alarm, these batteries can be volatile, the same goes for ebikes, hover boards etc. Luckily most ebikes have removable batteries. Even sitting there they can combust and burn the house down as rare as it might be it does happen.

The M365 weighs 12.5kg....so heavy enough if carrying it any distance.

It also has a BMS. I would either charge in the kitchen, but more likely in the side entrance.

19-05-2018 8:16pm

BMS is irrelevant when it comes to some battery fires. Wherever you charge it's essential to have smoke alarm as a bare minimum actually wherever you charge or keep the scooter regardless of charging it's a good idea to have it in a fire safe place with smoke detection.

12.5 Kg is heavy alright for the size of it. That's a lot with a dodgy back lifting in and out with a car but if cycling is too much then A, suffer city traffic or B get the scooter.

ted1 · 20-05-2018 1:19am

Deleted User wrote: »

As usual , someone wants to get something and the boards.ie police want to point out the legalities of it, so what if he wants to get this scooter what is it to people here ?

Anyway, I would say get a 2nd hand lightweight normal bike such as a giant and you'll even be able to pedal faster than 15 Mph.

Well if it’s the mibi who pay out. That increases our premium.

I’ve no problem with them reclassifying them. But at the moment claims would add a cost to our insurance.

Also driving 10km and switching to a scooter for 5 km is just pure wrong

ted1 · 20-05-2018 1:20am

Deleted User wrote: »

Hmm, then if normal bike is out I suppose normal ebike is out because they're heavy ?

What's the weight of this scooter ?

One word of caution, if you do get it do not charge or keep it in the house, at the very least charge it in the kitchen with a smoke alarm, these batteries can be volatile, the same goes for ebikes, hover boards etc. Luckily most ebikes have removable batteries. Even sitting there they can combust and burn the house down as rare as it might be it does happen.

*smoke and heat alarm

Recommend electric folding scooter for end of commute (Mod Note Post #1)

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