Go-Ahead Dublin City Routes - Updates and Discussion

end of the road · 29-10-2017 3:59am

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

That's rubbish with no founding at all. Just making stuff up.

it's not rubbish, but fact with plenty of founding. not making stuff up but reality.

Cookie_Monster · 29-10-2017 9:18am

end of the road wrote: »

it's not rubbish, but fact with plenty of founding. not making stuff up but reality.

should be easy to provide proof so?

markpb · 29-10-2017 10:02am

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

should be easy to provide proof so?

Hah!

I laughed so hard that my monacle fell into my morning tea.

punisher5112 · 29-10-2017 11:30am

brokenarms wrote: »

Most of the marked in drivers got it in 6 years or less. Some got it in one year. Now it's 10 years plus. A joke of a system. Bad duties for at least 10 years.

I hope it's one of the first things to go with bus connects or pressure from the compition.

It should be equal. For every worker. Regardless of experience.

No it shouldn't as everyone especially in any recent recruitment since the hire freeze knows well what the score is and are given enough warning of hours, duties and how its going to be.

I know it can be frustrating and bad of course getting bad duties a lot but so has everyone before the new drivers.

It shouldn't take so long and more marked in duties should be created.

Marking in is the only reason most wait it out because I can tell you for a fact 90% wouldn't be there now if that was taken.

Why would anyone work 30+ years and do absolutely crazy duties and have absolutely no life or social life(quality of life).

AlekSmart · 29-10-2017 1:22pm

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

That's rubbish with no founding at all. Just making stuff up.

There is a worldwide selection of published studies of this issue.

Much of it going back over 50 years,and,sadly behind paywalls,however the abstracts do refer.

https://academic.oup.com/annweh/article-abstract/5/2/69/207264?redirectedFrom=PDF

It is found that, for drivers with up to eight years' service, there is a tendency for the older men to have fewer accidents than the youngest men of the same length of service. A marked improvement in the accident rates is shown to occur with increasing experience.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3570620

with comparable experience: younger drivers had higher accident rates than older ones. An increase of accident risk during the second year of employment after an initial decline could be detected in the younger group of drivers; the older group only showed a continuous decline.

Added to this is decades of internal records,which in turn led to the introduction of the "Mentor" programme some years back,which has generally been welcomed by all involved.....Back in the Day,the only advice given to a new Busdriver unsure of a route was..."sure,you'll know it when ye get back !!"

Whilst there is a significant group of those who find the actual basics ie: Shift patterns,Duty makeup,Customer types,Vehicle types and other elements,of Urban Bus Driving to be challenging,it has to be borne in mind that in Dublin Bus's case,not all of it's approx 2,600 Busdrivers find these issues to be of such importance to spur them to post online about it.

The majority of Busdrivers,adapt,or avail of whatever adjusted patterns offer some benefits,whilst getting on with the job of earning a living.

Urban Busdriving,of it's very nature is COMPLETELY unlike any other occupation in the Transport related field.

A highly experienced Coach driver,transferring over to urban stage-carriage work,might flip within a week and head back to coaching as might a similiarly experienced Truck driver.

Urban stage-carriage work demands a significant sub-set of personality and human-nature resurces which many other driving jubs never call upon,and this combinational demand often comes as a complete surprise to entrants,who may simply be expecting a "driving" job,as often described by some customers..."Sure you're only a bleedin Busdriver"

People entering the world of Busdriving,whatever the operator,have to get very comfortable,very rapidly,with these demands....if they struggle with it,then sometimes the best option is find another area which imposes less personal stress on them...Life is simply TOO short to justify spending a large chunk of it in a Job you find challenging,unrewarding and health-threatening.
The World is a vast place,usually with options for everybody, IF they are prepared to recognise that.

brokenarms · 29-10-2017 1:32pm

Excellent post. And very true.

punisher5112 · 29-10-2017 1:34pm

Very well said aleksmart

bebeman · 29-10-2017 3:36pm

brokenarms wrote: »

It should be equal. For every worker. Regardless of experience.

What are you on about, in every job the new guy gets the ****ty end of the stick, when someone new starts in the job the ****ty stick is passed on to him, and so on it goes, has been this way since time began.

bebeman · 29-10-2017 3:39pm

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

That's rubbish with no founding at all. Just making stuff up.

Go into any DB depot on a thursday and you will see new drivers lined up out side the managers office, they are there to explain what happen in the accidents they were in.
Thats a fact, any driver who posts here can verify this.

Kyleboy · 29-10-2017 4:05pm

bebeman wrote: »

Go into any DB depot on a thursday and you will see new drivers lined up out side the managers office, they are there to explain what happen in the accidents they were in.
Thats a fact, any driver who posts here can verify this.

100%correct.

brokenarms · 29-10-2017 4:46pm

bebeman wrote: »

What are you on about, in every job the new guy gets the ****ty end of the stick, when someone new starts in the job the ****ty stick is passed on to him, and so on it goes, has been this way since time began.

For 10 years.
No where does any job give you the ****ty end of the stick for so long.

liger · 29-10-2017 5:10pm

brokenarms wrote: »

For 10 years.
No where does any job give you the ****ty end of the stick for so long.

I agree, The spare/marking in system in DB is so outdated and only protected by unions and management who are afraid of change.

Having spoken to a number of spare drivers in different garages, there is an appetite to walk away from DB for a better work/life balance even if it is for less money. That's drivers with 7 and 8 years experience, not just newbies in the door a year.

Again DB failure to be proactive with how they run the company will see them suffer the loss, this time in high quality staff they have invested considerable time and money training who will stroll into GA.

end of the road · 29-10-2017 6:17pm

liger wrote: »

I agree, The spare/marking in system in DB is so outdated and only protected by unions and management who are afraid of change.

Having spoken to a number of spare drivers in different garages, there is an appetite to walk away from DB for a better work/life balance even if it is for less money. That's drivers with 7 and 8 years experience, not just newbies in the door a year.

Again DB failure to be proactive with how they run the company will see them suffer the loss, this time in high quality staff they have invested considerable time and money training who will stroll into GA.

if it was outdated it would have been abolished. management and unions aren't protecting it, unions have nothing to do with it. nobody is afraid of change but change has to benefit everyone, and not negatively effect the terms and conditions of the staff, for which are the union's priority, as it is what they are paid to focus on.

dfx- · 29-10-2017 6:37pm

bebeman wrote: »

What are you on about, in every job the new guy gets the ****ty end of the stick, when someone new starts in the job the ****ty stick is passed on to him, and so on it goes, has been this way since time began.

Really it's unusual for this to take up so much time. The older worker gets the best or first option, it's no big deal.

This is the sort of navel gazing this tendering process is wasting its time on. This is the sort of thing this tendering process is not offering anything to the customer. This is the sort of thing the tendering process is designed for, the systematic breaking down of company practices with no benefit for users.

Nothing to do with the service actually running because who cares who is marked in or not, it's not on the ticket "this ticket was issued by a marked in driver, lucky him".

This is a gargantuan waste of time.

liger · 29-10-2017 6:38pm

end of the road wrote: »

if it was outdated it would have been abolished. management and unions aren't protecting it, unions have nothing to do with it. nobody is afraid of change but change has to benefit everyone, and not negatively effect the terms and conditions of the staff, for which are the union's priority, as it is what they are paid to focus on.

Of course it's being protected, Of course unions have something to do with it.

If the system was changed, a better system could be implemented to make work/life balance for all at DB, not just keep marked in drivers looked after. There are plenty of ways to make positive changes to make things fair for all. Don't spare drivers pay union fees too? so why after DECADES of a system that's not fit for purpose haven't unions been able to get a change made? because it's not in the interest of the majority of reps.

liger · 29-10-2017 6:47pm

dfx- wrote: »

Nothing to do with the service actually running because who cares who is marked in or not, it's not on the ticket "this ticket was issued by a marked in driver, lucky him".

This is a gargantuan waste of time.

A happier driver is more likely to provide better customer service,

If a driver isn't being forced to work awful shifts while others get handy days 5days a week, there is reduced chance that driver will just call in sick instead of coming to work. less missing duties/buses off.

Better work/life balance means drivers less likely to quit. less missing duties/buses off.

That's just some off the knock on effect to the passengers.

punisher5112 · 29-10-2017 6:47pm

I believe they are changing things but its not going to be good for marked in or spare.

Longer duties and get most driving hours out of all.

liger · 29-10-2017 6:54pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

I believe they are changing things but its not going to be good for marked in or spare.

Longer duties and get most driving hours out of all.

Yes, productivity related to the pay increases given. The marking in system should still be changed.

punisher5112 · 29-10-2017 6:58pm

liger wrote: »

Yes, productivity related to the pay increases given. The marking in system should still be changed.

I don't believe it should as its unfair for those that went through cuts among cuts in the recession and held it out.

Any new staff coming in doesn't have to join as they are well aware of the system.

I can tell you for sure if it is abolished every duty will be a bad duty and there will be no handy duties.

liger · 29-10-2017 7:08pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

I don't believe it should as its unfair for those that went through cuts among cuts in the recession and held it out.

Any new staff coming in doesn't have to join as they are well aware of the system.

I can tell you for sure if it is abolished every duty will be a bad duty and there will be no handy duties.

There are drivers who went through cut after cut during the recession and still are spare, now faced with 10% of routes going elsewhere they face more years in the spare role.

Changing the marking in system won't change the shifts.

Should drivers be squeezed for every minute they can work in a shift? DB are trying to run a business. They need to balance the impact of squeezing the staff with staff satisfaction and how it impacts on the business.

punisher5112 · 29-10-2017 7:11pm

I fully agree change there should be and it well could have been fixed and start more marking ins.

dfx- · 29-10-2017 7:32pm

liger wrote: »

A happier driver is more likely to provide better customer service,

If a driver isn't being forced to work awful shifts while others get handy days 5days a week, there is reduced chance that driver will just call in sick instead of coming to work. less missing duties/buses off.

Better work/life balance means drivers less likely to quit. less missing duties/buses off.

That's just some off the knock on effect to the passengers.

A better work life balance is great, but it's not something the regulator needs to spend so much time and energy on. Micromanagement of company practices is a waste of their time, but they are clearly much much more concerned with that than for example, DB customers on the street.

We have 30 minute gaps on the 27 at 6pm on Friday and 13s, 27s, 40s full to bursting and bunching. This is what needs to be fixed, thousands of customers who couldn't care less about marked in drivers or unmarked in drivers just waiting for a service.

How about them focusing on that. Imagine.

devnull · 06-11-2017 12:36am

Go-Ahead are now advertising for the following roles
- Head of Operations
- Operations Manager
- Scheduler

Closing date is 24th November.

Appeared on a few recruitment sites as well as in trade magazines this month.

brokenarms · 06-11-2017 2:36am

Interesting times ahead.

Looking forward to see what the drivers thinking of flipping will be offered.

There is a lot of talk in the canteen from spare drivers.

punisher5112 · 06-11-2017 7:23am

If they jump it won't be any better more then likely it will be worse.

I could be proven wrong but just doubt it very much.

devnull · 06-11-2017 10:27pm

From DublinBuses.com

12 GTs and 48 SGs are to be removed from the current Dublin Bus fleet during 2018 by the NTA to be provided for new operator Go-Ahead. These 60 displaced buses, plus 40 older buses will be replaced by a new order of 100 SGs commencing delivery to Dublin Bus from February 2018.

Fairest way of doing it I think, looks like there will be a mixture of ages entering service with Go-Ahead to keep the fleet profile balanced between operators.

dublinman1990 · 06-11-2017 11:30pm

I came across a 4 page article in the November 2017 edition of Buses Magazine which is about Go-Ahead's bus operation in Singapore. It is titled Serving The Lion City.

It has a feature about Go-Ahead Singapore who have 400 buses in their fleet & began operations on the 4th of September 2016 which was built entirely from scratch. Go-Ahead run 13 bus routes in Singapore; roughly half of the routes that Go-Ahead will run in Dublin in 12 to 15 months time. Their fleet colours in Singapore are in bright green with a dark green logo. For Double Deckers are tri-axle buses such as the Enviro 500 with the EV's front end from Dublin Bus. The Wright Gemini tri-axle fleet use the SG front end from Dublin Bus. The single deckers used by Go-Ahead Singapore are Mercedes Citaros. They also have a K9 electric bus on trial from BYD. This single deck bus has previously been trialled on 2 of London's former Red Arrow bus routes. Go-Ahead are using their company networks in London & Singapore as models on how to evaluate operational opportunities before they begin their bus services in Dublin in late 2018/early 2019.

According to the article; The Singapore Bus Network runs under a Bus Contracting model much like in the UK. The network there has a large amount of Double Deckers that are somewhat familiar with the UK & Ireland. The majority of buses in Singapore are built from Alexander Dennis & Volvo. It has a total of 4,500 buses that operate over 200 routes. All of Singapore's buses are all right hand drive vehicles like in Hong Kong, the UK & Ireland.

It doesn't include an awful lot of writing about the bus network in Dublin. It is mainly focuses on the Bus market in Singapore.

You can purchase the magazine in Easons Bookshop or other newsagents here if it is available or www.busesmag.com to have a further read of this interesting article. The November 2017 issue also includes a copy of a special supplement magazine called London's Buses to read about the day to day operations of TFL's London Bus network. Happy reading.

dublinman1990 · 07-11-2017 12:14am

devnull wrote: »

Fairest way of doing it I think, looks like there will be a mixture of ages entering service with Go-Ahead to keep the fleet profile balanced between operators.

I suppose this says to bus passengers GA Dublin will a mix of buses will come from a handful of different types of fleets given to them on the cheap while further reducing the size of the bus fleet from Dublin Bus. It does sound controversial to do a move like this to Dublin Bus as these were buses that were earmarked for fleet expansion in BusConnects. I feel that it is not to change the Dublin Bus network in a huge way after this news. BusConnects to me when the fleet size for Dublin Bus is concerned sounds like a bit of a flop so far unless they will get the BRT contract from the NTA than things become a little more interesting after that.

GA Dublin so far after digesting this news is that they have a total 100 buses for their fleet comprising of 40 new streetlites & 60 used double deckers from Dublin Bus. But GA Dublin are still short of 25 buses as a remainder; if they plan to use a fleet of 125 buses where is the remaining 25 vehicles going to come from?

devnull · 07-11-2017 12:28am

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I suppose this says to bus passengers GA Dublin will a mix of buses will come from a handful of different types of fleets given to them on the cheap while further reducing the size of the bus fleet from Dublin Bus.

They are not reducing the fleet size of Dublin Bus. Any buses taken from Dublin Bus will be replaced by brand new buses to keep the fleet levels the same as they are now and this has been stated so many times now.

It's expected that Dublin Bus will get approx 100 buses next year from what I have heard, which will allow 60 vehicles to go to Go-Ahead and 40 AVs to be withdrawn. They'll lose approx 100 buses worth of work but will suffer no loss of actual fleet numbers.

It does sound controversial to do a move like this to Dublin Bus as these were buses that were earmarked for fleet expansion in BusConnects. I feel that it is not to change the Dublin Bus network in a huge way after this news.

It's the fairest way of doing it, the other alternative would be to take no buses from Dublin Bus and give Go-Ahead a completely brand new fleet which would be far more unfair. This appears to be an attempt to somewhat balance the fleet age of NTA funded buses between the operators.

GA Dublin so far after digesting this news is that they have a total 100 buses for their fleet comprising of 40 new streetlites & 60 used double deckers from Dublin Bus. But GA Dublin are still short of 25 buses as a remainder; if they plan to use a fleet of 125 buses where is the remaining 25 vehicles going to come from?

New vehicles I would suspect will make up the balance, again to keep the age profile of the fleet balanced, I wouldn't be surprised if the GT and SG vehicles from Dublin Bus were a mixture of different ages to achieve this.

Plus it has not been explicitly stated where the Streetlites will end up.

bk · 07-11-2017 1:12am

dublinman1990 wrote: »

It does sound controversial to do a move like this to Dublin Bus as these were buses that were earmarked for fleet expansion in BusConnects.

If devnulls numbers are correct, then my read on this is is that the number of buses at Dublin Bus stays exactly the same and the overall number of buses in the dublin city bus fleet (including both DB and GA) increases by at least 60.

- Dublin Bus stays exactly the same fleet size as today
- Dublin Bus replaces 100 older buses of various ages with 100 brand new buses, but stays the same fleet size.
- GoAhead gets at least 60 buses
- The overall size of the dublin city bus fleet (DB + GA) increases by at least 60 buses.

devnull · 07-11-2017 1:19am

bk wrote: »

If devnulls numbers are correct, then my read on this is is that the number of buses at Dublin Bus stays exactly the same and the overall number of buses in the dublin city bus fleet (including both DB and GA) increases by at least 60.

- Dublin Bus stays exactly the same fleet size as today
- Dublin Bus replaces 100 older buses of various ages with 100 brand new buses, but stays the same fleet size.
- GoAhead gets at least 60 buses
- The overall size of the dublin city bus fleet (DB + GA) increases by at least 60 buses.

Go Ahead have stated in their own press release that the contract will give them approx 125 buses worth of work.

It remains to be seen how the approx 65 other vehicles will be made up, but I suspect it will be a mixture of new midibuses and new double deckers, so I'd expect to see the city bus fleet increase by approx 125.

bk · 07-11-2017 6:06pm

devnull wrote: »

It remains to be seen how the approx 65 other vehicles will be made up, but I suspect it will be a mixture of new midibuses and new double deckers, so I'd expect to see the city bus fleet increase by approx 125.

Which will be great news for commuters, something like a 15% increase in buses, very welcome.

dublinman1990 · 07-11-2017 8:56pm

I do understand what you're saying now when talking about fleet size.

Are there any plans to modify the transferred NTA buses once they are swapped to GA Dublin? The fleet that will be transferred over to them will still have some familiarity with Dublin Bus regarding their wall signage, ticket machines, internal route displays, internal yellow bus poles & bus seats.

These items will probably be realigned to match with the new TFI bus livery; Correct?

bebeman · 07-11-2017 9:47pm

liger wrote: »

Of course it's being protected, Of course unions have something to do with it.

If the system was changed, a better system could be implemented to make work/life balance for all at DB, not just keep marked in drivers looked after. There are plenty of ways to make positive changes to make things fair for all. Don't spare drivers pay union fees too? so why after DECADES of a system that's not fit for purpose haven't unions been able to get a change made? because it's not in the interest of the majority of reps.

Lets wait and see if Go ahead have a better system. If they do fantastic, if not, you will just have to suck it up like every marked in driver has.
As for junior drivers moving to Go ahead, its a possibility, but the driver i have spoke to want to know a few things first.
1, shifts, rosters. If animals or full of bogeys , forget it.
2, Marked in, if so will move , but not if spare.
3, location of depot, if its mile away from where work starts/finishes, forget it.
4, money/conditions, if less, forget it

bk · 07-11-2017 9:53pm

dublinman1990 wrote: »

Are there any plans to modify the transferred NTA buses once they are swapped to GA Dublin? The fleet that will be transferred over to them will still have some familiarity with Dublin Bus regarding their wall signage, ticket machines, internal route displays, internal yellow bus poles & bus seats.

These items will probably be realigned to match with the new TFI bus livery; Correct?

I don't have any insight, but I'd assume they will be repainted to the new livery, though I wouldn't expect any other major internal changes. Same ticket machines (unfortunately), validators, internal layout, etc.

After all, the idea would be to keep the passenger experience to be the same across both fleets.

bk · 07-11-2017 9:56pm

bebeman wrote: »

As for junior drivers moving to Go ahead, its a possibility, but the driver i have spoke to want to know a few things first.
1, shifts, rosters. If animals or full of bogeys , forget it.
2, Marked in, if so will move , but not if spare.
3, location of depot, if its mile away from where work starts/finishes, forget it.
4, money/conditions, if less, forget it

Sure, just like the questions any interviewee asks when interviewing.

Something to remember about interviews, they are two way, not only is the company interviewing you, but you are interviewing the company/position and it's suitability for you.

Stephen15 · 07-11-2017 10:15pm

bk wrote: »

I don't have any insight, but I'd assume they will be repainted to the new livery, though I wouldn't expect any other major internal changes. Same ticket machines (unfortunately), validators, internal layout, etc.

After all, the idea would be to keep the passenger experience to be the same across both fleets.

I believe GA will not be able to operate in DB colours as they are copyrighted as they are part of DBs corporate identity which is fair enough but my question does this copyright and corporate identity extend to the interiors of the buses ie the seat patterns signage on buses etc.

As for thing like ticket machines I could only hope that bus connects will sort out like these and new ticket machines/leap validators could be introduced.

Cookie_Monster · 07-11-2017 10:21pm

Can DB claim ownership of the interior livery choices (seat colours, yellow poles etc) as well as the exterior or is that just what the manufacture provides?

devnull · 07-11-2017 10:32pm

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Can DB claim ownership of the interior livery choices (seat colours, yellow poles etc) as well as the exterior or is that just what the manufacture provides?

Yellow is kind of a uniform colour for poles inside a bus and most manufacturers provide such colour as default, so I doubt they would be able to do it for that.

bebeman · 07-11-2017 10:33pm

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Can DB claim ownership of the interior livery choices (seat colours, yellow poles etc) as well as the exterior or is that just what the manufacture provides?

Seen the same colours on buses on TV shows, probably a small selection to pick from

bk · 07-11-2017 10:49pm

Stephen15 wrote: »

I believe GA will not be able to operate in DB colours as they are copyrighted as they are part of DBs corporate identity which is fair enough but my question does this copyright and corporate identity extend to the interiors of the buses ie the seat patterns signage on buses etc..

Yellow poles, etc. not a hope, that is very common on buses world over.

Seat patterns, maybe, if it is copyrighted by DB rather then being off the shelf from manufacturer, wouldn't be hard to change anyway.

I'm not sure what you mean by signage, I assume it will have NTA maps, etc.

Stephen15 wrote: »

As for thing like ticket machines I could only hope that bus connects will sort out like these and new ticket machines/leap validators could be introduced.

Oh god please....!

Stephen15 · 07-11-2017 11:00pm

bk wrote: »

Yellow poles, etc. not a hope, that is very common on buses world over.

Seat patterns, maybe, if it is copyrighted by DB rather then being off the shelf from manufacturer, wouldn't be hard to change anyway.

I'm not sure what you mean by signage, I assume it will have NTA maps, etc.

What I meant by signage is for example the "no smoking", "CCTV in operation signs" etc. that appear on DB presently. Would these types signs be DB copyright or could GA or The NTA use them

bk · 07-11-2017 11:07pm

Stephen15 wrote: »

What I meant by signage is for example the "no smoking", "CCTV in operation signs" etc. that appear on DB presently. Would these types signs be DB copyright or could GA or The NTA use them

Unless they specifically have the DB logo on them, I couldn't imagine it being an issue.

liger · 08-11-2017 1:45am

bebeman wrote: »

Lets wait and see if Go ahead have a better system. If they do fantastic, if not, you will just have to suck it up like every marked in driver has.

I've been marked in for years, That doesn't mean that I have to agree with the system that's in place, nor do I believe that because I was forced to do 10 years as a spare man that it's okay for the unions not to attack the situation to prevent new drivers from suffering the same fate.

Cookie_Monster wrote: »

Can DB claim ownership of the interior livery choices (seat colours, yellow poles etc) as well as the exterior or is that just what the manufacture provides?

Plenty of ex DB fleet being worked by private coaches that still have DB everything inside. I guess it would be hard to take GA to court to suddenly demand copyright now.

Cookie_Monster · 08-11-2017 2:24am

liger wrote: »

Plenty of ex DB fleet being worked by private coaches that still have DB everything inside. I guess it would be hard to take GA to court to suddenly demand copyright now.

You'd hope so but I can imagine DB trying anything to make life harder if they thought they could get away with it.

L1011 · 08-11-2017 8:23am

bk wrote: »

Unless they specifically have the DB logo on them, I couldn't imagine it being an issue.

They are printed in a font commissioned and owned by CIE I think

L1011 · 08-11-2017 8:25am

bebeman wrote: »

2, Marked in, if so will move , but not if spare.
3,

It's extremely unlikely they'll have such an insane concept. Everyone's rosters are better without it

bk · 08-11-2017 12:31pm

L1011 wrote: »

They are printed in a font commissioned and owned by CIE I think

They might have to replace them so.

But could you imagine the kerfuffle of a 100% government owned CIE suing the government! I don't think it would be likely to happen.

L1011 · 08-11-2017 1:58pm

http://pardueassociates.com/projects/cie-the-irish-transport-authority

In the past there was a lot more online about the CIE 2000 font; does appear to be what the onboard signage is in still.

Cost of replacing a few plaques isn't going to run that high anyway.

08-11-2017 2:59pm

The yellow poles I believe are an accessibility requirement so they would have to stay. The AVs originally had silver chromed poles but had to be repainted.

Go-Ahead Dublin City Routes - Updates and Discussion

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