GRO Records

Hermy · 12-09-2016 10:32am

...The way the image digitisation was done makes it unnecessarily difficult (but not impossible) to reconstruct the local registrars’ records...

Hmm...

pinkypinky · 12-09-2016 10:51am

Leave him a comment and ask him to elaborate?

Hermy · 12-09-2016 10:56am

Of course. Why didn't I think of that!

L1011 · 12-09-2016 10:57am

I suspect he means its difficult to just flick through the images in order to cherry-pick records for an individual area; as many local genealogists would want to do.

Hermy · 12-09-2016 11:16am

I figured it out. To get to the next page is just a matter of adding one to the number at the end of the URL.
The difficulty was finding a death on the same page or a close page which didn't take to long going through the indexes at Family Search.

Wyldwood · 12-09-2016 11:37am

Hermy wrote: »

A shame the pdf's aren't done the same way as the church records at the same site where you have the facility to turn a page so to speak.

Actually it's a complete mystery to me the difference between searching the two sets of records.

This was my exact thought yesterday when I couldn't find a birth record that should be there. It would be great to be able to trawl through the pages. I've spent many a happy hour doing that with the books in the Register's office here in Cork and uncovered a few unknown ancestors along the way.

However, I'm not looking a gift horse in the mouth as I've had great success so far with these new records.

shanew · 12-09-2016 12:42pm

Hermy wrote: »

A shame the pdf's aren't done the same way as the church records at the same site where you have the facility to turn a page so to speak......

just add or subtract 1 from page number in the url

L1011 · 12-09-2016 12:46pm

The ability to go through every cert of tens/hundreds of options without needing to file for personal insolvency has given me two g-g-g-grandfather's names; and ruined the chances of getting one of their wifes - the marriage cert shows that my g-g-grandmother was a lot older than the census led me to believe and hence pre-1864.

shanew · 12-09-2016 12:48pm

Hermy wrote: »

When I click to view the image for Catherine Coulter who died 1898 in Dublin SOuth I get an image for Dundalk deaths.
Is there a way of navigating to the correct image?

correct image link for death of Catherine

josip · 12-09-2016 12:55pm

L1011 wrote: »

They have never announced the existing work (matching/maiden names) in the past, so I imagine the images will be the same - put up when done.

Do you mean that they will add image links as and when they do them over the next 18 months or so?
So we should keep an eye on the website for updates?
Or that none of the outstanding images will be available until they're all done?

L1011 · 12-09-2016 12:58pm

josip wrote: »

Do you mean that they will add image links as and when they do them over the next 18 months or so?
So we should keep an eye on the website for updates?
Or that none of the outstanding images will be available until they're all done?

I would imagine they'll be updated when done.

eqwjewoiujqorj · 12-09-2016 1:18pm

I note that none of the pre 1864 births are up (1845 - 1863) apart form a few.
And those few don't have images - apart from the last one which is a mistake, 1857 instead of 1867.

shanew · 12-09-2016 1:27pm

eqwjewoiujqorj wrote: »

I note that none of the pre 1864 births are up (1845 - 1863) apart form a few.
And those few don't have images - apart from the last one which is a mistake, 1857 instead of 1867...

???? - registration of births started in 1864 - the only pre-1864 civil records are non-Catholic marriages.

eqwjewoiujqorj · 12-09-2016 1:53pm

shanew wrote: »

???? - registration of births started in 1864 - the only pre-1864 civil records are non-Catholic marriages.

oh right, never had reason to look at records before 1864, but had read that registration begin in 1845 for non Catholics - didn't know it was just for marriages.

pinkypinky · 12-09-2016 2:07pm

I'm now wondering how those births appear in the registers at all - possibly late registration allowed for people before the beginning of the official period?

shanew · 12-09-2016 2:48pm

presumably meant to be after abt 1900, since that's when the mother's maiden surname is indexed ?

shanew · 12-09-2016 2:56pm

eqwjewoiujqorj wrote: »

oh right, never had reason to look at records before 1864, but had read that registration begin in 1845 for non Catholics - didn't know it was just for marriages.

It's not always phrased the best, you're not the first to read that way..

Alan259 · 12-09-2016 4:52pm

Does anyone know if there is a trick for finding an entry if the image links to a blank page? For example, at this link: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/details-civil/f117b00988003 , the image is blank. I have tried looking several pages before and after the linked page, but still no luck. This is in the Superintendent Registrar's District of Galway Union, the Registrar's District of Turloughmore in Co. Galway BTW. Thanks.

shanew · 12-09-2016 5:04pm

it depends - in this case the old style index shows that birth as page 254. The image link shows page 256, the previous image shows page 253 - looks like there may be pages missing

Alan259 · 12-09-2016 5:59pm

shanew wrote: »

it depends - in this case the old style index shows that birth as page 254. The image link shows page 256, the previous image shows page 253 - looks like there may be pages missing

Thanks Shane, I didn't notice the page numbers printed on the pages. They will come in very handy with determining what is and isn't online.

Rox_88 · 12-09-2016 6:52pm

I've just found 65 births and 4 deaths under the registration district "Not Applicable" does anyone know what they are or why they're there? There doesn't seem to be images attached to any of them.

Sorry if this has been brought up before.

shanew · 12-09-2016 7:50pm

picking one of those 65 to check - the Patrick Doodican born 1871 and cross-checking for entries on the extracted civil births shows this, dob 10th March 1871 parents Michael Doodican & Margaret Horan, mother's surname matches the index. The extracted record shows refs. of v 4-2 p 626, which matches this index record in Swinford Registration District

pinkypinky · 13-09-2016 11:57am

I just called Roscommon to check on an order (1920s births) as it's over a week since it was sent in.

They report that a quite a few orders have been cancelled in the past week: I guess people weren't keeping an eye on Claire's blog and didn't know in advance!

KildareFan · 13-09-2016 12:32pm

Happy today - I've spent the last few years trying to find my great grandmother. She married for a second time between 1901 and 1911, but my dad couldn't remember the name of her second husband. I didn't know which surname she used on the second marriage, but since both her father's surname and first husband's surname were fairly common I was stuck with the prospect of buying 20-30 records to find her. Last night, I trawled through about 8 records and bingo, there she was. From that I found her in the 1911 census with her new husband, and then her death from influenza in 1919...

thank you Irishgenealogy!

Hesh's Umpire · 13-09-2016 3:04pm

A quick query from an inexperienced amateur.

My great grandfather committed suicide in the mid 1880's.

I cannot trace his death record.

Would there be a reason for that linked to the reason for his death?

pinkypinky · 13-09-2016 3:20pm

No, his death should still be registered.

josip · 13-09-2016 3:37pm

Hesh's Umpire wrote: »

A quick query from an inexperienced amateur.

My great grandfather committed suicide in the mid 1880's.

I cannot trace his death record.

Would there be a reason for that linked to the reason for his death?

Would his death have been registered in the RD where the autopsy was carried out instead of where he actually died?

shanew · 13-09-2016 3:46pm

a couple of things to try if you cant find an image

if the entry is on the GRO Index and has a link which shows an incorrect page, but the registration district at the top of the page is correct, then check the page number, usually top left or right, and see if it matches the page on the same entry on the old style index on FamilySearch (or Anc/FMP). If the page is incorrect, calculate the difference and alter the last section of the URL to try to locate the correct page.

If the district is incorrect (like the Coulter record mentioned previously), find the old style entry for the record in question, then look for other records of the same type in the same district and quarter (or year if before 1878) and locate these on the GRO Index to see if the image links are correct (and ideally the page number is close..), 'scroll' back or forwards to the required page. The same technique can help locate records that are not on the GRO index,but do show on the FamilySearch index - e.g. a birth in my tree from 1889.

Jellybaby1 · 13-09-2016 8:25pm

KildareFan wrote: »

Happy today - I've spent the last few years trying to find my great grandmother. She married for a second time between 1901 and 1911, but my dad couldn't remember the name of her second husband. I didn't know which surname she used on the second marriage, but since both her father's surname and first husband's surname were fairly common I was stuck with the prospect of buying 20-30 records to find her. Last night, I trawled through about 8 records and bingo, there she was. From that I found her in the 1911 census with her new husband, and then her death from influenza in 1919...

thank you Irishgenealogy!

It's lucky she remarried in Ireland. In my case, my g.mother remarried in the UK, even with the help of Ancestry and FindmyPast, even having purchased several wrong expensive records from UK, I still have not found her second marriage.

Tychoo · 14-09-2016 1:00pm

Is the updating records on going as there is still a lot a records with no image yet?

pinkypinky · 14-09-2016 1:58pm

Deaths before 1891 and marriages before 1888 are not up yet. Basically, anything with a GRID reference should have an image. The GRO will get the rest done when they can.

Jellybaby1 · 23-09-2016 5:16pm

Has anyone else noticed the changes in causes of death? Before 1900 the majority of my family all died well before 60 mainly of heart and lung diseases. Now in the 20th century I can see people living longer, but cancer is now entering the scene on my tree for the first time.

tabbey · 23-09-2016 7:34pm

Jellybaby1 wrote: »

Has anyone else noticed the changes in causes of death? Before 1900 the majority of my family all died well before 60 mainly of heart and lung diseases. Now in the 20th century I can see people living longer, but cancer is now entering the scene on my tree for the first time.

The biggest change is in the ages.

A century ago some people lived into their eighties and beyond, but the biggest group were those who died aged 0, mostly in the first few weeks. Infantile mortality is virtually a thing of the past.

More children died aged six or seven, from illnesses such as measles or rubella, now generally prevented by immunisation.

Late teens and early adulthood saw large numbers dying of TB and also acute infections, which could kill at any age, now cured by antibiotics.

Also deaths from cardiac and pulmonary complaints, occur later, because there are now better medications available.

One thing I noticed in a lot of people connected with my ancestors was nephritis / kidney failure. These would now be treated with meds and potentially dialysis or transplant.

Another change in certificates is that of terminology; pthisis became consumption then tuberculosis. In our own lifetimes, coronary thrombosis has become myocardial infarction and many more.

L1011 · 23-09-2016 7:34pm

Cancer was rarely diagnosed in the past, with something else cited as the cause, particularly in old age.

We're going to get the 6/7 year olds dying of vaccinatable illnesses back if the fact-denying nutjobs continue to grow in number, though.

tabbey · 23-09-2016 7:41pm

L1011 wrote: »

Cancer was rarely diagnosed in the past, with something else cited as the cause, particularly in old age.

We're going to get the 6/7 year olds dying of vaccinatable illnesses back if the fact-denying nutjobs continue to grow in number, though.

I was astonished one time on a death cert, one of those bought in the hope that it was of a relative with a common name, reading "cause of death: cancer, no medical attendant".
If the person had not been attended by a doctor, who made the diagnosis?

Also many causes given on death certs were massaged to cover up an embarrassing or stigmatised cause.
One of my female ancestors was certified as dying of Sp anaemia, this must be Splenic anaemia, which basically is associated with cirrhosis. It is easy to imagine my gg grandfather asking the doctor, "Is there any way we can avoid putting that on the death cert."

CassieManson · 23-09-2016 8:46pm

tabbey wrote:

I was astonished one time on a death cert, one of those bought in the hope that it was of a relative with a common name, reading "cause of death: cancer, no medical attendant". If the person had not been attended by a doctor, who made the diagnosis?

I think that means there was no medical attendant at the time of death. Not that there had not been a medical diagnosis?

pedroeibar1 · 23-09-2016 11:03pm

L1011 wrote: »

We're going to get the 6/7 year olds dying of vaccinatable illnesses back if the fact-denying nutjobs continue to grow in number, though.

Sadly that continues to happen. This young lad did not make it.

I'm looking forward for some death records research to be done by age cohort on the diseases named in the GRO records - it would provide some really fascinating social history.

Hermy · 24-09-2016 6:19pm

pinkypinky wrote: »

If we want to put together a coherent and succinct list of issues, I'd be happy to pass it on directly to him.

If I could change just one thing on that website it would be the infernal sign in/ captcha procedure. I don't mind signing in to use any website but having done so I see no reason to have to do it again and again, especially mid-session.
I will gladly provide name, address, date of birth and anything else if it means I don't have to be told again and again that I'm not a robot!:(

Alan259 · 24-09-2016 7:29pm

I'm looking up the death records for those who were executed in the 1916 Rising and I can find the 10 who were registered in 2000 at these links: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1916/020453/7178614 and https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1916/020453/7178615 . And I can find the contemporary registrations for Seán Hueston and Michael Mallin at this link: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1916/05245/4453541 . But when I search for Thomas MacDonagh and James Connolly, I find them listed on Irishgenealogy.ie but there is no link to an image of their death registrations. Does anyone know if their is a particular reason for the absence of their records or is it just a glitch on the site?

Alan259 · 24-09-2016 10:26pm

Alan259 wrote: »

I'm looking up the death records for those who were executed in the 1916 Rising and I can find the 10 who were registered in 2000 at these links: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1916/020453/7178614 and https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1916/020453/7178615 . And I can find the contemporary registrations for Seán Hueston and Michael Mallin at this link: https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1916/05245/4453541 . But when I search for Thomas MacDonagh and James Connolly, I find them listed on Irishgenealogy.ie but there is no link to an image of their death registrations. Does anyone know if their is a particular reason for the absence of their records or is it just a glitch on the site?

Just noticed that James Connolly's registration is on the same page as Heston's and Mallin's.

rhapsody · 25-09-2016 7:33pm

Alan259 wrote: »

I'm looking up the death records for those who were executed in the 1916 Rising

Thanks for mentioning this, and putting up the links. I've been so busy looking up my own people that I didn't think to search for historical figures. For anyone who someone didn't know the background, I'm sure they'd find it strange to see poets, sculptors, headmasters etc dying of 'probable gunshot wounds' (which in itself reads very strangely).

Jellybaby1 · 25-09-2016 7:58pm

There was also the 'Great Flu Epidemic' of 1918/19. Over 20,000 died in Ireland. I haven't found any in my own records yet but I am definitely seeing a few here and there in 1918.

Tralee Chess Player · 25-09-2016 9:12pm

I've just found two of my gran aunts after a long search. I was hoping they'd gone to America but sadly they dried in 1905 aged 7 and 15.
Today I'm just sad for my great grand mother who had to bury them both within two months of each other.

lottpaul · 26-09-2016 2:43pm

Was interested to read about the 1916 executions etc -- am trying to find a record for someone executed in the Civil War -- can find most of the people executed at the same time and in the same place (Beggars Bush Barracks) but no sign of him at all. Is it possible his death was never actually registered? Or just that some registers have been lost etc?

pinkypinky · 26-09-2016 11:07pm

Mistranscription is most likely.

Jellybaby1 · 28-09-2016 9:13pm

On birth records I've come across a few with 'C.E.' for profession of father. Anyone know what this stands for?

Alicat · 28-09-2016 10:13pm

I can't seem to find a civil cert for a marriage that I have the parish record for...

Between Thomas Hyland and Bridget Brennan, married 1st June 1890 in Kingstown.

Here's the link to the parish record.

Any ideas why I can't find a civil cert for it?

Alicat · 28-09-2016 10:16pm

Jellybaby1 wrote: »

On birth records I've come across a few with 'C.E.' for profession of father. Anyone know what this stands for?

I've seen "Corporation Employee" on two certs before if that's any use?

tabbey · 28-09-2016 10:30pm

Jellybaby1 wrote: »

On birth records I've come across a few with 'C.E.' for profession of father. Anyone know what this stands for?

Civil Engineer.

Jellybaby1 · 28-09-2016 11:34pm

Alicat wrote: »

I've seen "Corporation Employee" on two certs before if that's any use?

tabbey wrote: »

Civil Engineer.

Thank you both.

GRO Records

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