Should the 14 day quarantine for tourists and Irish remain?

stephenjmcd · 23-05-2020 4:31pm

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I suspect these quarantine measures won't last long as other countries relax theres.

It's a very high impact measure for increasingly limited effect in terms of illness suppression.

In fact I wouldn't be surprised if they forego it in June.

Yeah at this stage pointless. Would have been useful in March but not now

DivingDuck · 23-05-2020 4:43pm

What are people returning to their homes supposed to do for food during this period? Are provisions being made to facilitate acquiring "essential needs", or will people be returning to homes empty of food under the threat of prison if they try to go to Dunnes?

I'm not trying to be funny and I respect that there's a need to contain the disease, but people need access to food, too.

average_runner · 23-05-2020 4:48pm

DivingDuck wrote: »

What are people returning to their homes supposed to do for food during this period? Are provisions being made to facilitate acquiring "essential needs", or will people be returning to homes empty of food under the threat of prison if they try to go to Dunnes?

I'm not trying to be funny and I respect that there's a need to contain the disease, but people need access to food, too.

Online ordering or family that weren't away. Not that hard to make plans before u go

beauf · 23-05-2020 5:02pm

DivingDuck wrote: »

What are people returning to their homes supposed to do for food during this period? Are provisions being made to facilitate acquiring "essential needs", or will people be returning to homes empty of food under the threat of prison if they try to go to Dunnes?

I'm not trying to be funny and I respect that there's a need to contain the disease, but people need access to food, too.

I think if you managed to get a flight at this time getting food isn't beyond you no?

beauf · 23-05-2020 5:05pm

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I suspect these quarantine measures won't last long as other countries relax theres.

It's a very high impact measure for increasingly limited effect in terms of illness suppression.

In fact I wouldn't be surprised if they forego it in June.

Pity they didn't do it for those Italian flights, Cheltenham etc. I wonder how many cases came from those.

faceman · 23-05-2020 5:17pm

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

I suspect these quarantine measures won't last long as other countries relax theres.

It's a very high impact measure for increasingly limited effect in terms of illness suppression.

In fact I wouldn't be surprised if they forego it in June.

I'm not so sure. The government's exit strategy is slow compared to other EU countries. They have shot down the reduction of the 2m distance thing despite WHO advising the minimum distance can be 1m. The government has regularly referenced that they take guidance from WHO, but clearly there is a disconnect.

I wouldn't be surprised given Harris's previous remarks about no foreign holidays in 2020 and Leo referencing August to Ursula in the EU that the measure could stay in place much longer than we would expect/hope

owlbethere · 23-05-2020 5:18pm

We saw what happened with the Cheltenham goers back in March. The virus was growing in all of Europe and people here in Ireland who had plans to go to Cheltenham continued with their plans for the horse racing festivities.

Cases of Covid19 started appearing here from Cheltenham. I was told of one case. The man was an owner of a pub and he went to Cheltenham and he came home and got sick after Cheltenham. I read of another sad case here on boards from a Cheltenham goer.

I think restrictions have to happen in some form or another and hopefully it will just be for this summer and hopefully a vaccine will be through and we can start seeing some normality to travel and holidays abroad next year.

owlbethere · 23-05-2020 5:21pm

beauf wrote: »

Pity they didn't do it for those Italian flights, Cheltenham etc. I wonder how many cases came from those.

Yeah, it's absolutely fu*King insanity how that was allowed to happen - the Italian flights, Cheltenham.

Clonmel1000 · 23-05-2020 5:21pm

owlbethere wrote: »

We saw what happened with the Cheltenham goers back in March. The virus was growing in all of Europe and people here in Ireland who had plans to go to Cheltenham continued with their plans for the horse racing festivities.

Cases of Covid19 started appearing here from Cheltenham. I was told of one case. The man was an owner of a pub and he went to Cheltenham and he came home and got sick after Cheltenham. I read of another sad case here on boards from a Cheltenham goer.

I think restrictions have to happen in some form or another and hopefully it will just be for this summer and hopefully a vaccine will be through and we can start seeing some normality to travel and holidays abroad next year.

There may never be a vaccine. So what then? Lock us in forever and have no outward or inward travel. Bonkers stuff.

stephenjmcd · 23-05-2020 5:23pm

owlbethere wrote: »

We saw what happened with the Cheltenham goers back in March. The virus was growing in all of Europe and people here in Ireland who had plans to go to Cheltenham continued with their plans for the horse racing festivities.

Cases of Covid19 started appearing here from Cheltenham. I was told of one case. The man was an owner of a pub and he went to Cheltenham and he came home and got sick after Cheltenham. I read of another sad case here on boards from a Cheltenham goer.

I think restrictions have to happen in some form or another and hopefully it will just be for this summer and hopefully a vaccine will be through and we can start seeing some normality to travel and holidays abroad next year.

Travel abroad will happen well before next year. Nobody is going to wait for a vacinne that might not come any time soon.
Like it or not some form of travel will resume and plenty of people will travel.

What's the alternative? Seal us off after the horse has bolted and the rest of Europe is getting on with things.

Been said time and time again, we'll have to learn to live alongside this.

owlbethere · 23-05-2020 5:24pm

I saw pictures earlier in the week from Italy. Crowds of people gathering outside, sitting down together. Social distancing was nil at the tables.

I'll be interested to see what their case numbers will be like in a few weeks and if a second wave occurs there.

stephenjmcd · 23-05-2020 5:24pm

owlbethere wrote: »

Yeah, it's absolutely fu*King insanity how that was allowed to happen - the Italian flights, Cheltenham.

You do know Cheltenham was nothing to do with us yeah ? What are they supposed to do round up everyone in the country that was planning to go and lock them up.

Anyone coming back into the country should have had their own cop on to restrict their movements for 14 days as per the advice.

stephenjmcd · 23-05-2020 5:26pm

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

There may never be a vaccine. So what then? Lock us in forever and have no outward or inward travel. Bonkers stuff.

Sure just destroy the aviation industry and any hope that tourism had for later in the summer. It's fine we'll get a bailout to pay for it...

Muscles Schultz · 23-05-2020 5:29pm

I see Spain is opening up for tourists July 1. So anyone with holidays booked will have to go or lose cash. This silly restriction will need to be gone by then.

owlbethere · 23-05-2020 5:32pm

Clonmel1000 wrote: »

There may never be a vaccine. So what then? Lock us in forever and have no outward or inward travel. Bonkers stuff.

We don't know that about a vaccine. A vaccine might be formed. The London/Oxford vaccine is moving into the stage three of the trials, which would look promising for the vaccine.

I don't know how vaccine formation works but surely they wouldn't be moving into stage 3 of the vaccine, if stage 2 was a failure. It does look good.

(I'm someone who's happy to take it easy and wait it out for a vaccine and write off travel abroad for a year or two.)

Level 42 · 23-05-2020 5:32pm

owlbethere wrote: »

I saw pictures earlier in the week from Italy. Crowds of people gathering outside, sitting down together. Social distancing was nil at the tables.

I'll be interested to see what their case numbers will be like in a few weeks and if a second wave occurs there.

wont increase by much as the virus is burning out all over europe

DivingDuck · 23-05-2020 5:33pm

average_runner wrote: »

Online ordering or family that weren't away. Not that hard to make plans before u go

beauf wrote: »

I think if you managed to get a flight at this time getting food isn't beyond you no?

I have a family member who has been overseas since December and need to return before the end of the summer. There are plenty of people who've been away since before this all began, and will be coming home to empty houses. Online ordering isn't possible for everyone, especially if delivery slots are still so difficult to get. Not everyone has family nearby to assist, or family at all.

Under any quarantine situation, reasonable access to food and medical supplies must be guaranteed.

RugbyLad11 · 23-05-2020 5:33pm

otnomart wrote: »

Interesting Tweet from France 24 journalist:
"We may soon see all continental Europe (Schengen area) require a quarantine for visitors from the UK & Ireland this summer.
That may mean just 2 'travel bubbles': the British Isles, and Continental Europe."

https://twitter.com/DaveKeating/status/1264152186038222853

I understand the UK seen as they left the EU but why Ireland?

Del Griffith · 23-05-2020 5:33pm

DivingDuck wrote: »

What are people returning to their homes supposed to do for food during this period? Are provisions being made to facilitate acquiring "essential needs", or will people be returning to homes empty of food under the threat of prison if they try to go to Dunnes?

I'm not trying to be funny and I respect that there's a need to contain the disease, but people need access to food, too.

All sorts of reasons why this is ridiculous. Even getting home to isolate from the airport, are they putting on courtesy quarantine coaches?

stephenjmcd · 23-05-2020 5:34pm

Muscles Schultz wrote: »

I see Spain is opening up for tourists July 1. So anyone with holidays booked will have to go or lose cash. This silly restriction will need to be gone by then.

Will be interesting to see if Spain open up to everyone or limit entry to certain countries. But yeah if Ryanair have flights running for example and your hotels open you go or lose the money. Then the public opinion really changes when your talking about thousands of euro being lost per family

DivingDuck · 23-05-2020 5:35pm

RugbyLad11 wrote: »

I understand the UK seen as they left the EU but why Ireland?

Land border with the UK and no checks/controls, presumably.

stephenjmcd · 23-05-2020 5:36pm

RugbyLad11 wrote: »

I understand the UK seen as they left the EU but why Ireland?

Because we've got this stupid mandatory form filling rule now whereas they were giving us free entry.

It'll be up to the EU commission to sort this mess out, Leo may be told to get rid of the rule

stephenjmcd · 23-05-2020 5:37pm

Level 42 wrote: »

wont increase by much as the virus is burning out all over europe

I was sceptical about it burning out at the start but the more you look at it theres countries with restrictions eased who've seen no increase in R at all and infections still dropping so its something to keep an eye on

Micky 32 · 23-05-2020 5:39pm

stephenjmcd wrote: »

I was sceptical about it burning out at the start but the more you look at it theres countries with restrictions eased who've seen no increase in R at all and infections still dropping so its something to keep an eye on

China had no new cases today.

stephenjmcd · 23-05-2020 5:41pm

owlbethere wrote: »

We don't know that about a vaccine. A vaccine might be formed. The London/Oxford vaccine is moving into the stage three of the trials, which would look promising for the vaccine.

I don't know how vaccine formation works but surely they wouldn't be moving into stage 3 of the vaccine, if stage 2 was a failure. It does look good.

(I'm someone who's happy to take it easy and wait it out for a vaccine and write off travel abroad for a year or two.)

Stage 3 is only an increase in the sample subjects, so more people given the vaccine, it's far from a certainty. Even if it did pass everything and then get onto phase 4 and be approved by regulators for use, making and distributing on a large scale will take a long time.

Oxford needs more testing but initial indications are that it might not stop you actually getting it, it'll limit its effects potentially which is still a game changer but eradication it probably wont do.

You can wait for a vacinne all you want it may or may not come. Some people want to get on with their lives, I enjoy travelling and am eager to get back to it so wont be waiting a year or 2.

I'm also sure the thousands employed here in airports and with airlines wont want travel written off for a year or two when their jobs are on the line.

ednwireland · 23-05-2020 5:42pm

crazy rule. In March it could have made a huge difference. ireland closes as other countries open. it's insane.

stephenjmcd · 23-05-2020 5:44pm

Micky 32 wrote: »

China had no new cases today.

Yeah saw that, I just dont trust their numbers.

Germany is holding steady as well since reopening

Harry Palmr · 23-05-2020 5:48pm

So then UK, Ireland and France all with semi reciprocal legislation based around 14 days of quarantine

owlbethere · 23-05-2020 5:49pm

Muahahaha wrote: »

They are reviewing it on June the 18th so its a matter of watch this space.

That was the time for quarantine, between the Italian ski trippers and 20,000+ coming back from Cheletenham a quarantine then would have been of benefit. It also would have prevented those 5,000 odd Italian rugby fans from northern Italy from rolling into town for a piss up.

I wonder though why quarantine? Surely it would be a lot more efficient for an incoming traveller to get a test, isolate for 24 or 48 hours until the result comes in, then you test negative and off you go. People wouldnt mind paying 50 or 100 euro for a test if it meant they could just go about their normal business after two days rather than sitting around for 14.

Testing for incoming travellers might give a false sense of security. Taking an incubation period of 14 days for exposure to the infection to show symptoms. If someone tests negative at the airport, they might still be a carrier of the infection, and not know it. A negative test might give them false sense of security to continue as normal with work and family life and meeting friends etc, and potentially spreading virus.

otnomart · 23-05-2020 5:50pm

Harry Palmr wrote: »

So then UK, Ireland and France all with semi reciprocal legislation based around 14 days of quarantine

I think it would be more: UK and Ireland on one side, and rest of Europe on another side.

With reciprocal 14 days quarantine between the two sides.

gral6 · 23-05-2020 7:52pm

No more foreign travel. Enough says Harris

jester77 · 24-05-2020 12:43pm

If I arrive into Ireland and have somewhere I can quarintine, can I leave again before the 14 days are up? I've a 10 day trip to Ireland coming up at the end of July.

24-05-2020 12:52pm

I want to bring my family back to Ireland for a few months to live in our house and enjoy our garden. We are all currently abroad.

We are happy to abide by the quarantine but are curious about how we would get from the airport to our house. Are car rentals still operating at the airport? It seems an awful waste to rent a car at the airport only to then park it up outside the house for two weeks while we isolate.

ongarite · 24-05-2020 7:49pm

This quarantine is unworkable for business.

I've to go to Wales soon for a job thats nearly 3 months overdue.
Was planning to reduce my risk to as low as possible by getting ferry and driving to customer.

What's the point now if I'm out of work for 2 weeks when I get back??
I may as well fly and get there in a hour instead of 3 hour ferry trip and 5 hour drive

MadYaker · 24-05-2020 9:18pm

Spain are now saying they'll end the 2 week quarantine for arrivals from the 1st of July. this means I could fly from dublin to spain and back into belfast and avoid any quarantine.

Micky 32 · 24-05-2020 9:20pm

MadYaker wrote: »

Spain are now saying they'll end the 2 week quarantine for arrivals from the 1st of July. this means I could fly from dublin to spain and back into belfast and avoid any quarantine.

We don’t have a quarantine it’s just to sign the locator forms with a couple of follow up calls to try and intimidate and make you feel guilty to quarantine.

stephenjmcd · 24-05-2020 9:23pm

Micky 32 wrote: »

We don’t have a quarantine it’s just to sign the locator forms with a couple of follow up calls to try and intimidate and make you feel guilty to quarantine.

It's also at the moment only law until middle of June at the moment, conveniently around the same time as the EU suggested borders start to reopen

gral6 · 24-05-2020 9:57pm

What Simon Harris is getting paid for I wonder? I'd like to see him making ends meet on 350 a week

theoneeyedman · 24-05-2020 10:46pm

murphyebass wrote: »

Prefer to have people lose jobs than lives. 1 life is worth more that a million jobs.

This is plainly nonsensical.
All life is precious. However, poor people are generally less healthy than more affluent people, poor people die younger and are generally less healthy.
If we lose a million jobs, who pays the doctors bills, and sees the doctor for preventative checks.
Emotive BS posts not based of facts are adding nothing to the debate.

fisgon · 24-05-2020 11:39pm

Wibbs wrote: »

This quarantine is yet another perfect example of the complete and utter incompetents we have running this nation. Quarantine three or four months ago? When it would have actually made a difference? Fantastic. Quarantine today months after the fact, when everywhere else is opening up? Idiotic.

It is so easy to be wise when you know how things turned out. This virus has been a godsend for those who want to make themselves look smarter by lambasting those "in charge" - the implication being that if the complainer was in charge, everything would have been fine.

It's tedious - everything every decision is "idiotic", everyone is an "incompetent". We don't have "incompetents" running the country - such an attitude is juvenile, worthy of a fourteen year old contemptuous of all adults. Our virus numbers are now low and under control, partly because of decisions taken by these "incompetents." We need to grow the fcuk up and stop pretending that we know better than everyone else, just because we have the benefit of hindsight.

fisgon · 24-05-2020 11:40pm

gral6 wrote: »

What Simon Harris is getting paid for I wonder? I'd like to see him making ends meet on 350 a week

You think the government should be giving people more? 500 a week maybe? 1000?

Mortelaro · 24-05-2020 11:43pm

ongarite wrote: »

This quarantine is unworkable for business.

I've to go to Wales soon for a job thats nearly 3 months overdue.
Was planning to reduce my risk to as low as possible by getting ferry and driving to customer.

What's the point now if I'm out of work for 2 weeks when I get back??
I may as well fly and get there in a hour instead of 3 hour ferry trip and 5 hour drive

Theres an exception for business travel is there not?

Rubberchikken · 24-05-2020 11:45pm

The decisions were made by those in charge but unless the public had been compliant on the whole, the numbers would not have dropped.

It was the willingness of the majority who have helped reduce the virus figures

I've never minded the lockdown, queues, hand gel, even the toilet roll shortage but I think the attitude of loss if jobs us preferable to loss if life us too simplistic.

We need jobs, we need businesses and we need them as soon as possible, but I'm willing to wait out this roadmap to July/August and see how things go.

gral6 · 25-05-2020 7:36am

fisgon wrote: »

You think the government should be giving people more? 500 a week maybe? 1000?

Do not make up a things I did not say, I said ''What Simon Harris is getting paid for I wonder? I'd like to see him making ends meet on 350 a week''

faceman · 25-05-2020 9:49am

MadYaker wrote: »

Spain are now saying they'll end the 2 week quarantine for arrivals from the 1st of July. this means I could fly from dublin to spain and back into belfast and avoid any quarantine.

I’ll be on the same flight as you but hold your horses for a few days. The details should be published on Thursday this week. (Usually when the Spanish government has a Saturday press conference it takes till the following Thursday before rules/laws/details are published). Spain singled out the U.K. and non-Shengen already so let’s hope Sánchez doesn’t exclude us when borders open.

ednwireland · 25-05-2020 10:00am

fisgon wrote: »

It is so easy to be wise when you know how things turned out. This virus has been a godsend for those who want to make themselves look smarter by lambasting those "in charge" - the implication being that if the complainer was in charge, everything would have been fine.

austria closed its borders with italy on march 10th yeh "hindsight" (closed border except if you had a medical certificate)

i dont think its unfair to ask why our government allowed 5000 italians in for a cancelled rugby match a few days before

fly_agaric · 25-05-2020 10:29pm

Rubberchikken wrote: »

We need jobs, we need businesses and we need them as soon as possible, but I'm willing to wait out this roadmap to July/August and see how things go.

You are right. Think we have to be a bit leery of mass US/UK tourism resuming for a good while even if it hammers the tourism industry here given how important it is. The situation in both countries (esp. the US, where I'd also have more doubts about whether the full picture is really being kept track of given it seems to have become highly politically charged and part of their "culture war") is still evolving.

Better to carry on with getting the rest of our economy up and running as best we can (rather than risking a new outbreak so we can start up international tourism here as it was Pre-Covid 19). On the opening post, I think both Spain and Italy are more dependent on tourism than we are and would be surprised if they are not quite selective about who they are going to let in.

dfx- · 25-05-2020 11:11pm

fisgon wrote: »

It is so easy to be wise when you know how things turned out. This virus has been a godsend for those who want to make themselves look smarter by lambasting those "in charge" - the implication being that if the complainer was in charge, everything would have been fine.

It's tedious - everything every decision is "idiotic", everyone is an "incompetent". We don't have "incompetents" running the country - such an attitude is juvenile, worthy of a fourteen year old contemptuous of all adults. Our virus numbers are now low and under control, partly because of decisions taken by these "incompetents." We need to grow the fcuk up and stop pretending that we know better than everyone else, just because we have the benefit of hindsight.

I would agree with this idea, it's a free shot for all sorts of unqualified solutions and people who always seem to know better, but...

...there is no sense or logic to this decision objectively. It makes no logical sense to restrict people coming in only when most of Europe has some semblance of control of the virus.

The R value and cases have been dropping all the time while the quarantine was not in place, so why introduce it now when it is least needed.

NH2013 · 26-05-2020 2:38pm

https://www.rte.ie/radio/radioplayer/html5/#/radio1/21776908

News interview from this morning with Captain Evan Cullen of IALPA and Prof Sam McConkey of the RCSI talking about the proposed introduction of a mandatory quarantine on everyone entering the country.

Both seemed opposed to blanket quarantine measures and instead both favoured tailored approaches where by those coming from low risk countries could freely travel amongst each other but those coming from higher risk areas would have to be quarantined, as well as proposing the means to do this using current systems that track where you're coming from originally if you've a connecting flight, as well as a database already set up showing the real time risk in different countries and airports.

Seems a much more pragmatic approach than a blanket ban and hopefully more solutions like this can be found going forward, allowing us to get back to as much normal as possible while still keeping the virus at bay and diminishing with pragmatic sensible solutions and not just blanket one size fits all rules.

Kermit.de.frog · 26-05-2020 2:50pm

Switzerland has only 15 new cases and no new deaths.

No reason we should not have unfettered travel with them for example and there are many more.

Should the 14 day quarantine for tourists and Irish remain?

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