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07-02-2018, 10:50   #61
JimmiesRustled
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Just a quick update on the Ramp test. Managed to get a standard FTP test in last week and a ramp test last night. Seem to be bang on. FTP was coming out at 300 watts on the standard test and 303 on the Ramp test. This is purely anecdotal and I wouldn't use it as proof of the accuracy of the test but for me it seems to have worked. Now to be honest being on a dumb trainer made the Ramp test pretty difficult and I had advised against doing it on a dumb trainer here before but I seem to have been able to keep power pretty steady and within about 2-3 watts of the target throughout each step. Each step was over or on average target power.
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07-02-2018, 13:42   #62
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Tempted to try the ramp test as the clearing effort for the 20 minute test due in a couple of weeks? Just spin through the clearing effort in the test work out, or would the ramp test have me just too fecked?
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07-02-2018, 13:52   #63
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Not sure, if you try it, let us know how it went. Ill wait till it becomes official. Even at that, ill probably wait till end of season.

By the way, the trainerroad podcast is brilliant. They talk about so much, including training, plans, nutrition and race tactics.
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07-02-2018, 14:09   #64
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Tempted to try the ramp test as the clearing effort for the 20 minute test due in a couple of weeks? Just spin through the clearing effort in the test work out, or would the ramp test have me just too fecked?
Ramp test had me in a heap after. Similar type of test to the lactate and vo2 testing they do in trinity in terms of a workout. The test in trinity is set to 3 minute steps as opposed to 1 minute on TR. If you do it properly I can’t imagine having the will or power to get through anything but recovery/endurance.
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12-03-2018, 13:06   #65
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On a recovery week, so another go at the ramp test next week.

Saturday's workout did have me thinking again about a smart turbo v power meter. I was going to get a power meter, but realistically, most of my training is going to be done inside for the foreseeable. So bar giving me data afterwards from outside rides, rather than dictating the spins, does a power meter still trump a smart turbo?
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12-03-2018, 14:21   #66
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Most smart trainers don't have a power meter built in. In my experience tacx flux under reads about 10w up to 200w after which it's accurate. Tacx vortex is down about 10% everywhere.
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12-03-2018, 14:29   #67
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I've found the kickr (version 1) to read high. I use a power2max power meter with it. Honestly I don't use the smart trainers features enough, I got a little bored of zwift and find trainer road better for training. I haven't really used erg mode either, not out of any decision or any thinking on it, I just do the sessions as they come up and do my best to hit the numbers. If it were me I'd be buying a power meter, you can use that outside too and we race outside (mostly!). Power meter gives you power data inside and out, smart trainer will give you power data inside and some extra features but no power outside.
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12-03-2018, 14:45   #68
Macy0161
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Most smart trainers don't have a power meter built in. In my experience tacx flux under reads about 10w up to 200w after which it's accurate. Tacx vortex is down about 10% everywhere.
I'm not too bothered once it's consistent really.

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If it were me I'd be buying a power meter, you can use that outside too and we race outside (mostly!). Power meter gives you power data inside and out, smart trainer will give you power data inside and some extra features but no power outside.
Well that was my original thinking, but my head is getting a bit fried left side v total v dual, and compatibility between bikes (and cost of pedal options).

It was actually for erg mode that I thought a smart turbo would be an advantage, as I'm finding gear selection a pain in the arse to hit suggested cadence targets, especially during microburst sets.

I guess my thinking was along the lines I'll get power data outside, but what am I actually going to do with that data?
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12-03-2018, 15:01   #69
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I wouldn't say there is any one fits all solution, it's going to be down to your individual situation, budget and goals.

I'm not sure erg mode will help during micro bursts, would the turbo be quick enough responding before the end of the interval, I've never used it but if it responds like it does on zwift it takes a few seconds to catch up with the change in gradient. Something to look into anyway.
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12-03-2018, 15:08   #70
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I find ERG mode helpful during the microbursts so i dont go too hard and fry myself too early.

Im on a Tacx Neo. It does take a couple of seconds to catch up and hit the power target and for microbursts the overall power target you hit will be lower when you finish each burst. For me im usually 30 watts under. But i figure thats better than being way over for a set and then not being able to do the rest.
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12-03-2018, 15:08   #71
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I wouldn't say there is any one fits all solution, it's going to be down to your individual situation, budget and goals.

I'm not sure erg mode will help during micro bursts, would the turbo be quick enough responding before the end of the interval, I've never used it but if it responds like it does on zwift it takes a few seconds to catch up with the change in gradient. Something to look into anyway.
Find my vortex slow to respond for the bursts.
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12-03-2018, 15:17   #72
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Thanks all - food for thought (and more inaction! )
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12-03-2018, 15:47   #73
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For trainers that are slow in ERG mode you probably have smoothing set in the software doing the control.
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12-03-2018, 16:07   #74
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I have a smart turbo...tacx bushido....the so called wattage vampire!! and i have power meter pedals. when using turbo I train in erg mode, its perfect...only difference is the numbers...I have a turbo ftp...and a road ftp....smart trainer reads up to 60watts less of a difference to the vectors...so i train with the turbo ftp and its consistent...thats whats key...is consistancy....if your aim is to use structure on turbo trainer....a smart turbo is all you need....
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12-03-2018, 22:34   #75
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I prefer training by power rather than heart rate, I train to the numbers so I ideally want consistency of power measurement for every session, I favour turbo sessions in erg mode, and as much as I dislike FTP tests outdoors I dislike them even more on the turbo, all of which dictate my choice of training tools below.

So, the options I’d look at personally, from most to least preferred:

1) A reliable power meter on my bike (and preferably one that measures both legs independently) that I can use both outdoors and on the turbo, for “guaranteed” consistency of power measures across all sessions. Do an outdoor FTP test, choose a slightly lower FTP for indoor sessions. Use erg mode on the turbo, based on power measured from the power meter. Masochistically happy.

2) A power meter on bike for outdoors, a trustworthy measure of power built into the turbo. As above, do outdoor FTP test, derive (lower) indoor FTP from that. Use erg mode on the turbo, based on its own power measurement. Masochistically content.

3) A trustworthy measure of power built into the turbo. Do an indoor FTP test, from that derive my training heart rate zones and train to those for outdoor sessions. Use erg mode on the turbo. Not happy.

4) A non-smart turbo, use TrainerRoad to measure virtual power (so pick a turbo which they describe as “accurate”). Indoor FTP test, derive heart rate training zones from that for outdoor sessions. No erg mode. Very sad.

5) Sell/burn bikes. Buy lots of Haagen-Daz Belgian Chocolate ice-cream and a big TV. Death by chocolate. Messy but glorious.
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