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The future of RTE Radio 1 LW

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13567…72

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    #62
    Richard
    Registered Users Posts: 2,439 ✭✭✭Richard


    dxhound2005 wrote: »
    All very true. But at any given time probably well less than 50% of the home and/or car listeners are listening to Radio One. Why was there no option on long wave for all the other listeners to get their preferred station?

    It's the main station for Ireland's national broadcaster.


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    #63
    Cork_chick_94
    Closed Accounts Posts: 285 ✭✭Cork_chick_94


    I wonder will there be a special program to mark the transmitter closing down ?


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    #64
    Cork_chick_94
    Closed Accounts Posts: 285 ✭✭Cork_chick_94


    http://www.irishpost.co.uk/news/rte-accused-ignoring-diaspora-longwave-radio-axe


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    #65
    Antenna
    Registered Users Posts: 2,306 ✭✭✭Antenna


    From the Irish Post article:
    Tom McGuire, Head of RTÉ Radio 1 added: “It’s part of our digital switchover. The 252 service only came into operation in 2004 — before that it was a pop station called Atlantic 252. But over the last 10 years, listenership of RTÉ on longwave has dropped considerably. We estimate that no more than 2,000 listeners in total avail of our longwave service — and that’s in Ireland and Britain.

    “Earlier this year, due to technical problems, longwave RTÉ was off air for the whole of a Sunday. We only had seven complaints. With RTÉ now available on other platforms, including satellite, and with our FM service having improved dramatically,there is little argument for keeping the longwave service going.”

    regarding the only "7 complaints" when it was off air for a day earlier this year? In the past couple of years the LW has been off air for a day on a good few occasions for "maintenance" . To be fair listeners would assume it was yet more "maintenance" and so would not bother complaining (if they otherwise would) and just wait until it came back.
    Some might suggest the several outages in the past couple of years were to help wean people off the service in advance of a closure announcement. I can never recall Atlantic 252 going off-air during main listenership hours for maintenance, - they only went off overnight from midnight when there was maintenance needed.
    There have been occasions of FM relays (serving 1000s of people) in this country for particular stations breaking down and going off the air for more than 1 day and no one at all complain!

    Regarding the "The 252 service only came into operation in 2004 " comment - LW was of course introduced to replace RTE R1 on MW, it wasn't as if there was no external availability of RTE Radio 1 (on MW) in Britain, and NI beyond FM coverage before 2004


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    #66
    Cork_chick_94
    Closed Accounts Posts: 285 ✭✭Cork_chick_94


    http://www.irishtimes.com/debate/letters/goodbye-longwave-1.1955171#.VDUGgJU_KRg.twitter


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    #67
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,407 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    If they are that sure no-one is listening, why do they not ask listeners to write in, and offer some kind of worthwile prize. That will give an indication of listeners.

    Most people do not complain.


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    #68
    Cork_chick_94
    Closed Accounts Posts: 285 ✭✭Cork_chick_94


    Infact RTE cut off people from outside Ireland texing R1 when they introduced 515xx text numbers a few years ago.


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    #69
    Elmo
    Registered Users Posts: 23,641 ✭✭✭✭Elmo


    Cork_chick_94 wrote: »
    Infact RTE cut off people from outside Ireland texing R1 when they introduced 515xx text numbers a few years ago.

    I though the 515xx where open to NI & Britain?


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    #70
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Elmo wrote: »
    I though the 515xx where open to NI & Britain?

    80889 works in NI and UK.


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    #71
    The Cush
    Registered Users Posts: 15,500 ✭✭✭✭The Cush


    RTÉ representatives are in to meet the Oireachtas Transport and Communications Committee next Wed morning to discuss the decision to close the Clarkstown long wave transmitter and its impact on the diaspora in the U.K.

    Wednesday 15 October 2014, Committe Room 4, 9.30 a.m.
    Business of Seanad (Continued)

    Tuesday, 30 September 2014

    An Cathaoirleach:

    ...

    I have also received notice from Senator Paschal Mooney of the following matter: The need for the Minister for Communications, Energy and Natural Resources to confirm whether he was consulted by RTE regarding its decision to end transmission of RTE radio programmes on 252 long wave, whether he is aware that the termination of this service will cause considerable unease within the Irish diaspora in the UK, and whether he is aware that the withdrawal of the service will be of significant inconvenience to the elderly Irish in Britain and others who do not wish to access RTE radio through other media platforms.

    ...

    I regret I must rule the matter raised by Senator Mooney out of order as the Minister has no official responsibility in that regard.

    http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/DebatesWebPack.nsf/takes/seanad2014093000003?opendocument&highlight=long%20wave
    Business of Seanad (Continued)

    Tuesday, 30 September 2014

    Senator Paschal Mooney: I am very disappointed that the Cathaoirleach has ruled out of order my motion on RTE's decision to terminate the 252 long wave transmission. While I respect the Cathaoirleach's decision, I want to tell RTE I am not letting go of the matter. As a news broadcaster, RTE monitors everything that goes on in the House. I intend to raise it at tomorrow morning's meeting of the Committee on Transport and Communications and I will request the support of my colleagues, which I believe will be forthcoming, in inviting RTE to come before the committee to explain its terrible decision to terminate the 252 long wave transmission. RTE tried this some years ago but was stopped in its tracks. Now RTE has got it in under the radar and the Minister is acquiescing in it by refusing to come into the House to give his response to this outrageous decision that will have a very adverse effect on the Irish diaspora in Britain.

    It is unacceptable to state that only a small percentage of people are listening. How does RTE know? RTE says people have other platforms, but many people, Irish and otherwise, listen in their cars, travelling throughout England. I have received an extraordinary level of reaction to the decision from colleagues, friends and other representatives of the Irish community in Britain. I will not let go of it. RTE cannot and should not be allowed to do this. As a public service broadcaster it has a responsibility to look after the Irish diaspora as much as the people on the island of Ireland.

    ...

    [Senator Maurice Cummins: ] Senator Mooney mentioned the termination of 252 long wave transmission. I agreed with him, some time ago, that it is a retrograde step. A saving of €800,000 has been quoted but it will be interesting to see how he gets on when he raises this matter at an Oireachtas committee meeting in the morning.


    http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/DebatesWebPack.nsf/takes/seanad2014093000009?opendocument&highlight=long%20wave
    http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/DebatesWebPack.nsf/takes/seanad2014093000015?opendocument&highlight=long%20wave
    Seanad Order of Business (Continued)

    Wednesday, 8 October 2014

    Senator Paschal Mooney:

    ...

    Last week I raised the issue of RTE closing down its 252 long wave, LW, radio transmission to the detriment of the Diaspora. I promised then that I would continue to press the issue. I wish to inform the House that earlier this morning at the meeting of the Joint Committee on Transport and Communications I got the agreement of colleagues that the committee would request RTE representatives to appear before it next week to explain this outrageous decision which has caused enormous anger among the Diaspora. A letter was received from the enterprise and communications committee of the Northern Ireland Assembly which was circulated at the committee meeting, in which it expressed its concern about the shutdown of the 252 LW transmission, which will deny listeners in Northern Ireland the opportunity to listen to RTE Radio One programmes. I wish RTE would understand what it is doing with this decision. I expect it to reply positively to the invitation for its representatives to appear before the committee. When ii does, I hope it will explain the spin it has put on its decision and that it cost €900,000 to transmit programmes on 252 LW. The whole business smells fishy and is not right. I will continue to raise the issue until there is a satisfactory resolution, namely, RTE suspending its decision at the very least. I am particularly disappointed that when I tabled this as an Adjournment matter - it is not the Leader’s fault as it came through the Cathaoirleach - it was turned down, as the Minister had claimed he had no competence in the area. How far have democracy and accountability gone that the Minister in charge of RTE allows this policy decision, not an operational one, to go ahead which affects a large segment of the Diaspora? The Minister seems to have washed his hands of the matter, claiming he has no competence in it.

    http://oireachtasdebates.oireachtas.ie/debates%20authoring/debateswebpack.nsf/takes/seanad2014100800008?opendocument&highlight=long%20wave


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    #72
    Cork_chick_94
    Closed Accounts Posts: 285 ✭✭Cork_chick_94


    The problem with the likes of Paschal Mooney is, he was also causing a fuss when mw was being closed down, even though it was a total waste of money having the same output on every waveband.


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    #73
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    It was definitely a waste of money to have both MW and LW active at the same time.

    I'm not sure if I buy the argument that it will affect the elderly because they would have had to make the switch from MW at the time and I'd say a fair number went to FM at that stage, unless they had really old radios. LW was always marketed as a service for those in the UK and maybe, in the absence of an alternative, it should be kept for that reason. BBC World Service is funded by the licence fee even though it's not aimed at UK licence fee payers, so that's the same thing really.


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    #74
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 19,407 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Karsini wrote: »
    BBC World Service is funded by the licence fee even though it's not aimed at UK licence fee payers, so that's the same thing really.

    The BBC World Service was always funded by the Foreign Office until recent times. [Not sure which Gov made the Beeb pay for it].


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    #75
    Cork_chick_94
    Closed Accounts Posts: 285 ✭✭Cork_chick_94


    This Oireachtas Committees has no power over RTE though right ? RTE must have expected that irish emigrants living in the uk were going to be brought up.


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    #76
    OldRio
    Registered Users Posts: 5,927 ✭✭✭OldRio


    Sad news. When we lived in the UK we listened to this service. Many a happy memory.


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    #77
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    A revised announcement was transmitted on the stroke of midnight, which said "please note that RTE Radio 1 is not available on FM or DAB outside the island of Ireland".


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    #78
    petronius
    Registered Users Posts: 849 ✭✭✭petronius


    I cant believe there is only a 1 month notice of the closure of this service.
    This is a service which a lot of older people used, both in Ireland, especially the North and in Britain.
    It is against the spirit of the Good Friday Agreement (Belfast Agreement) to remove this service from listeners who would have accessed it in the North of Ireland where FM reception was unavailable. Especially since the closing of the Medium Wave service 6 years ago, with the argument that 252 long wave would be a better more cost effective option! And not just an easy target for the accountants to cut
    The listeners of this service are quite an older population, who would not be Internet Connected (so online is not an option) would have access to satellite or paid for cable services which provide RTE Radio, and not be in a region where FM is available, or have got up to DAB yet.
    -
    If the Diaspora are of concern to the Irish government (and by virtue RTE) and not just a market segment to be touched up for a few tourist euro on enterprises like "the gathering" then removing the Long Wave service is a betrayal.


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    #79
    Cork_chick_94
    Closed Accounts Posts: 285 ✭✭Cork_chick_94


    petronius wrote: »
    I cant believe there is only a 1 month notice of the closure of this service.
    This is a service which a lot of older people used, both in Ireland, especially the North and in Britain.
    It is against the spirit of the Good Friday Agreement (Belfast Agreement) to remove this service from listeners who would have accessed it in the North of Ireland where FM reception was unavailable. Especially since the closing of the Medium Wave service 6 years ago, with the argument that 252 long wave would be a better more cost effective option! And not just an easy target for the accountants to cut
    The listeners of this service are quite an older population, who would not be Internet Connected (so online is not an option) would have access to satellite or paid for cable services which provide RTE Radio, and not be in a region where FM is available, or have got up to DAB yet.
    -
    If the Diaspora are of concern to the Irish government (and by virtue RTE) and not just a market segment to be touched up for a few tourist euro on enterprises like "the gathering" then removing the Long Wave service is a betrayal.

    What difference would it make if they gave 6 months or two years notice ? 5 weeks is plenty of time to get a cheap smartphone or paytv.


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    #80
    Thurston?
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,278 ✭✭✭Thurston?


    Cork_chick_94 wrote: »
    5 weeks is plenty of time to get a cheap smartphone or paytv.

    Why pay TV?


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    #81
    Cork_chick_94
    Closed Accounts Posts: 285 ✭✭Cork_chick_94


    Thurston? wrote: »
    Why pay TV?

    R1 is on sky and virgin tv in the uk


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    #82
    Thurston?
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,278 ✭✭✭Thurston?


    Cork_chick_94 wrote: »
    R1 is on sky and virgin tv in the uk

    It's free-to-air on satellite.


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    #83
    petronius
    Registered Users Posts: 849 ✭✭✭petronius


    Yes RTE Radio One is free to air on Astra 28 -
    However they dropped RTE Radio One Extra (which was relayed on long wave) in January 2013 - it was described as "quality speech from home and abroad" alas that commitment is now no more!


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    #84
    dxhound2005
    Registered Users Posts: 20,657 ✭✭✭✭dxhound2005


    I don't want to see it going. I have a general coverage receiver beside my bed and it is handy to be able to go from the 40 meter amateur band for instance to RTE on longwave. But MW and SW are disappearing fast all round Europe and beyond. If RTE are correct that LW attracts only about 2000 listeners in Ireland it can hardly justify keeping it on the air. I don't buy the line that many people are that starved of technology that their only way to receive it is on LW.

    And as I mentioned before, at times less than 25% if the listening audience is tuned in to Radio 1 via any of it's platforms. Often the aggregrate majority is tuned to local radio, exclusively on FM. All the other national stations and local stations have had to get by without a LW outlet, while a minority station was given that platform.

    I know the argument about Britain and the North. As far as I know the Good Friday agreement only covers TV and it certainly does not have a remit in Britain. RTE is not an international broadcaster. And on the road the Radio 1 FM signal will disappear from the car here and there. But so will other stations and I suspect this applies in all countries which closed down MW.

    http://www.mediauk.com/radio/discussions/radio-chatter/the-end-of-medium-wavelong-wave-in-germany-and-france


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    #85
    Digifriendly
    Registered Users Posts: 4,019 ✭✭✭Digifriendly


    dxhound2005 wrote: »
    I don't want to see it going. I have a general coverage receiver beside my bed and it is handy to be able to go from the 40 meter amateur band for instance to RTE on longwave. But MW and SW are disappearing fast all round Europe and beyond. If RTE are correct that LW attracts only about 2000 listeners in Ireland it can hardly justify keeping it on the air. I don't buy the line that many people are that starved of technology that their only way to receive it is on LW.

    And as I mentioned before, at times less than 25% if the listening audience is tuned in to Radio 1 via any of it's platforms. Often the aggregrate majority is tuned to local radio, exclusively on FM. All the other national stations and local stations have had to get by without a LW outlet, while a minority station was given that platform.

    I know the argument about Britain and the North. As far as I know the Good Friday agreement only covers TV and it certainly does not have a remit in Britain. RTE is not an international broadcaster. And on the road the Radio 1 FM signal will disappear from the car here and there. But so will other stations and I suspect this applies in all countries which closed down MW.

    http://www.mediauk.com/radio/discussions/radio-chatter/the-end-of-medium-wavelong-wave-in-germany-and-france

    You begin by saying 'I don't want to see it going' and then proceed to give cogently strong reasons why it should go! Do you want it gone or not?


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    #86
    Cork_chick_94
    Closed Accounts Posts: 285 ✭✭Cork_chick_94


    Jesus H christ, I am just listening
    back now to the head of rte radio Jim
    Jennings on the today show this
    morning talking about this, he doesn't
    have a clue what he is saying, he also
    mumbled that they might deley the
    switch off date.


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    #87
    kazoo106
    Registered Users Posts: 501 ✭✭✭kazoo106


    Hopefully I am not breaking Boards T&C's by providing a link to this interview below
    http://www.rte.ie/radio/utils/radioplayer/rteradioweb.html#!rii=9%3A20664400%3A0%3A%3A

    This man is poorly informed - not only on the technical operation of the radio stations he manages, but also on the Geography of Ireland

    If Long wave in cars is an issue - let them re-activate 567kHz from Clarkestown which will give better MW reception into the UK than it did from Tullamore (however does anyone know if spectrum are still on 558 in London)

    567kHz has a wavelength of just short of 529m - a half wavelengh being 264.5m - meaning that extending the mast at Clarkestown by 16.5m would give a near perfect 1/2 wave length for 567 - with every car radio covered - If spectrum IS an issue - let them pump out 500kW on 612kHz - the mast is nearly a perfect half wave for 612 after they shave 3 or so metres off it !


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    #88
    TAFKAlawhec
    Registered Users Posts: 590 ✭✭✭TAFKAlawhec


    kazoo106 wrote: »
    Hopefully I am not breaking Boards T&C's by providing a link to this interview below
    http://www.rte.ie/radio/utils/radioplayer/rteradioweb.html#!rii=9%3A20664400%3A0%3A%3A

    This man is poorly informed - not only on the technical operation of the radio stations he manages, but also on the Geography of Ireland

    If Long wave in cars is an issue - let them re-activate 567kHz from Clarkestown which will give better MW reception into the UK than it did from Tullamore (however does anyone know if spectrum are still on 558 in London)

    567kHz has a wavelength of just short of 529m - a half wavelengh being 264.5m - meaning that extending the mast at Clarkestown by 16.5m would give a near perfect 1/2 wave length for 567 - with every car radio covered - If spectrum IS an issue - let them pump out 500kW on 612kHz - the mast is nearly a perfect half wave for 612 after they shave 3 or so metres off it !
    If only the retuning of such a mast was that simple - activating a new MW service from Clarkstown would require transmitter retuning, aerial work, ITU co-ordination etc.


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    #89
    TAFKAlawhec
    Registered Users Posts: 590 ✭✭✭TAFKAlawhec


    Karsini wrote: »
    A revised announcement was transmitted on the stroke of midnight, which said "please note that RTE Radio 1 is not available on FM or DAB outside the island of Ireland".
    Hmmm, that be news to some parts along the western coast of Britain, not to mention parts of the Isle of Mann. I remember from my visits to Liverpool that in parts of the city a weak but perfectly listenable FM signal for RTÉ can be got with a very good radio.

    The talk on the diaspora reminds me of the stories of English ex-pats on continental Europe, particularly in France who often listened to BBC Radio 4 on long wave as a connection to home, the idea back in the early 90's of turning R4LW into a rolling radio news service seen this example as one of the reasons it was opposed - it's not quite as vital a link these days with BBC domestic services outside the UK being more accessible via internet and to some extent satellite but it still has a following, especially in areas where receiving the UK & Ireland Astra 2E/2F spot beam isn't easy. Quite a few lost out when the BBC scaled down their Red Button service by shutting the transponder on 2A down that carried several RB streams and most of their domestic radio transmissions.


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    #90
    Apogee
    Registered Users Posts: 3,774 ✭✭✭Apogee


    RTE News wrote:
    RTÉ is postponing the closure of its longwave radio transmitter, the Managing Director of RTÉ Radio has told the Joint Committee on Transport and Communications.

    Jim Jennings said what was evident was that more time was needed to engage with groups affected.

    The closure has been postponed to 19 January 2015.

    http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/1015/652492-rte-longwave/


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    #91
    Cork_chick_94
    Closed Accounts Posts: 285 ✭✭Cork_chick_94


    Apogee wrote: »
    http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/1015/652492-rte-longwave/

    Waste of time, Doesn 't matter if its halloween or January.


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