BusConnects Dublin - Bus Network Changes Discussion

cgcsb · 01-08-2018 9:19am

Patww79 wrote: »

Looking through the whole layout again on what came through the door yesterday for my area and it really does need to change a fair bit from the proposal. From what I'm gathering from people it's not acceptable anyway as it stands.

This is a misunderstanding of what a public consultation is.

jd · 01-08-2018 9:40am

AlekSmart wrote: »

There is a lot of Politics at play here,and no better man than Dermot O Leary to recognise an opportunity to make considerable headway in establishing a presence on the Irish political stage

Is Dermot associated with any particular party?

schemingbohemia · 01-08-2018 10:23am

jd wrote: »

Is Dermot associated with any particular party?

Mé Féin

r93kaey5p2izun · 01-08-2018 10:43am

L1011 wrote: »

Clear the browser cache. But if you're trying to collect multiple submissions like a petition I suspect they'll do IP matching also. Need to encourage people to do it themselves

Not everyone has a device or knows how to access the Internet. I have a whole family of bus users relying on my helping them submit their opinion. Is there an alternative to online so they can do it themselves?

Dardania · 01-08-2018 10:48am

Anaya Angry Meatloaf wrote: »

L1011 wrote: »

Clear the browser cache. But if you're trying to collect multiple submissions like a petition I suspect they'll do IP matching also. Need to encourage people to do it themselves

Not everyone has a device or knows how to access the Internet. I have a whole family of bus users relying on my helping them submit their opinion. Is there an alternative to online so they can do it themselves?

Go to a library to use their internet access?
Or post it to the NTA following info here: https://www.nationaltransport.ie/consultations/pubic-consultation-on-the-dublin-area-bus-network-redesign/
Can one presume that the people making submissions have read the plans offline prior to making a submission?

LeinsterDub · 01-08-2018 10:55am

Anaya Angry Meatloaf wrote: »

Not everyone has a device or knows how to access the Internet. I have a whole family of bus users relying on my helping them submit their opinion. Is there an alternative to online so they can do it themselves?

You can email or ring them

r93kaey5p2izun · 01-08-2018 10:59am

Dardania wrote: »

Go to a library to use their internet access?
Or post it to the NTA following info here: https://www.nationaltransport.ie/consultations/pubic-consultation-on-the-dublin-area-bus-network-redesign/
Can one presume that the people making submissions have read the plans offline prior to making a submission?

Some have read the whole report on my ipad. All have at least read chapter 7.

An online only survey is not going to be representative of everyone. But maybe that's what they want. Will they have paper surveys at their information sessions?

Dardania · 01-08-2018 11:10am

Anaya Angry Meatloaf wrote: »

Dardania wrote: »

Go to a library to use their internet access?
Or post it to the NTA following info here: https://www.nationaltransport.ie/consultations/pubic-consultation-on-the-dublin-area-bus-network-redesign/
Can one presume that the people making submissions have read the plans offline prior to making a submission?

Some have read the whole report on my ipad. All have at least read chapter 7.

An online only survey is not going to be representative of everyone. But maybe that's what they want. Will they have paper surveys at their information sessions?

That I don't know - I'm sure though they could perform the submission on behalf of your relatives in person?

Qrt · 01-08-2018 11:18am

KD345 wrote: »

Lots of posters up around the Drimnagh area to ‘save the 122’. There is a local meeting happening this Thursday. I got speaking with some passengers at a bus stop today, they were very angry at the plans. They were well clued into the proposals and knew what Bus Connects involved. They felt annoyed their link to the SCR, Camden Street and city centre was being removed.

Looking at the map, there will be a missing link in Drimnagh if the 122 is cancelled. It is one of the few services to be removed without any local connecting service taking it’s place. It’s also quite a busy route and carries good loadings to and from the Camden Street area. For many, it’s over a 1km walk to the new D Spine or O to connect with the SCR.

Yeah the lack of services around Drimnagh and Crumlin will be pretty bad. Needs another local service IMO, or route the D1 down from the hospital down to Suir Road or something (and double yellow line the whole roads)

LeinsterDub · 01-08-2018 11:46am

Anaya Angry Meatloaf wrote: »

Some have read the whole report on my ipad. All have at least read chapter 7.

An online only survey is not going to be representative of everyone. But maybe that's what they want. Will they have paper surveys at their information sessions?

Of course they will. They are actively looking for feedback. It's not some conspiracy to ruin the bus service or change it to suit some sub section of society.

AlekSmart · 01-08-2018 5:53pm

LeinsterDub wrote: »

Of course they will. They are actively looking for feedback. It's not some conspiracy to ruin the bus service or change it to suit some sub section of society.

Have you tweeted this news to Dermot ...

?

Stephen15 · 02-08-2018 2:36am

Most riddiculous complaint from the NBRU they dislike how Walker called bus user's riders are they using the snowflake generation to favour their agenda. Rider is just the American term for a passenger or a user I'm not a big fan of Americanisms myself but come on the guy is American so it's natural that he uses American terms rather than Irish ones.

They also doesn't like the term transit lines that's the term he used and familiar with. It would be like a transport workers union in the States getting offended if an Irish person or a Brit said bus routes and public transport user. Jesus wept.

https://twitter.com/NBRU_DUBLIN/status/1024756108735533056?s=19

Qrt · 02-08-2018 9:04am

Stephen15 wrote: »

Most riddiculous complaint from the NBRU they dislike how Walker called bus user's riders are they using the snowflake generation to favour their agenda. Rider is just the American term for a passenger or a user I'm not a big fan of Americanisms myself but come on the guy is American so it's natural that he uses American terms rather than Irish ones.

They also doesn't like the term transit lines that's the term he used and familiar with. It would be like a transport workers union in the States getting offended if an Irish person or a Brit said bus routes and public transport user. Jesus wept.

https://twitter.com/NBRU_DUBLIN/status/1024756108735533056?s=19

If I see "current network facilitates choice" once again I think I'll scream. I wonder when the last time he travelled on a Dublin Bus was?

MJohnston · 02-08-2018 9:06am

Can't believe someone is actually investing in Twitter bots to work against this plan (and that they don't think it's blatantly obvious when a bot is a bot)

https://twitter.com/Theresa00464403/status/1024734050597187585

bk · 02-08-2018 10:44am

Stephen15 wrote: »

Most riddiculous complaint from the NBRU they dislike how Walker called bus user's riders are they using the snowflake generation to favour their agenda. Rider is just the American term for a passenger or a user I'm not a big fan of Americanisms myself but come on the guy is American so it's natural that he uses American terms rather than Irish ones.

LOL well "riders" is certainly a much nicer term then "Skulls"

AlmightyCushion · 02-08-2018 11:01am

Stephen15 wrote: »

Most riddiculous complaint from the NBRU they dislike how Walker called bus user's riders are they using the snowflake generation to favour their agenda. Rider is just the American term for a passenger or a user I'm not a big fan of Americanisms myself but come on the guy is American so it's natural that he uses American terms rather than Irish ones.

They also doesn't like the term transit lines that's the term he used and familiar with. It would be like a transport workers union in the States getting offended if an Irish person or a Brit said bus routes and public transport user. Jesus wept.

https://twitter.com/NBRU_DUBLIN/status/1024756108735533056?s=19

Is anyone else getting the urge to go through every NBRU tweet and highlight the ones where they use the word passengers and reply back with 'They're not passengers, they're people'. What a thing for the NBRU to to complain about, it's really petty shít.

pclive · 02-08-2018 11:21am

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Is anyone else getting the urge to go through every NBRU tweet and highlight the ones where they use the word passengers and reply back with 'They're not passengers, they're people'. What a thing for the NBRU to to complain about, it's really petty shít.

Go on, do it!

ThunbergsAreGo · 02-08-2018 11:37am

MJohnston wrote: »

Can't believe someone is actually investing in Twitter bots to work against this plan (and that they don't think it's blatantly obvious when a bot is a bot)

https://twitter.com/Theresa00464403/status/1024734050597187585

Looking forward to seeing the comparison routes of now to Bus Connect to see the difference in commuting times for much of North Dublin. I hope this time they provide information on the peak times as opposed to 12.00 on a weekday.

Any update on when this is due out?

MJohnston · 02-08-2018 1:09pm

naughtb4 wrote: »

Looking forward to seeing the comparison routes of now to Bus Connect to see the difference in commuting times for much of North Dublin. I hope this time they provide information on the peak times as opposed to 12.00 on a weekday.

Any update on when this is due out?

I have no idea, but if you have a specific comparison journey you'd like, I'd certainly be happy to help!

howiya · 02-08-2018 2:04pm

MJohnston wrote: »

I have no idea, but if you have a specific comparison journey you'd like, I'd certainly be happy to help!

The journey time element of the plan is the part I'm most interested in. NTA's journey planner currently puts my journey to work at 38 minutes which is almost right but it's probably closer to 35 minutes.

Google maps puts the car journey at 16-28 minutes. It has never taken me more than 20 minutes.

While I rarely use the car for work (preference) I would love to see the public transport journey get closer to the time of the car journey. I just can't see how the plan will reduce my journey because the major difference in journey time is the 1km walk to the bus stop, which won't change and then a short walk at the other end which will become a longer walk.

None of that is to say I'm against the plan, just that if I lived and worked somewhere else it would benefit me more than it will.

Zebra3 · 02-08-2018 2:29pm

Stephen15 wrote: »

Most riddiculous complaint from the NBRU they dislike how Walker called bus user's riders are they using the snowflake generation to favour their agenda. Rider is just the American term for a passenger or a user I'm not a big fan of Americanisms myself but come on the guy is American so it's natural that he uses American terms rather than Irish ones.

They also doesn't like the term transit lines that's the term he used and familiar with. It would be like a transport workers union in the States getting offended if an Irish person or a Brit said bus routes and public transport user. Jesus wept.

https://twitter.com/NBRU_DUBLIN/status/1024756108735533056?s=19

Curious what their definition of “direct access to a bus” is.

If they actually have one....

CatInABox · 02-08-2018 3:41pm

The first public meeting with the NTA is going on now, out in Charlestown SC, in Finglas.

https://twitter.com/BusConnects/status/1025013660941537281

Seems to be great interest.

Stephen15 · 02-08-2018 4:23pm

Any awkward question O'Leary is asked he quickly and conveniently curls up behind his keyboard. It's ironic I remember him on the radio about a year ago I think it was to do with Go-Ahead calling out one of the texters of being a keyboard warrior.

Here's an example no reply from O'Leary

https://twitter.com/UrbnWarfareDuck/status/1024791147510722560?s=19

Qrt · 02-08-2018 5:18pm

There's rumours going around twitter than an FF TD has been going around saying that people in Jobstown will need to change twice to get into town, whereas they'll have a direct bus (The D2). Shocking stuff if it's true.

Thrashssacre · 02-08-2018 6:02pm

Seams like th NBRU in conjunction with people before profit are having there own public consultation meeting to spread more dis information

Stephen15 · 02-08-2018 6:10pm

Thrashssacre wrote: »

Seams like th NBRU in conjunction with people before profit are having there own public consultation meeting to spread more dis information

I love the title "Defend Public Transport". So they plan to "defend" public transport from improvements.

OldMrBrennan83 · 02-08-2018 6:42pm

Stephen15 wrote: »

I love the title "Defend Public Transport". So they plan to "defend" public transport from improvements.

That's the thing though, for a lot of normal people on the ground they may not be improvements so why shouldn't they object? The attitude at the top of this plan and of all that worship at the church of Jarret doesn't do anything to help either. People have genuine concerns and scoffing at every single one of them does nothing. Whether this plan is right or wrong, the clarity, marketing, and general attitude around rolling it out at all levels has been atrocious. Things like this can never be as simple a matter of "this is better, now accept it you imbeciles" as it's coming across, the real life doesn't work that way.

john boye · 02-08-2018 6:54pm

Qrt wrote: »

There's rumours going around twitter than an FF TD has been going around saying that people in Jobstown will need to change twice to get into town, whereas they'll have a direct bus (The D2). Shocking stuff if it's true.

Would not surprise me one bit. I heard a driver on the 77A a couple of weeks ago telling another driver that people will have to get 3 buses in future if they want to get from Citywest to Ringsend. For all I know it could actually be true but it's extremely misleading. The Tallaght routes weren't moved to terminate at Ringsend because of any demand for it, it was because they had to be cleared off the quays and Ringsend Garage was a handy place just outside the city centre to turn them around. They all practically empty out at Central Bank and Townsend St and then take on another load heading to Ringsend. You'd need to be mad to consider doing the whole 77A route with its tours of Killinarden, The Square, Old Bawn, Seskin View, Bolbrook, Balrothery, Glenview and Tymon North on its never-ending odyssey to the city!

And while I'm on it, that's another thing that makes me laugh about the NBRUs cribbing. Wanting to preserve "direct" routes like the 77A when they're about as far removed from direct as you could get.

Qrt · 02-08-2018 6:59pm

john boye wrote: »

Would not surprise me one bit. I heard a driver on the 77A a couple of weeks ago telling another driver that people will have to get 3 buses in future if they want to get from Citywest to Ringsend. For all I know it could actually be true but it's extremely misleading. The Tallaght routes weren't moved to terminate at Ringsend because of any demand for it, it was because they had to be cleared off the quays and Ringsend Garage was a handy place just outside the city centre to turn them around. They all practically empty out at Central Bank and Townsend St and then take on another load heading to Ringsend. You'd need to be mad to consider doing the whole 77A route with its tours of Killinarden, The Square, Old Bawn, Seskin View, Bolbrook, Balrothery, Glenview and Tymon North on its never-ending odyssey to the city!

And while I'm on it, that's another thing that makes me laugh about the NBRUs cribbing. Wanting to preserve "direct" routes like the 77A when they're about as far removed from direct as you could get.

Lived along the 77a for years. It's a grand bus once you live before The Square. After that it's out and out agony. But I'm fairly sure the three buses thing is incorrect two. If anything it's the 63 to town then a bus down to ringsend. Anyone in their right mind would use the Luas though, and with a possible Poolbeg expansion on the cards...

Stephen15 · 02-08-2018 7:01pm

Patww79 wrote: »

That's the thing though, for a lot of normal people on the ground they may not be improvements so why shouldn't they object? The attitude at the top of this plan and of all that worship at the church of Jarret doesn't do anything to help either. People have genuine concerns and scoffing at every single one of them does nothing. Whether this plan is right or wrong, the clarity, marketing, and general attitude around rolling it out at all levels has been atrocious. Things like this can never be as simple a matter of "this is better, now accept it you imbeciles" as it's coming across, the real life doesn't work that way.

Having to change buses is not a genuine concern if the changes are seemless and if the buses are more frequent and journey times are reduced then that is a big improvement surely. Wanting an improved service is not Jarrett worshipping. I have my concerns and suggestions but I've submitted them to the NTA.

What's not clear about the map which was made I found it very simple and easy to understand. A lot of the misunderstandings are manufactured by opposition TD's/Councillors and the likes of O'Leary as the proposed plans don't fit in with their agenda.

Qrt · 02-08-2018 7:02pm

Does anybody have a decade from which most of the routes originate from? I want to say the 1930s, but it could be later.

L1011 · 02-08-2018 7:08pm

Qrt wrote: »

Does anybody have a decade from which most of the routes originate from? I want to say the 1930s, but it could be later.

Mix of the replacement routes as the tram network was closed 1930s-1940s and some which are the actual tram routings from the 19th century.

Add in decades of political interference (looping routings in to housing estates and so on) and you have a dysfunctional system not designed for the city it actually serves but a ghost of its past.

OldMrBrennan83 · 02-08-2018 7:09pm

Stephen15 wrote: »

Having to change buses is not a genuine concern if the changes are seemless and if the buses are more frequent and journey times are reduced then that is a big improvement surely. Wanting an improved service is not Jarrett worshipping. I have my concerns and suggestions but I've submitted them to the NTA.

What's not clear about the map which was made I found it very simple and easy to understand. A lot of the misunderstandings are manufactured by opposition TD's/Councillors and the likes of O'Leary as the proposed plans don't fit in with their agenda.

Look, that's your opinion and not gospel. That's the thing about all this, there's a completely blinkered view that anyone who isn't all in shouldn't have any say whatsoever.
Most normal people:
aren't highly interested in transport
aren't interested in city planning
don't read full reports cover to cover
don't care about bus routes that don't effect them
don't care what the bus system is like in [insert European city here]

There are a number of people with concerns and don't want the change and, rightly or wrongly, "shut up stupid" isn't the way to go about convincing them. Anything like this needs a certain amount of PR attached and it is really badly lacking right across the board.

Dardania · 02-08-2018 7:14pm

Patww79 wrote: »

Stephen15 wrote: »

Having to change buses is not a genuine concern if the changes are seemless and if the buses are more frequent and journey times are reduced then that is a big improvement surely. Wanting an improved service is not Jarrett worshipping. I have my concerns and suggestions but I've submitted them to the NTA.

What's not clear about the map which was made I found it very simple and easy to understand. A lot of the misunderstandings are manufactured by opposition TD's/Councillors and the likes of O'Leary as the proposed plans don't fit in with their agenda.

Look, that's your opinion and not gospel. That's the thing about all this, there's a completely blinkered view that anyone who isn't all in shouldn't have any say whatsoever.
Most normal people:
aren't highly interested in transport
aren't interested in city planning
don't read full reports cover to cover
don't care about bus routes that don't effect them
don't care what the bus system is like in [insert European city here]

There are a number of people with concerns and don't want the change and, rightly or wrongly, "shut up stupid" isn't the way to go about convincing them. Anything like this needs a certain amount of PR attached and it is really badly lacking right across the board.

While yes, people need to be brought along as stakeholders, to some degree they also need to be told what to do - the old Henry Ford abused alleged saying of if he asked people what they wanted improved about personal transport, they'd ask for a faster horse.
If there was a nicer approach, what would it look like?

AlekSmart · 02-08-2018 7:19pm

Patww79 wrote: »

That's the thing though, for a lot of normal people on the ground they may not be improvements so why shouldn't they object? The attitude at the top of this plan and of all that worship at the church of Jarret doesn't do anything to help either. People have genuine concerns and scoffing at every single one of them does nothing. Whether this plan is right or wrong, the clarity, marketing, and general attitude around rolling it out at all levels has been atrocious. Things like this can never be as simple a matter of "this is better, now accept it you imbeciles" as it's coming across, the real life doesn't work that way.

Dublin Bus,and before it,CIE's Dublin City Services has been one of the most consulted upon Transport entities in the stratosphere.

What makes Walkers report more relevant,is not alone it's up-to-date nature,but the very fact that there are Individuals,from the Boss down prepared to back it up and debate the thing.

One would be waiting a long time,before anybody identifiable,from McKinsey & Co,Deloitte & Touche or any of the several other Consultants could be found prepared to stand over their many recommendations.

The Busconnects proposals represent the first time in over 3 decades,that Bus Based solutions to Dublin City's rapidly worsening Public Transport problems are actually being promoted.

This plan is about MORE Vehicles,MORE Drivers,and More Bus Based options,an understanding of which,is something the NTA have woefully failed to bring to the debate.

Dermot & the NBRU,will at some point have to accept the reality,that for Dublin Bus,the Company & it's 3,500 Staff,being inside this tent peeing out,is a LOT safer than being outside the tent peeing in.

sharper · 02-08-2018 7:21pm

Patww79 wrote: »

There are a number of people with concerns and don't want the change and, rightly or wrongly, "shut up stupid" isn't the way to go about convincing them. Anything like this needs a certain amount of PR attached and it is really badly lacking right across the board.

Conversely if people want their genuine concerns heard they should be willing to listen and understand what the plan actually proposes.

We're all supposed to be adults here. If we want the country to work properly we all have a responsibility to think about what we want and engage in public consultations like the current one without making it an emotive issue or attacking the contractor hired to do it personally.

Also: Why the NBRU the ones who should be representing people's objections? Their only remit is the pay and conditions of their members, they have no responsibility for the quality of the bus service and historically their actions have demonstrated this.

You might as well be asking a consortium of car manufacturers and car park owners to represent your public transport concerns.

OldMrBrennan83 · 02-08-2018 7:29pm

sharper wrote: »

Conversely if people want their genuine concerns heard they should be willing to listen and understand what the plan actually proposes.

We're all supposed to be adults here. If we want the country to work properly we all have a responsibility to think about what we want and engage in public consultations like the current one without making it an emotive issue or attacking the contractor hired to do it personally.

Also: Why the NBRU the ones who should be representing people's objections? Their only remit is the pay and conditions of their members, they have no responsibility for the quality of the bus service and historically their actions have demonstrated this.

You might as well be asking a consortium of car manufacturers and car park owners to represent your public transport concerns.

That's what I said above, a lot of people don't care about the country working properly, they care about their own life and their own area. Whether that's right or wrong, if engagement is sought then it needs to go both directions and it's not at all.
My main point is, leaving the plan aside altogether, the actual roll-out of this by whoever is running it is atrocious. People won't react well to being talked at rather than to, that's just human nature.

sharper · 02-08-2018 7:51pm

Patww79 wrote: »

My main point is, leaving the plan aside altogether, the actual roll-out of this by whoever is running it is atrocious.

The rollout is not ideal but it's very far from atrocious. It's easy to point out flaws in what other people are doing but remember we're talking about a total redesign of the bus network here.

In general I think they missed out on the difference between discussing ideal public transport in general and public transport as it impact's people lives. This was also seen in the way the CPO was announced in a general way in the media first when those that would have actually been impacted should have been contacted with the specifics first.

All of this is aside from whether the plan is actually good or not. None of us are in a position to change the way the media is handled.

devnull · 02-08-2018 8:11pm

sharper wrote: »

TIn general I think they missed out on the difference between discussing ideal public transport in general and public transport as it impact's people lives. This was also seen in the way the CPO was announced in a general way in the media first when those that would have actually been impacted should have been contacted with the specifics first.

Better to get your message out first and then people knock it down a few days later than people to knock it down before you've even announced it.

If they had asked people first and one person ran to the press then the press would only be talking about that and the project details itself would be buried among all of that. Least if you get it out first you get a day or two of full press coverage of your side of the story before it gets knocked down.

sharper · 02-08-2018 8:23pm

devnull wrote: »

Better to get your message out first and then people knock it down a few days later than people to knock it down before you've even announced it.

Sure that approach can make sense but what they actually put out was basically "We're doing some improvements to the bus network and some people will be impacted to some degree". For people in the "impacted to some degree" category it's obviously worrying and also allowed for a lot of nonsense about everyone's gardens or even houses being taken to take root.

Even if people got letters the next day with the specifics it would have been better.

Personally I'm far more interested in a better bus network than the government's media management. I can't imagine any daily Dublin Bus user having a different set of priorities. It's certainly not as if Dublin Bus were ever a model citizen of public engagement.

KD345 · 02-08-2018 8:32pm

john boye wrote: »

Would not surprise me one bit. I heard a driver on the 77A a couple of weeks ago telling another driver that people will have to get 3 buses in future if they want to get from Citywest to Ringsend. For all I know it could actually be true but it's extremely misleading. The Tallaght routes weren't moved to terminate at Ringsend because of any demand for it, it was because they had to be cleared off the quays and Ringsend Garage was a handy place just outside the city centre to turn them around. They all practically empty out at Central Bank and Townsend St and then take on another load heading to Ringsend. You'd need to be mad to consider doing the whole 77A route with its tours of Killinarden, The Square, Old Bawn, Seskin View, Bolbrook, Balrothery, Glenview and Tymon North on its never-ending odyssey to the city!
.

Depending on what part of the 77A you live, you may need three buses to complete the journey.
Route 250 from Killinarden, Seskin View, Bolbrook or Tymon to connect with the D2 towards the city, then take the C spine to Ringsend.

You’re not wrong about the extension of the 77A to Ringsend, but in the last few years the area around Grand Canal Dock has become one of the busiest parts of the city.

The 77A was a cheap fix during Network Direct. Dublin Bus were losing money, passenger numbers were down and the 77A was a way to combine 3 routes into one.

Stephen15 · 02-08-2018 9:03pm

One thing about the media particularly the thrashy rags is bad news sells more newspapers or in this day and age generates more clicks and likes than anything that is good. You wouldn't think but the world is it's best position it has ever been however if you listened too much to the media you would think that we were going through turmoil.

Qrt · 02-08-2018 9:11pm

KD345 wrote: »

Depending on what part of the 77A you live, you may need three buses to complete the journey.
Route 250 from Killinarden, Seskin View, Bolbrook or Tymon to connect with the D2 towards the city, then take the C spine to Ringsend.

You’re not wrong about the extension of the 77A to Ringsend, but in the last few years the area around Grand Canal Dock has become one of the busiest parts of the city.

The 77A was a cheap fix during Network Direct. Dublin Bus were losing money, passenger numbers were down and the 77A was a way to combine 3 routes into one.

What as the third one? I know the 77a, and the 50, but the last one has slipped from my mind.

devnull · 02-08-2018 9:17pm

NTA's head of public affairs now getting involved on twitter
https://twitter.com/dermotog/status/1025109761015070720

Seems to be relatively encouraging that the NTA are willing to take on the scaremongering head on and are not cowering into a corner despite the much discussed spat on twitter.

Stephen15 · 02-08-2018 9:20pm

KD345 wrote: »

Depending on what part of the 77A you live, you may need three buses to complete the journey.
Route 250 from Killinarden, Seskin View, Bolbrook or Tymon to connect with the D2 towards the city, then take the C spine to Ringsend.

You’re not wrong about the extension of the 77A to Ringsend, but in the last few years the area around Grand Canal Dock has become one of the busiest parts of the city.

The 77A was a cheap fix during Network Direct. Dublin Bus were losing money, passenger numbers were down and the 77A was a way to combine 3 routes into one.

Most of the journies you mention looks like they could be done by walking to the A2, D2 or the 16 and then changing onto the O circle before you hit the city centre in order to get to the Grand Canal Dock.

john boye · 02-08-2018 9:21pm

Qrt wrote: »

What as the third one? I know the 77a, and the 50, but the last one has slipped from my mind.

I'd guess some part of the 65B

KD345 · 02-08-2018 9:29pm

Qrt wrote: »

What as the third one? I know the 77a, and the 50, but the last one has slipped from my mind.

The 65B between Citywest, Killinarden and Tallaght Village.

KD345 · 02-08-2018 9:31pm

Stephen15 wrote: »

Most of the journies you mention looks like they could be done by walking to the A2, D2 or the 16 and then changing onto the O circle before you hit the city centre in order to get to the Grand Canal Dock.

Yes, all current journeys are still possible through frequent connections. The 77A can be unreliable at times, so hopefully the more frequent spines and local services will help improve the service.

OldMrBrennan83 · 02-08-2018 10:45pm

Stephen15 wrote: »

But a large part of the miss communication has been due to the media giving out misinformation otherwise know as fake news.

It has been yes, but it's far from one sided. It's not ideal, but there are ways to deal with the general public and it hasn't been demonstrated from any angle yet, that's all I'm saying. It's not as full on down-taking as the smaller sample size here, as boards trends to be, but it's still on that half of the scale. Someone with some people and PR skills would work wonders for the whole thing.

_Kaiser_ · 02-08-2018 10:47pm

So I've read back and squabbling on Twitter and elsewhere continues unabated I see.

Pat is right.. the roll out has been a complete disaster. No-one outside those who designed it, or enthusiasts cares about the "bigger picture" or that this is "best practise" elsewhere. They care about how it will affect THEM.

As the quote goes... "if you're explaining, you're losing!" and that certainly seems to be what Jarret-the-Wunderkind and the NTA are spending a lot of time doing here.

Here's my conclusion... by the time the dust settles this plan will be either abandoned, or reworked so much that it'll be completely ineffective and/or actually make things worse!

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