Mars 2020 Missions

namloc1980 · 22-02-2021 9:50am

JJayoo wrote: »

So if the lander had crashed and the mission was a complete failure they wouldn't try again? I mean if the modest budget was all used up, just forget about mars and move on?

Yeah they would learn from their mistakes like they did with the Polar Lander in 1999.

namloc1980 · 22-02-2021 9:51am

JJayoo wrote: »

Ya it's called a tree

Can you grow trees on Mars? You should ring NASA straight away with your epic scientific find!

JJayoo · 22-02-2021 11:32am

namloc1980 wrote: »

Yeah they would learn from their mistakes like they did with the Polar Lander in 1999.

Ah soo the pot is endless, billion or so dollars down the drain feck it just try again

JJayoo · 22-02-2021 11:36am

namloc1980 wrote: »

Can you grow trees on Mars? You should ring NASA straight away with your epic scientific find!

You said

"This technology could also have significant benefits on EARTH. Imagine being able to remove carbon dioxide from the atmosphere and replace it with oxygen."

Look when you say something meme worthy it's usually best not to bring it up again.....head down move forward type job

Cookiemunster · 22-02-2021 11:37am

Descent and landing footage from 7pm tonight.

https://twitter.com/NASA/status/1363534955901579268

fryup · 22-02-2021 11:55am

namloc1980 wrote: »

Can you grow trees on Mars? You should ring NASA straight away with your epic scientific find!

you can grow potato's have you seen The Martian

TheIrishGrover · 22-02-2021 11:57am

That is a FANTASTIC shot from the skycrane (queue the tinfoil-hatters saying it's too good

). Really hope the helicopter works and can't wait to see actual video. Amazing. Anyone have their name on it?

As for the "Why bother?" posts: Sure. I'm sure the first cavemen was told "Why go over that mountain range when we have all we want here?" Why cross the oceans and seas for thousands of years? Will I ever walk on Mars? Of course not. Might man walk on Mars in my lifetime? I'd like to think so. Mankind needs to explore. Needs to see what's over the horizon. Or we are just animals. What do you think the reaction would be if we discover 100% conclusive proof of past life on Mars? Even microbial? Two average planets around an average star. Will it usher in world peace? No. Will it solve world hunger? No. Cure disease? No. But should we down tools because of that? No.

PokeHerKing · 22-02-2021 12:01pm

Why are Irish people so hung up on how the American government uses American citizens tax payers money?

I think they would see a better return if they focused on how our own government uses ours.

namloc1980 · 22-02-2021 12:04pm

JJayoo wrote: »

You said

"This technology could also have significant benefits on EARTH. Imagine being able to remove carbon dioxide from the atmosphere and replace it with oxygen."

Look when you say something meme worthy it's usually best not to bring it up again.....head down move forward type job

You haven't a notion what you're on about. Like your no advances in technology nonsense.

By the way have you rang NASA yet with your amazing science :pac:

namloc1980 · 22-02-2021 12:09pm

Cookiemunster wrote: »

Descent and landing footage from 7pm tonight.

https://twitter.com/NASA/status/1363534955901579268

That's going to be awesome. As a reminder here's the decent video from Curiosity:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Esj5juUzhpU

Fritzbox · 22-02-2021 12:22pm

PokeHerKing wrote: »

Why are Irish people so hung up on how the American government uses American citizens tax payers money?

I think they would see a better return if they focused on how our own government uses ours.

Exactly, it amuses me to see criticism of NASA's SLS launch system and its ever increasing costs. Nobody seems all that worried as to how efficient, effective and graft free is spending on space research in Russia, India or China, or are they?

JJayoo · 22-02-2021 12:35pm

Fritzbox wrote: »

Exactly, it amuses me to see criticism of NASA's SLS launch system and its ever increasing costs. Nobody seems all that worried as to how efficient, effective and graft free is spending on space research in Russia, India or China, or are they?

But why should someone asking about cost cause such offense and people to act so defensively? Its a forum for people to chat/ask questions.

In relation to the helicopter do ye think they will try and get the biggest bang for their buck if they manage to get it flying? Meaning fly as far and for as long as possible while recording video as opposed to doing smaller trial flights, and can the helicopter transmit it's recordings directly or will it have to return to the rover?

josip · 22-02-2021 12:35pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

That's going to be awesome. As a reminder here's the decent video from Curiosity:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Esj5juUzhpU

Did anyone else follow the heat shield's fall hoping for a Wily Coyote cloud of dust while doing the whistle in the background?

SuperSean11 · 22-02-2021 12:40pm

JJayoo wrote: »

Ya it's called a tree

Best post ever

Shlippery · 22-02-2021 12:41pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

That's going to be awesome. As a reminder here's the decent video from Curiosity:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Esj5juUzhpU

Important to note the audio isn't the real deal there & it's super stabilized..

Can't wait to see the comparison in tonight's footage! Wonder if they were able to capture the sound to accompany it?

Between this and a potential flight of SN10 this week, plenty of distractions!

TheIrishGrover · 22-02-2021 12:48pm

JJayoo wrote: »

But why should someone asking about cost cause such offense and people to act so defensively? Its a forum for people to chat/ask questions.

In relation to the helicopter do ye think they will try and get the biggest bang for their buck if they manage to get it flying? Meaning fly as far and for as long as possible while recording video as opposed to doing smaller trial flights, and can the helicopter transmit it's recordings directly or will it have to return to the rover?

I don't think anyone is acting defensively. Just answering.

As far as the helicopter, they are going to great lengths to explain that this really is just a POC. Minimal scientific value this version. They have actually been quite vague about the specifics. I would imagine that it can't travel very far: Far enough to verify it actually works. But close enough to be in direct communication (few meters I'd say). But I don't know. Few cool shots from it of the rover from a distance and from the rover of it in the air (Which would look cool) I suppose.

Next versions will probably have larger transmitters but would still probably need to remain within line of sight for possible laser communication to base rover. I'm assuming the ultimate goal would be direct communication to MRO or future satellites to basically have a wheeled rover for sample analysis and a decent sized drone for images.

Fritzbox · 22-02-2021 1:15pm

JJayoo wrote: »

But why should someone asking about cost cause such offense and people to act so defensively? Its a forum for people to chat/ask questions.

Probably because such a discussion about the cost and value of space research has been done to death before and discussing it here on the "Mars 2020 Missions" thread is just derailing the discussion.

In relation to the helicopter do ye think they will try and get the biggest bang for their buck if they manage to get it flying? Meaning fly as far and for as long as possible while recording video as opposed to doing smaller trial flights, and can the helicopter transmit it's recordings directly or will it have to return to the rover?

Funny you should ask. I was just watching this particular film on Youtube - might have all your answers.

JJayoo · 22-02-2021 1:55pm

I wonder could they ever try a balloon/cable system with a camera. I remember using helium balloons/300m fishing line/digital camera to get some 'drone' footage bout 15 years ago,kinda worked, cool at the time, annoying feeling it in

But could you recreate a 'balloon' - something which you can pump a gas Into that will float, connect it to a winch which would only allow it to operate when the wind, is there wind?, Is going in the right direction. Or let it trail out off the rover.

Quantum Erasure · 22-02-2021 7:59pm

Press conference starting now, with footage and audio of the landing being released

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21X5lGlDOfg

Capt'n Midnight · 22-02-2021 8:18pm

JJayoo wrote: »

I wonder could they ever try a balloon/cable system with a camera. I remember using helium balloons/300m fishing line/digital camera to get some 'drone' footage bout 15 years ago,kinda worked, cool at the time, annoying feeling it in

But could you recreate a 'balloon' - something which you can pump a gas Into that will float, connect it to a winch which would only allow it to operate when the wind, is there wind?, Is going in the right direction. Or let it trail out off the rover.

It would not go as far or as high as a helicopter.

But would have far fewer moving parts and would be lighter.

Maybe a balloon with variable pressure so it could go up and down. And a wee anchor so a rover could winch itself out of a sand trap.

Don't get me started on tungsten counterweights and all the kit you could have replaced them with.

ricimaki · 22-02-2021 8:19pm

WOW!
https://twitter.com/DJSnM/status/1363931124653649921

Shlippery · 22-02-2021 8:19pm

https://twitter.com/NASAPersevere/status/1363929492138254340

That is one of the coolest fcking things i've seen. wow. All the angles!

namloc1980 · 22-02-2021 8:39pm

Shlippery wrote: »

https://twitter.com/NASAPersevere/status/1363929492138254340

That is one of the coolest fcking things i've seen. wow. All the angles!

Definitely one of the coolest things I've ever seen! Incredible.

BArra · 22-02-2021 8:52pm

super cool, amazing engineering

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2OjN4NnQMY&ab_channel=ElonMuskZone

Does the paracord on top left image which is camera on the rover looking up at the descent module look like its been damaged, seems the cord at 2:44 has ripped a bit?

Shlippery · 22-02-2021 8:54pm

BArra wrote: »

super cool, amazing engineering

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M2OjN4NnQMY&ab_channel=ElonMuskZone

Does the paracord on top left image which is camera on the rover looking up at the descent module look like its been damaged, seems the cord at 2:44 has ripped a bit?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYQwuYZbA6o Live Q&A now...they're saying one or two minor blips and issues but mostly nominal!

namloc1980 · 22-02-2021 9:01pm

MRO has imaged the landing site from orbit. https://www.uahirise.org/releases/perseverance/

Perseverance on the surface with the blast marks from the sky crane engines on either side:

The parachute and back shell:

Heat shield:

Crashed sky crane:

JupiterKid · 22-02-2021 10:29pm

The first full colour panorama of the Jezero Crater landing site of the NASA Mars Perseverance rover.

ricimaki · 22-02-2021 10:58pm

Very nice 360 view now on YouTube. Great way even just to see the bits and bobs on the rover itself.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wE-aQO9XD1g

AMKC · 23-02-2021 12:39am

So the Sky crane just crashed then is that it? That's a pity that it could have not at least landed to be used in later missions maybe be refuelled by machine or by humans. Seems bit of wasted potential.

Turtwig · 23-02-2021 12:45am

AMKC wrote: »

So the Sky crane just crashed then is that it? That's a pity that it could have not at least landed to be used in later missions maybe be refuelled by machine or by humans. Seems bit of wasted potential.

The fuel required to land it would have significantly increased the cost of mission. Not quite exponentially but a similar relationship. It's much more cost effective to crash the thing.

Capt'n Midnight · 23-02-2021 12:54am

AMKC wrote: »

So the Sky crane just crashed then is that it? That's a pity that it could have not at least landed to be used in later missions maybe be refuelled by machine or by humans. Seems bit of wasted potential.

Don't get me started on the tungsten weights.

The skycrane was so that the rover wouldn't get contaminated by rocket exhaust or somesuch. Because that might contaminate the samples.

Thin atmosphere so can't just use bigger parachute.

But a helicopter ... hmm...

Man Vs ManUre · 23-02-2021 12:56am

If Covid makes it to Mars it will kill everybody there.

Capt'n Midnight · 23-02-2021 1:18am

Man Vs ManUre wrote: »

If Covid makes it to Mars it will kill everybody there.

Untrue.

But if it makes it there before the vaccinations are fully rolled out then no humans will survive.

namloc1980 · 23-02-2021 1:29am

AMKC wrote: »

So the Sky crane just crashed then is that it? That's a pity that it could have not at least landed to be used in later missions maybe be refuelled by machine or by humans. Seems bit of wasted potential.

If would introduce additional complexity to design it in such a way plus it would need to carry extra fuel as mentioned. It did the job it was designed to do and probably would have limited potential for further uses.

TheIrishGrover · 23-02-2021 9:28am

That was simply stunning footage. The sky behind when the parachutes opened. For some reason that, for me, really hits home that this is a whole other world. For decades we have had (admittedly pretty cool) photos of rocks and the ground and the occasional space squirrel

but the quick glimpse of a sky that looks so similar to our own (But isn't) was fantastic. Hopefully the cameras are sensitive enough to get some decent night shots. Would be fantastic to see the Martian night sky in HD photos.

But yeah, video from another world. Fantastic. Hopefully future generations will see posts like this ("Video from another world") while they walk on said worlds and think how twee and cute our excitement was (Look, 540 kilobytes on one disc!!!)

namloc1980 · 23-02-2021 5:46pm

Shlippery wrote: »

https://twitter.com/NASAPersevere/status/1363929492138254340

That is one of the coolest fcking things i've seen. wow. All the angles!

Was listening to some of the engineers who worked on the skycrane, which was originally conceived 15 years ago for Curiosity, and the video of it delivering Perseverance is the first time that've actually seen it working as designed. Obviously they tested all the aspects of it extensively on earth, but that was the first time they saw it working as a complete unit.

Shlippery · 23-02-2021 6:26pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

Was listening to some of the engineers who worked on the skycrane, which was originally conceived 15 years ago for Curiosity, and the video of it delivering Perseverance is the first time that've actually seen it working as designed. Obviously they tested all the aspects of it extensively on earth, but that was the first time they saw it working as a complete unit.

it's absolutely incredible, honestly, most of my mates brush it off as boring but when you look at the big picture, the launch windows, the length of the journey, all the planning. so impressive!

JupiterKid · 23-02-2021 7:45pm

The skycrane is an incredibly impressive feat of 21st Century engineering. It is very cutting edge - and has a futuristic vibe to it like robotic vacuum cleaners, lawnmowers, self drive cars etc.

The fact that it has performed flawlessly twice in a row on Mars is a testament to the engineers who designed and built the thing. The Americans have got very good at successfully putting hardware on Mars.

raspberrypi67 · 24-02-2021 8:40am

Folks

Just wonding if anyone has any thoughts about other reasons why countries are so keen to get to Mars. I'm sure the main reason is life etc , I'm inclined to think that even if there was that it'll be very hard to find after such a long time...My theory is they are really looking for minerals for future mining??
possible?

Wanderer78 · 24-02-2021 8:45am

raspberrypi67 wrote:

Just wonding if anyone has any thoughts about other reasons why countries are so keen to get to Mars. I'm sure the main reason is life etc , I'm inclined to think that even if there was that it'll be very hard to find after such a long time...My theory is they are really looking for minerals for future mining?? possible?

Its for all of the above really, Its for our forever wonder, are we alone, it's for possible future mining purposes, possible future colonisation, discovery of our neighbourhood, possible future........

raspberrypi67 · 24-02-2021 9:05am

Wanderer78 wrote: »

Its for all of the above really, Its for our forever wonder, are we alone, it's for possible future mining purposes, possible future colonisation, discovery of our neighbourhood, possible future........

I wander?!! lol

Quantum Erasure · 24-02-2021 9:40pm

HD panorama from mastcam-Z here

https://mars.nasa.gov/news/8873/nasas-perseverance-rover-gives-high-definition-panoramic-view-of-landing-site/

Asdfgh2020 · 25-02-2021 1:29pm

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

HD panorama from mastcam-Z here

https://mars.nasa.gov/news/8873/nasas-perseverance-rover-gives-high-definition-panoramic-view-of-landing-site/

Does anyone know why hygiene seems to be so important during the construction of space exploration machinery and in particular these Mars Rovers.....any time there is a clip of the rover during construction the entire engineering/science team are head to toe in white suits and masks as if they are in the COVID ward of a hospital...? Is it to do with minimising the amount of human/earth bacteria that could end up being transported to Mars and destroying whatever microbial life that there might be there......you would imagine that the 6 month trip through space and subsequent atmospheric decent to surface would have destroyed anything that would have attached to the craft/rover...??

Alun · 25-02-2021 1:38pm

Here you go ...

https://blog.gotopac.com/2018/08/31/satellite-cleanrooms/

josip · 25-02-2021 1:39pm

Asdfgh2020 wrote: »

Does anyone know why hygiene seems to be so important during the construction of space exploration machinery and in particular these Mars Rovers.....any time there is a clip of the rover during construction the entire engineering/science team are head to toe in white suits and masks as if they are in the COVID ward of a hospital...? Is it to do with minimising the amount of human/earth bacteria that could end up being transported to Mars and destroying whatever microbial life that there might be there......you would imagine that the 6 month trip through space and subsequent atmospheric decent to surface would have destroyed anything that would have attached to the craft/rover...??

That and imagine if they found living microbes on Mars.
Life on Mars!
Except they're exactly the same microbes that exist on earth.
Galactic co-incidence or contamination?

jkforde · 09-03-2021 12:05am

Asdfgh2020 wrote: »

Does anyone know why hygiene seems to be so important during the construction of space exploration machinery and in particular these Mars Rovers.....any time there is a clip of the rover during construction the entire engineering/science team are head to toe in white suits and masks as if they are in the COVID ward of a hospital...? Is it to do with minimising the amount of human/earth bacteria that could end up being transported to Mars and destroying whatever microbial life that there might be there......you would imagine that the 6 month trip through space and subsequent atmospheric decent to surface would have destroyed anything that would have attached to the craft/rover...??

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/article/tardigrades-become-first-animals-to-survive-vacuum-of-space

also, the rover is 100% protected by the heat shield and back shell during EDL so entry would not affect any hitchhikers!

Quantum Erasure · 11-03-2021 4:19am

https://m.soundcloud.com/nasa/perseverance-mars-supercam-laser-impacts-on-rock-target/s-5xUEkUbSPpW

"This is the first acoustic recording of laser impacts on a rock target on Mars from March 2, 2021, the 12th sol (Martian day) from Perseverance’s SuperCam instrument. The sounds of 30 impacts are heard, some slightly louder than others. Variations in the intensity of the zapping sounds will provide information on the physical structure of the targets, such as its relative hardness or the presence of weathering coatings. The target, Máaz (“Mars” in Navajo), was about 10 feet (3.1 m) away."

josip · 11-03-2021 12:11pm

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

https://m.soundcloud.com/nasa/perseverance-mars-supercam-laser-impacts-on-rock-target/s-5xUEkUbSPpW

"This is the first acoustic recording of laser impacts on a rock target on Mars from March 2, 2021, the 12th sol (Martian day) from Perseverance’s SuperCam instrument. The sounds of 30 impacts are heard, some slightly louder than others. Variations in the intensity of the zapping sounds will provide information on the physical structure of the targets, such as its relative hardness or the presence of weathering coatings. The target, Máaz (“Mars” in Navajo), was about 10 feet (3.1 m) away."

That's the cover story.
I'd imagine that ever since Spirit and Opportunity, the JPL guys have been nagging if they can zap stuff with lasers.

Quantum Erasure · 11-03-2021 8:43pm

Just read a comment on facebook:

120 years ago they thought Martians would invade earth with laser-wielding robots...

Quantum Erasure · 21-03-2021 9:44pm

Still a couple weeks to go till first flight but it's getting closer...

https://twitter.com/NASAPersevere/status/1373708912281542665

https://twitter.com/NASAPersevere/status/1372266346440892417

Mars 2020 Missions

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