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Council tactics re_ leasing

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24

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    #32
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    It’s an awful post

    He doesn’t live in area
    Has no information on tenant
    Has admitted he has had limited contact with other residents
    Has no idea about the person that is providing the information
    But still has no problem referring to them with all sorts of names.....

    The only way the above is incorrect ( or awful) is if the neighbour is telling lies, you obviously believe that they might be as your pretty damming about my interpretation

    I already stated that the locals are entitled to peace, I did not write off the people who live there, I saw no trouble in the few month period between buying and handing over possession but a handful of bad eggs can ruin an area and it becomes viewed as " bad"

    I am uncomfortable with the idea of people's lives being upended by anti social behaviour and ultimately its the authorities responsibility to tackle these issues, how this whole thing effects me is another matter, my overriding point is that the councils are using this long term lease scheme as a vehicle for repeat troublemakers, why would the council bother evicting them when the folks involved would be on to SF or PBP crying about homelessness?

    " empty vessels" etc


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    #33
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    dudara wrote: »
    Can you please stop saying “scum tenants”? It’s a sweeping generalisation and it’s not fair to the many social tenants who are not a problem. You have troublesome or anti-social tenants, but stop extending it to all council tenants.

    OK understood, I also defended the people in the locality, when other posters took an attitude of " well bad areas mean bad tenants"

    my issue is the council not having a proper screening process or worse deliberately offloading problem tenants


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    #34
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    dudara wrote: »
    I’m not disagreeing with the basic content of his post. I dislike the use of the word “sum”. Why not say “anti-social” or “troublesome”? It’s click-bait type language.

    Appologies


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    #35
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    tigger123 wrote: »
    You should make yourself aware of that risk tbh. I've never even considered purchasing a BTL property, but even I would know that if you rent it to the council there's an element of risk involved in terms of who's going to get in there.

    I'm still failing to see the issue here. He's renting to the Council, getting paid, and it's their responsibility.

    Yes I'm earning a lot per month considering what I put in to it but I won't know until I inspect it whether it's being neglected or not, I am ( per the lease contract) entitled to inspect every so often, even the property is being looked after, it seems that the council are indifferent to the anti social behaviour effecting the residents of the adjoining houses


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    #36
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    The_Conductor wrote: »
    In a case like this the neighbours would normally be advised to bring a 3rd party complaint, on the grounds of anti-social behaviour, to the RTB.
    The local authority and the property owner- and jointly notified parties to the case and required to present for adjudication.
    The owner can respond to the RTB advising of the long term lease with the local authority- and applying to have themselves removed from the case (they are not removed as a matter of course- they have to specifically request it- and it has to be justified via their long term lease with the local authority).

    The RTB *is* the agency for the local residents at this point- as the local authority have no vested interest in dealing with the issue- until such time as they their arses handed to them in a sling by another state agency (as has happened in Galway Co. Co., DCC, Fingal and elsewhere- in the last 6 weeks alone).

    If the neighbour contacts the owner again- they should be advised in the first instance to contact the local authority- however, if it continues unresolved- its RTB time.

    RTB not involved here and aren't under long term lease as tenant is a public body


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    #37
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    Have you read the contract?

    From what you have posted you have not which is fairly shocking.....

    I do not understand why anyone would sign up to an agreement with no idea what they have signed

    I have read the lease, I don't see anything in your posts bar personal assumptions.


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    #38
    tigger123
    Registered Users Posts: 4,441 ✭✭✭tigger123


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    Yes I'm earning a lot per month considering what I put in to it but I won't know until I inspect it whether it's being neglected or not, I am ( per the lease contract) entitled to inspect every so often, even the property is being looked after, it seems that the council are indifferent to the anti social behaviour effecting the residents of the adjoining houses

    How can you say that if you haven't discussed it with the council? (Apologies if you have and I missed that).


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    #39
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    tigger123 wrote: »
    How can you say that if you haven't discussed it with the council? (Apologies if you have and I missed that).

    Who is more likely to be a reliable source?

    Those living next door or a local authority who selected the very people being complained about.

    I'll soon know more but I won't be terribly surprised if the council do anything but play it down, admitting it's a major problem would potentially create work and councils hate work


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    #40
    tigger123
    Registered Users Posts: 4,441 ✭✭✭tigger123


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    Who is more likely to be a reliable source?

    Those living next door or a local authority who selected the very people being complained about.

    I'll soon know more but I won't be terribly surprised if the council do anything but play it down, admitting it's a major problem would potentially create work and councils hate work

    I'm not saying the neighbour is an unreliable source, I'm saying how do you know whether the council are indifferent to it or not if you haven't spoken to them?

    It seems you've gotten a few texts from the neighbour and instead of talking to Council about it (who are responsible for the entire arrangement) you're posting on boards.

    And if the Council "hate work", why would you entire into an agreement with such a work shy and unreliable business partner?


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    #41
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    I have read the lease, I don't see anything in your posts bar personal assumptions.

    You should not be contacting anyone in regards to the property, you have signed it over to the council. Ring the council if you want to discuss, not some neighbour

    Also if you read it you wouldn’t make statements about losing rent to do it up, the council has to return the property in the same condition as they took it off you

    Also the statement about drilling holes in wall? Also about the council leaving you with the tenants

    You clearly haven’t a clue what you signed

    Unless you signed a different agreement with council than everyone else has signed


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    #42
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    tigger123 wrote: »
    You're worried the council are just going to bail on the arrangement, and leave you with the tenants then.

    It's a concern were I to make demands re_ anti social behaviour, might the council just decide to walk based on some flimsy interpretation of a particular clause


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    #43
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    tigger123 wrote: »
    I'm not saying the neighbour is an unreliable source, I'm saying how do you know whether the council are indifferent to it or not if you haven't spoken to them?

    It seems you've gotten a few texts from the neighbour and instead of talking to Council about it (who are responsible for the entire arrangement) you're posting on boards.

    And if the Council "hate work", why would you entire into an agreement with such a work shy and unreliable business partner?

    The last paragraph suggests that you don't believe that the council are reliable to deal with


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    #44
    tigger123
    Registered Users Posts: 4,441 ✭✭✭tigger123


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    The last paragraph suggests that you don't believe that the council are reliable to deal with

    I don't know whether they are or not, I've never had to deal with them.


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    #45
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    You should not be contacting anyone in regards to the property, you have signed it over to the council. Ring the council if you want to discuss, not some neighbour

    Also if you read it you wouldn’t make statements about losing rent to do it up, the council has to return the property in the same condition as they took it off you

    Also the statement about drilling holes in wall? Also about the council leaving you with the tenants

    You clearly haven’t a clue what you signed

    Unless you signed a different agreement with council than everyone else has signed

    I'm afraid it's you who " haven't a clue"

    The council offer no more than a month's rent to cover any wear and tear at the end of the lease, add to that the lease specifically states that the furniture need not even still be in the property.

    The council do not pick up the tab if feral tenants do 50 k worth of damage in a house worth either 70 k or 270 k


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    #46
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    tigger123 wrote: »
    I don't know whether they are or not, I've never had to deal with them.

    I've dealt with various councils down the years with respect of various issues, they invariably take the path of least resistance about everything, they want a quiet life, getting troublesome housing list candidates into a house they have for ten years is a pontius pilot job for them.


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    #47
    Sinus pain
    Registered Users Posts: 507 ✭✭✭Sinus pain


    Ask the neighbor to contact the council - it’s uo to the council to deal with the tenants - the tenants would have had an anti social behavior clause in their tenancy agreement - let the council deal with them


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    #48
    tigger123
    Registered Users Posts: 4,441 ✭✭✭tigger123


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    I've dealt with various councils down the years with respect of various issues, they invariably take the path of least resistance about everything, they want a quiet life, getting troublesome housing list candidates into a house they have for ten years is a pontius pilot job for them.

    If you feel that way then you shouldn't have entered into the agreement with them in the first place.


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    #49
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Sinus pain wrote: »
    Ask the neighbor to contact the council - it’s uo to the council to deal with the tenants - the tenants would have had an anti social behavior clause in their tenancy agreement - let the council deal with them

    Ultimately that's very likely the only option, I will inspect the place first, if its in a terrible state, that makes matters more urgent and will prove to me that the council have put in the dregs of the housing list

    I might have to consider selling the property to the council but it's likely that they will want it at a significant discount if the tenants ( they selected) have caused damage


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    #50
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    I'm afraid it's you who " haven't a clue"

    The council offer no more than a month's rent to cover any wear and tear at the end of the lease, add to that the lease specifically states that the furniture need not even still be in the property.

    The council do not pick up the tab if feral tenants do 50 k worth of damage in a house worth either 70 k or 270 k

    No idea why you would even sign over your house with those T&C....


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    #51
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    tigger123 wrote: »
    If you feel that way then you shouldn't have entered into the agreement with them in the first place.

    Well this thread is designed to warn others, afterall there has been a much publicised campaign to get old houses back in the market with the council offering long term leasing arrangements

    This thread has hopefully done some good


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    #52
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Shefwedfan wrote: »
    No idea why you would even sign over your house with those T&C....

    Standard lease, you can't add your own, only negotiation point was rent amount


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    #53
    tigger123
    Registered Users Posts: 4,441 ✭✭✭tigger123


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    Well this thread is designed to warn others, afterall there has been a much publicised campaign to get old houses back in the market with the council offering long term leasing arrangements

    This thread has hopefully done some good

    But what's it warning them of? That you as a landlord might get texts from a neighbour?

    If you had already engaged with the Council, and it was a confirmed problem, and you were trying your best to do right by the neighbours I'd say fair enough. But you're just whining because your investment property may not quite work out exactly as you thought it would. Even though you're happy to receive the payments from the Council every month.


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    #54
    Mrs OBumble
    Registered Users Posts: 25,676 ✭✭✭✭Mrs OBumble


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    Ultimately that's very likely the only option, I will inspect the place first, if its in a terrible state, that makes matters more urgent and will prove to me that the council have put in the dregs of the housing list

    Even the so-called "dregs" have to go somewhere.

    The council have no right to refuse to house people because Mrs Bucket next door might not like them.


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    #55
    Shefwedfan
    Closed Accounts Posts: 18,958 ✭✭✭✭Shefwedfan


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    Standard lease, you can't add your own, only negotiation point was rent amount


    Did you get legal advice before signing?

    Did they review contract and mark it up and send to Council?


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    #56
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Sinus pain wrote: »
    Ask the neighbor to contact the council - it’s uo to the council to deal with the tenants - the tenants would have had an anti social behavior clause in their tenancy agreement - let the council deal with them

    Done that twice but the last text from the neighbour was like a cry for help, I don't want to coldly ignore, I'll try and see if the council take myself more seriously, I'm conscious of not having much power to help her so merely said I would contact council about neighbours concerns


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    #57
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    tigger123 wrote: »
    But what's it warning them of? That you as a landlord might get texts from a neighbour?

    If you had already engaged with the Council, and it was a confirmed problem, and you were trying your best to do right by the neighbours I'd say fair enough. But you're just whining because your investment property may not quite work out exactly as you thought it would. Even though you're happy to receive the payments from the Council every month.

    Do you want some cake with all those assumptions


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    #58
    Phileas Frog
    Closed Accounts Posts: 946 ✭✭✭Phileas Frog


    dudara wrote: »
    I’m not disagreeing with the basic content of his post. I dislike the use of the word “sum”. Why not say “anti-social” or “troublesome”? It’s click-bait type language.

    So you're equating scum with anti social or troublesome??


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    #59
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Mrs OBumble wrote: »
    Even the so-called "dregs" have to go somewhere.

    The council have no right to refuse to house people because Mrs Bucket next door might not like them.

    Dregs should forfeit any rights to shelter if they cannot behave.

    Number one problem in this country is pampering of brats

    Property owners can be part of the housing problem but government needs to demand something from those seeking homes too


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    #60
    StupidLikeAFox
    Registered Users Posts: 7,698 ✭✭✭StupidLikeAFox


    Mad_maxx wrote: »
    Do you want some cake with all those assumptions

    To be fair that's a bit hypocritical considering this whole thread is based off the text of one neighbour. You haven't met the tenants, you don't know their relationship with the neighbour, you are working off a very small amount of detail on one side of the story, you haven't seen the house, you haven't engaged with the council, so you are making a fair amount of assumptions yourself.

    With regard to the council reneging on your deal based on some spurious clause or technicality in the lease, I'd say it's unlikely. They need all the houses they can get their hands on.


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    #61
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users Posts: 13,505 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    StupidLikeAFox wrote: »
    To be fair that's a bit hypocritical considering this whole thread is based off the text of one neighbour. You haven't met the tenants, you don't know their relationship with the neighbour, you are working off a very small amount of detail on one side of the story, you haven't seen the house, you haven't engaged with the council, so you are making a fair amount of assumptions yourself.

    With regard to the council reneging on your deal based on some spurious clause or technicality in the lease, I'd say it's unlikely. They need all the houses they can get their hands on.

    The council need as many people off the housing list as possible, if they bail on the lease, the folk living in my house will remain, effectively no change for the waiting list.


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