Replacment for Cessna 172

source · 08-09-2020 2:49pm

Larbre34 wrote: »

A number of twitter sources in the know are showing all 3 PC-12 Spectres en route to Ireland for their delivery flight from Rocky Mountain Airport, Colorado, via a number of American continental and transatlantic stopovers.

It'll be like Christmas morning in the Don in the next few days.

According to Flightradar they are all at Burlington Airport in Vermont - heading to Goose Bay in Canada.

Search for N280NG, N281NG and N282NG.

Edit: Estimated time of departure is 11:17 local which is in about 40 minutes. Current local time is 10:41.

cameramonkey · 08-09-2020 5:17pm

Here are those 3 air corps PC12's crossing Canada on way back to Europe.

sparky42 · 09-09-2020 1:30pm

On their way to Iceland today.

Manic Moran · 09-09-2020 4:03pm

They being flown by IAC personnel or Pilatus delivery folks?
Is this type only made in the US? Surprised they're not from the Swiss factory.

deRanged · 09-09-2020 4:06pm

it's just the ISTAR fitout in the US isn't it?

jonnybigwallet · 09-09-2020 4:11pm

Yes it is.

source · 09-09-2020 4:18pm

Yeah they flew to the US under Swiss registration and got fitted for ISTAR role in Denver. It's ferry pilots bringing them across. I was listening to the take off from Burlington Airport yesterday and the accents were a mix of American and British.

jonnybigwallet · 09-09-2020 7:03pm

They must be getting pretty close by now. Gandor Newfounland or maybe Iceland?

Psychlops · 09-09-2020 8:42pm

Due tomorrow.

thomil · 09-09-2020 10:02pm

Currently on the ground in Reykjavik in Iceland, probably staying there overnight. Can they manage Reykjavik to Baldonnel on a single tank or will they have to make a refuelling stop in the Faroe Islands?

Larbre34 · 09-09-2020 11:06pm

thomil wrote: »

Currently on the ground in Reykjavik in Iceland, probably staying there overnight. Can they manage Reykjavik to Baldonnel on a single tank or will they have to make a refuelling stop in the Faroe Islands?

They can indeed. Today's leg from Canada to Iceland is about 50% longer than the final leg to Dublin. Flight time about 4 hours weather permitting.

source · 10-09-2020 8:58am

Already back in the air. They left 50 minutes ago and are off the south east coast of Iceland. Destination is listed as N/A, so no estimated arrival time. But based off Labre34's estimate of a flight time of 4 hours, they should be here by mid-day.

jonnybigwallet · 10-09-2020 9:13am

Hope we get a video of their arrival at Baldonnel. They look the biz!

10-09-2020 9:30am

Hmmmm. I wonder if they could squeeze onto the runways on the Aran Islands? Would be a great boost to ATCP if they were available in an emergency.

roundymac · 10-09-2020 11:06am

Off the west coast of Scotland, should in B/D in about an hour or so.

Sgt. Bilko 09 · 10-09-2020 3:14pm

roundymac wrote: »

Off the west coast of Scotland, should in B/D in about an hour or so.

Was just sent this, credit to whoever took the photo.

jonnybigwallet · 10-09-2020 3:51pm

Superb shot Bilko. Cracking trio of aircraft. Look the dog's boll##ks! Just the ticket for tha AC

Heraldoffreeent · 10-09-2020 4:25pm

https://twitter.com/IrishAirCorps/status/1304052227712131072

Arrived in the Bal.

punisher5112 · 10-09-2020 4:30pm

How old are these 3 and what will their duties be?
Interesting with the propeller set up is this still a thing or just older aircraft?

source · 10-09-2020 4:43pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

How old are these 3 and what will their duties be?
Interesting with the propeller set up is this still a thing or just older aircraft?

They're 2 years old, built for the air corps by Pilatus. They were flown to Denver Colorado for fit out and are now being delivered.

Their main role is intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance (this role is the reason they were in the US for fit out), but they have the ability to also carry 9 passengers or 2 stretchers.

punisher5112 · 10-09-2020 4:46pm

source wrote: »

They're 2 years old, built for the air corps by Pilatus. They were flown to Denver Colorado for fit out and are now being delivered.

Their main role is intelligence, surveillance and reconnaissance (this role is the reason they were in the US for fit out), but they have the ability to also carry 9 passengers or 2 stretchers.

Cheers, very informative.
Wasn't aware they were getting them.

Will they be used here or abroad by the Irish defence forces?

jonnybigwallet · 10-09-2020 4:46pm

Another terrific set of photos. Thanks for posting the link. Anybody capture them on video at all? Guess they'll be adding the roundels etc in a bit. Tip top acquisition. Good work wringing the funding out of the DOD.

sparky42 · 10-09-2020 5:03pm

punisher5112 wrote: »

Cheers, very informative.
Wasn't aware they were getting them.

Will they be used here or abroad by the Irish defence forces?

They are to replace the old Cessna's, currently there's no plans for foreign deployments (given the usual issues) but Coveney since becoming Minister has expressed hope that the AC will be deployed at some point.

Psychlops · 10-09-2020 10:32pm

Given their role primarily as ISTAR I would suggest they will be overseas.

sparky42 · 10-09-2020 10:38pm

Psychlops wrote: »

Given their role primarily as ISTAR I would suggest they will be overseas.

They would be great for that, but I doubt the AC could generate the numbers right now.

Larbre34 · 10-09-2020 11:42pm

The way things are going in recent days they'll be chasing smugglers in the border area.

sparky42 · 11-09-2020 12:10am

Larbre34 wrote: »

The way things are going in recent days they'll be chasing smugglers in the border area.

Or double jobbing dealing with all the potential fishing disputes...

roadmaster · 11-09-2020 12:32pm

Who will crew the back of the PC12's. I presume personal will get promoted to fill the vacancies and then the air corps will just have to run a campaign for new enlisted personal to fill any gaps from promotions,?

Larbre34 · 12-09-2020 2:27pm

roadmaster wrote: »

Who will crew the back of the PC12's. I presume personal will get promoted to fill the vacancies and then the air corps will just have to run a campaign for new enlisted personal to fill any gaps from promotions,?

You mean as spotters/technicians? There would already by enlisted personnel trained up and working on the CASAs, helicopters etc. I imagine when more of those are needed there would be the usual sort of selection carried out among the AC and Army.

roadmaster · 29-09-2020 7:42pm

Larbre34 wrote: »

You mean as spotters/technicians? There would already by enlisted personnel trained up and working on the CASAs, helicopters etc. I imagine when more of those are needed there would be the usual sort of selection carried out among the AC and Army.

I was just wondering would it be hard to get the crews with all the issues.

roadmaster · 29-09-2020 7:44pm

I seen yesterday the utility pc12 heading to the continent with tests. We could regret Maurice's penny pinching yet turning down the second utility aircraft

sparky42 · 29-09-2020 7:54pm

roadmaster wrote: »

I seen yesterday the utility pc12 heading to the continent with tests. We could regret Maurice's penny pinching yet turning down the second utility aircraft

Most likely, would have been dead handy having a second trash haulier version.

Stovepipe · 29-09-2020 8:40pm

they did it before, when they rejected keeping the white Casa, evn though it was proving immensely useful.

sparky42 · 29-09-2020 10:33pm

Stovepipe wrote: »

they did it before, when they rejected keeping the white Casa, evn though it was proving immensely useful.

Yep, penny wise, pound foolish, I'm sure the AC and Army would have liked to have a cargo 235 at the very least.

Stovepipe · 30-09-2020 10:13am

When maritime operations started with the Casas, initial mission crew were drawn from the ranks of local ATC and Signals, but that soon faded to open competition from all ranks for seats. People have been drawn from other parts of the Air Corps as well as the wider DF.

roadmaster · 30-09-2020 3:34pm

Stovepipe wrote: »

When maritime operations started with the Casas, initial mission crew were drawn from the ranks of local ATC and Signals, but that soon faded to open competition from all ranks for seats. People have been drawn from other parts of the Air Corps as well as the wider DF.

Is there much interest within the DF of roles such as radar operators in the back of casas and the now PC12s?

Stovepipe · 30-09-2020 4:17pm

Back when I served, which is a while ago now, all such jobs were open to all comers and were notified to all units of the DF via Routine Orders, posted up on every notice board, so theoretically, it was open season. In reality, the herd was soon thinned by educational qualifications and technical experience. If you rocked up, fresh from basic training, you were wasting your time. It sounded glamourous but people soon found that flying sideways in a Casa, for six hours over the Atlantic, often at low level, was a bit of a grind. Some people loved it and took to it like a duck to water;others hated it and got out of it as soon as they could. Originally, if you got the operators' course,you had to commit to a year in the seat. Fellas were known to jack it as soon as their commitment had expired. It's not for everyone.

pidgeoneyes · 01-10-2020 9:07pm

What sort of equipment is fitted to the PC12's for the ISTAR role?

Stovepipe · 01-10-2020 10:39pm

Look on the Pilatus website. Do some reading on general ISTAR equipment such as cameras, infra-red and night vision equipment. that kind of stuff is widely in the public domain and is used worldwide.

roadmaster · 03-10-2020 9:54am

Stovepipe wrote: »

Back when I served, which is a while ago now, all such jobs were open to all comers and were notified to all units of the DF via Routine Orders, posted up on every notice board, so theoretically, it was open season. In reality, the herd was soon thinned by educational qualifications and technical experience. If you rocked up, fresh from basic training, you were wasting your time. It sounded glamourous but people soon found that flying sideways in a Casa, for six hours over the Atlantic, often at low level, was a bit of a grind. Some people loved it and took to it like a duck to water;others hated it and got out of it as soon as they could. Originally, if you got the operators' course,you had to commit to a year in the seat. Fellas were known to jack it as soon as their commitment had expired. It's not for everyone.

At least in the PC12 they will be sitting forward looking

California Dreamer · 16-10-2020 6:05pm

Are we privy or is it ok to ask where the PC-12s are flying to?

FR24 shows lots of flights to Liege for instance. Is that tests?

Psychlops · 16-10-2020 10:16pm

Great new DF podcast speaking to Mr Barcoe, 280 will eventually get the paint scheme of the rest, it was priority to get it & start using it first & that was more important than painting her.

California Dreamer · 22-10-2020 6:56am

Psychlops wrote: »

Great new DF podcast speaking to Mr Barcoe, 280 will eventually get the paint scheme of the rest, it was priority to get it & start using it first & that was more important than painting her.

Very good listen!

California Dreamer · 11-01-2021 9:47am

Was randomly looking at a youtube video the other day of the PC-24.

Would that be a natural replacement for the Learjet when its retirement is due?

Is the flight deck set up the same as the PC-12?

source · 11-01-2021 10:24am

California Dreamer wrote: »

Was randomly looking at a youtube video the other day of the PC-24.

Would that be a natural replacement for the Learjet when its retirement is due?

Is the flight deck set up the same as the PC-12?

That would be a serious drop in capability, 14 pax down to 8 pax and a range reduction from 7,800km to 3,300km (according to Wikipedia).

Peregrine · 11-01-2021 12:10pm

source wrote: »

That would be a serious drop in capability, 14 pax down to 8 pax and a range reduction from 7,800km to 3,300km (according to Wikipedia).

Are you sure you're looking at the Learjet 45? I don't think Learjet has ever made an aircraft with that kind of range or passenger capacity. That sounds like the Gulfstream.

source · 11-01-2021 1:00pm

Peregrine wrote: »

Are you sure you're looking at the Learjet 45? I don't think Learjet has ever made an aircraft with that kind of range or passenger capacity. That sounds like the Gulfstream.

You're right, looking at it again it was the gulfstream IV I was looking at not the Learjet 45 which has similar capacity and range as the PC 24.

Larbre34 · 12-01-2021 3:02am

As of the first outbreak of Covid, when we had repatriation issues and PPE transport issues, Varadkar was making the case for a heavier airlifter, either a tactical military version like a C-130 Hercules or an airliner with modular fitout like the RNZAF 757s.

Thats not the first time it's been mooted, the Air Corps even had a model of an A320 painted in their colours trying to convince the Govt it needed one.

No doubt there are bean counters coming up with a thousand reasons why not to get one and I could come up with a thousands reasons in favour of it, not least of which is there will not be a cheaper time for many year to pick up a barely used airframe for buttons than now, or indeed to secure a very competitive leasing arrangement from someone like Aer Lingus to wet or dry lease a modern jet for State use from their stored inventory.

roundymac · 12-01-2021 12:32pm

Larbre34 wrote: »

As of the first outbreak of Covid, when we had repatriation issues and PPE transport issues, Varadkar was making the case for a heavier airlifter, either a tactical military version like a C-130 Hercules or an airliner with modular fitout like the RNZAF 757s.

Thats not the first time it's been mooted, the Air Corps even had a model of an A320 painted in their colours trying to convince the Govt it needed one.

No doubt there are bean counters coming up with a thousand reasons why not to get one and I could come up with a thousands reasons in favour of it, not least of which is there will not be a cheaper time for many year to pick up a barely used airframe for buttons than now, or indeed to secure a very competitive leasing arrangement from someone like Aer Lingus to wet or dry lease a modern jet for State use from their stored inventory.

It should be pointed out to the"bean counters" that that is all they are,

jonnybigwallet · 12-01-2021 12:37pm

There are some great bargains out there at the moment. A340's and even A380's.

Replacment for Cessna 172

Comments