Formula 1 2019 - Round 1 – Australia

Vic_08 · 17-03-2019 11:06pm

AMKC wrote: »

Channel 4 showed it in there highlights and I would say they would have shown it if they were live too.

It was on the C4 replay.

Agreed the sound was terrible. C4 done it better. I have no problem with David Coulthard.

Thats bull;shi,th. They are just no good simple as. Chanel 4 would have had it and shown it had they been live. In fact the C4 highlights was way better than the live Sky. If only they could scrap the adds during the race I would watch just the C4 highlights this year and feck Sky and there live show.

It's amazing what confirmation bias will do to your perception of things, you don't like Sky so you project that on to every aspect of their coverage.

This is the second time you have said that C4 have better pictures and sound.

Sky, C4 and every other broadcaster shows the same coverage with the same race audio, it is mixed live by FOM not the individual broadcasters. The only differences from the F1 opening banner at 5 minutes before the parade lap to the end of the podium ceremony is the main commentary audio and cutaways to pitlane reporters mixed in by the broadcasters, I didn't notice any in this race but usually Sky do it with a split screen showing the world feed and their pitlane camera footage.

As far as the sound goes, C4 have consistently had poor quality audio on their commentary for the last few years. I don't know why but it always sounds over compressed with clipped high frequency. This may have made the race audio sound louder in contrast but I always found the tinny commentary quality irritating, admittedly not nearly as irritating as the nonsense spouted from croft though.

The mix up with Kubica at the start was obvious but it is easy to understand that commentators have more to watch than just the main feed so can get things wrong occasionally. The sainted Murray Walker was constantly mixing up drivers, teams, positions and everything else, particularly in the latter part of his career.

LollipopJimmy · 17-03-2019 11:28pm

Any chance the discussion on broadcast quality or lack of can be elsewhere? The race thread was completely derailed with it

v3ttel · 18-03-2019 1:32am

Depressing race. I can't actually take yet another year of total Mercedes domination. To see them 0.7s ahead in qualifying and finish 20+ seconds ahead of Red Bull and nearly a minute ahead of Ferrari was awful. Between that and not having any TV channel that shows F1 (bar when it's on Sky Sports Main Event), it could be the year when I lose interest in F1 until the next reg change.

Totally agree with the posts that "Crofty" is an oaf. I also have an immense dislike of "Joe.......... Vinazzi" through no fault of his own. Good lad Joe. Croft is constantly making a clown of himself between missing blatantly obvious things, and his unique ability to say "Is that <last name>?" before a graphic pops up which invariable shows that it's his team mate. Also, his hair brained ideas of how to change F1 (eg: reverse grid races, etc) that he shares frequently. It's like they just took a local casual F1 fan from the pub and put him as the voice of F1.

Such a shame as there are plenty of excellent commentators out there.

ayux4rj6zql2ph · 18-03-2019 11:19am

David Croft is the Sky F1 version of RTE's Peter Collins

Frank Bullitt · 18-03-2019 4:13pm

So much for that form Ferrari showed in pre-season.

Spaghetti Politcis strikes again.

Having said that, despite a very uneventful race, I was very happy to see Bottas get the win, and in the style he did too.

Cookie_Monster · 19-03-2019 9:25pm

LIGHTNING wrote: »

Sky are rapidly heading towards the toilet that is the American style coverage at an alarming rate. Having too many people on screen, trying to make drama out of nothing, stupid nicknames etc

The rubbish that Liberty are pushing in terms of graphics and factoids and such are not helping either.
Having to read out facts about Australia / Melbourne in the intro is so stupid

Paully D · 20-03-2019 11:28am

ScrubsfanChris wrote: »

Channel 4 decided to ignore it, was LeClerc told to back off Vettel? Was clearly faster.

https://twitter.com/vetteleclerc/status/1107178454175436800?s=21

He was.

I can understand why he asked, but I’d like to have seen him go toe-to-toe with Vettel to try and stamp his authority on things from the off.

Could you imagine a young Hamilton or someone like Verstappen even asking?

H3llR4iser · 20-03-2019 2:03pm

Paully D wrote: »

https://twitter.com/vetteleclerc/status/1107178454175436800?s=21

He was.

I can understand why he asked, but I’d like to have seen him go toe-to-toe with Vettel to try and stamp his authority on things from the off.

Could you imagine a young Hamilton or someone like Verstappen even asking?

Yeah, they'd be ignoring the order if it didn't suit them and screaming like babies if they wanted to be allowed past / protected. Verstappen very nearly took Sainz out of the race while racing for Toro Rosso, and managed to actually take both cars out in Baku last year. In the specific case above, there was literally nothing to be gained in terms of points - Charles would most likely have been let through if they were within striking distance from Verstappen. As for the fastest lap - it's not guaranteed it would have worked, Bottas still had a lot of pace at the end.

Once again, it's funny how people get upset about Ferrari's team orders, but hardly a peep comes when it's Mercedes doing it (and often in much more questionable ways - like using a driver as a roadblock)

Charlie-Bravo · 20-03-2019 2:33pm

I don't like teams orders for any team. I'm hoping that drivers can follow the roadblock much closer this year which should mean the roadblock will be pushing to keep a 1 sec gap to prevent DRS, but the roadblock ending up much closer to the driver in front.

Australia isn't a good guage for the season. Still lots yet to happen. Vettel got the benefit of team orders but we know LeClerc will bed himself in quickly and become fast soon. Better quali, and better race starts to follow. All to watch for this season.

H3llR4iser · 20-03-2019 3:28pm

astrofluff wrote: »

I don't like teams orders for any team. I'm hoping that drivers can follow the roadblock much closer this year which should mean the roadblock will be pushing to keep a 1 sec gap to prevent DRS, but the roadblock ending up much closer to the driver in front.

Australia isn't a good guage for the season. Still lots yet to happen. Vettel got the benefit of team orders but we know LeClerc will bed himself in quickly and become fast soon. Better quali, and better race starts to follow. All to watch for this season.

Leclerc WILL be one though customer, that is for sure - people expected him to come in and trash Vettel straight away, which was never going to happen as there are reasons Seb's a 4x WDC; Plus most people fail to understand the analogies with the 2014 season at Red Bull are useless - watching the Netflix documentary should have dispelled any doubt about how RBR deal with the "not favourite" driver in the team: so much so that Ricciardo took a literal leap into the unknown rather than put up with it one more season.

But Charles will be fast, Ferrari are betting on him to lead the team in the future and once again, there are very good reasons behind it.

Inviere · 20-03-2019 4:26pm

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Once again, it's funny how people get upset about Ferrari's team orders, but hardly a peep comes when it's Mercedes doing it (and often in much more questionable ways - like using a driver as a roadblock)

I don't remember Merc issuing any orders when Hamilton and Bottas were at zero points though, that's the point. Let them race, when one has a shot at the title, by all means, use orders to maximise their chances.

Faugheen · 20-03-2019 4:53pm

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Once again, it's funny how people get upset about Ferrari's team orders, but hardly a peep comes when it's Mercedes doing it (and often in much more questionable ways - like using a driver as a roadblock)

You have got to be sh*tting me.

Hamilton/Bottas switch happened last year and there was war on this forum, meanwhile there didn't seem to be any issue when Kimi was the permanent no. 2 and acted as such.

Cop on to yourself starting a row based on complete and utter lies.

H3llR4iser · 20-03-2019 4:55pm

Inviere wrote: »

I don't remember Merc issuing any orders when Hamilton and Bottas were at zero points though, that's the point. Let them race, when one has a shot at the title, by all means, use orders to maximise their chances.

Toto Wolff himself called him a "wingman" in what is the mother of all Freudian lapsus; I do think Valterri's performance last sunday has a lot to do with it - kinda of a new "not bad for a no.2 driver, eh?".

They did freeze the positions in a very similar situation, back in 2013, Malaysia, ordering Rosberg to drop back off Hamilton in 3rd place. It was the second race of the year, they were completely out of contention for the championship, the reasoning was to avoid issues and bring home both cars to maximize points. Nobody emitted a peep, as it was "the right thing to do".

Furthermore, they issued team orders on Rosberg in Monaco 2016 - to a driver who was fighting his team mate for the WDC. Nobody made a sound, as it was "the right thing".

They used Bottas as a roadblock in Spain 2017, race 5 out of 20; He was only 10 points behind Hamilton before the race and theoretically fully in contention for the championship.

I hate team orders as much as you do, but ffs let's not have conditional criticism depending on who issues them - I understand Ferrari come from a terrible track record from the Schumacher era, but the current team ain't the same. Also, we've seen last year with RB, how useful can be for a team to "refuse" employing team orders no matter what - or to have drivers who routinely disregard them; Force India threw away what could have easily been an 1-2 finish in Baku 2017 because of the latter...

Inviere · 20-03-2019 5:51pm

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Toto Wolff himself called him a "wingman" in what is the mother of all Freudian lapsus; I do think Valterri's performance last sunday has a lot to do with it - kinda of a new "not bad for a no.2 driver, eh?".

Valterri only has himself to blame really, until now, he just hasn't had the bit between his teeth. He absolutely has been a wingman, possibly until now. We'll see.

They did freeze the positions in a very similar situation, back in 2013, Malaysia, ordering Rosberg to drop back off Hamilton in 3rd place. It was the second race of the year, they were completely out of contention for the championship, the reasoning was to avoid issues and bring home both cars to maximize points. Nobody emitted a peep, as it was "the right thing to do".

Not the same situation, and it was the right thing to do. Hamilton and Rosberg were racing each other hard, there was every chance they were going to take each other out so Brawn got on the radio and put a stop to it.

Furthermore, they issued team orders on Rosberg in Monaco 2016 - to a driver who was fighting his team mate for the WDC. Nobody made a sound, as it was "the right thing".

This? Seems the right thing to do again. Rosberg couldn't get his tires up to temp, and the leader was streaking away. They released Hamilton to have a crack at Ricciardo, which he did successfully. Rosberg wasn't even on the podium.

They used Bottas as a roadblock in Spain 2017, race 5 out of 20; He was only 10 points behind Hamilton before the race and theoretically fully in contention for the championship.

Perhaps so, I suppose the trick is not to be 10 points behind your team mate who's a multiple world champion then. Hardly an easy gig, but you kinda know what you're getting into in a top team like that.

I hate team orders as much as you do, but ffs let's not have conditional criticism depending on who issues them

It's not that at all. If Bottas was told to hold station against Hamilton when the points are 0-0, they'd be open to the same criticism too.

recyclebin · 20-03-2019 6:26pm

If you want to become world champion you don't accept a number two role in the team.

Killinator · 20-03-2019 9:32pm

recyclebin wrote: »

If you want to become world champion you don't accept a number two role in the team.

Unless you're biding your time to become number 1 after the current number 1 leaves in a few years using the time now to lay the groundwork in the team and in his experience?

I think Leclerc is playing the long game

skipper_G · 20-03-2019 9:52pm

H3llR4iser wrote: »

Yeah, they'd be ignoring the order if it didn't suit them and screaming like babies if they wanted to be allowed past / protected. Verstappen very nearly took Sainz out of the race while racing for Toro Rosso, and managed to actually take both cars out in Baku last year. In the specific case above, there was literally nothing to be gained in terms of points - Charles would most likely have been let through if they were within striking distance from Verstappen. As for the fastest lap - it's not guaranteed it would have worked, Bottas still had a lot of pace at the end.

Once again, it's funny how people get upset about Ferrari's team orders, but hardly a peep comes when it's Mercedes doing it (and often in much more questionable ways - like using a driver as a roadblock)

The thread from the Russian GP last season makes for interesting viewing.
https://touch.boards.ie/thread/2057914294/1

My third post in that thread from qualifying day

skipper_G wrote: »

I don't agree, Mercedes like to talk about how they don't do team orders a lot but they've done it more than anyone else this season. They're full of hot air, just like with all the poor Ocon garbage Toto's been spouting

I understand and accept that team orders can and will happen as it is after all a team sport. But I despise unnecessary team orders, Austria 2002, Germany 2010, Russia 2018 and last weekend are all in that bucket.

recyclebin · 21-03-2019 12:05pm

Killinator wrote: »

Unless you're biding your time to become number 1 after the current number 1 leaves in a few years using the time now to lay the groundwork in the team and in his experience?

I think Leclerc is playing the long game

No point playing the long game unless Vettels quits very soon. There are plenty of drivers on the conveyor belt that could come in in a few years and usurp Leclerc.

Name any number 2 driver at a big team that went on to better things in the long run.

Drivers have to be selfish if they want drivers titles. Otherwise they will be left settling for helping win a constructors.

21-03-2019 12:28pm

recyclebin wrote: »

No point playing the long game unless Vettels quits very soon. There are plenty of drivers on the conveyor belt that could come in in a few years and usurp Leclerc.

Name any number 2 driver at a big team that went on to better things in the long run.

Drivers have to be selfish if they want drivers titles. Otherwise they will be left settling for helping win a constructors.

You can arguably make yourself number 1 by out qualifying your team mate and been faster on the track.
It doesn't generally happen though. In fact, I can't think of a single example.

Cool_CM · 21-03-2019 1:57pm

recyclebin wrote: »

Name any number 2 driver at a big team that went on to better things in the long run.

Nigel Mansell at Ferrari in 1990, but that was slightly different

Charlie-Bravo · 21-03-2019 2:03pm

I have to say, I like LeClerc's attitude and acceptance that his comes in as No. 2, but it is up to him to change that. Right attitude from the start so he really hasn't resigned himself to being second and that he'll just stay second.

Inviere · 21-03-2019 4:09pm

Killinator wrote: »

I think Leclerc is playing the long game

That's all well and good for race 1, wait until he has a solid crack at the title and then see how he feels about holding station. I feel he's gonna get under Vettel's skin before long, and fireworks may ensue.

LollipopJimmy · 21-03-2019 4:30pm

Cool_CM wrote: »

Nigel Mansell at Ferrari in 1990, but that was slightly different

Johnny Herbert went on to have a successful career as an F1 pundit

Inviere · 21-03-2019 4:37pm

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

Johnny Herbert went on to have a successful career as an F1 pundit complete knob

Agreed.

Killinator · 21-03-2019 9:23pm

Inviere wrote: »

That's all well and good for race 1, wait until he has a solid crack at the title and then see how he feels about holding station. I feel he's gonna get under Vettel's skin before long, and fireworks may ensue.

100%
It's easy play a long game on day 1, as long as he keeps finishing behind Vettel there are no issues, it's when he out qualifies or passes early on in a race that it becomes a problem. Holding position is one thing but being asked to relinquish one is another.

He only needs to keep in strikingly distance points wise to unsettle everyone and as you said, fireworks ensue

elperello · 21-03-2019 9:31pm

LollipopJimmy wrote: »

Johnny Herbert went on to have a successful career as an F1 pundit

All this abuse of Johnny Herbert is becoming tiresome.

For the record JH had a very successful career as a racing driver. He won three Grand Prix and won Le Mans.

patmahe · 22-03-2019 4:14pm

Inviere wrote: »

That's all well and good for race 1, wait until he has a solid crack at the title and then see how he feels about holding station. I feel he's gonna get under Vettel's skin before long, and fireworks may ensue.

From Leclerc's perspective, things are simple. He just needs to give Ferrari something to think about. If they see him outqualify Vettel often enough, or out-race him, or cruise up behind him the way he did in Melbourne.

After that its up to Ferrari management to sit Vettel down and tell him he's no longer number one. If they don't do that then maybe Charles will begin to talk to other teams where he can go and gain number 1 status.

Until all that plays out he just needs to be patient, do as the team asks but always be there lurking in the background

LollipopJimmy · 22-03-2019 4:19pm

Good post ^^

Charles needs to out qualify Vettel on a regular basis to force Ferrari's hand

Inviere · 22-03-2019 5:22pm

elperello wrote: »

All this abuse of Johnny Herbert is becoming tiresome.

Each to their own. As long as he’s happy to act the clown and add nothing of any value, he’s fair game for criticism imo. There’s only so much of “a day out for de lads” one can take.

elperello · 22-03-2019 7:48pm

Inviere wrote: »

Each to their own. As long as he’s happy to act the clown and add nothing of any value, he’s fair game for criticism imo. There’s only so much of “a day out for de lads” one can take.

I was just making the point that he had a good career as a racing driver and is not some village idiot.

You have to have something about you to win three grand prix and Le Mans.

Formula 1 2019 - Round 1 – Australia

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