The Virgin Media Television thread

Elmo · 21-07-2014 9:38pm

ftakeith wrote: »

http://www.tv3.ie/pr_sub.php?type=1&view_pr=595

good news for tv3

PR is similar to RTÉ TWO best ever WC viewing figures.

Both channels loose audience because they don't promote themselves on big occasions.

The following Saturday on 3e could have been made up with the First Xmen at a later time (scheduled for afternoon, a repeat of their Friday schedule) followed by the Defendor, which airs the same night after midnight on TV3.

Onthe3rdDay · 21-07-2014 9:56pm

Elmo wrote: »

PR is similar to RTÉ TWO best ever WC viewing figures.

Both channels loose audience because they don't promote themselves on big occasions.

The following Saturday on 3e could have been made up with the First Xmen at a later time (scheduled for afternoon, a repeat of their Friday schedule) followed by the Defendor, which airs the same night after midnight on TV3.

To be fair RTE 2 had 31 days in a row to crow about... 3e had one. Plus if you add in all the other big sporting days RTE 2 matches and beats 3e Saturday Figures probably 80 days a year. In fact RTE 2 is still the most watched station in Ireland probably close to every 2 days in 7 (average of course and we are talking Sports). We have to remember that they were the best ever 3e figures...ever. Those figure won't be seen again until maybe the Europa cup final and I'm going very easy on 3e.

RTE 2 has been mismanaged greatly over the last 5 or so years. However when you compare it to the TV3 group it actually doesn't look too bad. If there had been a proper commercial broadcaster in place (and if the BAI had played hardball) RTE 2 would have had to change it's ways years ago.

I love the way they claim it's the highest rated sporting event ever. It doesn't look as good if it was it's highest rated show ever.

Elmo · 21-07-2014 10:02pm

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

To be fair RTE 2 had 31 days in a row to crow about... 3e had one. Plus if you add in all the other big sporting days RTE 2 matches and beats 3e Saturday Figures probably 80 days a year. In fact RTE 2 is still the most watched station in Ireland probably close to every 2 days in 7 (average of course and we are talking Sports). We have to remember that they were the best ever 3e figures...ever. Those figure won't be seen again until maybe the Europa cup final and I'm going very easy on 3e.

RTE 2 has been mismanaged greatly over the last 5 or so years. However when you compare it to the TV3 group it actually doesn't look too bad. If there had been a proper commercial broadcaster in place (and if the BAI had played hardball) RTE 2 would have had to change it's ways years ago.

I love the way they claim it's the highest rated sporting event ever. It doesn't look as good if it was it's highest rated show ever.

True and I am sure TV3 won't realise their figures for those 31days.

icdg · 22-07-2014 8:34am

iseegirls wrote: »

Was First Blood shown? I thought Cliffhanger was going to be show after it?

Great news - and hopefully it will give TV3/3e the courage to pick up some more free to air rights - if they are available.

Given BT Sport are the UFC rights holders for Ireland I'm surprised Setanta didn't call foul over that one, but there's probably not much they could have done anyway and the promotion probably felt it needed the exposure.

lertsnim · 22-07-2014 8:45am

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

As far as I can work out that was UFC fight night 46, fight night 47 will be on August 16 in Maine. Will 3e be showing this? I somehow doubt it. Other broadcasters may also have the rights to Ireland for this.

It was a one off deal for TV3 and I imagine FTA rights for the next UFC event in Dublin will also be offered. Much like how Channel 5 will show any UK events live.

BT Sport show most of the UFC events live. Notable exception being the ones in south east Asia which were shown on delay.

Onthe3rdDay · 22-07-2014 5:29pm

lertsnim wrote: »

It was a one off deal for TV3 and I imagine FTA rights for the next UFC event in Dublin will also be offered. Much like how Channel 5 will show any UK events live.

BT Sport show most of the UFC events live. Notable exception being the ones in south east Asia which were shown on delay.

That's really my point. It was a one off deal for TV3. Depending on how much they paid for it and all the free publicity they gave the event you'd have to wonder did they have any plans for the next step. The UFC might not run an event in Dublin again for another few years.

lertsnim · 23-07-2014 2:05am

With UFC fightpass we will be seeing a massive increase in the number of European events. I wouldnt be surprised if they were back within 2 years.

Onthe3rdDay · 23-07-2014 3:15am

lertsnim wrote: »

With UFC fightpass we will be seeing a massive increase in the number of European events. I wouldnt be surprised if they were back within 2 years.

Unfortunately 3e probably won't be around by then. (or not as we know it.)

endakenny · 27-07-2014 7:00pm

Given the Republic's small population and the plethora of TV news channels and websites, TV3's provision of news at weekends was never going to be successful. Therefore, it's not surprising that TV3 has no news coverage on weekends and bank holidays anymore. UTV Ireland probably will have better luck with weekend news because it will draw on its resources in NI and its radio stations in the Republic and possibly ITN for world news.

Elmo · 27-07-2014 9:21pm

endakenny wrote: »

Given the Republic's small population and the plethora of TV news channels and websites, TV3's provision of news at weekends was never going to be successful. Therefore, it's not surprising that TV3 has no news coverage on weekends and bank holidays anymore. UTV Ireland probably will have better luck with weekend news because it will draw on its resources in NI and its radio stations in the Republic and possibly ITN for world news.

Nothing to do with it, TV3 just didn't want to have to deal with News at the Weekend. No newsroom keeps a full set of reporters during the weekend.

Of course when a majorly private news story reaches TV3 on a Saturday Bank Holiday they happily pretend that they always provide a 30 minute news on Bank Holidays and Weekends.

endakenny · 27-07-2014 10:17pm

Elmo wrote: »

Nothing to do with it, TV3 just didn't want to have to deal with News at the Weekend. No newsroom keeps a full set of reporters during the weekend.

Why did Comreg let TV3 drop the weekend news?

Elmo wrote: »

Of course when a majorly private news story reaches TV3 on a Saturday Bank Holiday they happily pretend that they always provide a 30 minute news on Bank Holidays and Weekends.

Is that a reference to TV3's reporting of the late Brian Lenihan Jnr's cancer diagnosis?

Elmo · 27-07-2014 11:30pm

endakenny wrote: »

Why did Comreg let TV3 drop the weekend news?

Is that a reference to TV3's reporting of the late Brian Lenihan Jnr's cancer diagnosis?

The BCI (now BAI) gave into them as they always do, watch them give money towards Red Rock.

Oh yeah a report that was broadcast during a normal news programme on a Saturday.

Elmo · 28-07-2014 12:43am

Anyway they be F'ed

http://www.herald.ie/news/sybils-set-for-new-tv3-evening-show-30460525.html

Prime Time TV3

5:30 The 5:30
6:00 Bondi Rescue
6:30 Xposé
7:30 The Evening Show
8:00 Off There Rockers/???/Highland Rescue/Neville's Doorstep Challenge
8:30 ???/Red Rock/Ireland's Animal A&E/Red Rock/???
9:00 24 Hrs To Kill/???/Big Fat Gypsy/Film/America's Got Talent
10:00 Wentworth/???/Josef Fritzl/Film/America's Got Talent
11:00 Tonight/Film

Good to see Michael Ryan returning to TV screens he's missed on Nationwide

channelsurfer2 · 28-07-2014 9:50am

Elmo wrote: »

Anyway they be F'ed

http://www.herald.ie/news/sybils-set-for-new-tv3-evening-show-30460525.html

Good to see Michael Ryan returning to TV screens he's missed on Nationwide

errrr no thats a different fella altogther.

http://www.tv3.ie/pr_sub.php?type=1&view_pr=454

anyway yes they are doomed with that sort of cheap junk schedule.

Elmo · 28-07-2014 10:21am

channelsurfer2 wrote: »

errrr no thats a different fella altogther.

http://www.tv3.ie/pr_sub.php?type=1&view_pr=454 anyway yes they are doomed with that sort of cheap junk schedule.

Yes I know I should have put a smilie face at the end of that sentence

Onthe3rdDay · 28-07-2014 2:37pm

Elmo wrote: »

Anyway they be F'ed

http://www.herald.ie/news/sybils-set-for-new-tv3-evening-show-30460525.html

Prime Time TV3

5:30 The 5:30
6:00 Bondi Rescue
6:30 Xposé
7:30 The Evening Show
8:00 Off There Rockers/???/Highland Rescue/Neville's Doorstep Challenge
8:30 ???/Red Rock/Ireland's Animal A&E/Red Rock/???
9:00 24 Hrs To Kill/???/Big Fat Gypsy/Film/America's Got Talent
10:00 Wentworth/???/Josef Fritzl/Film/America's Got Talent
11:00 Tonight/Film

Good to see Michael Ryan returning to TV screens he's missed on Nationwide

The important word in that report is "expected" Running the show at 7.30 would be completely nuts. However, I don't doubt that it could end up there. Extending Xpose to an hour is also nuts. It's basically an infomercial right now. They might get away with 30 minutes but the cracks already show. An hour will actually drive away many of the audience they have. Seriously, they could come up with any other plan and have a better chance of success.

dublinman1990 · 28-07-2014 4:18pm

I think the brakes will firmly be put on Xpose once it goes on for the full hour every evening.

Just think of it lads and ladies from their word, 60 minutes of pure entertainment comprising of showbiz and fashion every single evening which should make you become a showbiz and fashion freak or can make you go completely clueless with all the gossip around you.

How lovely! NOT! :mad:

Onthe3rdDay · 28-07-2014 4:33pm

dublinman1990 wrote: »

I think the brakes will firmly be put on Xpose once it goes on for the full hour every evening.

Just think of it lads and ladies from their word, 60 minutes of pure entertainment comprising of showbiz and fashion every single evening which should make you become a showbiz and fashion freak or can make you go completely clueless with all the gossip around you.

How lovely! NOT! :mad:

If it were 60 minutes of pure entertainment comprising of showbiz and fashion they might be able to justify it, but anytime I've watched it for more than 5 minutes it seems to be an ad or a plug for A nail polishing service or someone selling Dresses in Dublin. It's all product placement. There's very little gossip or information on it as they try to shift stock.

dublinman1990 · 28-07-2014 4:41pm

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

If it were 60 minutes of pure entertainment comprising of showbiz and fashion they might be able to justify it, but anytime I've watched it for more than 5 minutes it seems to be an ad or a plug for A nail polishing service or someone selling Dresses in Dublin. It's all product placement. There's very little gossip or information on it as they try to shift stock.

The thing is that the show is probably making this product placements on Xpose due to the fact that TV3 currently have a large debt on their back at the moment. In my view they need to get whatever money out of product placement deals they get as means of a financial contribution to keep reducing the debt down to zero even if it is highly impossible to do that task alone.

Onthe3rdDay · 28-07-2014 4:58pm

dublinman1990 wrote: »

The thing is that the show is probably making this product placements on Xpose due to the fact that TV3 currently have a large debt on their back at the moment. In my view they need to get whatever money out of product placement deals they get to keep reducing the debt down to zero even if it is highly impossible to do it.

between the low payment rates for the people that work on the show and the various product placement and freebies, the show probably breaks even or even makes a small profit. However, it's more important because it provides a 2 and a half hours of home produced product every week, plus at least another 7 and a half hours of repeats (but TV3 count this as Original Irish output)

However you can see what happens next. Xpose extends to one hour in January. Within a few months It turns out they can't afford their News Service. However, If they Drop the 5.30 News they're not really going below a percentage of News and Current affairs programmes as Xpose has an extra half hour of entertainment News and Gossip.

Luckily they've already got a solution to the News problem. They'll just use their rip and read News Headlines Service that's going out on 3e.

So by this time next year likely schedule is.

5.58 TV3 Headline News
6.00 Xpose
6.58 TV3 Headline News
7.00 Quiz Show
7.30 Evening show.
8.00 Film or Various Cheap filler shows from US or Australia
10.00 Travellers/Crime/Misery Doc America Idol on Fridays.
10.58 Headline News
11.00 Best of Evening Show
11.30 NCIS/Wentworth/Film
Late Night, repeats of Xpose, Evening Show, Ireland AM.

If their soap comes on line that will also go on the schedule but there will be no programmes to put around it to build an audience.

Awful_Bliss · 28-07-2014 5:03pm

Quote from the OP's link: "New talent announced today included comedian Jason Byrne alongside crime reporter Donal MacIntyre and economist, author and broadcaster David McWilliams."

Since when did Jason Byrne become a comedian??

Elmo · 28-07-2014 7:32pm

Pretty much definate that Xposé will be going out for a full hour

http://www.irishmirror.ie/showbiz/irish-showbiz/exclusive-xposs-lisa-cannon-gets-3925232

She hasn't set a date yet and with Xpose moving to a full hour show in September, it's a hectic schedule for the presenter, however Lisa is really excited about this new challenge.

She told the Irish Mirror: "It's going to be great, really exciting and we've loads of content.

"It won't be too different from the show right now but we're getting a whole new set so that's amazing.

"There'll be a new presenter joining us too, but we don't know who TV3 have decided on yet, we'll have to wait and see."

I don't usually read the showbiz gossip

Though you've probably guest I am a huge fan of Xposé, bring on the hour.:pac:

Fred Swanson · 28-07-2014 8:05pm

This post has been deleted.

irishfeen · 28-07-2014 8:58pm

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

To be honest mate its beyond me and most people of a sane nature...

irishfeen · 28-07-2014 9:00pm

Meanwhile over at UTVI HQ... The biggest threat to TV3 since its foundation is taking shape...

UTV Ireland ‏@UTVIreland 1h
Our HQ fit out is moving along nicely. Great work from @macinteriors10 #UTVIreland #Excited pic.twitter.com/Y8jIMMEukU

BtpyI2yIEAAEuyz.jpg:large

Onthe3rdDay · 28-07-2014 9:40pm

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

That's just it, they don't even understand their own audience. There would be certain people, mostly women that will watch 25 minutes of Xpose instead of six-one. However, I would think that's the limit of it. Unless you're appearing on the show people will turn over to see what else is on.

Much as I dislike the show there is an audience for it. The show as it is works because it's off within half an hour and the audience can then move on to Hollyoaks or Home and Away. What they'll end up doing is actually drive down their viewership overall making it less attractive to advertisers.

channelsurfer2 · 28-07-2014 10:04pm

Tv3 seem to think they are in cloud cuckoo land and are like the ostrich in the sand. If they think an hour of expose and a half hour of lite bite soft focus clap trap will attract enough advertising revenue they are in for a big suprise. Anyway this time next year will tell a lot. utvI will be 7 months on air and will have bedded in.

irishfeen · 28-07-2014 10:09pm

channelsurfer2 wrote: »

Tv3 seem to think they are in cloud cuckoo land and are like the ostrich in the sand. If they think an hour of expose and a half hour of lite bite soft focus clap trap will attract enough advertising revenue they are in for a big suprise. Anyway this time next year will tell a lot. utvI will be 7 months on air and will have bedded in.

Yep I think if TV3 can survive into 2016 they will be doing well - unless there are major (and I mean major) changes in programming and schedule UTVI will close them and close them quick.

Onthe3rdDay · 28-07-2014 10:54pm

channelsurfer2 wrote: »

Tv3 seem to think they are in cloud cuckoo land and are like the ostrich in the sand. If they think an hour of expose and a half hour of lite bite soft focus clap trap will attract enough advertising revenue they are in for a big suprise. Anyway this time next year will tell a lot. utvI will be 7 months on air and will have bedded in.

Of course TV3 did know that this wouldn't work years ago. That's why they came up with Ireland AM. What goes out during that show wouldn't be fit for purpose any time after lunchtime when more and more people start to turn on their TV sets. However what Ireland AM gave TV3 was the freedom to basically put on popular UK and US programmes between 7 and 11pm. They were able to show the BAI their commitment to Irish Shows while not spending very much cash.

It was the same with Xpose, they were able to cut back their News by introducing Xpose which cost a lot less money and actually comes close to breaking even.

With Home programmes covered they could then show whatever they wanted to make money in Primetime. This policy didn't really work but at least it did show that TV3 management had some idea of the quality of what they were producing.

The end when it comes will probably be quick and happen within hours of the announcement, much like Century back in the early 90's
A buyout by someone...anyone is the only real chance it'll be on air in 18 months

However, Now all their big programmes have been taken by UTV and to a lesser extent SKY. They have very little to offer from Jan 1. Trying to use poor Daytime programmes to shore up Primetime is never going to work.

It's a small station in a small market that has never made a real profit. In fact their losses over the last decade are shocking when you consider how little they produce and how few they employ. A real sign of this was how long they allowed their quiz show and psychics were left on to broadcast. Profits from those enterprises would have been slim in international terms.

Elmo · 28-07-2014 10:58pm

Technically TV3 were making a profit by 2001 and still are AFAIK, their loan is an expense rather than a loss. The problem was it was over priced and they assume ITV couldn't find another buyer.

ITV must have been very annoyed at TV3 to suggest the shows to UTV.

Onthe3rdDay · 28-07-2014 11:00pm

irishfeen wrote: »

Yep I think if TV3 can survive into 2016 they will be doing well - unless there are major (and I mean major) changes in programming and schedule UTVI will close them and close them quick.

The end when it comes will be quick and it'll happen within hours of the announcement. Much like Century in the early 90's. All was going well at lunchtime. The station was closed at 6pm.

I'd be surprised if they're on air in 18 months time without major changes, or a buyout...will someone...anyone buy them?

Onthe3rdDay · 28-07-2014 11:05pm

Elmo wrote: »

Technically TV3 were making a profit by 2001 and still are AFAIK, their loan is an expense rather than a loss. The problem was it was over priced and they assume ITV couldn't find another buyer.

ITV must have been very annoyed at TV3 to suggest the shows to UTV.

Yes technically they were but accountancy can be a magical world. They had debts either written off or parked of about 150million give or take a few million.

So TV3 makes losses in real terms but can show a profit.
On the other hand Hollywood studios with blockbusters worth billions never turn a profit... Which looks the better bet?

I think ITV know how much their programmes are worth and got it from UTV, business pure and simple.

Fred Swanson · 28-07-2014 11:51pm

This post has been deleted.

Onthe3rdDay · 29-07-2014 12:21am

Fred Swanson wrote: »

This post has been deleted.

No, according to TV3 the shows had run their course. It was just a coincidence that it happened after all the complaints, the judgements by the BAI and the general heat that the shows were generating in the wrong way. Plus I'm fairly certain they'd have been VERY disappointed with their share of the funds once the company in eastern Europe took it's share.

If there had been decent money coming from that source I don't know if they'd ever have taken them off. They just weren't worth the fight in the long run.

Elmo · 29-07-2014 12:39am

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

I think ITV know how much their programmes are worth and got it from UTV, business pure and simple.

Clearly TV3 though they could play hard ball with ITV and to an extent they were probably right, ITV must have come to the conclusion that they'd never get RTÉ back on board as it would be political suicide for the "dual" funded state broadcaster, and then though of letting UTV know TV3's intentions. UTV seem to suggest that TV3 dropped the ball was it widely know that TV3 was planning to let go of the programmes????

Onthe3rdDay · 29-07-2014 1:03am

Elmo wrote: »

Clearly TV3 though they could play hard ball with ITV and to an extent they were probably right, ITV must have come to the conclusion that they'd never get RTÉ back on board as it would be political suicide for the "dual" funded state broadcaster, and then though of letting UTV know TV3's intentions. UTV seem to suggest that TV3 dropped the ball was it widely know that TV3 was planning to let go of the programmes????

Well it would be interesting to see what they actually offered ITV. I think that if UTV hadn't purchased the soaps they could have then gone to RTE. they could have purchased the soaps and justified them by pointing out they made a profit for the station. Putting them on RTE2 would have given the station a huge boost. Obviously TV3 would have threatened to go to court or suchlike. TV3 never in a million years would have dropped the programmes. What they worked out as the worst outcome... the soaps would have stopped and a press campaign would have started to get the shows back from the EVIL ITV... They just didn't think that ITV would go elsewhere.

However, UTV must have thought they were dreaming when this happened. Getting back their Market share in the republic will boost profits, share prices and strengthen their operation overall.

Oddly enough that's probably why the GAA went to SKY. The same negotiations would have started. However, the GAA are a bit smarter than that. Plus I would assume that money to the GAA would have been paid in installments and there's no Guarantee that TV3 will be around next year. SKY on the other hand are as sure as you can be.

iseegirls · 29-07-2014 9:26am

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

Of course TV3 did know that this wouldn't work years ago. That's why they came up with Ireland AM. What goes out during that show wouldn't be fit for purpose any time after lunchtime when more and more people start to turn on their TV sets. However what Ireland AM gave TV3 was the freedom to basically put on popular UK and US programmes between 7 and 11pm. They were able to show the BAI their commitment to Irish Shows while not spending very much cash.

TV3 produced Ireland AM in 1999 because they saw a big gap in the breakfast/morning TV market. Before Ireland AM, they would have begun their day at 11:30am. Starting at 7am so brought lots of advertisements, and sponsorship deals for the shows.

I disagree that the material isn't fit for purpose after lunch time. The Daily Show or whatever RTE have in the afternoons for a small portion of the year has a similar layout of fashion, food, chat and news.

It serves its audience well for that time in the morning. Look at how much of a mess Channel 4 and now ITV have gotten into with breakfast TV - audiences decreasing year or year after many changes over the past few years.

I'm sure it is an expensive show to make - you've four/five full time presenters, along with the news and sport team, backroom staff, getting all the features together from gardening, cooking to fashion - for 3 hours a day and around 250 shows a year.

It was the same with Xpose, they were able to cut back their News by introducing Xpose which cost a lot less money and actually comes close to breaking even.

They didn't cut back on the news - their news was at 5:30 and 6:30. The 6:30 news was an exact copy of the 5:30 news. What Xpose brought was an extra 30mins of entertainment news alongside fashion and events info. It also employed 5 full time presenters alongside a whole new backstage team.

However, Now all their big programmes have been taken by UTV and to a lesser extent SKY. They have very little to offer from Jan 1. Trying to use poor Daytime programmes to shore up Primetime is never going to work.

The One Show works very successfully on BBC One, and is on 5 days a week, and holds a good audience up against Emmerdale at 7pm. This is the type of programming that TV3 need to give it at least a chance to cope against the soaps.

I am happy that at least they are combatting the shows they are losing with home produced programming.

Elmo · 29-07-2014 10:24am

To an extent I can agree with you @iseegirls

Ireland AM's initial start was certainly a gap in the market, RTÉ's weren't providing a Live Morning programme and even the hour pre-recorded of 2TV wasn't up to much. However Ireland AM also had the effect of stretching out TV3's schedule, with a 2 hour morning show TV3 could meet it Irish daily requirements and also increase the number of ads its sold. So TV3 were now able to go from 7am to 2am daily. It's a cheap 3hours in comparison to Prime Time TV.

Channel 4 took the view that 2 Live morning shows from ITV and BBC were the only Breakfast shows necessary in the market, only News channels provide breaky news none of the newer entertainment channels have attempted the morning breakfast show. I wonder if Breaky TV has taken a hit due to online media though it seems ITV really don't know what they are doing.

TV3 News @5:30 and @6:30 was largely a repeat and TV3 did go to the BAI to get out of their commitment to News. However Xposé was also supposed to provide a certain amount of Irish Entertainment news with reports on new Bands, Film, Art events etc etc I know on occasion they have featured.

After that Daytime and Morning TV have been about additional hours, on one side to be reach requirement set out by the BAI and on the other to be able to say they have 40% of their programming coming from Ireland, but mainly to be able to have a 24hour schedule to sell more advertising.

All are in house and employ staff that TV3 had due to requirements for News and Current Affairs.

The BBC can get away with The ONE Show because it provide a great mix of TV out side Daytime Chat even when you look at Daytime on BBC ONE.

TV3 on the other had provide largely in-house in-studio programming and very little outside of this.

Ireland AM, Midday, 12:30 News, Late Lunch Live, 5:30 News, Xposé and Tonight.

I can't see the audience hanging around for an extra 30mins of Xposé (the gap isn't that big) and another 30mins of in-studio programming.

And none of these shows are repeatable. If TG4 was to only have transmission fees given to them for a year, they could happily repeat many of their Docs and Dramas, TV3 on the other hand if it were to try to drop all Irish programming in favour of repeats could not show any of the past episodes of any of the shows mentioned above and would possible last 3 months before starting to repeat again.

Onthe3rdDay · 29-07-2014 3:35pm

Elmo wrote: »

To an extent I can agree with you @iseegirls

Ireland AM's initial start was certainly a gap in the market, RTÉ's weren't providing a Live Morning programme and even the hour pre-recorded of 2TV wasn't up to much. However Ireland AM also had the effect of stretching out TV3's schedule, with a 2 hour morning show TV3 could meet it Irish daily requirements and also increase the number of ads its sold. So TV3 were now able to go from 7am to 2am daily. It's a cheap 3hours in comparison to Prime Time TV.

It was a gap in the market but with good reason, There was no real audience at that time of Morning, there still isn't. Look at the UK where ITV keep relaunching and the audience stands still or falls. Ireland AM was great for TV3 as it did give them the chance to fill out their Irish TV quota. Go back to when it started and you'll find almost no Irish programmes on at Prime time. That's never what the BAI intended when the licence was given out.

Onthe3rdDay · 29-07-2014 3:54pm

iseegirls wrote: »

TV3 produced Ireland AM in 1999 because they saw a big gap in the breakfast/morning TV market. Before Ireland AM, they would have begun their day at 11:30am. Starting at 7am so brought lots of advertisements, and sponsorship deals for the shows.

First of all they would have begun their day at 8.00 or earlier with infomercials. You get more money for them if you broadcast them between 6am and midday than in the middle of the night. There was a gap in the market in the sense that RTE didn't have a show on, but for the first few years many of those advertisements you saw were freebies. they were thrown in because of the advertising bought later in the day and I can tell you advertising agencies weren't interested because figures were so low.

iseegirls wrote: »

I disagree that the material isn't fit for purpose after lunch time. The Daily Show or whatever RTE have in the afternoons for a small portion of the year has a similar layout of fashion, food, chat and news.

Yes and RTE don't show it in primetime, It's not fit for purpose after 6 O Clock.

iseegirls wrote: »

It serves its audience well for that time in the morning. Look at how much of a mess Channel 4 and now ITV have gotten into with breakfast TV - audiences decreasing year or year after many changes over the past few years.

Channel 4 were correct in their analysis that Breakfast TV wasn't watched in this side of the world, not like in America where there's a different TV culture. Different ways to consume news have also eaten into the audience. But as you say yourself audiences do decrease year after year in Britain. It's hard for them to decrease in Ireland as they're already so small.

iseegirls wrote: »

I'm sure it is an expensive show to make - you've four/five full time presenters, along with the news and sport team, backroom staff, getting all the features together from gardening, cooking to fashion - for 3 hours a day and around 250 shows a year.

The way TV3 are set up it's not expensive to make.

iseegirls wrote: »

They didn't cut back on the news - their news was at 5:30 and 6:30. The 6:30 news was an exact copy of the 5:30 news. What Xpose brought was an extra 30mins of entertainment news alongside fashion and events info. It also employed 5 full time presenters alongside a whole new backstage team.

They dropped 2 and a half hours of news a week and replaced it with basically an infomercial for nice dresses, jewelery and make up, with 5 minutes of entertainment news at the start. The presenters (who are on terrible wages by any standards) were mostly working for TV3 already. There was no new backstage team, it was all the same staff. It was a cutback on output plain and simple. I will say it was clever at the time because it provided something different to what RTE offered. However it quickly turned into what it is now.

iseegirls wrote: »

The One Show works very successfully on BBC One, and is on 5 days a week, and holds a good audience up against Emmerdale at 7pm. This is the type of programming that TV3 need to give it at least a chance to cope against the soaps.

The One show is a decent show with a lot of money put into it. That won't be the case for TV3's show. Plus TV3 show will either be competing against Soaps or Nationwide, it's a terrible move.

Anyway it's probably just a move to get rid of Tonight and the News in the long run. Remember we gain the new evening show but we lose FYI on 3e. Now that was something half original. There's no overall gain in Home production for this show.

iseegirls · 29-07-2014 4:35pm

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

It was a gap in the market but with good reason, There was no real audience at that time of Morning, there still isn't. Look at the UK where ITV keep relaunching and the audience stands still or falls.

ITV's previous audience is now going to other channels, with BBC Breakfast making the most out out ITV's decision of getting rid of GMTV and replacing it with the doomed Daybreak.

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

Go back to when it started and you'll find almost no Irish programmes on at Prime time. That's never what the BAI intended when the licence was given out.

TV3 had 20/20, A Game Of Two Halves, Screen 3, Pop On 3, Speakeasy, News @6, News And Sports Tonight, The Week In Review, Gimme 3, Agenda, Daytrippers, Messrs Tylak And Rooney, Pepsi Chart Show on during its first year when Ireland AM came along. We'll wait and see if UTVi will produce anything other than 'Lesser Spotted Republic' or 'UTVi Live' in their first year

Elmo · 29-07-2014 4:56pm

iseegirls wrote: »

TV3 had 20/20, A Game Of Two Halves, Screen 3, Pop On 3, Speakeasy, News @6, News And Sports Tonight, The Week In Review, Gimme 3, Agenda, Daytrippers, Messrs Tylak And Rooney, Pepsi Chart Show on during its first year when Ireland AM came along. We'll wait and see if UTVi will produce anything other than 'Lesser Spotted Republic' or 'UTVi Live' in their first year

You missed SpeakEasy. Largely intermittent shows or shows that have been pushed around.

News @6 = 5:30/Xposé
News & Sports Tonight = Tonight With VB
The Week in Review = Midweek
Pop 3, Gimme 3, Agenda = Rolled into Ireland AM
Pepsi Chart Show was simple a bought in product with an Irish Face
Messrs was a six parter

I expect as much from UTV as I do from TV3.

iseegirls · 29-07-2014 4:59pm

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

First of all they would have begun their day at 8.00 or earlier with infomercials. You get more money for them if you broadcast them between 6am and midday than in the middle of the night. There was a gap in the market in the sense that RTE didn't have a show on, but for the first few years many of those advertisements you saw were freebies. they were thrown in because of the advertising bought later in the day and I can tell you advertising agencies weren't interested because figures were so low.

Adverts are bought in blocks - there's no such thing as free adverts. If that was the case, and they were giving away advertising space - then Ireland AM would have been long gone.
The gap in the market was that there was no live Breakfast TV show which had Irish news, sport, weather and the rest. If there isn't a market there - then why did RTE launch Morning Edition last year?

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

Yes and RTE don't show it in primetime, It's not fit for purpose after 6 O Clock.

Ireland AM and Daily Show are designed for daytime - they were never made to fit into a prime time slot.

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

They dropped 2 and a half hours of news a week and replaced it with basically an infomercial for nice dresses, jewelery and make up, with 5 minutes of entertainment news at the start. The presenters (who are on terrible wages by any standards) were mostly working for TV3 already. There was no new backstage team, it was all the same staff. It was a cutback on output plain and simple. I will say it was clever at the time because it provided something different to what RTE offered. However it quickly turned into what it is now.

They dropped 2 and half hours of repeated news for a brand new show contained new features which was on for 2 and half hours - how is that a cutback on their output?
To have a news show go up against the 2nd half of Six:One was not going to work anymore - it needed to be removed.
Lisa Cannon didn't work for TV3 when she joined. Neither did Glenda Gilson when she was added later. Karen Koster was plucked from Ireland:AM, and that led Ireland:AM to employ new people into their vacated slots like Anna Daly and other presenters.

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

Anyway it's probably just a move to get rid of Tonight and the News in the long run. Remember we gain the new evening show but we lose FYI on 3e. Now that was something half original. There's no overall gain in Home production for this show.

I liked FYI - but i don't think the time slot worked for it. I would have liked to see it at 11pm. However, will any of its viewers even miss when it disappears from the screens in a few weeks time? I doubt it. FYI was very cheap to make - all features were news stories shared from tv3 and other news outlets, with youtube videos thrown in.

iseegirls · 29-07-2014 5:02pm

Elmo wrote: »

You missed SpeakEasy. Largely intermittent shows or shows that have been pushed around.

News @6 = 5:30/Xposé
News & Sports Tonight = Tonight With VB
The Week in Review = Midweek
Pop 3, Gimme 3, Agenda = Rolled into Ireland AM
Pepsi Chart Show was simple a bought in product with an Irish Face
Messrs was a six parter

I expect as much from UTV as I do from TV3.

It's there beside Pop on 3 in my list

I could add The Weakest Link a year later but i think we all want to forget about that one. :eek:

Onthe3rdDay · 29-07-2014 5:44pm

iseegirls wrote: »

Adverts are bought in blocks - there's no such thing as free adverts. If that was the case, and they were giving away advertising space - then Ireland AM would have been long gone.
The gap in the market was that there was no live Breakfast TV show which had Irish news, sport, weather and the rest. If there isn't a market there - then why did RTE launch Morning Edition last year?

Of course there are free adverts, or close to free adverts. During the early 2000's I was in an office where they were picking up ads on TG4 for 6 euro a pop. Regularly if you're advertising on TV, Print or Radio and times are tough you'll get freebies thrown in. TV3 were getting almost no measurable viewers at all for Ireland AM for years. Advertisers weren't beating down the doors. In fact I know that one advertiser used to refuse free adverts from TV3 because of the Seventh sense sponsorship of their Daytime shows.

As for Morning edition, there's no Market for that either. TV3 aren't the only ones that can make mistakes. In fact RTE will give them a run for their money a lot of the time. Morning Edition seems to have lead to the cutback of News output on RTE after 9pm. There were 10 times as many people watching the 20 minutes news on two, but that has been scaled back because of Morning edition. There also appears to be no Late News now on RTE1, but I might be mistaken.

iseegirls wrote: »

Ireland AM and Daily Show are designed for daytime - they were never made to fit into a prime time slot.

Exactly my point. Neither was Xpose but they now all seem to be appearing on prime time slots on TV3 (under different names) because they have literally nothing else

iseegirls wrote: »

They dropped 2 and half hours of repeated news for a brand new show contained new features which was on for 2 and half hours - how is that a cutback on their output?

It's a cutback because it was supposed to be an hour of news, that was chopped into 2 half hour pieces repeating the same thing. Then the second news bulletin was cut and replaced with the 5 minutes of entertainment and infomercial. To be fair there was more content when Lorraine Keane called the shots.

iseegirls wrote: »

To have a news show go up against the 2nd half of Six:One was not going to work anymore - it needed to be removed.

Yes I'd agree with that especially as it's a repeat. Why did they not put news on at any other slot between 7 and 11?... and remember News in Ireland is a ratings winner.

iseegirls wrote: »

Lisa Cannon didn't work for TV3 when she joined. Neither did Glenda Gilson when she was added later. Karen Koster was plucked from Ireland:AM, and that led Ireland:AM to employ new people into their vacated slots like Anna Daly and other presenters.

Yes and many, many people were left off at that same time, and practically all that were taken on were at a reduced wage level.

iseegirls wrote: »

I liked FYI - but i don't think the time slot worked for it. I would have liked to see it at 11pm. However, will any of its viewers even miss when it disappears from the screens in a few weeks time? I doubt it. FYI was very cheap to make - all features were news stories shared from tv3 and other news outlets, with youtube videos thrown in.

Any other slot would have given FYI a better audience number but that would have meant keeping people in studio to produce it, which costs money. No one will miss it as no one seems to really watch 3e unless you're in Saorview only land. (One night of Ultimate fighting doesn't really count it's the other 364 that would worry me)

iseegirls wrote: »

TV3 had 20/20, A Game Of Two Halves, Screen 3, Pop On 3, Speakeasy, News @6, News And Sports Tonight, The Week In Review, Gimme 3, Agenda, Daytrippers, Messrs Tylak And Rooney, Pepsi Chart Show on during its first year when Ireland AM came along. We'll wait and see if UTVi will produce anything other than 'Lesser Spotted Republic' or 'UTVi Live' in their first year

20/20 had one Irish story tacked on.
A Game of Two Halves was fair enough but didn't last
Screen 3, Pop on 3... Just cheaply made continuity between videos or trailers.
News @ 6 and Sport Tonight. Fair enough
Week in Review (cop out so they didn't have to show a sunday night bulletin.)
Daytrippers don't remember it to be honest
Messrs Tylak And Rooney 12 eps...why were there not more?
Gimme 3 Continuity between Cartoons.

Many of the shows were just continuity between videos. Even UTV don't have the balls to say that Julian counts as a show.

UTV have given commitments to the BAI, I'm sure they'll stick to them as they have a 55 year track record of generally sticking to commitments on TV and Radio. When they were naughty it was to break a News Story about the peace process. Lesser Spotted Ulster might not be your cup of tea, but it's made for an certain audience and it's watched.

TV3 have been trying to get away with stuff from Day one. Now their chickens are coming home to roost. Had they developed proper programmes over the last 15 years the next year would be a challenge but nothing more. It does look like closure (or major change) is more likely.

Elmo · 29-07-2014 6:43pm

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

TV3 were getting almost no measurable viewers at all for Ireland AM for years. Advertisers weren't beating down the doors. In fact I know that one advertiser used to refuse free adverts from TV3 because of the Seventh sense sponsorship of their Daytime shows.

Any idea how well The Morning Show & Midday are doing?

What did the advertiser say? What was his view on 7th Sense Sponsorship?

Onthe3rdDay · 29-07-2014 6:59pm

Elmo wrote: »

Any idea how well The Morning Show & Midday are doing?

What did the advertiser say? What was his view on 7th Sense Sponsorship?

The Morning Show went last year. I don't know the current state of Midday but I do know that none of the daytime shows were doing good business this time last year. That's why they had the big shake up. They couldn't get rid of Ireland AM (which was on the table) because it makes up so much of their home produced programming.

His view was that he didn't want his product to be associated with anything like that. You have to remember at the time some of the biggest advertisers on TV3 were the psychic lines and other phone services. They would happily pay small money for open slots on the station (which there were quite a few) It made total sense for Seven Sense to sponsor Daytime as it was the same people watching TV3 that would phone their service. It wasn't generally driving other advertisers away as they just weren't around. That wouldn't have entirely been TV3's fault at certain points in the past Decade. I also know ads that ran that were never booked or paid for. I don't know if that was by accident or just to fill up Ad space, but it used to happen often.

It's was the same if you picked up the Irish Mirror and the Irish Sun from 2007 till 2011. Phone Services would pick up adverts on those papers a few years ago for a fraction of what you'd expect because there was no one else advertising. You'd also get ads for charities for the same reason.

Onthe3rdDay · 29-07-2014 7:17pm

To be fair, I do have to point out that TV3 programmes are available in America on that Today's Ireland Service. So you can watch Midday, late lunch live and Tonight in the states.

Also to be fair I don't watch Midday, did that show ever get the live studio audience it was promised this time last year?

Elmo · 29-07-2014 7:30pm

Onthe3rdDay wrote: »

To be fair, I do have to point out that TV3 programmes are available in America on that Today's Ireland Service. So you can watch Midday, late lunch live and Tonight in the states.

Also to be fair I don't watch Midday, did that show ever get the live studio audience it was promised this time last year?

I would have thought 25% share and 50000 viewers would be enough to keep Ireland AM, is that an incorrect figure???

Any idea of the actual viewers of The Morning Show & Midday when they where on, for that matter Jeremy Kyle?

Onthe3rdDay · 29-07-2014 7:45pm

Elmo wrote: »

I would have thought 25% share and 50000 viewers would be enough to keep Ireland AM, is that an incorrect figure???

As far as Im aware you're correct, that's why they did keep Ireland AM, however the new management would want a far higher share than 25%, It took years to take off, once it did it's market share was well into the mid 30% but that has fallen off.

Elmo wrote: »

Any idea of the actual viewers of The Morning Show & Midday when they where on, for that matter Jeremy Kyle?

I don't know, I have heard from someone reliable that Late Lunch Live does better business than the Morning Show. However. even the figures quoted above for Ireland AM would be disappointing for many local Radio Stations around the country, where they only have to have 2 or 3 people in to do the breakfast Show. The quality of the 50,000 that watch Ireland AM compared to those listening to Radio stations would also be taken into account by Advertisers. It's possible that they would still get a market share of 25% and 50.000 showing sitcoms and Headlines. Much Like Channel 4. However, they'd lose a huge chunk of home produced programmes and that's what really keeps it on air. You have to have respect for those that came up with the Idea originally as it solved problems TV3 had quickly.

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