Dark side of the ring

Itssoeasy · 10-04-2020 10:41pm

I'm listening to the Kevin Sullivan interview on the Jim cornette experience which is very interesting so far. Now it's his side but it's good to get both sides.

Blanco100 · 10-04-2020 11:04pm

Itssoeasy wrote: »

I'm listening to the Kevin Sullivan interview on the Jim cornette experience which is very interesting so far. Now it's his side but it's good to get both sides.

whats the general gist of what he is saying?

Itssoeasy · 10-04-2020 11:13pm

Blanco100 wrote: »

whats the general gist of what he is saying?

He's disputing the the claims of abuse and his timelines are different to Nancy Benoits sister. It's interesting but I've not gotten to if they discuss the whole murder suicide tragedy.

Itssoeasy · 10-04-2020 11:38pm

Kevin Sullivan is not a fan of the makers of the dark side of the ring. The only recorded incident of domestic abuse in their relationship was from Nancy and she was charged with it. I've never heard Kevin Sullivan curse but he did in this interview because of the people who believe he was someway involved in the deaths.

He didn't take part in the show because he hadn't been given the green light by Nancy's parents.

sky88 · 11-04-2020 12:35am

If anyone wants to read Sullivan instead of listening

https://www.reddit.com/r/SquaredCircle/comments/fyrbne/report_kevin_sullivan_on_the_jim_cornette/

OneEightSeven · 11-04-2020 6:43am

I was surprised when Russo said he created the Brawl for All because of JBL. I remember someone saying it was to capitalise on the popularity of the UFC at the time. Can't for the life of me remember who it was.

As a kid I didn't care much for it, but I paid more attention to it than a WWE show these days. In the unlikely scenario Vince decided to bring back the Brawl for All, the WWE might actually grab my attention for more than 30 seconds at a time.

Blanco100 · 11-04-2020 10:08am

it might have been crap, but it would be intriguing to see who would win out of current roster. providing Lesnar didnt enter of course.

briany · 11-04-2020 10:49am

I'm not convinced that Dr. Death would ever have gotten to work a program with Steve Austin even if he hadn't been injured.

A) If fans were supposed to buy into the guy as a tough SOB, then Ken Shamrock would have had a main event program as well.

The Brawl for All was not that much of a credibility killer for Bob Holly, JBL and The Godfather, so if Dr. D was really that handy, he would have been able to work his way up the card after coming back from injury, which he didn't do.

C) The roster was stacked with charismatic stars at the time and competition would have been fierce for Dr D.

D) To hear Cornette tell it, Vince and Kevin Dunn dislike southern 'wrasslin' and anything that reminds them of it, of which Dr. D would have been a prime example.

The White Wolf · 11-04-2020 12:26pm

briany wrote: »

I'm not convinced that Dr. Death would ever have gotten to work a program with Steve Austin even if he hadn't been injured.

A) If fans were supposed to buy into the guy as a tough SOB, then Ken Shamrock would have had a main event program as well.

The Brawl for All was not that much of a credibility killer for Bob Holly, JBL and The Godfather, so if Dr. D was really that handy, he would have been able to work his way up the card after coming back from injury, which he didn't do.

C) The roster was stacked with charismatic stars at the time and competition would have been fierce for Dr D.

D) To hear Cornette tell it, Vince and Kevin Dunn dislike southern 'wrasslin' and anything that reminds them of it, of which Dr. D would have been a prime example.

I never really saw Dr Death as a good fit for Stone Cold. They tried the monster heel beating
him with Kane and not only could they not bring themselves to give Kane a clean win, his win only lasted 24 hours.

The build up to Summerslam 98 was strange as well, with the audience not really wanting to see a bad ass Undertaker as a threat to Stone Cold.

The truth is Stone Cold was at his best when raging against the system and taking on cowardly heels. Dr Death just wouldn't have worked against a peak stone cold in my opinion.

EDIT Just on Bart Gunn winning, perhaps it was just me but even as a kid I was well impressed. I remember trying to convince my brothers who were boxers and who no interest in wrestling that Bart Gunn was for real. Maybe that was just me though but I don't buy Cornette or JR saying there was no where to go with Bart. They just weren't arsed in trying.

briany · 11-04-2020 12:34pm

The White Wolf wrote: »

I never really saw Dr Death as a good fit for Stone Cold. They tried the monster heel beating
him with Kane and not only could they not bring themselves to give Kane a clean win, his win only lasted 24 hours.

The build up to Summerslam 98 was strange as well, with the audience not really wanting to see a bad ass Undertaker as a threat to Stone Cold.

The truth is Stone Cold was at his best when raging against the system and taking on cowardly heels. Dr Death just wouldn't have worked against a peak stone cold in my opinion.

EDIT Just on Bart Gunn winning, perhaps it was just me but even as a kid I was well impressed. I remember trying to convince my brothers who were boxers and who no interest in wrestling that Bart Gunn was for real. Maybe that was just me though but I don't buy Cornette or JR saying there was no where to go with Bart. They just weren't arsed in trying.

The best I could have seen would be that Dr. Death got Bossman's spot as enforcer for The Corporation and been this guy who would beat up on and get beaten up by Stone Cold, but as far as a main event run that would have made the company 5 million dollars? Nah.

Bart Gunn seemed like a decent guy from the doc, but he hadn't the charisma to capitalise on the win and go to bigger and better things. I have to say, though, I can get into the Brawl for All as an underdog story where no-one gave Gunn a chance against Doctor Death.

sky88 · 11-04-2020 12:40pm

I feel like the only dr. Death would work with stone cold was jr

The White Wolf · 11-04-2020 6:23pm

Have started to look at Old Raws from 98 and happened to pick the Raw after KOTR as a starting point, which just so happened to have the first brawl for all bout between Mero and Blackman.

What an absolute sh1t show, Blackman looked embarrassed to be involved while Mero look to cop on fairly sharply that he had made a big mistake. Poor fcuker looked shell-shocked. :pac:

Agent Coulson · 12-04-2020 6:45am

Back to the real dark of of the ring with the next episode.

Jimmy Snuka and the death of Nancy Argentino.

Itssoeasy · 12-04-2020 10:53am

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Back to the real dark of of the ring with the next episode.

Jimmy Snuka and the death of Nancy Argentino.

Oh good because WWE needs a bit of good publicity so here's the episode that Snuka claimed vince had a briefcase entering the police station and didn't leave with it. Good man jimmy.

PTH2009 · 12-04-2020 6:32pm

How episodes in the season left ??

Is Owen Hart the last episode

Itssoeasy · 12-04-2020 7:06pm

PTH2009 wrote: »

How episodes in the season left ??

Is Owen Hart the last episode

The Owen hart one is last and there's the snuka one and there's a road warriors one which is meant to be very good. There is a Dr D David Shultz who slapped John stossel backstage at the garden and he sued WWE and apparently there is new interviews with both. There is a herb Abrams one which if you don't know the story you'll love it. How he died was an bizarre as anything. It involves oil and prostitutes. Theres a Dino bravo one which should be good.

Agent Coulson · 12-04-2020 8:09pm

PTH2009 wrote: »

How episodes in the season left ??

Is Owen Hart the last episode

10 episodes in the second season.

I’d imagine they will finish with a double episode on Owen Hart to bookend the double episode they opened with.

Snuka next week then the following weeks episode is.....

The Assassination of Dino Bravo.

PTH2009 · 13-04-2020 12:35am

The Final Bell on Wrestlelamia is pretty good and similar to this series

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLMeSnscTzFCmS50NhQalxcVkS8irtwXfK

764dak · 15-04-2020 7:46am

The Snuka episode seemed lame.

Agent Coulson · 15-04-2020 9:55am

It wasn't great really.

Itssoeasy · 15-04-2020 1:29pm

It just kind of put everything in one place and the detective came across shady as ****, and vince doesn't come out smelling of roses but that's because snuka mentioned him being at a meeting at the time which considering there is no record of what was said in that meeting raises more questions than answers.

The White Wolf · 15-04-2020 9:01pm

Yeah this episode was the most disappointing so far, either there was nothing new unearthed or they were limited in what could be claimed without ramifications.

Doesn't give me confidence in the upcoming Owen Hart episode.

PTH2009 · 15-04-2020 9:30pm

Can see this whole WWE Covid saga (PC shows, releases, Vince's ego etc.) been a future episode

HanFiredFirst · 17-04-2020 9:33pm

There was noting new in the Snuka episode if you are a wrestling fan but if you are a casual viewer watching this they may find it quiet shocking.

The White Wolf · 17-04-2020 9:48pm

Hogan is the first thing I remember about wrestling, while Snuka was always a wrestler I knew of and liked. The only thing I'll give this episode is they got across just how big a star Snuka was for a time. I actually had no idea how popular he was in spite of the WWE PR machine always bigging him up.

764dak · 18-04-2020 10:42pm

PTH2009 wrote: »

Can see this whole WWE Covid saga (PC shows, releases, Vince's ego etc.) been a future episode

No

ThePott · 19-04-2020 8:02pm

Yeah just watched it. Pretty lacklustre episode unfortunately. Seemed like they didn't have much to really fill the episode and there was certainly no sense of closure or relevation to the whole thing. Which is the sad reality of the whole thing but doesn't make for a great episode as a result.

Blanco100 · 19-04-2020 11:54pm

Love to see an in depth look at the actual relationship between Andy Kaufmann and Jerry Lawler from their interactions back in the 80s. I know it was a work, but when they used him for the movie with Jim Carrey as Kaufmann, its apparent that Carrey took the kayfabe a little too far with Lawler and seemingly played the gimmick of Kaufmann even more seriously than Kaufmann himself.

Apparently it caused serious tensions with Lawler so would love to see this explored

ThePott · 20-04-2020 12:04am

You see a good chunk of that in the Jim Carrey documentary, Jim & Andy on Netflix.
Decent doc but if you're a Carrey fan it might ruin him a bit for you he comes off as such a pretentious asshat.

Agent Coulson · 22-04-2020 9:32am

The Dino Bravo episode was really interesting and some great talking heads in the Mountie and Jimmy Hart.

Agent Coulson · 23-04-2020 10:35am

Vice Eyes More ‘Dark Side Of The Ring’ & Plans To Expand Franchise Into New Worlds

Dark Side of the Ring has become one of Vice TV’s biggest ever series. The youth-skewing cable network is now looking to double-down on the wrestling docuseries as well as expand the franchise into new areas.

Morgan Hertzan, EVP & General Manager, Vice TV told Deadline that the show has become a “mega-hit” for the network.

“We are eagerly looking forward to explore more ways to do more episodes of Dark Side of the Ring and Dark Side of other strands,” he said. “We also are looking at all of our audience data and what people love about that show is, and are using it to inform other shows that we’re greenlighting. The audience is telling us they love this kind of storytelling so we want to keep delivering on that over and over again.”

https://deadline.com/2020/04/vice-dark-side-of-the-ring-expand-franchise-1202912188/

montyrebel · 23-04-2020 12:01pm

what other episodes could they film?

vince steroid trial?
probably an episode with trumps time in wwf

???

CastorTroy · 23-04-2020 12:11pm

Brian Pillman? Dynamite Kid?

764dak · 23-04-2020 12:56pm

montyrebel wrote: »

what other episodes could they film?

vince steroid trial?
probably an episode with trumps time in wwf

???

What about this woman?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juana_Barraza

The Nal · 23-04-2020 1:50pm

montyrebel wrote: »

what other episodes could they film?

vince steroid trial?
probably an episode with trumps time in wwf

???

Pretty much any wrestler who has died of an OD or drugs related death. Davey Boy, Rick Rude, Mr Perfect, Test et al.

Owen Hart

The Vince Russo/Hulk Hogan thing with Jeff Jarrett.

Jake the Snake.

Blanco100 · 23-04-2020 4:30pm

Definately the Vince steroid trial.

The need to also take an indepth look at why a certain generation of wrestlers are no longer around anymore, alot of guys dropping dead in their late 30s/early 40s due to years of (alleged) steroid abuse.

Chyna also, the life and times. Even detailing her relationship with HHH

Agent Coulson · 25-04-2020 9:21pm

Richard Belzer suing Hogan for $5m would be an interesting one to do.

Itssoeasy · 25-04-2020 11:18pm

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Richard Belzer suing Hogan for $5m would be an interesting one to do.

I can't believe I'm going to defend hogan on this but if you watch the footage hogan doesn't tighten the hold that much. It was the fact he dropped like a sack of spuds onto a studio floor that did the damage.

gerrybbadd · 29-04-2020 12:51pm

The Nal wrote: »

Pretty much any wrestler who has died of an OD or drugs related death. Davey Boy, Rick Rude, Mr Perfect, Test et al.

Owen Hart

The Vince Russo/Hulk Hogan thing with Jeff Jarrett.

Jake the Snake.

The last episode of this current series is about Owen

Agent Coulson · 29-04-2020 4:55pm

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Richard Belzer suing Hogan for $5m would be an interesting one to do.

Discussed this week as part of the David Schultz episode.

This weeks episode was a really interesting one.

Schultz is a really interesting guy.

PTH2009 · 29-04-2020 11:01pm

Enjoying the series so far and its something positive in these challenging times

Pity the season will be over in a few weeks

OneEightSeven · 30-04-2020 5:23am

I'm enjoying this series, but I'm struggling to see what's so "dark" about the Brawl For All and David Schultz.

In regards to other stories they can document. They can cover steroids and sex abuse scandals involving Terry Garvin, Pat Patterson, and Mel Phillips. The steroids stuff would have to be at least a two-parter and they should include footage of Vince trying to intimidate the interviewers. Here's one such example:

I think there's another one where he gets in Bob Costas' face and comes across as such a deranged weirdo, but the WWE blocked it from YouTube:

https://www.si.com/extra-mustard/2017/05/10/bob-costas-vince-mcmahon-pro-wrestling-xfl

Rob Feinstein getting caught in a child predator sting operation is another story they could cover:

https://www.facebook.com/AvoidRFVideo/videos/vb.799819180036558/1038217486196725/?type=2&theater

JamieHP · 30-04-2020 12:02pm

Would like to see an episode on the 1992 Ringboy Sex Scandal. Really enjoying the last 2 seasons

The White Wolf · 01-05-2020 6:51pm

The show is starting to lose a bit its shine me, it's main strength now being that it can both sides in front of one camera so to speak.

And what an arsehole John Stossel is "the pain went away eventually.....once I got paid."

briany · 01-05-2020 7:35pm

The White Wolf wrote: »

And what an arsehole John Stossel is "the pain went away eventually.....once I got paid."

I even wanted to slap him in the head by the end of the programme.

Incidentally, a good simple way to get heat would be for a weaselly heel to claim assault when attacked outside of a match. And he would be technically correct as well. It's been done before, but not lately on a big stage.

The White Wolf · 01-05-2020 8:05pm

briany wrote: »

I even wanted to slap him in the head by the end of the programme.

Incidentally, a good simple way to get heat would be for a weaselly heel to claim assault when attacked outside of a match. And he would be technically correct as well. It's been done before, but not lately on a big stage.

It actually crossed my mind when he said that because the line was so over the top. I wonder if he's trying to work himself into another pay day assuming any promotion would be stupid enough to indulge.

Agent Coulson · 04-05-2020 8:43pm

This weeks episode will be on Herb Abrams owner of The UWF (The TNA of it's day) not someone I know a huge amount about other than he died in police custody

sky88 · 05-05-2020 1:56am

Agent Coulson wrote: »

This weeks episode will be on Herb Abrams owner of The UWF (The TNA of it's day) not someone I know a huge amount about other than he died in police custody

Know the name and that’s it looking forward to learning about the story

B.A._Baracus · 05-05-2020 2:32am

Agent Coulson wrote: »

Richard Belzer suing Hogan for $5m would be an interesting one to do.

Would be an interesting episode but it wouldnt end with a decent answer I think.

I know what it feels like to take a front chancery / guillotine and it Fu*ing sucks. You feeling like tapping the second it's fully on. But to sink that in you have to wrench back and up (standing on your tippy toes helps)

So on one hand there's no way Hogan would sink it in on live TV. Ahead of the biggest match that's gonna make him a megastar.

Then, and I just paused typing and watched it again and you see Hogan "wrench up" - I honestly have no idea what happened.

Did Hogan set it in?
Was Belzer just selling along and hit his head THEN sued?
Was Belzer, dare I say it, a bitch and passed out?

Hard to say.

Itssoeasy · 05-05-2020 3:29pm

Agent Coulson wrote: »

This weeks episode will be on Herb Abrams owner of The UWF (The TNA of it's day) not someone I know a huge amount about other than he died in police custody

This will be an amazing episode because the story of his last days is just so pro wrestling it's amazing.

He did die in police custody but it was nothing linked to the police. He died of a heart attack.

Dark side of the ring

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