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Dark side of the ring

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  • Just on episode 2 now. Just talking about the tribute show. The first part mentioned the texts.

    Yeah Perry joined the same time as Dean, Chris and Eddie as the Radicalz but they didn't mention him. Maybe he didn't want to be involved.
    Yeah just reading on wiki he disappeared and reappeared a few years later clean and sober




  • Itssoeasy wrote: »
    Did you watch the episode ?

    Think just wondering what "outkicked his coverage" means. I've never heard the term.
    Malenko is still WWE, isn't he? Didn't realise he had Parkinson's.

    As for the wellness policy, I was thinking Jericho would've said if it wasn't adequate since he doesn't work there anymore. But then realised there's a difference between taking digs on AEW and criticising the system. Wouldn't want to burn those bridges too badly and may have people looking at him and friends that are currently still in WWE.

    I wonder if they were to ever put Nancy into the HoF, which is unlikely, would her family allow it or would it be similar to Owen as we saw her sister's reaction to WWE sending a rep to the funeral




  • CastorTroy wrote: »
    Think just wondering what "outkicked his coverage" means. I've never heard the term.
    Malenko is still WWE, isn't he? Didn't realise he had Parkinson's.

    As for the wellness policy, I was thinking Jericho would've said if it wasn't adequate since he doesn't work there anymore. But then realised there's a difference between taking digs on AEW and criticising the system. Wouldn't want to burn those bridges too badly and may have people looking at him and friends that are currently still in WWE.

    I wonder if they were to ever put Nancy into the HoF, which is unlikely, would her family allow it or would it be similar to Owen as we saw her sister's reaction to WWE sending a rep to the funeral
    It's like batting above your average in cricket. No he's with AEW. He doesn't have Parkinson's.




  • God that was a tough watch but absolutely compelling. Probably the most definitive telling of the story there could or probably should ever be. Your heart really does break for David, I know people have had issues with his takes on his father but the kid has gone through the unimaginable. Happy to see Nancy's sister and him got to reconnect too.

    I also want to echo the question someone else had because I'm not entirely sure. The consistently use WWE footage in all their episodes and I'm not sure how they're allowed to. I've tried looking it up before and they mention they get lots of raw footage from wrestling companies meaning it hasn't been edited hence the grainier look I'm assuming but I don't entirely understand why that would make things more acceptable from a legal standpoint. I have a loose idea of the copyright argument surrounding raw footage, can anyone shed a better light on this?




  • Itssoeasy wrote: »
    He doesn't have Parkinson's.
    He does, it was pretty evident watching the documentary but he's also talked about it quite openly.

    https://www.ringsidenews.com/2019/08/31/dean-malenko-reveals-he-suffers-from-parkinsons-disease/


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  • ThePott wrote: »
    He does, it was pretty evident watching the documentary but he's also talked about it quite openly.

    https://www.ringsidenews.com/2019/08/31/dean-malenko-reveals-he-suffers-from-parkinsons-disease/

    I meant he didn't say it during the documentary.




  • Yeah he didn't say it, but I noticed the tremors so looked it up.




  • ThePott wrote: »
    God that was a tough watch but absolutely compelling. Probably the most definitive telling of the story there could or probably should ever be. Your heart really does break for David, I know people have had issues with his takes on his father but the kid has gone through the unimaginable. Happy to see Nancy's sister and him got to reconnect too.

    I also want to echo the question someone else had because I'm not entirely sure. The consistently use WWE footage in all their episodes and I'm not sure how they're allowed to. I've tried looking it up before and they mention they get lots of raw footage from wrestling companies meaning it hasn't been edited hence the grainier look I'm assuming but I don't entirely understand why that would make things more acceptable from a legal standpoint. I have a loose idea of the copyright argument surrounding raw footage, can anyone shed a better light on this?

    Not my response taken from
    https://blog.frame.io/2017/08/30/copyrights-and-fair-use-for-filmmakers/

    According to the U.S. Copyright Office, Fair Use is “a legal doctrine that promotes freedom of expression by permitting the unlicensed use of copyright-protected works in certain circumstances. Section 107 of the Copyright Act provides the statutory framework for determining whether something is a fair use and identifies certain types of uses—such as criticism, comment, news reporting, teaching, scholarship, and research—as examples of activities that may qualify as fair use. Section 107 calls for consideration of the following four factors in evaluating a question of fair use:

    Purpose and character of the use, including whether the use is of a commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes

    Nature of the copyrighted work (using parts of something more creative in nature, like a movie or book, has a weaker “fair use” argument than news footage or a technical article).

    Amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole (i.e. do you really need 3 whole minutes of “Avengers: Age of Ultron” in that video essay about superhero movies? Or will 3 seconds do?)

    Effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work (will the use hurt the original copyright holder’s ability to make money from the work that was copied?).




  • It wasn't a 'mistake', as JR said, to have the Benoit tribute show so soon. It was standard operating procedure. They always have those things at the first opportunity, and I've always found it tactless, frankly, because it amounts to sticking a camera in sobbing wrestlers' faces where the feelings are so raw and the news has barely even sunk in. I wouldn't be surprised if there was a feeling that something was iffy with the way that Chris died, but Vince was so obsessed with the ratings grab and a bit of grief porn that he arrogantly disregarded it.




  • Sirsok wrote: »
    According to the U.S. Copyright Office, Fair Use is “a legal doctrine that promotes freedom of expression by permitting the unlicensed use of copyright-protected works in certain circumstances.
    I was aware of fair use but didn't think it would apply in this regard or if nothing else that WWE would dispute it. Thinking about it, it does make sense though considering how sparingly they use the footage.


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  • I was thinking they could also being using the footage that all the news stations used around the same time so that footage is out there in the public domain now.

    I would guess the same will be done for the Owen Hart episode.




  • Other than the Benoit episode i haven't seen any others. Any recommendations for particularly good episodes in the previous series?




  • That got to me big time. Feel for David so much. What a horrible tragedy.




  • That got to me big time. Feel for David so much. What a horrible tragedy.

    Yeah that part was emotional. He really is an innocent bystander in it and wwe should not of treated him the way they did. It's a bit odd all the same that benoit never texted/called David during his breakdown that led to the tragedy

    Does anyone think JR knows much more about the wwe blank situation then he makes out ??

    Did Chris Benoit also have a daughter or am I mixing up Eddie Guerrero who had a daughter after he left vicky ?




  • Davy05 wrote: »
    Other than the Benoit episode i haven't seen any others. Any recommendations for particularly good episodes in the previous series?

    The Von Erichs episode.:(




  • PTH2009 wrote: »
    Yeah that part was emotional. He really is an innocent bystander in it and wwe should not of treated him the way they did. It's a bit odd all the same that benoit never texted/called David during his breakdown that led to the tragedy

    Does anyone think JR knows much more about the wwe blank situation then he makes out ??

    Did Chris Benoit also have a daughter or am I mixing up Eddie Guerrero who had a daughter after he left vicky ?

    i think he had a daughter always thought he had 2 before daniel




  • the first season is on vice. just search for it in the sky guide




  • sky88 wrote: »
    i think he had a daughter always thought he had 2 before daniel

    Ye I am pretty sure David has a sister from Benoit's first marriage.




  • briany wrote: »
    It wasn't a 'mistake', as JR said, to have the Benoit tribute show so soon. It was standard operating procedure. They always have those things at the first opportunity, and I've always found it tactless, frankly, because it amounts to sticking a camera in sobbing wrestlers' faces where the feelings are so raw and the news has barely even sunk in. I wouldn't be surprised if there was a feeling that something was iffy with the way that Chris died, but Vince was so obsessed with the ratings grab and a bit of grief porn that he arrogantly disregarded it.

    What should they have done?




  • 764dak wrote: »
    What should they have done?

    Acknowledged Chris had died on that RAW and said it is a shock to everyone at the company and then held off for a week and done a tribute show on the following RAW maybe.


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  • Acknowledged Chris had died on that RAW and said it is a shock to everyone at the company and then held off for a week and done a tribute show on the following RAW maybe.

    So what else should have happened on that Raw episode besides acknowledging his death?




  • 764dak wrote: »
    So what else should have happened on that Raw episode besides acknowledging his death?

    A normal RAW the same as they do when the address the death of any former wrestler the must go on.




  • A normal RAW the same as they do when the address the death of any former wrestler the must go on.

    The show must go on? That episode was supposed to be a special 3-hour Raw with Mr. McMahon's funeral.




  • The roster were prob in shock after finding out what happened and theres no way they could of done a normal raw show that night




  • The Von Erichs episode.:(

    Kevin saying that he used to be able to say he was one of 5 brothers but now he can't even call himself a brother really rattled me.

    Insane level of grief for someone to have to go through.




  • Where is this available to watch?
    Thanks in advance!




  • 764dak wrote: »
    What should they have done?


    Best thing to do would be to cancel the show and reschedule. This should be protocol any time a member of the active roster dies suddenly. I know wrestlers want to pay tribute to one of their own, and they have a real 'show must go on' mentality, but it would be best at least to give it a week, to let the reality of the thing sink in and collect their thoughts.




  • you have to wonder what the hell was going through Benoits head at the time

    Did he not think Nancy and Daniel would be able to cope without him if he commited suicide (wish he would of done that of how it played out). He didnt even text/call his other children at the time of the supposed mental breakdown




  • I'm very slow to criticise WWE in those kind of situations. In other things I'll do it but not in these situations because this is an active roster member dying. Owen hart they should have stopped the show but they didn't but they made the call they made.

    Eddie guerrero and Benoit and Pillman are different types of cases to Owen because they didn't die at an event. I mean they can't not acknowledge it but they also can't really go on as normal IMO. I mean the people I mentioned had friends in the locker room and you don't know are they up to wrestling.

    I know Jericho said it and I've said it that the William regal tribute was very different to the others the night of Benoits tribute. As far as I know he's never commented on it so only he knows what he knew and why he seemed different that night.


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  • PTH2009 wrote: »
    you have to wonder what the hell was going through Benoits head at the time

    Did he not think Nancy and Daniel would be able to cope without him if he commited suicide (wish he would of done that of how it played out). He didnt even text/call his other children at the time of the supposed mental breakdown

    My likely version of events is him killing Nancy in a fit of rage, they'd been having troubles and he'd hit her before, then when he comes to his "senses" he decides Daniel would be better off dead than without his mother before finally himself since how in the hell could he live with what was done

    It's all idle speculation really except it's known when they all died


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