Avengers: Endgame [ SPOILERS FROM POST 613 ]

27-04-2019 2:52pm

pah wrote: »

I think the majority here are in agreement, the sentiment was good but the execution was poor.

My post in TLDR version

Foxtrol · 27-04-2019 3:16pm

Deleted User wrote: »

The women were already destroying it on screen, none of the other group shots were laboured in such a way.
Nobody is complaining that Wanda completely owned Thanos, people cheered (personally would have loved her to strike the killing blow on Thanos given, from her point of view, him killing Vision has JUST happened, but it was Tony's way out).

The "how and when" is the balls, not about resonating. It jarred against the story, indeed much like the Spidey flag waving nonsense.
They can and should sell the message better (they were selling it better to be fair)
I've been part of project teams with marketing and conceptual designers and yeah it prob has made me much more cynical, listening to them talk about "Hank" the target customer. I can just picture the circle jerk, in the room, story telling be damned.

The Wakandans coming through the portal got major approval from the 15 or so black people behind me because it was timed well, integrated well, flowed well, and the Wakandans are awesome. That row wasn't the only row going "fu*k yeah" even though it was targetted directly at them, everyone loved it.

So yeah, a 10 second slot can bug me. Because it broke me out of the story and I'm a cynical f*ck who thinks that those female characters deserve more effort

Again, I don’t disagree with most of that (though I found the group shots in Avengers and AoU just as labored), but my point is that the need some feel to comment on it far outweighs the ‘bugging’ the 10 second slot caused or deserved.

I don’t remember a consistent complaint after the original Spiderman movie being that flag scene. People just accepted it as 10 seconds of forced pandering during a movie they enjoyed and moved on, whereas in our current climate and because it is a group of women it looks like many feel the need to push back on it.

27-04-2019 4:07pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

Again, I don’t disagree with most of that (though I found the group shots in Avengers and AoU just as labored), but my point is that the need some feel to comment on it far outweighs the ‘bugging’ the 10 second slot caused or deserved.

It's not the 10 sec shot, it's the breaking of immersion. Lasts longer than 10 seconds for an unnecessary sequence.
Did something like that need to be there? Arguably yes
Should it have been written better? Yes
Did they completely over egg it? Yes

It's not what they were trying to do that warrants comment, it's how badly they did it.

I understand that you're not, in principal, disagreeing and I had my fill of marketing types so am more prone to the roll eyes when it's so ham-fisted than most. So we're prob not going to be able to close that gap.

Foxtrol · 27-04-2019 4:58pm

Deleted User wrote: »

It's not the 10 sec shot, it's the breaking of immersion. Lasts longer than 10 seconds for an unnecessary sequence.
Did something like that need to be there? Arguably yes
Should it have been written better? Yes
Did they completely over egg it? Yes

It's not what they were trying to do that warrants comment, it's how badly they did it.

I understand that you're not, in principal, disagreeing and I had my fill of marketing types so am more prone to the roll eyes when it's so ham-fisted than most. So we're prob not going to be able to close that gap.

The same marketing types likely pushed for the Spidey flag shot and the group shots in AA and AoU etc and none received the same need for people to go out of their way to point out how 'forced', 'cringey', 'eye-rolling' they were.

The fact that posters are implying, in some instances just stating, that having powerful female characters, having 3 on screen at the same time with no men during a battle scene, or having Wakandans at all is some form of tokenism that they are gracious enough to be ok with really says a lot.

Yeah, we aren't going to close the gap on this and for you and the many others who commented on scene I never really expected to be able to do that. My aim was more to highlight that these forced shots are pretty consistent in previous movies and that people may need some self reflection why this forced shot required push back when the others get a pass.

alchemist33 · 27-04-2019 5:00pm

8/10 for me. My main issue was the time heist section in the middle was a little dull. The girl power scene was eye-rolling but not enough to dock a point.

Overall it was a fitting climax and suitably heroic.

Mitch Connor · 27-04-2019 5:03pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

The same marketing types likely pushed for the Spidey flag shot and the group shots in AA and AoU etc and none received the same need for people to go out of their way to point out how 'forced', 'cringey', 'eye-rolling' they were.

The fact that posters are implying, in some instances just stating, that having powerful female characters, having 3 on screen at the same time with no men during a battle scene, or having Wakandans at all is some form of tokenism that they are gracious enough to be ok with really says a lot.

Yeah, we aren't going to close the gap on this and for you and the many others who commented on scene I never really expected to be able to do that. My aim was more to highlight that these forced shots are pretty consistent in previous movies and that people may need some self reflection why this forced shot required push back when the others get a pass.

Imo the team ups in the other movies made sense in how they came together. My issue with the shot 8n this one is it just doesn't make sense. It could have been done as a rolling shot through them doing cool stuff rather than for some reason JUST all the women converge in one spot and go from a standing start there. It's a weird shot.

AMKC · 27-04-2019 5:12pm

Deleted User wrote: »

He could have Peggy do it?

F*Ck ABC for cancelling Agent Carter anyway.

I agree. It was a great show and deserved to get more than one 1 season.

Any chance of Agent Carter getting her own film?

Paddy Cow wrote: »

She's got the personality of a cactus. Very prickly and nothing to be jealous of.

Ye maybe your right. While I enjoyed the Captain Marvel film I did think she could have done with some humour.

RayCun · 27-04-2019 5:19pm

Enjoyed it enough while watching, but I think it was a fairly weak movie.

The tone was all over the place. On the one hand its supposed to be terribly sad and everyone is in shock from the snap, on the other every two minutes there is a blatant wink to the audience and call back to a previous film. Someone above mentioned the Stan Lee cameos - every cameo would drop you out of the story so you could say, "look, it's Stan Lee!". The time travel scenes were an excuse for twenty minutes of "hey, remember this? And him? And that thing?"

The Thor jokes went on too long. Also it felt obvious that if he was going to die in this movie he'd have lost the dad bod and spent more time looking sad and serious.

And the final battle didn't work for me. In infinity war, the fight on Titan was good, and the last bit of the fight in Wakanda. This was too obviously a big CGI fest, with the hand to hand fight with Thanos feeling forced (didn't fit with how close the fights were in the previous movie, too clearly designed to include specific moments) and the glove chase lacking any weight, manufactured to give some characters their required screen time.

It's often said that the Marvel movies are good at connecting to each other, but in this one it really felt like a burden.

Paddy Cow · 27-04-2019 5:48pm

The Thor joke was funny in the beginning but after he had the talk with his mother I thought he'd buck up. I didn't expect to see him all buff but it was disappointing that he showed no character progression.

Slydice · 27-04-2019 6:28pm

USA money is on the board!

Day 3: $643 Million
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=marvel2019.htm

Now at position 3 on the 2019 board:
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/yearly/chart/?view2=worldwide&yr=2019&p=.htm

All-Time Worldwide. Position 131:
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/alltime/world/?pagenum=2&p=.htm

Slydice wrote: »

Day 2: $305 Million
Now at position 7 on the 2019 board
Also now showing on the All-Time Worldwide. Position 452

Slydice wrote: »

Day 1: $169 Million
On the 2019 board at number 10

Can it do a billion in one weekend?

:eek: Is that even possible?

Uncharted · 27-04-2019 6:43pm

Just seen Endgame.
A good solid movie,imo about 20 mins too long. Felt a little padded with ott saccharine guff.

Some nice touches,with well timed cameos and familial interludes.

The battle was woefully underwhelming though , and not a patch on Avengers assemble fight scenes.

I enjoyed it but it's not as amazing as it could have been,and certainly not befitting the grand finale hyperbole train buzz .

All in all,a good movie.

One viewing is enough.

7/10.

kerplun k · 27-04-2019 6:45pm

AMKC wrote: »

I agree. It was a great show and deserved to get more than one 1 season..

I think it got 2.

27-04-2019 6:49pm

alchemist33 wrote: »

8/10 for me. My main issue was the time heist section in the middle was a little dull. The girl power scene was eye-rolling but not enough to dock a point.

Overall it was a fitting climax and suitably heroic.

Yeah in the grand scheme it was an annoyance nothing more

marklazarcovic · 27-04-2019 6:50pm

Loved the quill and Thor "who's the captain now" scene ..

Hilarious.

branie2 · 27-04-2019 7:44pm

I saw it this evening, and I thought it was brilliant

pah · 27-04-2019 8:27pm

Just out of a second viewing. Enjoyed it more this time. Combination of better screen and sound and a better crowd too. The lad in front of me was literally on the edge of his seat for a lot of it. Let out a massive whoop as moljnir flew towards Cap's hand and kicked off the applause at the end. Took 4 kids with me 15, 11, 8 and 6 they all loved it, shed some tears though.

Epic.

Riddle101 · 27-04-2019 8:34pm

Watched it today and I absolutely loved the movie. Impressed me so much I going to go see it again in another week or two. I think it's the best movie of them all.

flazio · 27-04-2019 10:13pm

kerplun k wrote: »

I think it got 2.

It did and ended on an annoying cliff hanger.
They didn't even print a follow-up comic.

27-04-2019 10:40pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

The fact that posters are implying, in some instances just stating, that having powerful female characters, having 3 on screen at the same time with no men during a battle scene, or having Wakandans at all is some form of tokenism that they are gracious enough to be ok with really says a lot.

Everyone is actually saying the opposite

pjohnson · 27-04-2019 11:07pm

Foxtrol wrote: »

Again, I don’t disagree with most of that (though I found the group shots in Avengers and AoU just as labored), but my point is that the need some feel to comment on it far outweighs the ‘bugging’ the 10 second slot caused or deserved.

I don’t remember a consistent complaint after the original Spiderman movie being that flag scene. People just accepted it as 10 seconds of forced pandering during a movie they enjoyed and moved on, whereas in our current climate and because it is a group of women it looks like many feel the need to push back on it.

And you feel the need to repeatedly try to complain that people have issue solely because it was women involved it was just jarring. Simple as.

bur · 27-04-2019 11:12pm

Slydice wrote: »

USA money is on the board!

Day 3: $643 Million
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/movies/?id=marvel2019.htm

Now at position 3 on the 2019 board:
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/yearly/chart/?view2=worldwide&yr=2019&p=.htm

All-Time Worldwide. Position 131:
https://www.boxofficemojo.com/alltime/world/?pagenum=2&p=.htm

Can it do a billion in one weekend? :eek: Is that even possible?

Yes it's going to make all the money. who cares?

AMKC · 27-04-2019 11:23pm

kerplun k wrote: »

I think it got 2.

Your right it did. It deserved a few more seasons.

flazio wrote: »

It did and ended on an annoying cliff hanger.
They didn't even print a follow-up comic.

Yes your right. Been a while since I seen it but always looked forward to each episode. It deserved more seasons.

santana75 · 28-04-2019 1:00am

Have to say, I really enjoyed that. My expectations going into this movie though where rock bottom, right down in the bargain basememt. Had been burned too many times in the past by the Marvel hype machine(Blank panther and captain marvel where just awful films). This time I wasnt getting sucked in by inflated RT scores or fan boys losing the run of themselves on twitter. But 10mins into this I knew it was actually gonna be enjoyable. 3 hours flew by which says a lot about how well paced and well made it was. And it has to be said, even just from a logistical point of view, the scale of the film making has to be respected. Best part for me though was Thor as Jeff Lebowski. Hilarious. Actually couldve watched an entire film with just Thor as The dude, nothing else required. Well maybe Jeff Goldblum as the grand master thrown into the mix aswell.
Didnt really buy into the faux emotional stuff(there were people crying in the cinema which i have to say I rolled my eyes at). But it was a proper good adventure all the same.
For my money Spiderman into the spider verse is still the best super hero film ever made, and Endgame is not up to that standard, but its still a really enjoyable movie which by all reports has had the biggest opening weekend in history.

Agent Coulson · 28-04-2019 2:04am

bur wrote: »

Yes it's going to make all the money. who cares?

Plenty care.

You don't and that's fine but there are those who do.

So there you go plenty care.

Mokuba · 28-04-2019 2:16am

The time travel in this movie is absolutely terribly done. (The rules or changes or alternate realities or whatever theory somebody comes up with to explain the hokeyness). Holes all over the place.

Power levels are way off in this movie. Thanos with no gauntlet is almost as strong as Thanos with the gauntlet. Thor managed to almost kill a full infinity gauntlet Thanos with one superpowered weapon, yet with 2 superpowered weapons he gets destroyed by a Thanos with no gauntlet? Why, because he is fat now? Not having that.

Thor being made fat is something which wore thin very quickly after the initial joke. They took a character with a great and powerful arc in Infinity War and turned him into a joke.

Captain Marvel is ridiculously overpowered.

"Good" Nebula sent one of Natasha or Clint to their deaths. Convenient that they sent the only two people who actually love each other to Vormir. Imagine if they had sent Rocket and Ant-Man, might have been awkward.

Why did Gamora run away? Regardless of her not knowing Quill, very odd that she would run off without spending more time with good Nebula!

Overheal · 28-04-2019 2:19am

Saw it again in IMAX 3D in a packed showing so the visuals and the atmosphere were all very much better. Theater roared at mjolnir, and several points during the last battle. Lot of sniffles at the end.

PTH2009 · 28-04-2019 3:39am

Was cool knowing the battle of New York was being fought by others off camera with the ancient one fighting the aliens

pjohnson · 28-04-2019 9:14am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F_mhWxOjxp4

Silvestri's score from the Avengers Assemble moment.

irish_stevo815 · 28-04-2019 10:02am

Seen this yesterday evening and absolutely loved it.

What an emotional rollercoaster, I'm actually still not able to comprehend what I seen.

Went my partner and 13 year old daughter and it was the first time where all 3 of us were in tears watching a movie together. Just shows how invested you can get with these characters over the years.

The final battle scene was just mind blowing, I could not believe what I was seeing at times. Cap wielding Moljnier, "Avengers.....Assemble ", even seeing Spidey flying through the air behind Moljnier while holding onto the gauntlet was just a Wow moment for me.

When all the portals opened up to bring the snapped characters it was perfectly done too. We knew they were coming back but it worked so well this way.

In regards to Thanos, I think 2014 Thanos was a lot more menacing when he arrived at Avengers HQ as he was just about pure destruction rather than thinking he was doing right by restoring balance to the universe.

I will definitely need to watch it again, soon.

NuMarvel · 28-04-2019 10:30am

Mokuba wrote: »

Power levels are way off in this movie. Thanos with no gauntlet is almost as strong as Thanos with the gauntlet. Thor managed to almost kill a full infinity gauntlet Thanos with one superpowered weapon, yet with 2 superpowered weapons he gets destroyed by a Thanos with no gauntlet? Why, because he is fat now? Not having that.

Thor had the element of surprise in IW, whereas Thanos was ready and waiting in Endgame. And don't forget that Thanos gave the Hulk the mother of all beat downs at the start of Infinity War. He can hold his own against the superpowered, even without using the stones.

Mokuba · 28-04-2019 10:39am

NuMarvel wrote: »

Thor had the element of surprise in IW, whereas Thanos was ready and waiting in Endgame. And don't forget that Thanos gave the Hulk the mother of all beat downs at the start of Infinity War. He can hold his own against the superpowered, even without using the stones.

Thanos least had a stone when he did that.

And that was the same Hulk that lost to Thor with no weapon in the arena. Thor beat Hulk with a stick in Ragnarok.

No way you can realistically have Thor with two super-weapons get so easily defeated by Thanos with no stones, based on what we have already seen. Think they buffed and nerfed power levels in this movie with little regard for what was already established.

Mitch Connor · 28-04-2019 10:41am

Mokuba wrote: »

Thanos least had a stone when he did that.

And that was the same Hulk that lost to Thor with no weapon in the arena. Thor beat Hulk with a stick in Ragnarok.

No way you can realistically have Thor with two super-weapons get so easily defeated by Thanos with no stones, based on what we have already seen. Think they buffed and nerfed power levels in this movie with little regard for what was already established.

Fat ass thor that hasn't be training or fighting, for seemingly 5 years.

This was not peak thor.

Mokuba · 28-04-2019 10:44am

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Fat ass thor that hasn't be training or fighting, for seemingly 5 years.

This was not peak thor.

He had 2 of the most super-powered weapons in the universe vs no gauntlet. I don't care if he was 50 stone it was still a fight he should have won.

Mitch Connor · 28-04-2019 11:01am

Mokuba wrote: »

He had 2 of the most super-powered weapons in the universe vs no gauntlet. I don't care if he was 50 stone it was still a fight he should have won.

Do stones make you stronger? They give powers, but do they make the holder more physically powerful?

Was Thanos kicking ass in IW not down to him being physically powerful and quick, abd then able to counter strange, for example, with counter powers.

Realestate · 28-04-2019 11:08am

Don't forget Thanos has his own weapon which looked very powerful. Isn't Thanos supposed to be one of the most powerful beings in the universe even without the gauntlet?

Either way it would have been quite anti climactic if Thanos was easily defeated in the final battle scene.

Penn · 28-04-2019 11:14am

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Do stones make you stronger? They give powers, but do they make the holder more physically powerful?

Was Thanos kicking ass in IW not down to him being physically powerful and quick, abd then able to counter strange, for example, with counter powers.

Thanos is powerful without the stones, and in the fight against Hulk in IW, he wasn't using the power stone (they established throughout the film that Thanos has to close his fist to activate/use any of the stones in the gauntlet, and they glow when he does). The power stone never glows when Thanos fights Hulk. Thanos is just that powerful.

Thor had both his hammers, and there were numerous shots of Thanos being hit and knocked about by both of them (whether by Thor or Cap), but in parts where Thanos is better able to defend himself, he does so.

I don't disagree some variances of people's powers and abilities were used, but I don't think any of them were so out of place as to be inexplicable.

NuMarvel · 28-04-2019 11:18am

Mokuba wrote: »

Thanos least had a stone when he did that.

And that was the same Hulk that lost to Thor with no weapon in the arena. Thor beat Hulk with a stick in Ragnarok.

No way you can realistically have Thor with two super-weapons get so easily defeated by Thanos with no stones, based on what we have already seen. Think they buffed and nerfed power levels in this movie with little regard for what was already established.

Thanos had a stone in his fight against the Hulk, but didn't use it.

And I think what we've seen before makes Thanos's power levels plausible.

In IW, we had a super amped, just reborn Thor, out for vengeance, making a rapid, surprise attack against a Thanos who was just after a fight against Iron Man, Dr Strange, Spider-Man and the Guardians.

In Endgame, we had a PTSD suffering, out of shape Thor up against a battle ready, rested Thanos, who already knew from Nebula's files that Thor was the one who would kill a different version him.

In those circumstances, I think it's plausible that Thanos would hold his against Thor.

NuMarvel · 28-04-2019 11:23am

Penn wrote: »

Thanos is powerful without the stones, and in the fight against Hulk in IW, he wasn't using the power stone (they established throughout the film that Thanos has to close his fist to activate/use any of the stones in the gauntlet, and they glow when he does). The power stone never glows when Thanos fights Hulk. Thanos is just that powerful.

Thor had both his hammers, and there were numerous shots of Thanos being hit and knocked about by both of them (whether by Thor or Cap), but in parts where Thanos is better able to defend himself, he does so.

I don't disagree some variances of people's powers and abilities were used, but I don't think any of them were so out of place as to be inexplicable.

The bit I rolled my eyes at was Thanos being able to spin his blade fast enough to deflect multiple energy beams traveling at the speed of light. But I can forgive a bit of licence with the laws of physics here and there.

RayCun · 28-04-2019 11:27am

Could see Thanos holding his own against Thor, but not against Thor, Captain America and Iron Man at once. Would have made more sense if his lieutenants were in the fight too.

I mean, obviously, these are fictional characters, they are as strong as the plot requires. But sometimes the thumb on the scales is a little too visible, it's a little too clear that certain moments are being set up.

Gbear · 28-04-2019 11:51am

NuMarvel wrote: »

The bit I rolled my eyes at was Thanos being able to spin his blade fast enough to deflect multiple energy beams traveling at the speed of light. But I can forgive a bit of licence with the laws of physics here and there.

I dunno was that him spinning it, or was it just the blade itself spinning.

Penn wrote: »

Thanos is powerful without the stones, and in the fight against Hulk in IW, he wasn't using the power stone (they established throughout the film that Thanos has to close his fist to activate/use any of the stones in the gauntlet, and they glow when he does).
[...]
I don't disagree some variances of people's powers and abilities were used, but I don't think any of them were so out of place as to be inexplicable.

Thanos chucks off his armour and goes weaponless for the rest of Infinity War once he has the space and power stones. They weren't for show. He just became overconfident (and was within a whisker of paying for it on Titan).

Also, I think he had a coherent belief system in the first film, where he had a plan and was sticking to it. He didn't need to kill any of the Avengers because they were so vastly dwarfed by his power, he could just toss them aside, and hold the moral high ground (in his eyes) when he did the snap, leaving it to chance as to whether they survived.

But in End Game his sheer irrationality is exposed once his plan is a proven failure and he starts moving goalposts. There's a mad gleam in his eye in the second film and he becomes wild and angry and is fully suited up with armour and weaponry that seems to be roughly on a par with Thor's weapons, and chops up Cap's vibranium shield like it's made of plywood.

I thought it was handled excellently.

Tazzimus · 28-04-2019 11:51am

Seen it last night, ho Lee chit.
Great end to the saga and very well done, couldn't help but smile when Mjolnir flew back into caps hand.

Regarding power levels, Thor was massively out of shape and depressed, likely ****ing around with his power level.

For Mjolnir and Stormbreaker, the weapons themselves aren't as powerful as people seem to think, they're a focal point for Thor's power, plus the enchantment on Mjolnir giving whoever is worthy his power as well.

Captain Marvel is also supposed to be overpowered, she's basically Marvel's Superman.

Uncharted · 28-04-2019 12:01pm

Tazzimus wrote: »

Regarding power levels, Thor was massively out of shape and depressed, likely ****ing around with his power level.

So,ancient gods,who have lived for millenia,are at a massive loss of power,because they gain 4or5 stone weight? Nah. No chance.

It was a lazy plot device to install Iron man front and centre as the saviour. (Which was inevitable,I don't know anyone who didn't already know the outcome for Stark prior to seeing AE).

As an aside,the "sad,meloncolic,fat " Thor schtick was also waay overdone imo. It was humorous for 5minutes,but was tiresome after that.

pjohnson · 28-04-2019 12:04pm

Thor is the power not his weapons. Odin told him Mjolnir was only a supplement Thor could go hand to hand with Hela/her army without any weapon and still use his lightning.

Stormbreaker is stronger than Mjolnir and can channel the Bifrost but again it is Thor himself that provides the vast majority of the power.

pjohnson · 28-04-2019 12:08pm

Uncharted wrote: »

So,ancient gods,who have lived for millenia,are at a massive loss of power,because they gain 4or5 stone weight? Nah. No chance.

Thor himself may have been around for millenia but he himself for almost all of that time had absolutely no idea he could even channel lighting without Mjolnir. Thor in reality was nowhere near that experienced with regards controlling his own natural power levels. He spent most of his time over-relying on Mjolnir.

Gbear · 28-04-2019 12:09pm

I saw it last night and while I don't want to oversell what is still ostensibly a silly superhero film, I kinda want to as well.

I don't see that many films in the cinema. It's pretty much just blockbusters.
With that caveat, it was probably the most riveting, thrilling and enjoyable film I've ever seen at the cinema.

Nobody's getting oscars for this, because that's just the nature of the beast, but I thought by any standards, the performances were brilliant. To a large extent you don't really get the emotional payoff in Infinity War, because it's just happened. It's this film where I think that is all payed off. In the back of your mind you know everything is going to be "fine", but seeing the characters live through their new reality was really compelling, and Scarlett Johansson, Chris Evans, Jeremy Renner and RDJ really sold it fantastically. Their performances as straight characters were brilliant.

Josh Brolin was brilliant as well, and not only did he (and the CGI team), seamlessly fit a giant purple man into a live action film, but he managed to do it in a way that seemed subtly distinct from the one we saw last time.

Hemsworth was a little different, but no less brilliant in my eyes. Thinking about it, I'd love to see him play a surfing champion who loses a leg or something when he's in the prime of his life, and the film is a dark comedy about him coming to terms with that, and his fight with his aimless hopelessness and struggles with alcoholism and substance abuse. He was funny, but I thought his performance brought a vulnerability that elevated it well above just silliness for silliness's sake.

In general, I think the film was better acted, better shot, better written, funnier, more emotionally striking and more thrilling than Infinity War, and I really liked Infinity War.

I don't think you can give films an objective relative score on the same criteria, but for what this film was trying to achieve, and on a technical and artistic basis, it was essentially perfect in my eyes. I eyerolled a bit at the girl power scene, but I think that was literally the only foible and I didn't actually mind it that much.

Mokuba · 28-04-2019 12:14pm

And any comment on how convenient it was that the only two characters who loved each other ended up going to Vormir? What if any other two characters had gone. Was it just chance? A 45/1 chance by the way.

And it was 'good Nebula' who knowingly sentenced one of them to death. Maybe she observed that they loved each other and recommended they go together. In Infinity War she says:

"Gamora... He took her to Vormir, he came back with the Soul Stone, she didn't"

She displays an understanding that something would have had to take place for him to get it and says nothing to anyone. Because when Clint and Nat rock up, the last thing they are expecting is this little twist.

Uncharted · 28-04-2019 12:17pm

pjohnson wrote: »

Thor himself may have been around for millenia but he himself for almost all of that time had absolutely no idea he could even channel lighting without Mjolnir. Thor in reality was nowhere near that experienced with regards controlling his own natural power levels. He spent most of his time over-relying on Mjolnir.

That's not really my point though. Regardless of what Thor "knew" about his powers, they still existed within him.

My point is that this movie set him up as a secondary character,(obviously to put Stark in the limelight for his swansong) predominately due to his obesity,and booze issue.

A beer belly and a foggy beer brain turned Thor into a far far lesser superhero???

I mean,is that not just lame??

Anyway,I'm not here to take away from anyone else's enjoyment of the movie. I enjoyed it myself but it just seemed ever so slightly ham fisted with some plot devices.

Each to their own.

Ferajacka · 28-04-2019 12:20pm

In the thanos power versus Thor debate - Thanos is a Hardy b*stard and was in his prime coming from the past. Thor is out of shape and messed up. Also if Thor was at his best he still would not beat Thanos on his own he came close IW with help.

Mokuba · 28-04-2019 12:25pm

Ferajacka wrote: »

In the thanos power versus Thor debate - Thanos is a Hardy b*stard and was in his prime coming from the past. Thor is out of shape and messed up. Also if Thor was at his best he still would not beat Thanos on his own he came close IW with help.

He had no gauntlet vs two superpowered weapons. And Cap. And Tony who was able to draw blood from a Thanos with almost full gauntlet.

Nothing you can say about weight changes that. They messed with the power scales that they had established in the last movie for dramatic effect.

titan18 · 28-04-2019 12:35pm

Tazzimus wrote:

Captain Marvel is also supposed to be overpowered, she's basically Marvel's Superman.

See, that's where things go wrong. She's been overpowered in the films and other characters have been underpowered (Thor and Hulk mainly). She's never been anywhere near equivalent of Superman's power levels in the comics, whereas Thor has.

There's a huge amount of power scaling in the MCU vs the comics and even between MCU films.

Avengers: Endgame [** SPOILERS FROM POST 613 **]

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Avengers: Endgame [ SPOILERS FROM POST 613 ]