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10-05-2019, 19:25   #811
odyssey06
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Going to a match is great though. Bohemians may not play like Liverpool but just going to the match and knowing you're contributing to the club and you're part of the community of Bohs is a lovely feeling. I honestly feel like I belong there as I first went to games as a kid with my Dad and Uncle and my family are from around there. That's what I don't get about the Liverpool stuff etc. Going to their matches etc, I just wouldn't feel like I belong. They are the city of Liverpool's team, not ours. I understand you can follow them, but you wont get that lovely feeling you get with your own local club, like the Liverpudlians are getting.
Please don't take this the wrong way but that's almost more than a sporting feeling though the way you describe it, some people get that feeling of belonging from their local church or local school or local history.. or in your case standing on the terraces of your local club.
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10-05-2019, 19:30   #812
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Please don't take this the wrong way but that's almost more than a sporting feeling though the way you describe it, some people get that feeling of belonging from their local church or local school or local history.. or in your case standing on the terraces of your local club.
And there exactly is the point, every single person that follows their local club has that feeling. Now imagine the feeling you have when your team play and multiplying it by that feeling of belonging as you call it.

Supporting a foreign team doesn't even come close.
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10-05-2019, 19:33   #813
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I just could never get why most of Dublin and the rest of the country supported the English league .
Because most of Dublin acknowledges that their team is sh|te.
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10-05-2019, 19:35   #814
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Teams were established to represent the areas they are in. Theres a reason they're named after where they are and not by their nicknames, even those though tend to have roots in the clubs geographical area.
Shamrock Rovers.

Wimbledon.
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10-05-2019, 19:40   #815
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Shamrock Rovers.

Wimbledon.
Shamrock Avenue in Ringsend, where the club was formed.

Is that a piss take? Wimbledon is a really well known area in London.
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10-05-2019, 19:42   #816
odyssey06
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And there exactly is the point, every single person that follows their local club has that feeling. Now imagine the feeling you have when your team play and multiplying it by that feeling of belonging as you call it. Supporting a foreign team doesn't even come close.
Or maybe lots of people already have that sense of belonging from the land, from their jobs, from their church... and approach football purely from a sporting perspective.
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10-05-2019, 19:44   #817
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Or maybe lots of people already have that sense of belonging from the land, from their jobs, from their church... and approach football purely from a sporting perspective.
So what you're saying is you have a limit to how many things you feel you belong to and because of this you shouldn't get the full experience from following a football club?
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10-05-2019, 19:47   #818
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So what you're saying is you have a limit to how many things you feel you belong to and because of this you shouldn't get the full experience from following a football club?
No, a football club is a football club. To some people it is something more. To others, it is a sporting club and they connect with it on that level and are content with that and don't need it to mean any more than that.
It doesn't mean they are not fans of the sporting club.
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10-05-2019, 19:49   #819
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No, a football club is a football club. To some people it is something more. To others, it is a sporting club and they connect with it on that level and are content with that and don't need it to mean any more than that.
It doesn't mean they are not fans of the sporting club.
A football club is a representation on the area its from. If you see it as just a football club I really feel for you.
If that were the case why not shut down every league in the world and just have one big super league and everyone can just pick a team in that and "support" them?

That's why MK Dons are so hated, the Kilcoynes are hated, so on so forth. If football clubs were purely sporting then ripping them out of their area would be no big deal.

Last edited by D14Rugby; 10-05-2019 at 19:52.
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10-05-2019, 20:04   #820
odyssey06
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A football club is a representation on the area its from. If you see it as just a football club I really feel for you.
If that were the case why not shut down every league in the world and just have one big super league and everyone can just pick a team in that and "support" them?
That's why MK Dons are so hated, the Kilcoynes are hated, so on so forth. If football clubs were purely sporting then ripping them out of their area would be no big deal.
Why do we have club football then instead of just having regional provincials and internationals like county cricket? Or NFL franchises that are for the whole of a city?
Arsenal was founded for workers at the Royal Arsenal. Presumably nobody else should have supported them, except workers and their families?
Sheffield Wednesday should still be playing on Wednesdays?

Why do clubs even sell TV rights? On your logic the only people who should be able to see a game are those in the ground.
We don't even need national leagues, local teams for local people, just have a city league for all the teams within the same city. Save on travel expenses.
On your logic you shouldn't even cheer for Man Utd if you are from Manchester, unless their ground is the exact closest to you as the crow flies over all the other teams in the pyramid that are based in Manchester?

Fanbases come in two sorts, the ones who go to the games and the sometimes larger sometimes smaller fanbase of fans who view on TV. Clubs want both and have valued both since the 1980s. If they moved they would lose one kind, if they cut off TV rights they would lose the other.
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10-05-2019, 20:21   #821
Kermit.de.frog
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The quality on offer.

Same as TV/Movies. British/American content is better then Irish content.
Of course it is.

What do you expect when so many Irish people have such a lack of self esteem and faith in their own country? That applies across the board, not just football btw.

Quality is poor when things are not supported.

Ergo Irish football.
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10-05-2019, 20:43   #822
odyssey06
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Of course it is.
What do you expect when so many Irish people have such a lack of self esteem and faith in their own country? That applies across the board, not just football btw.
Quality is poor when things are not supported.
Ergo Irish football.
Realistically, we are never going be able to compete with US and UK. We're not going to be able to produce the output or offer the rewards a talented english speaker can get there. That's why Irish players play for English teams at soccer, Irish actors appear in American movies and English soaps.

When you throw the appeal of GAA into the mix as a spectator and participatory sport, the 'event' rugby games, well there is only so much support to go round...

How does a lack of self esteem and faith explain a sport, GAA, that is only really played in Ireland gathering higher attendances than global sports such as soccer, rugby, cricket? Are we hiding, afraid we can't compete, or is it a reflection of self-esteem? As is the confidence of irish players and actors into trying to make it in US & UK?

If we wanted to focus on quality we should have put all our eggs into the 'rugby' basket and became the New Zealand of the northern hemisphere. Instead we have support and quality and resources spread all around, reflecting the arbitrary twists and turns of history and culture.
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10-05-2019, 21:18   #823
D14Rugby
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Why do we have club football then instead of just having regional provincials and internationals like county cricket? Or NFL franchises that are for the whole of a city?
Arsenal was founded for workers at the Royal Arsenal. Presumably nobody else should have supported them, except workers and their families?
Sheffield Wednesday should still be playing on Wednesdays?

Why do clubs even sell TV rights? On your logic the only people who should be able to see a game are those in the ground.
We don't even need national leagues, local teams for local people, just have a city league for all the teams within the same city. Save on travel expenses.
On your logic you shouldn't even cheer for Man Utd if you are from Manchester, unless their ground is the exact closest to you as the crow flies over all the other teams in the pyramid that are based in Manchester?

Fanbases come in two sorts, the ones who go to the games and the sometimes larger sometimes smaller fanbase of fans who view on TV. Clubs want both and have valued both since the 1980s. If they moved they would lose one kind, if they cut off TV rights they would lose the other.
No because there are different demographics in cities and clubs are there to cater for those demographics.
Clubs started like that because it was a time where everyone in a certain area did a certain job, as that changed they said let's just represent the area.
What does the day they play have to do with who supports them.

See there you go again confusing watching matches with supporting the teams.
As for if you're from Manchester, Manchester is very much split into areas that are for clubs so yeah if you're from those areas support those clubs unless there's something like your family support a different one and moved there.

Clubs don't really care about both fan bases they just want people to watch the TV and buy shirts, they don't care if they're fans or neutrals.

There are fans who have to follow their team on TV for one reason or another but we're not talking about that, we're talking about people that choose to. Big difference.
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10-05-2019, 21:26   #824
odyssey06
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No because there are different demographics in cities and clubs are there to cater for those demographics.
Clubs started like that because it was a time where everyone in a certain area did a certain job, as that changed they said let's just represent the area.
What does the day they play have to do with who supports them.
And now they have changed to represent the fans that support them all around the world, as well as the local area, even though they started out as merely playing outlets for the workers of Royal Arsenal, or those who had a halfday on a Wednesday in Sheffield, or for members of the Villa Cross Wesleyan Chapel, or the congregation of St Domingo Methodist New Connexion Chapel (that's Everton).

A club is a club, it's not a county it's not a city it's not a country. Their players come from England, sometimes from Ireland, sometimes from the four corners of the earth. As does their fans.
Why people have an issue with this I really don't know. I think the ones who have an issue with it are the ones with an issue. Get over it and live and let live.

For some people being there on the terraces is a deeper experience, fine, but I don't see why that has to turn into denigrating the experiences of the TV fan. Talk up that experience, don't talk down the other.

Last edited by odyssey06; 10-05-2019 at 21:36.
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10-05-2019, 22:23   #825
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You need to see both leagues as a product first and foremost. As an entertainment product....

The skill and entertainment on the pitch in the premiership is vastly superior to what can be offered here. There is vastly more money on offer to attract the best players in the world to the premiership.

The facilities in terms of scope, size, atmosphere and comfort are again, vastly superior in the premiership making each game more of an occasion of gladiatorial stature, something the LOI can’t begin to match.

The romanticism and legacy of the competitions there, scripted by the truest greats of the sport are the pillars that uphold the great legacy and ongoing appeal that we all tune in to watch as the next chapters are written, this weekend for example!

LOI for its quality, cannot compete but us vs them is not how it should be, it’s football ultimately, to be enjoyed.
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