Dublin 15 is going to get a lot more congested.

Nijmegen · 19-02-2021 11:27am

beauf wrote: »

It not inefficient. You only think that if you only look at space as the only criteria.

Its also not a quick fix. Anyone who thinks it is, doesn't understand the complexities involved.

There are also older immigrant, wealthy and with families. Looking for upmarket homes and living standards on par with that they are used to in other countries, which are often than much higher than we have in Ireland.

A lot of work isn't in the city. Its in the industrial and business parks in the suburbs and outskirts of the city. Thus apartments are also needed in the suburbs.

I think we are actually in violent agreement, on both counts!

A real issue with all proposed solutions to housing problems and the problems of urban development is that basically every single one will attract some form or another of objection or have a roadblock highlighted as a good reason to proceed. Many of the objections in isolation have merit, even if only from a narrow perspective.

So you have that offset against real need, and prices rise and nobody is happy. The engine eternal, as they'd say in Snowpiercer.

beauf · 19-02-2021 12:31pm

I was kinda expanding on your comment.

We are kinda in limbo with the lockdown when it comes to congestion and housing.

It's very uncertain what will happen afterwards.

Namer · 11-03-2021 7:38pm

Another Strategic Housing Development for Dublin 15 http://www.clonsillashd.ie/
The construction of a residential development of 198 no. Build to Rent apartment units (120 no. one beds, 59 no. two beds and 19 no. three beds) in 8 no. blocks (ranging in height from four/five to seven storeys in height)

Praetorian22 · 11-03-2021 7:58pm

looks great, but will it turn out great?............. hopefully but high-rises? similar to what was done down in Ongar/Hansfield.

Only took a few months for the canal to become a dumping ground

Delighted to see the old St Mochtas school building salvaged however

BlazingSaddler · 12-03-2021 12:30am

Namer wrote: »

Another Strategic Housing Development for Dublin 15 http://www.clonsillashd.ie/
The construction of a residential development of 198 no. Build to Rent apartment units (120 no. one beds, 59 no. two beds and 19 no. three beds) in 8 no. blocks (ranging in height from four/five to seven storeys in height)

Impressive video and nice to see what they plan to do with the old school but seriously how will the roads infrastructure currently available to us handle this?, remember the level crossing will be closed by the time this is built (probably) so all that extra traffic will be sent in one direction only and past St Mochta’s School.

Phil.x · 12-03-2021 7:10am

They must be apartments for cyclists, 392 bicycle parking spaces.

Former Former Former · 12-03-2021 7:14am

Build to rent, disaster.

198 apartments, 100 car spaces. Really?

IngazZagni · 12-03-2021 11:56am

Former Former Former wrote: »

Build to rent, disaster.

198 apartments, 100 car spaces. Really?

This is the planning dilemma. Provide 300 parking spaces and it's blocked because there would be too much traffic.
This development is only a 10 minute walk to the train station. Short walk to lots of local facilities.
Modern Ireland doesn't need as many cars. That's why there are about 2 cycling spaces for each apartment.

Development looks good. Just need to get them to commit to high quality materials.

Edit: I've just been reviewing the documents. Very interesting to see that GoCar have agreed to base 8 cars in the development and this rental car can be used by all residents. Is this something we could see more of moving forward? I think it's a great idea.

Former Former Former · 12-03-2021 1:59pm

IngazZagni wrote: »

This is the planning dilemma. Provide 300 parking spaces and it's blocked because there would be too much traffic.
This development is only a 10 minute walk to the train station. Short walk to lots of local facilities.
Modern Ireland doesn't need as many cars. That's why there are about 2 cycling spaces for each apartment.

Development looks good. Just need to get them to commit to high quality materials.

Edit: I've just been reviewing the documents. Very interesting to see that GoCar have agreed to base 8 cars in the development and this rental car can be used by all residents. Is this something we could see more of moving forward? I think it's a great idea.

I just think the reality of life in D15 is such that you still need a car. Access to the train is great - if you want to go somewhere that is also served by the train, which isn't that many places apart from the city centre. Walking or cycling to local services is great, until you need to bring home a load of groceries, or it's raining...

I would just be worried that the roads and estates around it would end up strewn with cars which sort of defeats the purpose. But also see the logic that if we keep building car parks, people will keep filling them.

Caranica · 12-03-2021 2:12pm

That's national planning policy for sites near public transport now. Gone are the days of 1.5 spaces per unit with 2-3 bedrooms and 2 for 4 beds.

daymobrew · 13-03-2021 10:08am

Former Former Former wrote: »

Walking or cycling to local services is great, until you need to bring home a load of groceries, or it's raining...

I do my weekly shop on my bike (my heaviest load was 30kg). I'll concede that I'm an outlier but so many people drive when they could cycle or walk e.g. a 1km trip to Spar.

Phil.x · 23-04-2021 7:28pm

A cyclist was knocked off his bike at the allendale roundabout this evening, not sure what happened but luckily he had his helmet on as his head smashed the windscreen said the garda. It took about 15/20 mins for ambulance, but fire brigade arrived in minutes.

I came across the scene today and I think he was with 3 other people on bikes, not roadies but dressed in trousers and jumper like the others, maybe about 25 years of age, then what looked like his boss arrived in a black Tesla to talk to the others.

ongarboy · 04-05-2021 12:47pm

I see the foundations are well advanced for the new 8 storey apartment blocks (211 apartments in total) to going up on the site between Windmill and Station Courts and the canal. Will be quite a visible development from the Dr. Troy bridge on completion.

http://windmillshd.ie/

Bigmac1euro · 24-05-2021 2:05pm

Bridge at station court road blocked

https://fb.watch/5HnwE_hWBd/

daymobrew · 24-05-2021 2:31pm

Not "blocked" but "scrapped".

More info:

Iarnród Éireann and DART+West conducted the first round of public consultations between August and October last year and took on board the strong local opposition regarding the Coolmine level crossing closure preferred option. After a multi-criteria analysis was conducted on all options, taking into account the 900 submissions on Coolmine, the following is now the preferred option.
The permanent closure of Coolmine level crossing turning the Coolmine Road and Carpenterstown Road into cul-de-sacs at the train station

Provision of a pedestrian & cyclist bridge at Coolmine Station, linking Coolmine Road to Carpenterstown Road

As an alternative to the provision of a new vehicular bridge, the existing local road network and some junctions will be upgraded

Traffic modelling and road junction analysis has informed the selection of the preferred option. The upgraded road junctions, including change from roundabouts to signalised junctions, are proposed to accommodate the increase in traffic. The junction upgrade solutions proposed are considered adequate to accommodate diverted traffic volumes associated with the closure of Coolmine level crossing.

raheny red · 24-05-2021 2:34pm

Instead of starting a new thread.... N3 M50 to Clonee

https://consult.fingal.ie/en/consultation/n3-m50-clonee-non-statutory-public-consultation-scheme-update-emerging-preferred-option

Flinty997 · 24-05-2021 5:56pm

Bigmac1euro wrote: »

Bridge at station court road blocked

https://fb.watch/5HnwE_hWBd/

That quite surprising..

landofthetree · 24-05-2021 5:57pm

Phil.x wrote: »

Man when will all this building in D15 stop.
Roads, rail, bus, amenities are at breaking point and in some cases broken.

https://consult.fingal.ie/en/consultation/barnhill-local-area-plan-2017-2023-strategic-issues-paper

Dublin is one of the least densely populated cities in Europe.

Larbre34 · 24-05-2021 6:27pm

raheny red wrote: »

Instead of starting a new thread.... N3 M50 to Clonee

https://consult.fingal.ie/en/consultation/n3-m50-clonee-non-statutory-public-consultation-scheme-update-emerging-preferred-option

Despite all the route selection guff, its just a third lane from the M50 to the M3 in the median. Its a pity it wasn't tied in to the Snugborough bridge works and get the whole lot delivered together.

IngazZagni · 24-05-2021 9:09pm

Flinty997 wrote: »

That quite surprising..

I guess having one less railway crossing point is what people wanted. It’s not what I wanted but I respect the will of the local community. I have serious concerns this will just concentrate more traffic at other crossings. It’ll be interesting to see what the proposed road upgrade options are. Either way please just get on with the Dart upgrade.

Larbre34 wrote: »

Despite all the route selection guff, its just a third lane from the M50 to the M3 in the median. Its a pity it wasn't tied in to the Snugborough bridge works and get the whole lot delivered together.

You have to laugh at it really. All sorts of nonsense that probably cost a fortune when anyone could have told you building the extra lanes in the central median was the obvious answer. It was designed with this in mind. I don’t think it will help with city bound traffic as you’ll just get to the traffic faster but it will be a great help for the outbound flow so people aren’t blocked by exiting blanch area traffic.

Flinty997 · 24-05-2021 11:37pm

IngazZagni wrote: »

...I guess having one less railway crossing point is what people wanted. It’s not what I wanted but I respect the will of the local community. I have serious concerns this will just concentrate more traffic at other crossings. It’ll be interesting to see what the proposed road upgrade options are. Either way please just get on with the Dart upgrade....

At least this way the DART upgrade is not blocked.

ongarboy · 24-05-2021 11:56pm

Flinty997 wrote: »

At least this way the DART upgrade is not blocked.

Are the other level crossings such as Ashtown, Porterstown and Clonsilla all to permanently close to motor traffic too to facilitate DART West? I assume the new road to west of Educate Together Hansfield will have to get in place prior to closing Clonsilla level crossing? Porterstown should really be a non issue as there is so little traffic and residents on that road. Ashtown I thought might cause issue as there is a fair population in the Rathborne development impacted by that closure but I don't hear anyone up in arms about that the way Coolmine residents were.

Larbre34 · 25-05-2021 12:24am

I'd say theres a bit more water to go under the bridge before the Coolmine crossing is agreed and resolved. It will be very problematic.

Flinty997 · 25-05-2021 12:32am

You'll never build enough crossings or junctions to handle the amount of road traffic caused by all the housing that is being planned.

Same all over tbh.

Former Former Former · 25-05-2021 12:41am

ongarboy wrote: »

Are the other level crossings such as Ashtown, Porterstown and Clonsilla all to permanently close to motor traffic too to facilitate DART West? I assume the new road to west of Educate Together Hansfield will have to get in place prior to closing Clonsilla level crossing? Porterstown should really be a non issue as there is so little traffic and residents on that road. Ashtown I thought might cause issue as there is a fair population in the Rathborne development impacted by that closure but I don't hear anyone up in arms about that the way Coolmine residents were.

The Rathborne crossing was a great outcome because it closes the crossing, but the road will now pass under the canal, no bridge needed and through traffic is taken further away from people's houses. None of that applied to Coolmine, unfortunately, hence the differing responses.

Brock Turnpike · 25-05-2021 9:14am

daymobrew wrote: »

Not "blocked" but "scrapped".

More info:

I can't wait to see the traffic this is going to cause in the area.

Flinty997 · 25-05-2021 9:36am

Brock Turnpike wrote: »

I can't wait to see the traffic this is going to cause in the area.

I've avoided coolmine crossing for years. There bridges either side of it. Why choose a route that's going to be closed and thus blocked 50% of the time.

The only future for all of D15 is more traffic. There is no of avoiding that with all the housing being planned.

Flinty997 · 25-05-2021 9:37am

This thread was started 4yrs ago this was the question...

Phil.x wrote: »

Man when will all this building in D15 stop.
Roads, rail, bus, amenities are at breaking point and in some cases broken.

https://consult.fingal.ie/en/consultation/barnhill-local-area-plan-2017-2023-strategic-issues-paper

blanch152 · 25-05-2021 12:30pm

Larbre34 wrote: »

I'd say theres a bit more water to go under the bridge before the Coolmine crossing is agreed and resolved. It will be very problematic.

The bridge will be built following the outcry over the traffic issues caused by the closure of Coolmine crossing. It will be funny to watch.

Pinch Flat · 25-05-2021 12:41pm

blanch152 wrote: »

The bridge will be built following the outcry over the traffic issues caused by the closure of Coolmine crossing. It will be funny to watch.

There will be outrage when people living on the coolmine cross realise they can't drive and park in the station. You'd never know maybe people might turn to radical means of transport, like a 10 minute walk instead of driving to the station.

Phil.x · 25-05-2021 2:06pm

" The junction upgrade solutions proposed are considered adequate to accommodate diverted traffic volumes associated with the closure of Coolmine level crossing."

"Adequate" Sounds unconvincing at best.

Flinty997 · 25-05-2021 2:24pm

Pinch Flat wrote: »

There will be outrage when people living on the coolmine cross realise they can't drive and park in the station. You'd never know maybe people might turn to radical means of transport, like a 10 minute walk instead of driving to the station.

I know a few people including myself that drive not to avoid walking but because they have other trips before and/or work that require a car, and have limited time to get it all done.

It's not like anyone would choose to drive 20 mins in heavy traffic to avoid a 10 Min walk. At least I assume they wouldn't.

Phil.x · 25-05-2021 2:48pm

Flinty997 wrote: »

I know a few people including myself that drive not to avoid walking but because they have other trips before and/or work that require a car, and have limited time to get it all done.

It's not like anyone would choose to drive 20 mins in heavy traffic to avoid a 10 Min walk. At least I assume they wouldn't.

No need to justify yourself.

Flinty997 · 25-05-2021 4:11pm

Phil.x wrote: »

No need to justify yourself.

I was just putting a different perspective on it.

Pinch Flat · 25-05-2021 5:55pm

Flinty997 wrote: »

I know a few people including myself that drive not to avoid walking but because they have other trips before and/or work that require a car, and have limited time to get it all done.

It's not like anyone would choose to drive 20 mins in heavy traffic to avoid a 10 Min walk. At least I assume they wouldn't.

True. Loads don't though. A neighbour of mine justified driving the 700 metres from the house because there was more parking available when they introduced the paid parking.

Flinty997 · 25-05-2021 6:38pm

Pinch Flat wrote: »

There will be outrage when people living on the coolmine cross realise they can't drive and park in the station. You'd never know maybe people might turn to radical means of transport, like a 10 minute walk instead of driving to the station.

There must not have been enough of them vocal enough to sway the proposal.
They will still be able to drive and take longer to get there then walking. If that's their preference.

blanch152 · 28-05-2021 11:05am

Flinty997 wrote: »

There must not have been enough of them vocal enough to sway the proposal.
They will still be able to drive and take longer to get there then walking. If that's their preference.

People who are happy with a planning proposal rarely contribute to the debate. Those with an objection or a complaint always make the largest contribution.

Former Former Former · 28-05-2021 8:20pm

Flinty997 wrote: »

There must not have been enough of them vocal enough to sway the proposal.

Just to be clear, no one has had a chance to comment on the proposal yet.

IngazZagni · 28-05-2021 9:14pm

Former Former Former wrote: »

Just to be clear, no one has had a chance to comment on the proposal yet.

People had ample opportunities to make their voice heard about which option they liked the best and hated the most. This is one of those options. Irish Rail preferred a different option but have now selected this other option after public outcry.

However yeah I'm sure this isn't the last outcry we will hear. There's no option that will please everyone.

Phil.x · 24-06-2021 8:30pm

I see the home owner is blocking off the footpath outside their home so the new footpath and cyclelane cannot continue. They have used garden stones, flower pots and metal barriers. This is beside the canal at clonsilla going upto St Joseph hospital which is resulting in people walking and cycling on the road for 40 or 50 feet.
Old screenshots photo.

daymobrew · 25-06-2021 2:37pm

Phil.x wrote: »

I see the home owner is blocking off the footpath outside their home so the new footpath and cyclelane cannot continue. They have used garden stones, flower pots and metal barriers.

Can you submit a report on FixYourStreet.ie to about illegal dumping on the footpath?

Flinty997 · 30-06-2021 9:59am

Phil.x wrote: »

I see the home owner is blocking off the footpath outside their home so the new footpath and cyclelane cannot continue. They have used garden stones, flower pots and metal barriers. This is beside the canal at clonsilla going upto St Joseph hospital which is resulting in people walking and cycling on the road for 40 or 50 feet.
Old screenshots photo.

Confused. What are we meant to looking at in that photo? Do you just mean this location.

Larbre34 · 30-06-2021 5:15pm

I hardly think a few plant pots and the odd painted rock is going to stop a civil contractor in any case.

ongarboy · 30-06-2021 11:01pm

Phil.x wrote: »

I see the home owner is blocking off the footpath outside their home so the new footpath and cyclelane cannot continue. They have used garden stones, flower pots and metal barriers. This is beside the canal at clonsilla going upto St Joseph hospital which is resulting in people walking and cycling on the road for 40 or 50 feet.
Old screenshots photo.

I've noticed that too as I run by there often and it's handier to avoid the much more congested and narrower path opposite but its dangerous having to run or walk out on the open road bend for that obstructed section. There are two private entrances and both have blocked the path. While the St Josephs development haven't technically finished the last 20 feet of new footpath adjacent, once they have finished, I'd be expecting those 2 residents to remove their unsightly obstructions too.

I don't see how they can claim ownership of path outside their walls. If someone wants to trespass on their property, a few flowerpots and hand scribbled private property signs will not be a deterrent so I'm not sure what their motivation is by causing that obstruction. Instead they are creating a dangerous situation for pedestrians and other road users.

Former Former Former · 30-06-2021 11:25pm

Chrisam wrote: »

I see today that an application has gone in to APB for 198 build to rent apartments, in the grounds of the Old Schoolhouse, Porterstown Road. Add that to the 350 apartments planned behind St Mochta's school and you have 500+ apartments feeding traffic on to the Clonsilla Road (as a cul de sac, if the level crossing is closed). All happening right beside a primary school. Housing needed yes, but I don't agree with pushing all that extra traffic on to the Clonsilla Rd, right beside a primary school. Let's hope they all cycle!

This has been rejected by ABP, apparently.

Polar101 · 01-07-2021 5:36am

Flinty997 wrote: »

Confused. What are we meant to looking at in that photo? Do you just mean this location.

The issue is that there is a new cycle track/footpath built to west side of the road (right side of the road in this picture), but it ends abruptly at this spot. The footpath continues after the gap, but is very narrow until it reaches the Clonsilla station park&ride section of the road (around where that car on the left is just coming from), where it becomes a wider footpath/cycle track again. And it seems the narrow bit is now blocked by the houseowners.

Here is it on Google maps - most of the new cycle track/footpath is visible outside St. Joseph's (west side of the road). Street view is not current, and doesn't show the St. Joseph's estate.

https://www.google.com/maps/@53.3849115,-6.4281476,237m/data=!3m1!1e3

Flinty997 · 01-07-2021 8:14am

Cycle paths, or foot paths that abruptly end for no reason leaving you on the road is so common in D15 I assumed it's done deliberately by someone in a Fungal having a laugh.

raheny red · 01-07-2021 4:34pm

https://twitter.com/Fingalcoco/status/1410616108835430403?s=19

Larbre34 · 01-07-2021 5:05pm

Jesus C, on top of the 30 minute delays I heard about on the Westmanstown Road lately thanks to the closure of Lucan-Clonee, that'll be a nightmare.

Polar101 · 01-07-2021 7:40pm

Yeah, traffic pretty much at standstill there today. Hopefully there was no structural damage to the bridge and that they get it assessed quickly. I didn't notice any obvious damage myself, but I'm not a bridge engineer so I'm not declaring it safe just yet.

Dublin 15 is going to get a lot more congested.

Comments