Shelbourne Hotel remove historic statues due to association with slavery - *Read OP**

Spanish Eyes · 29-07-2020 12:12am

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

Choosing to continue using these patriarchal terms is embedding sexism into our culture on every level.

Ah have a drop of Hemlock, you'll be grand but dead. Socrates said so.

Overheal · 29-07-2020 12:14am

o1s1n wrote: »

Didn't you get the memo? Everyone in the past was a Nazi and their history must be eradicated.

Well if someone’s “we can’t eradicate history” virtue signaling is to remain consistent it stands to simple reason it should be able to stand up to the informal ‘Nazi Test’ as it were. There’s a difference between “vaporizing history” and moving statues to less prolific sites.

For Forks Sake · 29-07-2020 12:17am

Yyhhuuu wrote: »

Planning permission is most certainly required to remove any part of the protected structure.

Please lodge a complaint to Dublin city council's planning enforcement section. E mail/ postal address:

The Enforcement Section
Planning Department
Civic Offices
Block 4, Floor 2
Wood Quay
Dublin 8

There's a fairly hefty irony to DCC's planning section being located at Wood Quay given the archaelogical vandalism that went on in building that office block

Spanish Eyes · 29-07-2020 12:20am

For Forks Sake wrote: »

There's a fairly hefty irony to DCC's planning section being located at Wood Quay given the archaelogical vandalism that went on in building that office block

That was a total travesty alright. Pains me to think about what is underneath that behomoth of a building. You have triggered my anger.

MoonUnit75 · 29-07-2020 12:23am

It’s almost like no one notices the fundamentalism taking hold.

Danzy · 29-07-2020 12:23am

KaneToad wrote: »

Wait till they start going through the art galleries of the world and start removing the masterpieces that depict unsavoury content.

They already are. Famous Victorian painting of Greek Nymphs and Narcissus was taken down fir being problematic.

o1s1n · 29-07-2020 12:42am

Overheal wrote: »

Well if someone’s “we can’t eradicate history” virtue signaling is to remain consistent it stands to simple reason it should be able to stand up to the informal ‘Nazi Test’ as it were. There’s a difference between “vaporizing history” and moving statues to less prolific sites.

So decorative statues which have been there for over a century and a half have the same historical display value as political statues thrown up for a brief period in Germany during the Third Reich?

Nazi statues were never of historical significance at the time as they were barely up relatively speaking before being torn down. It's not the same thing and you're well aware how ridiculous a comparison it is.

MoonUnit75 · 29-07-2020 12:48am

Overheal wrote: »

Well if someone’s “we can’t eradicate history” virtue signaling is to remain consistent it stands to simple reason it should be able to stand up to the informal ‘Nazi Test’ as it were. There’s a difference between “vaporizing history” and moving statues to less prolific sites.

Great, we’ll start moving ‘problematic’ books to less troublesome shelves, in a bunker somewhere. Good books should be able to pass the new Woke cult test, right?

Omackeral · 29-07-2020 12:52am

KaneToad wrote: »

Wait till they start going through the art galleries of the world and start removing the masterpieces that depict unsavoury content.

The Pyramids need to go ASAP

Quantum Erasure · 29-07-2020 1:00am

mc25 wrote: »

The article did say that they had been planned to be removed for some time...

I mean that could be corporate BS, but would there be as much talk here if it was statues of unicorns or something equally as ridiculous?

Planned for some time, like a few weeks

The hotel’s general manager JP Kavanagh said the decision to take the four statues down had been taken by them alone and there had been no complaints from outsiders about them.

“It was a decision taken just by us with our owner and operator. This decision has been coming for a number of weeks given what has been happening in the world,” he said.

SafeSurfer · 29-07-2020 1:15am

For those of you asking “where will this all end” the answer is it won’t. Dublin City Council or any public body simply do not have the guts to insist that these statues, which form part of a protected structure, be reinstated.

The removal of these statues will further embolden anyone with an agenda to demand cultural items be suppressed, banned and removed.

1990sman · 29-07-2020 1:20am

white noise omfg so racisht padraig

1990sman · 29-07-2020 1:22am

quick burn the sliced pan before aunt aoife gets here! had no idea she was so political.

ronivek · 29-07-2020 1:47am

Can’t say I agree with removing statues or indeed any form of art or sculpture without very good reason; would much rather see plaques nearby which put them into their correct context and otherwise leave them be. If they’re moved to a museum or park then I wouldn’t have much of an issue either.

I would be interested to see what if any kind of reaction there will be from Dublin City Council since presumably there was no planning permission sought.

SafeSurfer · 29-07-2020 1:59am

The hotel virtue signalling by removing statues that few if any realised had any slavery connotations.

How about some real virtue. Like employing a diversity officer or paying minimum wage workers 50 cent more an hour? No? Of course not, the statues will have to go to prove how virtuous and multiculturally aware they are.

Now try booking a traveller wedding in the Shelbourne.

Overheal · 29-07-2020 2:08am

MoonUnit75 wrote: »

Great, we’ll start moving ‘problematic’ books to less troublesome shelves, in a bunker somewhere. Good books should be able to pass the new Woke cult test, right?

You won’t find Mein Kampf in the kids or young adults sections no.

KungPao · 29-07-2020 2:17am

Jeez what next? Pretend we weren’t once part of the United Kingdom and blow up Nelson’s Pillar? Spray paint the post boxes green?

Madness.

Quantum Erasure · 29-07-2020 2:18am

Overheal wrote: »

You won’t find Mein Kampf in the kids or young adults sections no.

Wasnt there a call just last week to remove To Kill a Mockingbird from the Junior Cert curriculum? (and Of Mice and Men, though I haven't read it, so I'm not sure what's 'problematic' about that...)

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40021460.html

Carfacemandog · 29-07-2020 2:19am

It's their hotel, it seems a bit silly to me given the context but they can remove them if they want. Though it is funny juxtaposing this thread with others where posters are saying if people want statues taken down they should do it by peaceful means instead of just ripping them out of the ground.

Strumms · 29-07-2020 2:30am

walshb wrote: »

World is fooking mad....and the maddest thing is that it's going to get madder...

It is, we are simply lying down and pandering to a bunch of people who we opened our doors, arms, financial resources to and are now prepared self rape our own identity, history, culture and ideology so that they might not get offended... the world / country is bananas.... mental... we are living in truly fûcked up times.

Only a matter of time before we see companies advertising online for staff and at the bottom of the advertisement the BLM badge. Underneath... “Our policy is to hire 50% or better people who are black / African heritage...

Nesta99 · 29-07-2020 3:26am

Racial supremacy, slavery, genocide, eugenic behaviour, wiping out entire species of animal, overthrowing democratically elected governance - time to take the wrecking ball to Colesseum and all that Roman stuff!

Pardon the term but white washing history is wrong - within reason leave remnants of historical ills as part of the educating of future generations. Explain the significance of these things. They should rename US military bases commemorating confederates that defended slavery, but its should be eg Fort Tuskagee (formally known as Fort Benning) with even an info point or plaque on why renaming happened.

Yyhhuuu · 29-07-2020 3:37am

SafeSurfer wrote: »

For those of you asking “where will this all end” the answer is it won’t. Dublin City Council or any public body simply do not have the guts to insist that these statues, which form part of a protected structure, be reinstated.

The removal of these statues will further embolden anyone with an agenda to demand cultural items be suppressed, banned and removed.

If there has been a breach of planning legislation and a valid complaint is lodged to their Enforcement section they are then obliged to act by investigating and if necessary issuing an enforcement notice, which if not complied with should result in enforcement proceedings. If a member of the public is of the opinion the council failed to take appropriate action then they should lodge a complaint with the Ombudsman.

Yyhhuuu · 29-07-2020 3:42am

Carfacemandog wrote: »

It's their hotel, it seems a bit silly to me given the context but they can remove them if they want. Though it is funny juxtaposing this thread with others where posters are saying if people want statues taken down they should do it by peaceful means instead of just ripping them out of the ground.

The building is on the Register of Protected structures which I understand to mean planning permission is required to interfere with the fabric of the building.

Overheal · 29-07-2020 4:00am

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

Wasnt there a call just last week to remove To Kill a Mockingbird from the Junior Cert curriculum? (and Of Mice and Men, though I haven't read it, so I'm not sure what's 'problematic' about that...)

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40021460.html

You say you aren’t sure yet it’s explained in the link you offered.

ChosenWong · 29-07-2020 4:23am

It all seems a bit medieval that these monuments are being pulled down or removed

Rubberchikken · 29-07-2020 4:29am

Solve the amount of slavery happening in the modern world. The past is past.

And the bloody Muppets who perpetuate this nonsense haven't a clue.

Montage of Feck · 29-07-2020 5:42am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

They were statues of slaves ffs What do you think they were for? Lol. It'll take some really limber mental gymnastics to make the anti BLM argument on this.

The statues are apparently of Nubian princesses and their slave girls, in other words they're depictions of black slave holders; so in reality it's got nothing all to with BLM.

stinkypinky · 29-07-2020 6:02am

Overheal wrote: »

So they “removed” the statues but you’ve gone for the slippery slope of “demolish all the 18th and 19th century buildings” - seems to be the only storm in a teacup here tbh. The statues aren’t demolished yes just removed from the hotel front?

It's always the same with these post modernist types encouraging such nonsense, whether it's statues, violent agitators, cancel culture or big burly men competing in Women's sport. They'll throw in a little connotation attempting to downplay such incidents as isolated incidents whilst basking gleefully in the calamity of it all. They have a stranglehold on society and imo it's very dangerous.

Rodney Bathgate · 29-07-2020 6:11am

Nesta99 wrote: »

Pardon the term but white washing history is wrong

Have things gotten so bad that using the phrase ‘white washing’ requires an apology in advance?

tabby aspreme · 29-07-2020 7:48am

Frank McDonald on rte1radio talking a lot of sense, asking what relevance a statue depicting a scene from 4000 years ago, has to modern slavery issues

OMM 0000 · 29-07-2020 9:06am

It is worrying to see this US crap making its way into Irish politics and culture. We should all try to reject it as it's toxic and divisive and is almost like a virus, making people obsessed with race and sex.

Omackeral · 29-07-2020 9:31am

OMM 0000 wrote: »

It is worrying to see this US crap making its way into Irish politics and culture. We should all try to reject it as it's toxic and divisive and is almost like a virus, making people obsessed with race and sex.

Read the other day that when the League of Ireland starts back this weekend the players and refs will be “taking the knee” for the first 8 games. I think it’s overkill tbh.

NIMAN · 29-07-2020 9:38am

Omackeral wrote: »

Read the other day that when the League of Ireland starts back this weekend the players and refs will be “taking the knee” for the first 8 games. I think it’s overkill tbh.

.... and same in Scotland
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53569161

I love how it says the players can take the knee "should they wish to do so".

Who isn't going to get down? Its like the poppy now, you haven't got a choice.

Really think one or two players are going to stand when everyone else is kneeling? The mob would be online immediately calling you a racist and trying to end your career.

OMM 0000 · 29-07-2020 9:39am

Omackeral wrote: »

Read the other day that when the League of Ireland starts back this weekend the players and refs will be “taking the knee” for the first 8 games. I think it’s overkill tbh.

Clowns.

A tiny bit of reading shows BLM are a toxic organisation and US police brutality is a statistical anomoly. And obviously has nothing to do with Ireland.

MOH · 29-07-2020 9:42am

Overheal wrote: »

Like what, leaving Nazi statues in the Berlin city center?

There’s a proper place for history and it’s not always in positions of honor.

Did you seriously just compare statues depicting ancient Egyptian culture to Nazis?

That's probably the stupidest Godwin-ing of a thread I've ever seen

suicide_circus · 29-07-2020 9:44am

For Forks Sake wrote: »

There's a fairly hefty irony to DCC's planning section being located at Wood Quay given the archaelogical vandalism that went on in building that office block

Well the Vikings were chronic slave traders so i'm glad DCC vandalised wood quay.

I'd also like to see all our other grandiose symbols of imperialist colonialism demolished; The Custom House, The GPO, Trinity College etc - that would prove our virtue far more effectively than some small statues of African princesses and their servants which no one even knew represented slavery to being with.

OMM 0000 · 29-07-2020 9:44am

MOH wrote: »

Did you seriously just compare statues depicting ancient Egyptian culture to Nazis?

That's probably the stupidest Godwin-ing of a thread I've ever seen

There's a lot of extremists here. It's best to add them to your ignore list.

Outkast_IRE · 29-07-2020 9:45am

Its no different that all the companies jumping onto the pride bandwagon the last few years. They go all out to ensure they get their photos and publicity from it.

Where were these companies 20 - 30 years ago when these groups actually needed support and doing so meant sticking your neck on the chopping block.

This current bout of companies trying to be super woke and sensitive is just as sickening. They only make the effort when the tide has already turned.

TheValeyard · 29-07-2020 9:52am

Heard someone rightly say its the US Hotel owners importing cancel culture into Ireland.

dubrov · 29-07-2020 10:02am

It sounds like they wanted to remove the statues anyway.
This is just a means of removing them knowing that the council will be unlikely to object due to BLM.
The hotel also looks like it is taking the moral high ground

Genius from management.

Feisar · 29-07-2020 10:07am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

They were statues of slaves ffs What do you think they were for? Lol. It'll take some really limber mental gymnastics to make the anti BLM argument on this.

A depiction of something is not automatically a celebration of it.

29-07-2020 10:16am

When they finally go after statues of Roman emporers, the world might finally wake up and end this abhorrent removal of art, culture and history.

It should be illegal. An international hotel group should not be allowed to remove statues from the 1800s because some Americans have lost the plot.

Edgware · 29-07-2020 10:16am

KaneToad wrote: »

Wait till they start going through the art galleries of the world and start removing the masterpieces that depict unsavoury content.

Unsavoury content Ooooh Vicar!

Edgware · 29-07-2020 10:25am

NIMAN wrote: »

.... and same in Scotland
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53569161

I love how it says the players can take the knee "should they wish to do so".

Who isn't going to get down? Its like the poppy now, you haven't got a choice.

Really think one or two players are going to stand when everyone else is kneeling? The mob would be online immediately calling you a racist and trying to end your career.

Wait until the Premiership in November. First we will have a minute taking the knee, then a minute for the poppy and then a few minutes clapping for the Front line Heroes and another minute in memory of some oul lad who used sell programmes outside the ground

Nesta99 · 29-07-2020 10:27am

NIMAN wrote: »

.... and same in Scotland
https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/53569161

Who isn't going to get down?

Let them Boogie-Woogie....

Edgware · 29-07-2020 10:29am

dubrov wrote: »

It sounds like they wanted to remove the statues anyway.
This is just a means of removing them knowing that the council will be unlikely to object due to BLM.
The hotel also looks like it is taking the moral high ground

Genius from management.

Really shouldnt they knock the hotel down as it was used by the British in 1916 to shoot down at the Volunteers dug into trenches in St. Stephens Green.
It was a brilliant manouevre by that great military technician, Countess Markievitz to order trenches be dug in a park surrounded by rows of four storey buildings.

SEPT 23 1989 · 29-07-2020 10:41am

Edgware wrote: »

It was a brilliant manouevre by that great military technician, Countess Markievitz to order trenches be dug in a park surrounded by rows of four storey buildings.

:pac:

Feisar · 29-07-2020 10:43am

ChosenWong wrote: »

It all seems a bit medieval that these monuments are being pulled down or removed

Also reminds me of the futuristic film Equilibrium. Anything thought provoking needs to be wiped out.

conorhal · 29-07-2020 10:58am

KaneToad wrote: »

Wait till they start going through the art galleries of the world and start removing the masterpieces that depict unsavoury content.

The Bamiyan Buddahas of Afghanistan:

Before/After a bunch of ideological loons took offence.

These BLM nutters and those that pander to them are no different to the Taliban, in fact I've become pretty convinced that the left are now enforcing their own flavour of 'secular Sharia' and nobody is standing up to the lunacy.

This crap needs to end.

The Nal · 29-07-2020 11:02am

Proper order.

They should knock down the Pyramids next.

An ban Toblerones.

Shelbourne Hotel remove historic statues due to association with slavery - *Read OP**

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