Dairy Chitchat 3

thisyear · 15-06-2020 10:47am

cosatron wrote: »

I did my green cert down there and they had a great herd of Holsteins breed from some of the best cow families in Ireland. they are after doing the same thing in Mountbellew ag college aswell. what's wrong with them, should they not be trailing a variety of breeds in different area to see how they perform to give any young farmer guidance on how different cows perform in different system.

Think the plan there is to have the largest commercial college dairy farm for the students to learn from.... Its a big farm and the bottom of it is reclaimed from the sea. surprised they are having drought problems. it is a big suspect that a dairymaster parlour is going in, conflict of interest rules???

Mooooo · 15-06-2020 10:56am

I dunno why people are getting their backs up so much. When I mentioned winter milk I meant calving cow's for the winter without contract, not milking a few late calvers on in a spring system. I've heavy ground, been in winter milk, experienced plenty of other ****e thru farming and outside of it, the same as most on here. I mentioned nothing of people not knowing their costs. The stuff is there for you to use it or not. Questioned plenty of it myself particularly methodology in some of the trials. Obviously plenty of ye don't agree with it as well and that's grand. Jersey calf issue is overplayed imo, it's the beef industry is fcuked in terms of a return to the farmer and has been with a a few years. No calf in west cork made much this year, jex, fr aa or HE. Bar the late ones which ironically will prob cost the buyer more to raise.
Dawg no harm to question the status quo but you are in a country where all these grass alternatives can grow cheaper and with less chance of harvest failure. Maize is great in a good growing year but in a bad one it's a grand an acre that you won't get much of a return from. Can't grow it here so I had to buy it in, same with any crop on a good share of my ground. Wet years effected me just as much in winter milk as silage couldn't always be made top notch either and like that lower yields and quality of bought in maize.
It's the processors have to up their game in my view really in order to get a better price for our product as all they seemed to do was offer it at the cheapest price in order to get sales and that has us at the lowest milk prices in Europe and beyond

thisyear · 15-06-2020 11:03am

Ive been thinking about this crossbreeding debate. We are black and white and was tempted to cross. no issue with whatever way people want to farm as in reality all farms are different. I milked lots of JRX when I was working for other lads before coming home and they were lovely easy manage cows. Just didnt go that way as fertility wasnt a massive issue for us. The way im looking is the cows I bulled this year will calve in two years and wont peak for 3years after that. so thats 5 years and its only 20% of the herd. Can anyone tell me what the landscape we farm in will be in 5years.

My thoughts

Im betting on a couple of things.
1. The environmental stuff isnt going away so the idea of more cows/ha just doesnt look feasible. Im guessing anything over 2.5/ha is going to be a problem
2. We are not going to be allowed slaughter calves, just not consumer friendly.
3. Live export is under pressure, will the transport distance rules change in effect ruling out calves to holland? likely
4. Welfare, antibiotics use is going to go selective dry cow
5. More audits because the coop will need them from a customer pov

So my cow needs to work for me, im paid for milk solids so Im going to produce them. I like an easy life. Saying that im not going to be allowed horse feed into them cos that doesnt work for the green image for the coops so there is a limit

My calves will end up on beef farms.... hopefully. To get someone to buy them the calf will have to grow some bit and get to 270-280kg carcass at 23-24months or the beef lad gets done on price and carbon (over 24months and change in LU)

Some say sexed semen, I say thats not looking at whole picture. The cow would still be JRX, so what beef do you put in?

The beef lad wont take Jersey.

So Ive concluded, black and white 550kg cow (550kg x 0.5 killout =275Kg) and as much solids as possible from her? Can she do 550kg in solids? more?

my few thoughts

Keepgrowing · 15-06-2020 11:09am

Mooooo wrote: »

I dunno why people are getting their backs up so much. When I mentioned winter milk I meant calving cow's for the winter without contract, not milking a few late calvers on in a spring system. I've heavy ground, been in winter milk, experienced plenty of other ****e thru farming and outside of it, the same as most on here. I mentioned nothing of people not knowing their costs. The stuff is there for you to use it or not. Questioned plenty of it myself particularly methodology in some of the trials. Obviously plenty of ye don't agree with it as well and that's grand. Jersey calf issue is overplayed imo, it's the beef industry is fcuked in terms of a return to the farmer and has been with a a few years. No calf in west cork made much this year, jex, fr aa or HE. Bar the late ones which ironically will prob cost the buyer more to raise.
Dawg no harm to question the status quo but you are in a country where all these grass alternatives can grow cheaper and with less chance of harvest failure. Maize is great in a good growing year but in a bad one it's a grand an acre that you won't get much of a return from. Can't grow it here so I had to buy it in, same with any crop on a good share of my ground. Wet years effected me just as much in winter milk as silage couldn't always be made top notch either and like that lower yields and quality of bought in maize.
It's the processors have to up their game in my view really in order to get a better price for our product as all they seemed to do was offer it at the cheapest price in order to get sales and that has us at the lowest milk prices in Europe and beyond

My comments re winter milk without contract was exactly as you’ve quoted. Calving cows for winter milk without contract is financial folly end of.

mahoney_j · 15-06-2020 11:24am

Keepgrowing wrote: »

My comments re winter milk without contract was exactly as you’ve quoted. Calving cows for winter milk without contract is financial folly end of.

How can u say that of other farms when u know little of what happens there no doubt u know your costs but u can’t say u know it for others .....
What works for u might not work for others and vice versa .beyond me why we seem to care so much about what others are doing .if a lad can milk thru or calve a block of cows with no contract and makes money why is that such an issue???if I had a liquid/baileys/winter contract from glanbia I wouldn’t give it up for live no money and anyone I know with one would take more at expense of less spring

Keepgrowing · 15-06-2020 11:44am

mahoney_j wrote: »

How can u say that of other farms when u know little of what happens there no doubt u know your costs but u can’t say u know it for others .....
What works for u might not work for others and vice versa .beyond me why we seem to care so much about what others are doing .if a lad can milk thru or calve a block of cows with no contract and makes money why is that such an issue???if I had a liquid/baileys/winter contract from glanbia I wouldn’t give it up for live no money and anyone I know with one would take more at expense of less spring

I actually care for this industry. The more people stay in it the better for us all and the more get in the better as we need young blood.

I am speaking as a very experienced winter milker with huge investment in facilities for it and I can attest to the fact that I wouldn’t supply 1 litre more than our contract as I know it a loss maker. I know this from bitter experience, you and others may choose to disagree and that’s absolutely fine by me.

Being accused of “self preservation” by another poster because I said this is really unfair. The more people in this game the better.

Finally you commented on Glanbia winter/liquid contracts and people’s demand for more, in my DG for example there was 50% in contracted milk today I’m the only one. Winter milk with contract is no gold mine so I cannot see how it can be without a bonus.

Just my experience

Mooooo · 15-06-2020 11:56am

Keepgrowing wrote: »

I actually care for this industry. The more people stay in it the better for us all and the more get in the better as we need young blood.

I am speaking as a very experienced winter milker with huge investment in facilities for it and I can attest to the fact that I wouldn’t supply 1 litre more than our contract as I know it a loss maker. I know this from bitter experience, you and others may choose to disagree and that’s absolutely fine by me.

Being accused of “self preservation” by another poster because I said this is really unfair. The more people in this game the better.

Finally you commented on Glanbia winter/liquid contracts and people’s demand for more, in my DG for example there was 50% in contracted milk today I’m the only one. Winter milk with contract is no gold mine so I cannot see how it can be without a bonus.

Just my experience

Same in our group, just the 2 left in winter milk, 4 exited in last few years.

Timmaay · 15-06-2020 12:27pm

And mooo 2bh maize crops grown on contract I don't think are particularly good value, 55e/ton seems to be the price across the board, if its a 33%dm fit crop then at 170e it's good value, but cut too early and green which it often is when sold on contract to maximise the wet tons sold, then you could well be back to 25% dm and a lower ufl so your suddenly at the likes of 220e/ton dm, and with a ufl of likes of 0.87 then suddenly the ton of nuts is as good a value without the hassle of the pit, low protein, waste etc. I've grown maize here myself the last few years, next year I will most likely put them 13ac back into grass for more cows, but I'll be looking out to rent another field for maize myself rather than buy it on contract 2bh.

Buford T. Justice XIX · 15-06-2020 12:32pm

A fairly simple decision making chart from Andre on topping or not:)
https://twitter.com/Graiseconsult1/status/1272489193093111809?s=19

Gawddawggonnit · 15-06-2020 2:35pm

Mooooo wrote: »

I dunno why people are getting their backs up so much. When I mentioned winter milk I meant calving cow's for the winter without contract, not milking a few late calvers on in a spring system. I've heavy ground, been in winter milk, experienced plenty of other ****e thru farming and outside of it, the same as most on here. I mentioned nothing of people not knowing their costs. The stuff is there for you to use it or not. Questioned plenty of it myself particularly methodology in some of the trials. Obviously plenty of ye don't agree with it as well and that's grand. Jersey calf issue is overplayed imo, it's the beef industry is fcuked in terms of a return to the farmer and has been with a a few years. No calf in west cork made much this year, jex, fr aa or HE. Bar the late ones which ironically will prob cost the buyer more to raise.
Dawg no harm to question the status quo but you are in a country where all these grass alternatives can grow cheaper and with less chance of harvest failure. Maize is great in a good growing year but in a bad one it's a grand an acre that you won't get much of a return from. Can't grow it here so I had to buy it in, same with any crop on a good share of my ground. Wet years effected me just as much in winter milk as silage couldn't always be made top notch either and like that lower yields and quality of bought in maize.
It's the processors have to up their game in my view really in order to get a better price for our product as all they seemed to do was offer it at the cheapest price in order to get sales and that has us at the lowest milk prices in Europe and beyond

I couldn’t fault anything you say there Moo.
1. Maize. I’ve never even suggested that farmers grow maize. Been there, done that. For the one or two good crops every five years, it makes it a non-runner imv.
What I’ve railed against is the growing of monoculture pgr with no thought given to the year that it doesn’t grow. Any tillage farmer that would only grow one crop would want a hole in his head to contemplate such folly, not to mention that it’s not allowed anymore.
Using the soil as a kind of matrix to grow these monocultures whilst loading on N has no future. The last few fodder crises have proven that.
I speak every now and then to a former Teagasc adviser, now in private enterprise, and I suggested that he could contact Teagasc to tell them that I’d be available to make introductions on alternative forages...jayz I’d say he’s still laughing!
Yet, the message still remains,’spread a bag’.
The world has moved on...

2. Cow type.
I couldn’t give a damn what cow type anyone has, why would I?
However the killing of newborn calves is one travesty that has fallen on the Irish dairy industry. Please don’t deny it is happening because I’ve many examples to tell if needs be...
Killing the calves is a direct result of a diktat from Teagasc on using Jersey crosses as a shortcut into producing more solids. It’s a perfect example of the law of unintended consequences. They just didn’t think through the whole project.

3. Nitrates/Derogation.
Irish farmers are sleepwalking into a shytestorm on this. Teagasc have to shoulder the majority of the blame for the charge down that road.
How in Gods earthly world do they think that it’s going to be allowed to carry on by Europe? For sure the Dept are complicit in this also and I won’t even mention the fouling of watercourses with raw sewage.
Dérogation is what Teagasc are concerned about, where they would be better off taking a step back and looking at the whole picture, which is nitrogen.
Does anyone even wonder how come Ireland is the only country that grant aids new fertilizer spinners? The mind truly boggles. Jeez go on Twitter...every dairy farmer posting photos of their new spinner and they out spreading nitrogen!! Fcuk, but that’s not the message any farmer would want to be broadcasting to the general population, surely?
The ‘mining’ of the environment to produce cheap milk isn’t an option.
You’re in West Cork? I’ve spent many a good sporting day hunting the countryside in that beautiful place. The last time I was there was shortly after the financial crisis and there were excavators after destroying the best of wild bird habitat because there was no other work to be got at the time...plenty fellas post on Twitter etc to this day about ‘making’ land out of scrubby/mountainy ****holes...couldn’t they just leave well enough alone?

3. Price. I feel sorry for the way ye are being well and truly ridden by your own Coops but that’s a commercial decision that ye’ve to make for yourselves. I gave up posting on the Milk Price thread...

mahoney_j · 15-06-2020 3:01pm

Keepgrowing wrote: »

I actually care for this industry. The more people stay in it the better for us all and the more get in the better as we need young blood.

I am speaking as a very experienced winter milker with huge investment in facilities for it and I can attest to the fact that I wouldn’t supply 1 litre more than our contract as I know it a loss maker. I know this from bitter experience, you and others may choose to disagree and that’s absolutely fine by me.

Being accused of “self preservation” by another poster because I said this is really unfair. The more people in this game the better.

Finally you commented on Glanbia winter/liquid contracts and people’s demand for more, in my DG for example there was 50% in contracted milk today I’m the only one. Winter milk with contract is no gold mine so I cannot see how it can be without a bonus.

Just my experience

Not doubting u on any of above but guys exit winter milk from what I’ve seen for a variety of reasons the biggest ones been lack labour ,cost of upgrading facilities ,age and a simpler spring calving system
If the returns and margins which u havnt adhered to in winter milk are so tight why not go all spring calving in your system sell your liquid /winter/baileys whatever winter contract .......from what I gather u like winter milk and there’s no way you’d do it for small margin

Castlekeeper · 15-06-2020 3:13pm

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

I couldn’t fault anything you say there Moo.
1. Maize. I’ve never even suggested that farmers grow maize. Been there, done that. For the one or two good crops every five years, it makes it a non-runner imv.
What I’ve railed against is the growing of monoculture pgr with no thought given to the year that it doesn’t grow. Any tillage farmer that would only grow one crop would want a hole in his head to contemplate such folly, not to mention that it’s not allowed anymore.
Using the soil as a kind of matrix to grow these monocultures whilst loading on N has no future. The last few fodder crises have proven that.
I speak every now and then to a former Teagasc adviser, now in private enterprise, and I suggested that he could contact Teagasc to tell them that I’d be available to make introductions on alternative forages...jayz I’d say he’s still laughing!
Yet, the message still remains,’spread a bag’.
The world has moved on...

2. Cow type.
I couldn’t give a damn what cow type anyone has, why would I?
However the killing of newborn calves is one travesty that has fallen on the Irish dairy industry. Please don’t deny it is happening because I’ve many examples to tell if needs be...
Killing the calves is a direct result of a diktat from Teagasc on using Jersey crosses as a shortcut into producing more solids. It’s a perfect example of the law of unintended consequences. They just didn’t think through the whole project.

3. Nitrates/Derogation.
Irish farmers are sleepwalking into a shytestorm on this. Teagasc have to shoulder the majority of the blame for the charge down that road.
How in Gods earthly world do they think that it’s going to be allowed to carry on by Europe? For sure the Dept are complicit in this also and I won’t even mention the fouling of watercourses with raw sewage.
Dérogation is what Teagasc are concerned about, where they would be better off taking a step back and looking at the whole picture, which is nitrogen.
Does anyone even wonder how come Ireland is the only country that grant aids new fertilizer spinners? The mind truly boggles. Jeez go on Twitter...every dairy farmer posting photos of their new spinner and they out spreading nitrogen!! Fcuk, but that’s not the message any farmer would want to be broadcasting to the general population, surely?
The ‘mining’ of the environment to produce cheap milk isn’t an option.
You’re in West Cork? I’ve spent many a good sporting day hunting the countryside in that beautiful place. The last time I was there was shortly after the financial crisis and there were excavators after destroying the best of wild bird habitat because there was no other work to be got at the time...plenty fellas post on Twitter etc to this day about ‘making’ land out of scrubby/mountainy ****holes...couldn’t they just leave well enough alone?

3. Price. I feel sorry for the way ye are being well and truly ridden by your own Coops but that’s a commercial decision that ye’ve to mwhat teake for yourselves. I gave up posting on the Milk Price thread...

While you have some valid points, I've never heard of a grant for a fertiliser spinner, what have I missed out on?

And all farmland in Ireland has been "made" by deforestation, so it's a bit ironic to suggest that others can't make the "most" of what they have unless one is a shining example of native habitat protection or re-wilding in ones own patch, however "good" the land is.
The " " refer to subjective terms.

Buford T. Justice XIX · 15-06-2020 4:53pm

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

I couldn’t fault anything you say there Moo.
1. Maize. I’ve never even suggested that farmers grow maize. Been there, done that. For the one or two good crops every five years, it makes it a non-runner imv.
What I’ve railed against is the growing of monoculture pgr with no thought given to the year that it doesn’t grow. Any tillage farmer that would only grow one crop would want a hole in his head to contemplate such folly, not to mention that it’s not allowed anymore.
Using the soil as a kind of matrix to grow these monocultures whilst loading on N has no future. The last few fodder crises have proven that.
I speak every now and then to a former Teagasc adviser, now in private enterprise, and I suggested that he could contact Teagasc to tell them that I’d be available to make introductions on alternative forages...jayz I’d say he’s still laughing!
Yet, the message still remains,’spread a bag’.
The world has moved on...

2. Cow type.
I couldn’t give a damn what cow type anyone has, why would I?
However the killing of newborn calves is one travesty that has fallen on the Irish dairy industry. Please don’t deny it is happening because I’ve many examples to tell if needs be...
Killing the calves is a direct result of a diktat from Teagasc on using Jersey crosses as a shortcut into producing more solids. It’s a perfect example of the law of unintended consequences. They just didn’t think through the whole project.

3. Nitrates/Derogation.
Irish farmers are sleepwalking into a shytestorm on this. Teagasc have to shoulder the majority of the blame for the charge down that road.
How in Gods earthly world do they think that it’s going to be allowed to carry on by Europe? For sure the Dept are complicit in this also and I won’t even mention the fouling of watercourses with raw sewage.
Dérogation is what Teagasc are concerned about, where they would be better off taking a step back and looking at the whole picture, which is nitrogen.
Does anyone even wonder how come Ireland is the only country that grant aids new fertilizer spinners? The mind truly boggles. Jeez go on Twitter...every dairy farmer posting photos of their new spinner and they out spreading nitrogen!! Fcuk, but that’s not the message any farmer would want to be broadcasting to the general population, surely?
The ‘mining’ of the environment to produce cheap milk isn’t an option.
You’re in West Cork? I’ve spent many a good sporting day hunting the countryside in that beautiful place. The last time I was there was shortly after the financial crisis and there were excavators after destroying the best of wild bird habitat because there was no other work to be got at the time...plenty fellas post on Twitter etc to this day about ‘making’ land out of scrubby/mountainy ****holes...couldn’t they just leave well enough alone?

3. Price. I feel sorry for the way ye are being well and truly ridden by your own Coops but that’s a commercial decision that ye’ve to make for yourselves. I gave up posting on the Milk Price thread...

Just to clear up two points you made there, Dawg.

There's no grants of fertiliser spreaders and I can't remember there ever being one.

The use of Jersey genetics wasn't encouraged for milk solids, it was encouraged as a quick solution to relatively poor black and white reproductive genetics. Hybrid vigour resulting from that also resulted in an increase in milk solids from an increase in days in milk which also continues in future generations.

whelan2 · 15-06-2020 5:22pm

mahoney_j wrote: »

Not doubting u on any of above but guys exit winter milk from what I’ve seen for a variety of reasons the biggest ones been lack labour ,cost of upgrading facilities ,age and a simpler spring calving system
If the returns and margins which u havnt adhered to in winter milk are so tight why not go all spring calving in your system sell your liquid /winter/baileys whatever winter contract .......from what I gather u like winter milk and there’s no way you’d do it for small margin

The reason I'm still in liquid milk is labour. If I had a euro for everytime someone asked me when am I going all spring I'd be rich , or the other gem is you could have extra cows on that land base. What's the point in killing yourself working? I don't see the point in expanding big time and buffer feeding all summer. Keep it simple is my motto. Out of yard by 5.30pm 99% of the time

whelan2 · 15-06-2020 5:35pm

cosatron wrote: »

I did my green cert down there and they had a great herd of Holsteins breed from some of the best cow families in Ireland. they are after doing the same thing in Mountbellew ag college aswell. what's wrong with them, should they not be trailing a variety of breeds in different area to see how they perform to give any young farmer guidance on how different cows perform in different system.

Young lad is in Ballyhaise they too are gone jex. They also doing grazing trials which I think are ridiculous. They are being done in groups of 20 cows.

Gawddawggonnit · 15-06-2020 6:14pm

Buford T. Justice VI wrote: »

Just to clear up two points you made there, Dawg.

There's no grants of fertiliser spreaders and I can't remember there ever being one.

The use of Jersey genetics wasn't encouraged for milk solids, it was encouraged as a quick solution to relatively poor black and white reproductive genetics. Hybrid vigour resulting from that also resulted in an increase in milk solids from an increase in days in milk which also continues in future generations.

Apologies. It can be somewhat confusing with all those grants... https://www.farmersjournal.ie/tams-ii-fertiliser-spreader-details-available-290460

Whatever their original, and continuous, pushing of using Jersey genetics, I’ll wager it was the quick and easy solution to the national herds inefficiencies...originating fromNz.

I’m finished with this discussion.

yosemitesam1 · 15-06-2020 6:55pm

whelan2 wrote: »

Young lad is in Ballyhaise they too are gone jex. They also doing grazing trials which I think are ridiculous. They are being done in groups of 20 cows.

It's possible in those small grazing trials to show that set stocking equals performance of intensive rotational grazing

cosatron · 16-06-2020 11:37am

savage dairy farm for sale on the farming indo website in the kingdom. looks a good set up 145 acres for a cool 1.25m. It will be a nice out farm for the heifers buford

Buford T. Justice XIX · 16-06-2020 12:07pm

Gawddawggonnit wrote: »

Apologies. It can be somewhat confusing with all those grants... https://www.farmersjournal.ie/tams-ii-fertiliser-spreader-details-available-290460

Whatever their original, and continuous, pushing of using Jersey genetics, I’ll wager it was the quick and easy solution to the national herds inefficiencies...originating fromNz.

I’m finished with this discussion.

The fertility inefficiencies weren't from the NZ stock, Dawg. Rather, it was from the Holstein genetics used from countries that didn't have a seasonal calving requirement in their herds and a calf every 18 months or 2 years was acceptable.

The first cross Holstein brought in a lot of extra milk while retaining the majority of the calving efficiency of the friesian but further crosses brought the fertility of the Holstein into more prominence, with the down side of reduced numbers of lactations but the upside of increased milk from those lactations.

I'm wondering how you can find fault with the fertility of the NZ genetics when the vast majority of their herd has to calve within a 6 week window when the genetics you avow would have more like a 6 month calving window?

Buford T. Justice XIX · 16-06-2020 12:15pm

cosatron wrote: »

savage dairy farm for sale on the farming indo website in the kingdom. looks a good set up 145 acres for a cool 1.25m. It will be a nice out farm for the heifers buford

I'd want a lot more heifers to be stocking there:pac:

https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/pictures-model-145ac-dairy-farm-in-the-kingdom-is-ready-to-go-for-a-new-owner-39278569.html

Tbh, it's not bad money for what's there, a turnkey dairy farm, just add stock.

cosatron · 16-06-2020 12:24pm

Buford T. Justice VI wrote: »

I'd want a lot more heifers to be stocking there:pac:

https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/pictures-model-145ac-dairy-farm-in-the-kingdom-is-ready-to-go-for-a-new-owner-39278569.html

Tbh, it's not bad money for what's there, a turnkey dairy farm, just add stock.

nice stack of bales aswell to keep ye entertained :pac:

ted_182 · 16-06-2020 12:32pm

cosatron wrote: »

savage dairy farm for sale on the farming indo website in the kingdom. looks a good set up 145 acres for a cool 1.25m. It will be a nice out farm for the heifers buford

I wonder could we all chip in to buy it and make it the boards.ie research farm, with a board of directors made up of posters in charge of running it of course ðŸ˜…

Neddyusa · 16-06-2020 1:24pm

Buford T. Justice VI wrote: »

The fertility inefficiencies weren't from the NZ stock, Dawg. Rather, it was from the Holstein genetics used from countries that didn't have a seasonal calving requirement in their herds and a calf every 18 months or 2 years was acceptable.

The first cross Holstein brought in a lot of extra milk while retaining the majority of the calving efficiency of the friesian but further crosses brought the fertility of the Holstein into more prominence, with the down side of reduced numbers of lactations but the upside of increased milk from those lactations.

I'm wondering how you can find fault with the fertility of the NZ genetics when the vast majority of their herd has to calve within a 6 week window when the genetics you avow would have more like a 6 month calving window?

I won't speak for Dawg but I think what he meant was that the import of NZ breeding was seen as the "quick-fix" for poor fertility in the Irish herd.

Signpost · 16-06-2020 1:24pm

Anyone getting power from BeEnergy? Just checking Bonkers and Airtricity have there usual limit where they ride you above 3k & 2k units but this other crowd seem very competitive but never heard of them?

mahoney_j · 16-06-2020 1:30pm

Signpost wrote: »

Anyone getting power from BeEnergy? Just checking Bonkers and Airtricity have there usual limit where they ride you above 3k & 2k units but this other crowd seem very competitive but never heard of them?

What price per kw you paying ??.i tried bonkers etc thought I was getting in great till I got contact details of a chap in Galway with his own company that looks after meter usage and switching suppliers etc he’s paid a small yearly fee per meter and the rates I’m paying per kw will leave a fairly substantial saving on what I could find online thru bonkers etc.if u want details I’ll dm u

mahoney_j · 16-06-2020 1:33pm

Neddyusa wrote: »

I won't speak for Dawg but I think what he meant was that the import of NZ breeding was seen as the "quick-fix" for poor fertility in the Irish herd.

Buford mentioned about high 6 week calving rates from New Zealand think we all know how they were achieving that for a long time .....practice no longer allowed I believe now

Mooooo · 16-06-2020 2:12pm

Buford T. Justice VI wrote: »

I'd want a lot more heifers to be stocking there:pac:

https://www.independent.ie/business/farming/pictures-model-145ac-dairy-farm-in-the-kingdom-is-ready-to-go-for-a-new-owner-39278569.html

Tbh, it's not bad money for what's there, a turnkey dairy farm, just add stock.

I wonder does the river bounding it make it that value. Share of it could be under water for a bit depending on weather. Looks a fine place in fairness alright

JoFarmer · 16-06-2020 2:17pm

straight wrote: »

I'm asking Santa for a calf feeder. Leaning towards a jfc evolution. Have any of you any experience of them.

Go for the Holm & Laue CalfExpert, feed 150 calves, all individual !, can handle whole milk as well and even mix powder and whole milk, if one calf needs additive, you can do that. no
vulnerable touchscreen, but smart keys and all full controllable over a app.
You can see the drinking speed, weight grow, visits etc. it send you a massage before the powder is empty.
It can also feed with 2 different powders if you want.
Dairymaster sells them.

Panch18 · 16-06-2020 2:31pm

JoFarmer wrote: »

Go for the Holm & Laue CalfExpert, feed 150 calves, all individual !, can handle whole milk as well and even mix powder and whole milk, if one calf needs additive, you can do that. no
vulnerable touchscreen, but smart keys and all full controllable over a app.
You can see the drinking speed, weight grow, visits etc. it send you a massage before the powder is empty.
It can also feed with 2 different powders if you want.
Dairymaster sells them.

how do they compare in price with the volac feeders for instance? are they reliable?

charolais0153 · 16-06-2020 2:39pm

Mooooo wrote: »

I wonder does the river bounding it make it that value. Share of it could be under water for a bit depending on weather. Looks a fine place in fairness alright

If ya cant go with 125kg/ha of urea in january, is it even worth having?

awaywithyou · 16-06-2020 2:56pm

JoFarmer wrote: »

Go for the Holm & Laue CalfExpert, feed 150 calves, all individual !, can handle whole milk as well and even mix powder and whole milk, if one calf needs additive, you can do that. no
vulnerable touchscreen, but smart keys and all full controllable over a app.
You can see the drinking speed, weight grow, visits etc. it send you a massage before the powder is empty.
It can also feed with 2 different powders if you want.
Dairymaster sells them.

u were doing great til ya came to the last line...:pac:

awaywithyou · 16-06-2020 2:58pm

ted_182 wrote: »

I wonder could we all chip in to buy it and make it the boards.ie research farm, with a board of directors made up of posters in charge of running it of course &#55357;&#56837;

while i know ur taking the mickey.... might b no harm to inform yereselves about that farm and might be no harm for me to say the pictures only tell half the story... literally...

Panch18 · 16-06-2020 3:27pm

awaywithyou wrote: »

while i know ur taking the mickey.... might b no harm to inform yereselves about that farm and might be no harm for me to say the pictures only tell half the story... literally...

from the pictures it looks like the farm has been divided and only part of it for sale?

Buford T. Justice XIX · 16-06-2020 4:01pm

Neddyusa wrote: »

I won't speak for Dawg but I think what he meant was that the import of NZ breeding was seen as the "quick-fix" for poor fertility in the Irish herd.

True, I didn't pick it up that way:)

mahoney_j wrote: »

Buford mentioned about high 6 week calving rates from New Zealand think we all know how they were achieving that for a long time .....practice no longer allowed I believe now

Thankfully it's not but I thought that was used for cows calving after the first 6 weeks of the calving season, though?

ted_182 · 16-06-2020 5:51pm

JoFarmer wrote: »

Go for the Holm & Laue CalfExpert, feed 150 calves, all individual !, can handle whole milk as well and even mix powder and whole milk, if one calf needs additive, you can do that. no
vulnerable touchscreen, but smart keys and all full controllable over a app.
You can see the drinking speed, weight grow, visits etc. it send you a massage before the powder is empty.
It can also feed with 2 different powders if you want.
Dairymaster sells them.

They are a weapon of a piece of kit infairness, the problem is if you need to bring dairymaster out to it they will charge you handsomely for the privilidge, il say no more now tho, incase they wont sponser us with a parlour for the research farm ðŸ˜‚

Birdnuts · 16-06-2020 9:41pm

Dawg would enjoy the piece in todays Farming indo on the Meath man Dairy farming in the Wesht!!;)

giveitholly · 17-06-2020 8:11am

How many kgs are fellas feeding cows that have plenty of grass ahead of them?

alps · 17-06-2020 9:11am

giveitholly wrote: »

How many kgs are fellas feeding cows that have plenty of grass ahead of them?

Depends on pre grazing cover and residuals. We were going into 1400/1600 covers grazing down to 50 and feeding 3kg (to 5 kg for those over 40l) with 17.5 grass intakes.

Still on a 19 day round 1300pgc but cows in the last 3 days only going down to about 250...wont know intakes for a week as I do a weekly back calculation to find this, but I suspect its dropped to 15 or so which means it's time to pull out ration to the bare minimum...1.5kg here..

Henwin · 17-06-2020 6:10pm

Ran out of grass a week ago, feeding 8kg of meal, and 2kg of maize meal, and they are coming in bout 3 to eat hay and silage mixed in d diet feeder. 78 cows dropped 1000 litres in a matter of days and I'm trying to rectify it. My vet suggested that I give them 2kg of soya bean in the diet feeder, this sounds like a lot, wat do ye think, protein is 3.28. And butterfat is 3.8 at the minute.

Timmaay · 17-06-2020 7:50pm

Henwin wrote: »

Ran out of grass a week ago, feeding 8kg of meal, and 2kg of maize meal, and they are coming in bout 3 to eat hay and silage mixed in d diet feeder. 78 cows dropped 1000 litres in a matter of days and I'm trying to rectify it. My vet suggested that I give them 2kg of soya bean in the diet feeder, this sounds like a lot, wat do ye think, protein is 3.28. And butterfat is 3.8 at the minute.

I feel your pain, was like thar for most of July 2018 here. What is the silage quality like? What protein is in the nuts? How quickly have you changed to this diet? Are the cows getting them 8k of nuts all in the parlour or some in the diet feeder? 2kg of soybean is a substantial increase in the dietary protein, perhaps you need it if the current silage and nuts well short on protein, however you'd want to introduce that amount slowly. You definitely need to look at the protein and energy of the overall diet however.

And I don't mean to be harsh here, but moving forward you should aim to cut more pure leafy paddocks, covers of leafy grass that have only just gone too heavy for the milkers, and if you need to feed milkers during a drought or wet weather the cows will milk as good as if they were on grass. If this means sacrificing 1st cut area then who cares, you can buy in drycow silage very easy, but not Milker quality stuff. The other thing I'd suggest is start buffering sooner when the grass growth has slowed and aim to stretch out the grass you have as long as possible, this helps slow the diet transition, alongside keeping the grass covers up, this usually involves pushing out the rotation length as long as you can.

jaymla627 · 17-06-2020 7:54pm

Henwin wrote: »

Ran out of grass a week ago, feeding 8kg of meal, and 2kg of maize meal, and they are coming in bout 3 to eat hay and silage mixed in d diet feeder. 78 cows dropped 1000 litres in a matter of days and I'm trying to rectify it. My vet suggested that I give them 2kg of soya bean in the diet feeder, this sounds like a lot, wat do ye think, protein is 3.28. And butterfat is 3.8 at the minute.

Seen good quality maize bales on DoneDeal in Dublin/Wicklow at 65 a bale plus delivery, it’s dear feed but given the levels of meal your on it would give a great mat to the stomach and keep cows right, hay and middling silage is pure poison to milking cows yieldwise

straight · 17-06-2020 8:17pm

Henwin wrote: »

Ran out of grass a week ago, feeding 8kg of meal, and 2kg of maize meal, and they are coming in bout 3 to eat hay and silage mixed in d diet feeder. 78 cows dropped 1000 litres in a matter of days and I'm trying to rectify it. My vet suggested that I give them 2kg of soya bean in the diet feeder, this sounds like a lot, wat do ye think, protein is 3.28. And butterfat is 3.8 at the minute.

How many litres are they doing now or kgms? I'd say the hay is a disaster anyway.

Buford T. Justice XIX · 17-06-2020 8:41pm

Henwin wrote: »

Ran out of grass a week ago, feeding 8kg of meal, and 2kg of maize meal, and they are coming in bout 3 to eat hay and silage mixed in d diet feeder. 78 cows dropped 1000 litres in a matter of days and I'm trying to rectify it. My vet suggested that I give them 2kg of soya bean in the diet feeder, this sounds like a lot, wat do ye think, protein is 3.28. And butterfat is 3.8 at the minute.

You might give Aidan B a shout at the creamery and get in touch with one of the nutritionists there for a chat about it if you're buying from them. Or call who ever is supplying your ration to discuss it, it's in their best interest to give you good advice on feeding and compare advice to see which suits best?

The lads above have got today and tomorrow covered but I'll focus on the near future.

You say you're out of grass but you're still letting the cows graze something? Roughly how much, 1 or 2 kgs or 5 or 6kgs? If you're out of grass, it's going to take a while to build up a cover of grass again so you may have to feed heavy for over a week and probably 2 before you can cut back on the feeding.

There should be good growth coming after the rain and more forecast for this weekend so your best bet is to look at a 25 day rotation so just give the cows 4% of the grazing area every day, probably in 2 blocks, and balance what grass is there with silage and ration. As the covers ahead of you get better, you can start to reduce the feed to the cows until you're back on track again. And make sure to back fence the grazed ground, you don't want the cows eating the recovery grass.

Get a bag of pasture sward or similar, probably with sulpher, out on every acre you have available for the cows. If you have some silage ground you can walk the cows to then strip graze that by night and give the grass and any silage needed by day and swap it around when grass starts to build up.

And have a look at the link below, the weekly Grass10 newsletter, it might be of some help.

https://pasturebase.teagasc.ie/V2/Grass10%20Weekly.pdf

GrasstoMilk · 17-06-2020 10:05pm

Henwin, dont know what part of the country you are in but give Bil Ryan in agritech a call.
He's very good

Mooooo · 17-06-2020 10:27pm

If you can cut out the hay do as it prob ain't helping. Feed max 6 kg in parlour, 3 in morning and evening, and a 3 way mix then to put thru the feeder with silage, perhaps beet pulp, soya hulls and maize meal? Are they eating much grass at all? As said above a chat to an advisor may help.

mahoney_j · 18-06-2020 7:01am

Henwin wrote: »

Ran out of grass a week ago, feeding 8kg of meal, and 2kg of maize meal, and they are coming in bout 3 to eat hay and silage mixed in d diet feeder. 78 cows dropped 1000 litres in a matter of days and I'm trying to rectify it. My vet suggested that I give them 2kg of soya bean in the diet feeder, this sounds like a lot, wat do ye think, protein is 3.28. And butterfat is 3.8 at the minute.

Get rid of the hay for a start no matter how good it is that’s killing your solids and p .if silage Is good enough shouldn’t have any negative effect in milk or solids lot of meal going in ,risk of acidosis snd are they all eating 8 kg in parlour good independent nutritionist worth a punt or if your any where in the riches feeds catchment paddy Mcarthy def worth a call

richie123 · 18-06-2020 8:07am

Castlekeeper wrote: »

While you have some valid points, I've never heard of a grant for a fertiliser spinner, what have I missed out on?

And all farmland in Ireland has been "made" by deforestation, so it's a bit ironic to suggest that others can't make the "most" of what they have unless one is a shining example of native habitat protection or re-wilding in ones own patch, however "good" the land is.
The " " refer to subjective terms.

Bolsanaro making that exact same point in Brazil as we speak.where do we draw the line.its a hard one to call as most this country was cleared over the past 200 300 years

cosatron · 18-06-2020 8:53am

Henwin wrote: »

Ran out of grass a week ago, feeding 8kg of meal, and 2kg of maize meal, and they are coming in bout 3 to eat hay and silage mixed in d diet feeder. 78 cows dropped 1000 litres in a matter of days and I'm trying to rectify it. My vet suggested that I give them 2kg of soya bean in the diet feeder, this sounds like a lot, wat do ye think, protein is 3.28. And butterfat is 3.8 at the minute.

Whatever about the cows, look after yourself as your in a stressful situation and don’t be one bit shy to sell couple of cows to ease the burden as it will be easy to restock again.

Timmaay · 18-06-2020 9:57am

richie123 wrote: »

Bolsanaro making that exact same point in Brazil as we speak.where do we draw the line.its a hard one to call as most this country was cleared over the past 200 300 years

The only solution there if the world cares enough would be to compensate Brazil for curbing its deforestation (so buy the amazon off them or something ha) , instead we just get the rest of the world bitching that it's terrible etc, and Brazil yous aren't allowed this quick fix to help lift yourselves out of poverty, that's some of the reason they ended up letting a right wing nutjob in power.

richie123 · 18-06-2020 10:33am

Timmaay wrote: »

The only solution there if the world cares enough would be to compensate Brazil for curbing its deforestation (so buy the amazon off them or something ha) , instead we just get the rest of the world bitching that it's terrible etc, and Brazil yous aren't allowed this quick fix to help lift yourselves out of poverty, that's some of the reason they ended up letting a right wing nutjob in power.

Well it's a good one now.are we being hypocritical calling for Brazilian s to stop deforestation when that's exactly what we've being doing for the last 100 year and more.
I know my own father cleared out farm which is great farmland now ...but it's was trees scub etc 50 60 year ago.

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