Saracens vs Munster, Sat 20th April, 3pm

AbusesToilets wrote: »

POM and Beirne aren't that good, and Stander is very one dimensional these days.

lol

Another thing too, Kilcoyne, Archer and Ryan are getting on in age. As is Holland.
There's a window of opportunity still, but these lads will most likely be finished in the next few years.
I reckon Munster can still have a shot at the pro14. But, they would really have to front up like they did v Leinster in December.

Clegg wrote: »

PoM is still a serious operator and Stander is a good, if somewhat limited player. I have serious doubts about Beirne though. I don't think he has the power to play in the second row the way Munster and Ireland want.

Very worringly & not for the first time POM was anonymus on Saturday very poor from such a player also kicked the ball again hangs out on the wing altough he can't run and seems to kick it every time he gets it. I think he needs a summer off as doesn't look right at all.

I don't think people can really give out too much about the number of carries from a variety of players....it's hard to carry the ball when the opposition have it. The game was played in the air around the fringes and Munster lost both battles fairly comprehensively.

I think the nature of the carries and lack of variety/changing the point of attack was an issue but the fact is that Saracens dominated the game becuase they're an excellent side. Half their team were starting for the Lions in the last test series. I don't think there's a more stacked team in Europe.

I do think Munster need a top class openside, inside centre and probably an upgrade at tighthead to be competitive but it's near impossible to find those players for the money available. I think they'll make one big signing....probably in the backs given they've recruited heavily up front already with Cloete, Beirne, Knox, Oliver and Botha all having been brought in over the last couple of years. I'd imagine they'll look to build on those guys.

I know Rory Scannell is a popular player with many Munster supporters but I simply do not see him ever being of the required level to compete at the top end. He's decent in a lot of elements but will not stand out in any single aspect. I see him as a less talented (pre-injury) Luke Marshall. A top quality 12 will assist the back line significantly but it won't make up for the one or two weaker spots up front. If Munster are struggling for physical dominance up front, it's not a playmaking option they need but

Mr Tickle wrote: »

I have to disagree about Scanell. I think he's a great player. although i don't know that Munster are the right team for him. He was a 10 originally but ended up turning into a hard carrying 12. If the game plan was to play a more expansive game I think you'd see more from him.

I think it's the tactics that need to be changed rather than the squad.

In a way the issue is that there's such an expectation for immediate results every year that it's hard to really shake things up. If a few league results go wrong the temptation is to revert to type and grind out a few wins. Very hard to really bed in a new plan without an extended run and keeping the faith.

Rob Penny was pushing towards a more open game and there were signs of it starting to work before he was replaced. 2 semi finals wasn't it? Haven't done much better since.

Tactics are an issue but against Saracens, they weren't THE issue.

Saracens were rushing up in the 10-12 channel all day knowing that Munster didn't have the skill to flick it wide where there was space. Scannell is the weakness in that backline, too much ball dies in the midfield. He only had 9 passes in 80 minutes.

Rugby is not a complicated game, it's a big pitch with 15 players and you can't cover everywhere adequately. Every defense has a carefully selected vulnerability that you need to have the skills to attack. Saracens on the day decided to shift their vulnerability out wide knowing that Munster can't or won't attack there. They stacked the middle and rushed the edge and suffocated them. And then they won collisions and contestables repeatedly.

Saracens are a much better team but Munster should have been closer and would have been with a better second receiver.

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Blyendaal wasn’t good enough in 2017 and he is still not good enough....

And your whole team is in trouble if you do not have a good 10.
I think it would have been a much different game if Carberry was fit.

eagle eye wrote: »

I think it would have been a much different game if Carberry was fit.

Dan Larkham-Wilkinson could have started at outhalf. It wouldn't have made much of a difference if they couldn't get their hands on any decent ball. Munster have also changed their plan such that their outhalf is used very sparingly this season. Murray completely runs the show.

Just talking about Scannell, we had Arnold and Goggin available to play 12, both are strong physical carriers.
I would have selected Goggin over Scannell against Saracens for the game-plan that was used.

If we used Scannell to throw skip passes then he would be worth keeping ahead of the others though.
Scannell has a deceptive burst of speed, but the problem is it's wasted when he is only carrying a few steps into contact.
I wonder would he be better playing in the wider channels?

For the future I would go with 12. Goggin, 13. Farrell,
and backup would be 12. Arnold, 13. Scannell/Shane Daly

Burkie1203 wrote: »

RoG on OTB with Ger Gilroy discussing Zebo as one of the answers to Munsters problems because he brings xfactor

I'd have to say bollocks to that. Zebo has turned to a blubbering mush this season.

AbusesToilets wrote: »

Seems to playing pretty well in fairness, scoring plenty of tries.

Have you actually watched him play? He's great at getting at the end of a try. But he's seriously overweight and really struggles defensively. He's also quite standoffish, even for a winger.

troyzer wrote: »

Have you actually watched him play? He's great at getting at the end of a try. But he's seriously overweight and really struggles defensively. He's also quite standoffish, even for a winger.

I've only seen clips of him, so I'll defer to you. Is he actually overweight, or just bigger?