Limerick-Foynes Rail Line

stevielenihan · 05-09-2011 7:43pm

Judgement Day wrote: »

Don't worry I think you'll find out soon.

What do you mean by that?

Amtmann · 05-09-2011 8:02pm

I'm sorry Stevie, but for the greater good I'm going to restrict your access until next March.

JeffK88 · 16-02-2012 9:32pm

So.. anymore news about this reopening or was it just some rumor ?

pigtown · 16-02-2012 10:19pm

Just a rumour I'd imagine. There's talk of converting it into a busway in the new MWASP (Mid-Western Area Strategic Plan). Appendix C.

http://www.mwasp.ie/documents/consultation/MWASP_DRAFTReport_09012012.pdf

JeffK88 · 17-02-2012 1:05am

Ahh another good idea that might benefit the country down the toilet typical of the past few years

Sponge Bob · 17-02-2012 12:06pm

Busway wheeeeeeee. Not a greenway then.

corktina · 19-02-2012 9:37am

a busway to Foynes? yeah right

pigtown · 20-02-2012 9:14pm

Had another look at that (very long) document and it's more of a suggestion that a busway to Mungret and a greenway to Foynes are possible uses for the line.
I wonder would that busway be a viable alternative to the controversial southern green route in the city?

Jim Martin · 04-03-2012 1:39pm

Was at the concrete works in Limerick Fri & there was a non-stop procession of heavy lorries going in & out - it's a disgrace the railway was allowed to pull out!

corktina · 04-03-2012 4:51pm

On the face of it, but did the railway go where those lorries were heading?

Joko · 04-03-2012 11:16pm

Jim Martin wrote: »

Was at the concrete works in Limerick Fri & there was a non-stop procession of heavy lorries going in & out - it's a disgrace the railway was allowed to pull out!

Modern companies use Just-In-Time stock keeping. There is no place for hoarding of large amounts of stock and as a result railfreight just dosn't cut it.

Jim Martin · 05-03-2012 10:24am

corktina wrote: »

On the face of it, but did the railway go where those lorries were heading?

I wonder, did anyone even bother to find out, indeed, are they watching the current situation for possible openings?

Judgement Day · 05-03-2012 11:18am

Joko wrote: »

Modern companies use Just-In-Time stock keeping. There is no place for hoarding of large amounts of stock and as a result railfreight just dosn't cut it.

What does this mean exactly? How do companies get their stock - teleportation.

pigtown · 05-03-2012 1:49pm

Well I know that building sites that are tight for space have detailed plans on when exactly a load of concrete will be poured and they have it delivered at the time of the day it is needed so they dont have to take up space storing it. With rail you'd have to be ready when the train arrives.

Judgement Day · 05-03-2012 2:49pm

pigtown wrote: »

Well I know that building sites that are tight for space have detailed plans on when exactly a load of concrete will be poured and they have it delivered at the time of the day it is needed so they dont have to take up space storing it. With rail you'd have to be ready when the train arrives.

The cement products delivered by rail were either bagged (on pallets) or bulk which went into silos at rail depots - it wasn't readmix concrete.

Jim Martin · 09-03-2012 1:29pm

Judgement Day wrote: »

The cement products delivered by rail were either bagged (on pallets) or bulk which went into silos at rail depots - it wasn't readmix concrete.

So how come the railway managed to lose such valuable traffic?

L1011 · 09-03-2012 8:38pm

Jim Martin wrote: »

So how come the railway managed to lose such valuable traffic?

The cement factory in Mungret is closed completely. I believe Platin isn't producing as much as it was either.

Judgement Day · 09-03-2012 9:20pm

MYOB wrote: »

The cement factory in Mungret is closed completely. I believe Platin isn't producing as much as it was either.

Irish Cement don't appear to agree with you.

http://www.irishcement.ie/operations/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYGOE9QhQp4

L1011 · 09-03-2012 10:08pm

Judgement Day wrote: »

Irish Cement don't appear to agree with you.

http://www.irishcement.ie/operations/

I've driven past Mungret in the past weeks. Its most certainly closed.

Either that, or they have trucks that can drive over large boulders....

It may be a case that only part of the site is operational, however the entire N69 frontage is not. Demand for cement in Ireland has, understandably, collapsed.

Sponge Bob · 09-03-2012 10:48pm

What about the main entrance off the Roundabout MYOB??

Tragedy · 10-03-2012 2:18pm

You mean this entrance that was already closed several years ago when Google Streetview was being taken?

Or this entrance that was open last time I was down(late February)?

L1011 · 11-03-2012 3:22pm

More than one entrance was closed.

All I can find by searching is references to various different layoffs over recent years so it would appear they've seriously scaled down production if its not closed.

The traffic that was coming out of there by rail isn't coming out there on anything, anyway.

Itsdacraic · 14-03-2012 12:04am

MYOB wrote: »

I've driven past Mungret in the past weeks. Its most certainly closed.

Either that, or they have trucks that can drive over large boulders....

It may be a case that only part of the site is operational, however the entire N69 frontage is not. Demand for cement in Ireland has, understandably, collapsed.

Trucks haven't come directly onto the N69 from the factory in years.

Poxyshamrock · 05-04-2012 3:48pm

Just passed Childers Road there and the Foynes line and Cement Factory like have been covered over with tar mac.

flyingsnail · 05-04-2012 8:20pm

For anybody who might be interested, both the Foynes line and the branch to Castlemungret have now been disconnected by the removal of the level crossing at Rathbane on Childers road.

Poxyshamrock wrote: »

Just passed Childers Road there and the Foynes line and Cement Factory like have been covered over with tar mac.

As far as I know the Foynes line is also disconnected from the network at Limerick Station and some panels have been lifted further out the line.

Judgement Day · 05-04-2012 8:24pm

Wonderful news. :rolleyes:

Poxyshamrock · 12-04-2012 3:46pm

Does anyone know (roughly) the last time the Castlemungret section of the line was used?

flyingsnail · 12-04-2012 3:54pm

Poxyshamrock wrote: »

Does anyone know (roughly) the last time the Castlemungret section of the line was used?

For cement it think it was around may 09, for shale maybe September/October 09. There was a empty stock transfer on 24/06/2010.

Poxyshamrock · 12-04-2012 6:17pm

Cheers Flyingsnail!

Hungerford · 12-04-2012 7:07pm

flyingsnail wrote: »

For cement it think it was around may 09, for shale maybe September/October 09. There was a empty stock transfer on 24/06/2010.

My Goodness. Tricky Dicky's timescales are shortening as rail liberalisation appears on the horizon.

pigtown · 12-08-2012 6:54pm

Line may be reopened for freight traffic in the not too distant future.
http://www.limerickleader.ie/news/business/irish-rail-ceo-indicates-that-foynes-rail-link-could-be-re-opened-1-4148299

Judgement Day · 12-08-2012 7:16pm

I think that you're being overly optimistic as this is the critical piece in the article 'could be re-opened if there was sufficient traffic to create a good business case to do so' - the classic get-out clause. Love to see it and a perhaps a heritage operation to Foynes but it won't happen.

Tinytony · 12-08-2012 7:51pm

Judgement Day wrote: »

I think that you're being overly optimistic as this is the critical piece in the article 'could be re-opened if there was sufficient traffic to create a good business case to do so' - the classic get-out clause. Love to see it and a perhaps a heritage operation to Foynes but it won't happen.

You'd imagine there might be some small potential for a heritage/history tourist thing on the line. Especially if Foynes started to attract more cruise liners, and with the track providing a link to Adare it might prove popular?

Only last month IE tried to remove the gates from the station at Askeaton and replace them with a fence so they mustn't have any serious notions of reopening it.

pigtown · 12-08-2012 8:12pm

Judgement Day wrote: »

I think that you're being overly optimistic as this is the critical piece in the article 'could be re-opened if there was sufficient traffic to create a good business case to do so' - the classic get-out clause. Love to see it and a perhaps a heritage operation to Foynes but it won't happen.

This was the bit I was focusing on;

“active discussions with Foynes port management are ongoing, as it is currently believed there will be traffic to justify re-opening the route in the foreseeable future”.

Sponge Bob · 13-08-2012 2:00am

Zinc mines are being explored all over Limerick. It will take 3-5 years minimum to commission any of them though.

Itsdacraic · 22-02-2013 3:02pm

Shannon Foynes Port Company has launched a 30-year plan to develop port facilities along the Shannon estuary.
The estuary is the deepest waterway in Ireland and one of the deepest in Europe.
Its natural deepwater gives it a distinct advantange over other ports in Ireland, as it can handle the huge container ships being developed with the expansion of the Panama Canal.
The port company facilitates €6 billion worth of international trade at its ports in a year, and over a third of the country's bulk container traffic now transits the estuary.
It handles 10 million tonnes of cargo and is growing at around 8% a year.
The plan charts the development of Foynes port and Limerick docks over the next 30 years.
The development will allow the company to take complete commercial advantage of the estuary's natural deepwater.
Minister for Transport Leo Varadkar today launched the plan, which is known as Vision 2041.
He said Shannon Foynes is an important asset for the southwest of Ireland and he welcomed the company's goal to attract significant international investment.
A new deep water berth will be built at Foynes and over 300 acres of extra land will be developed to build new warehousing and facilities.
In addition the Foynes-Limerick railway line could be reopened to facilitate new trade and the road infrastructure, in particular the N69, would need to be radically improved.
Future business at the estuary is also being governed by events at the Panama Canal, which is being expanded and will be accommodating supersize container vessels of 80,000 tonnes by 2015.
The natural deep waters of the estuary will be a distinct advantage in what is known as the post-pamamax era.
As a result the Shannon Foynes Port Company is to begin talks with IDA Ireland to attract more foreign direct investment and bring more employment to the entire Shannon estuary region.
Shannon Foynes Port Company Chairman Michael Collins said that while ambitious and challenging, the projected growth in the plan is more than achievable.
"With the unrivalled opportunity we have due to our deepwater and emergence of larger vessels, we have a unique opportunity here that we need to take advantage of. For these reasons, the estuary is one of the jewels in the nation's crown from an investment potential perspective," Mr Collins said.

Judgement Day · 22-02-2013 6:15pm

What's new in this? The same old guff has been spouted for years with no sign of any reopening. The Foynes line is more likely to become a Greenway than reopen.

corktina · 23-02-2013 3:12pm

i just can't see where all this container traffic could be going to/coming from.

Also 10 million tonnes of cargo? really?

flazio · 23-02-2013 10:24pm

corktina wrote: »

i just can't see where all this container traffic could be going to/coming from.

Also 10 million tonnes of cargo? really?

It won't all be for Ireland apparently. Foynes according to the report is a really deep dock capable of ships that other countries further into Europe can't take so I reckon the idea would be to dock in Foynes, transport the cargo by road and rail to Rosslare and Dublin and let smaller ships continue on onto the continent.

corktina · 24-02-2013 12:56pm

flazio wrote: »

It won't all be for Ireland apparently. Foynes according to the report is a really deep dock capable of ships that other countries further into Europe can't take so I reckon the idea would be to dock in Foynes, transport the cargo by road and rail to Rosslare and Dublin and let smaller ships continue on onto the continent.

Yep, I knew someone would say that. :rolleyes:

If thats what the Foynes people are thinking will happen, then this project is doomed to fail. The Economics of that are clearly MAD.

rainbowdash · 24-02-2013 2:26pm

flazio wrote: »

It won't all be for Ireland apparently. Foynes according to the report is a really deep dock capable of ships that other countries further into Europe can't take so I reckon the idea would be to dock in Foynes, transport the cargo by road and rail to Rosslare and Dublin and let smaller ships continue on onto the continent.

The biggest constraints are the panama and suez canals, anything that can fit through these can fit into Rotterdam, Le Harve, Felixstowe, Southampton, Hamburg etc. already.

Ship from China to Foynes, train to Rosslare, ship to France, train up to Rotterdam or Germany = Stupidest idea ever.

Stonewolf · 24-02-2013 2:31pm

You'd have to be able to run trains directly onto the continent through the UK, which is a great idea but firstly, there's a bit missing and secondly, our trains are the wrong size.

corktina · 24-02-2013 4:07pm

yep, they can forget continental traffic, IF a deep water port was needed on the west Coast of Europe, Milford Haven could take whatever they could throw at it AND is rail linked. They've never done that so I imagine that's because it's a non-starter.

cgcsb · 25-02-2013 12:09am

corktina wrote: »

Yep, I knew someone would say that. :rolleyes:

If thats what the Foynes people are thinking will happen, then this project is doomed to fail. The Economics of that are clearly MAD.

Out of curiosity how's that?

flyingsnail · 25-02-2013 9:57am

They only thing that may work would be if those larger vessels were to use Foynes to drop off their Ireland bound cargo en-route to Europe.

corktina · 25-02-2013 10:03am

flyingsnail wrote: »

They only thing that may work would be if those larger vessels were to use Foynes to drop off their Ireland bound cargo en-route to Europe.

but would that amount justify the massive investment outlined? And would the massive ships that improvements to the Panama Canal implies really divert to a port half way up the west of Ireland to drop off just a few containers?

corktina · 25-02-2013 10:09am

cgcsb wrote: »

Out of curiosity how's that?

Can you really not see why such plans are MAD?

OK short version....invest billions in expanding Foynes Port....invest millions improving rail and road to Rosslare and Dublin....pay to unload ship...pay to load train/truck/....haul to east coast port.....pay to unload train/truck....load on to ship.....sail to Wales...unload and load on to train or truck....haul to destination in UK/Europe....all extra costs over just sailing the first ship to the UK or European ports in the first place. QED

flyingsnail · 25-02-2013 10:16am

corktina wrote: »

but would that amount justify the massive investment outlined? And would the massive ships that improvements to the Panama Canal implies really divert to a port half way up the west of Ireland to drop off just a few containers?

That is why I said it may work. It would entirely depend on what level of traffic they could produce.

ardmacha · 25-02-2013 12:49pm

It won't all be for Ireland apparently. Foynes according to the report is a really deep dock capable of ships that other countries further into Europe can't take so I reckon the idea would be to dock in Foynes, transport the cargo by road and rail to Rosslare and Dublin and let smaller ships continue on onto the continent.

I think people have the wrong end of the stick here. Goods bound for Ireland or perhaps UK will unload at Foynes. Goods bound for other European locations would probably be transshipped (literally) on to smaller vessels. So smaller vessels might go to Mediterranean destinations or Baltic destinations, say Italy or Sweden. This might well be as economic as unloading at Rotterdam and sending by land over the Alps.
This kind of thing happens at Singapore, which is an island.

corktina · 25-02-2013 1:03pm

ardmacha wrote: »

I think people have the wrong end of the stick here. Goods bound for Ireland or perhaps UK will unload at Foynes. Goods bound for other European locations would probably be transshipped (literally) on to smaller vessels. So smaller vessels might go to Mediterranean destinations or Baltic destinations, say Italy or Sweden. This might well be as economic as unloading at Rotterdam and sending by land over the Alps.
This kind of thing happens at Singapore, which is an island.

why would you need the rail line then? or the upgraded road?

Limerick-Foynes Rail Line

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