Burning the Poppy - A thread.

Alf Veedersane · 10-11-2019 9:24am

Good article here on it here re the abuse James McClean and how it's becoming something it wasn't supposed to be

Shefwedfan · 10-11-2019 9:31am

Everyone says it’s for WW 1 & 2 but also covers the Boar wars where the lovely army created concentration camps which is where Hitler got the idea, they forget that bit of history

I with James McClean on this one

Fr Tod Umptious · 10-11-2019 9:45am

I was watching Strictly Come Dancing last night (stick with me on this)

In one segment of the show a contestant and his professional dancer were out on a race track driving a high performance car (all part of the stuff they put in the show as part of the background to what the pair did in preparation etc)
At the track a race car driver presented the contestant with a trophy for some race the contestant had won.
The race car driver in full racing gear was wearing a poppy.
For the 5 seconds he was as on it was made abundantly clear that he was wearing a poppy, you could not miss it, it looked so out of place on his motor racing outfit.

So someone in the BBC had to make sure that this person for this fleeting moment on TV had to be wearing a poppy, even though it looked daft, or else there would be a backlash from somewhere.

It's gone nuts.

However, it was refreshing to see Niall Horan not wearing one on Friday night on Norton's show.
I don't know or care about Horans politics but I'm guessing he was requested to wear one and declined.

Alf Veedersane · 10-11-2019 9:47am

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

I was watching Strictly Come Dancing last night (stick with me on this)

In one segment of the show a contestant and his professional dancer were out on a race track driving a high performance car (all part of the stuff they put in the show as part of the background to what the pair did in preparation etc)
At the track a race car driver presented the contestant with a trophy for some race the contestant had won.
The race car driver in full racing gear was wearing a poopy.
For the 5 seconds he was as on it was made abundantly clear that he was wearing a poopy, you could not miss it, it looked so out of place on his motor racing outfit.

So someone in the BBC had to make sure that this person for this fleeting moment on TV had to be wearing a poopy, even though it looked daft, or else there would be a backlash from somewhere.

It's gone nuts.

However, it was refreshing to see Niall Horan not wearing one on Friday night on Norton's show.
I don't know or care about Horans politics but I'm guessing he was requested to wear one and declined.

What have nappies got to do with anything?

Gynoid · 10-11-2019 9:50am

What is outrageous is this - in order to see a 16 second video at that link of a girleen being a little bit silly, (lads thats pretty tame for being mad), I had to sit first through a 30 second advertisement, which had stunningly beautiful imagery, inviting me to consider being a tourist in Saudi Arabia. The same Saudi Arabia, funder of Wahhabist extremism in Europe, that is shunting missiles bought from US and European armaments suppliers, companies with respectable Tax numbers and govt subsidies, over their border to the jihadists in Yemen so they can rain down slaughter on famine stricken civilians. I swear to God, people, irony is completely lost in this mad world.

Gynoid · 10-11-2019 9:52am

Haha

poopy

Achasanai · 10-11-2019 9:53am

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

In our case i have noticed its more a case of freedom to be a dick.

Makes no sense. It doesn't matter whether it's an English person or an Irish person who burns a poppy. Freedom of speech doesn't apply to just the citizens of a country (or at least it shouldn't).

El_Duderino 09 · 10-11-2019 9:55am

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

I was watching Strictly Come Dancing last night (stick with me on this)
.

Yeah the BBC makes sure nobody forgets to wear one. It makes sense given the climate where some people will go bananas if they're not wearing one. As long as nobody has to wear one, I'm fine with it.

I know you say Kelvin was on screen for 5 seconds in that scene but it probably took half a day to film so it make sense to just have the poppy on at all times. So any 5second snippet that is aired, everyone will have a poppy on. But it's not as if they put on a poppy, film for 5 seconds and take it off again.

Poppy is just part of every costume

Fr Tod Umptious · 10-11-2019 9:59am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Yeah the BBC makes sure nobody forgets to wear one. It makes sense given the climate where some people will go bananas if they're not wearing one. As long as nobody has to wear one, I'm fine with it.

I know you say Kelvin was on screen for 5 seconds in that scene but it probably took half a day to film so it make sense to just have the poppy on at all times. So any 5second snippet that is aired, everyone will have a poppy on. But it's not as if they put on a poppy, film for 5 seconds and take it off again.

Poppy is just part of every costume

But it wasn't Kelvin I was referring, it was the guy who drove up, with the racing helmet on, in full racing gear, to give him the trophy that was wearing it.

I'd expect Kelvin, the contestant, to have one visible all the, he is lots of air time.
But the other guy was just on for 5 seconds.

Shefwedfan · 10-11-2019 10:02am

Didn’t the girl from Northern Ireland wear a NI school on Eastenders and some clowns went nuts over it as they thought it was GAA and they supported the IRA or something stupid like that?

Then they have no problem sticking every person on with a poppy which supports concentration camps

Fr Tod Umptious · 10-11-2019 10:02am

Alf Veedersane wrote: »

What have nappies got to do with anything?

Fixed, thanks.

_Brian · 10-11-2019 10:02am

I dislike the whole poppy thing because it’s used by scummy people to celebrate the brutality of British forces over ordinary folk in places like NI.

However, I see it’s important to some people and wouldn’t condone burning it either.

Shefwedfan · 10-11-2019 10:03am

_Brian wrote: »

I dislike the whole poppy thing because it’s used by scummy people to celebrate the brutality of British forces over ordinary folk in places like NI.

However, I see it’s important to some people and wouldn’t condone burning it either.

No need to burn but no need to shove down everyone throats

10000maniacs · 10-11-2019 10:12am

Edgware wrote: »

The bottom line is that without the sacrifice of thousands of young British, American and Russian soldiers we would be living under Nazi rule.

Even if they won WW2, the Nazis wouldn't have been able to sustain it more than a few years. The German nation can only stretch so far. Worldwide Guerrilla warfare would have put a stop to the Nazis.

gimli2112 · 10-11-2019 10:19am

Damien360 wrote: »

Wearing the poppy in the UK is approaching cult status. Woe betide anyone that fails to follow the cult and show their allegiance.

I thought it was changed to James McClean day

El_Duderino 09 · 10-11-2019 10:22am

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

But it wasn't Kelvin I was referring, it was the guy who drove up, with the racing helmet on, in full racing gear, to give him the trophy that was wearing it.

I'd expect Kelvin, the contestant, to have one visible all the, he is lots of air time.
But the other guy was just on for 5 seconds.

Oh yeah the teammate. Like I said, poppy is part of every costume this weekend. It's not surprising. Makes sense to just make sure nobody can forget their poppy. As long as nobody is forced to wear it, what's the issue?

Fr Tod Umptious · 10-11-2019 10:27am

El_Duderino 09 wrote: »

Oh yeah the teammate. Like I said, poppy is part of every costume this weekend. It's not surprising. Makes sense to just make sure nobody can forget their poppy. As long as nobody is forced to wear it, what's the issue?

I suppose.
The wardrobe people will know how many individual consumes they need, whether that be a tuxedo or racing gear, and they then make sure they have a poppy for each one, whether that poppy ends up being worn or not.

Edgware · 10-11-2019 10:34am

10000maniacs wrote: »

Even if they won WW2, the Nazis wouldn't have been able to sustain it more than a few years. The German nation can only stretch so far. Worldwide Guerrilla warfare would have put a stop to the Nazis.

Thats ok so. But then our own brave I.R.A. lads under Sean Russell were prepared to collaborate with the Nazis so we would be safe.

storker · 10-11-2019 10:35am

NIMAN wrote: »

DM stuck for stories to be outraged about?

Don't be silly...the Daily Mail is never stuck for something to be outraged about.

Alf Veedersane · 10-11-2019 10:37am

This sums up the madness of quite a few:

Galwayguy35 · 10-11-2019 10:48am

Only thing that bothers me is when I see Irish politicans like Neil Richmond wearing it, it's a British tradition so let him fook off over there and put it on if he wants to.

As for the subject of the thread she sound like a posh little rich kid who was looking for her few minutes of fame, sounds like it backfired on her though.

JohnnyFlash · 10-11-2019 10:52am

Peak poppy.

https://twitter.com/ofalafel/status/1193156433988206593?s=21

Alf Veedersane · 10-11-2019 10:56am

David Squires predicted something similar in 2015. I don't know if anyone imagined something that level would come to pass...

https://www.theguardian.com/football/picture/2015/nov/10/david-squires-on-football-and-remembrance-day#img-1

Cazale · 10-11-2019 10:58am

Edgware wrote:

The bottom line is that without the sacrifice of thousands of young British, American and Russian soldiers we would be living under Nazi rule.

Without the sacrifice of thousands of young British soldiers we would be living in a 32 county Republic speaking our own language with a much larger population not decimated by the great hunger.

The White Wolf · 10-11-2019 11:08am

Edgware wrote: »

The bottom line is that without the sacrifice of thousands of young British, American and Russian soldiers we would be living under Nazi rule.

And Irish.

The J Stands for Jay · 10-11-2019 11:12am

Unknown Soldier wrote: »

Came across this on Twitter.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7664271/Outrage-video-young-woman-burning-poppy-emerges-ahead-Remembrance-Sunday.html

I've found it fascinating, for a number of reasons.

I think she shouldn't have.

You?

#sexchat

That link gave me cancer.

Shefwedfan · 10-11-2019 11:20am

Edgware wrote: »

The bottom line is that without the sacrifice of thousands of young British, American and Russian soldiers we would be living under Nazi rule.

Irish, NZ, Australian, Chinese, Polish, Canadian etc etc

Really this statement shows you haven’t a clue about the World War.....

10-11-2019 11:29am

To me the poppy represents those who died for our freedom, no matter what army or what war. That freedom allowed this uainseach do what she did. I hope that she’s proud of what she’ll be remembered for.

Shefwedfan · 10-11-2019 11:39am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

To me the poppy represents those who died for our freedom, no matter what army or what war. That freedom allowed this uainseach do what she did. I hope that she’s proud of what she’ll be remembered for.

It also stand for the British Empire which decided who and when they wanted to invade countries and kill people.....for no reason apart from greed

Most recent been Iraq when they made up stories with the US to get the war approved which has since been proved as illegal, this was nothing to do with freedom, it was to get their hands on oil

10-11-2019 11:41am

Edgware wrote: »

Thats ok so. But then our own brave I.R.A. lads under Sean Russell were prepared to collaborate with the Nazis so we would be safe.

Give over with this spectacularly historically illiterate comedy session. Your heroic British state was collaborating with Nazi Germany for a full 6 years before it decided, in September 1939, to finally grow a pair of balls and stand up to it. Of course, to the British in the 1930s the greater evil was communism so supporting Nazi Germany was good because it was a bulwark against the spread of communism. You don't hear them justifying it like that now, however.

This collaboration, by the way, survived the establishment of the first Nazi concentration camps (in March 1933) - inspired by the British concentrations camps during the Second Boer War (1899-1902) - and the Nuremberg Laws against Jews. In the same year as the latter, 1935, the British decided to stab the French in the back and smash the Stresa Front against Nazi Germany by signing the Anglo-German Naval Agreement so that Britain could profit from Nazi rearmament. Then the British selling out the Austrians, Czechs and all the rest. Not to mention its refusal at the Evian Conference (1938) to take more Jewish refugees...

And you think you can deflect from this staggering British state collaboration with Nazi Germany by pointing at the ineffably insignificant actions of Russell? The Union Jack blinkers are heavy there.

10-11-2019 11:43am

Edgware wrote: »

The bottom line is that without the sacrifice of thousands of young British, American and Russian soldiers we would be living under Nazi rule.

So, if it's just out of respect for their resistance to Nazism why don't you wear a Russian symbol of commemoration given that the British contribution to defeating Nazism was small - total British Empire deaths were about one-fiftieth, c. 450,000, of the USSR deaths of 25 million people, for instance - compared to the USSR contribution? Hmmm.

Indeed, as some 800,000 Greeks died in WWII you could also wear whatever they wear with more justification than you could use the British poppy (a British imperialist symbol which, lest we forget, explicitly commemorates everybody who fought for the British Empire, including in the centuries-long subjugation of the Irish people).

s7ryf3925pivug · 10-11-2019 11:44am

Her trolling worked a little too well.

10-11-2019 11:44am

Deleted User wrote: »

To me the poppy represents those who died for our freedom, no matter what army or what war. That freedom allowed this uainseach do what she did. I hope that she’s proud of what she’ll be remembered for.

Such ignorant rubbish. The poppy is a unique British symbol designed to commemorate only those who died for the British Empire in all wars by that Empire, including the subjugation of the Irish for centuries. No other state outside of their Empire/Commonwealth wear it. Why can't you even get the basic facts correct?

10-11-2019 11:44am

Cazale wrote: »

Without the sacrifice of thousands of young British soldiers we would be living in a 32 county Republic speaking our own language with a much larger population not decimated by the great hunger.

Touché. Game, set and match with that truth.

Dyr · 10-11-2019 11:46am

Edgware wrote: »

The bottom line is that without the sacrifice of thousands of young British, American and Russian soldiers we would be living under Nazi rule.

Agus bheimís go leir ag labhairt Gearmáinis mar dhea? :rolleyes:

JohnnyFlash · 10-11-2019 11:49am

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Give over with this spectacularly historically illiterate comedy session. Your heroic British state was collaborating with Nazi Germany for a full 6 years before it decided, in September 1939, to finally grow a pair of balls and stand up to it. Of course, to the British in the 1930s the greater evil was communism so supporting Nazi Germany was good because it was a bulwark against the spread of communism. You don't hear them justifying it like that now, however.

This collaboration, by the way, survived the establishment of the first Nazi concentration camps (in March 1933) - inspired by the British concentrations camps during the Second Boer War (1899-1902) - and the Nuremberg Laws against Jews. In the same year as the latter, 1935, the British decided to stab the French in the back and smash the Stresa Front against Nazi Germany by signing the Anglo-German Naval Agreement so that Britain could profit from Nazi rearmament. Then the British selling out the Austrians, Czechs and all the rest. Not to mention its refusal at the Evian Conference (1938) to take more Jewish refugees...

And you think you can deflect from this staggering British state collaboration with Nazi Germany by pointing at the ineffably insignificant actions of Russell? The Union Jack blinkers are heavy there.

Jesus, calm down, dude. It’s only a thread on a silly website. You’ll give yourself a hernia or irritable bowel syndrome or something.

I hope history isn’t a hobby of yours. You are so ideologically blinkered and bigoted that any attempts at analysis or nuance would be a complete folly.

10-11-2019 11:50am

Deleted User wrote: »

Such ignorant rubbish. The poppy is a unique British symbol designed to commemorate only those who died for the British Empire in all wars by that Empire, including the subjugation of the Irish for centuries. No other state outside of their Empire/Commonwealth wear it. Why can't you even get the basic facts correct?

But, it originated in France!

10-11-2019 11:53am

Deleted User wrote: »

But, it originated in France!

Here we go again with the ignorance. The French remembrance symbol:

Bleuet_de_France

15437223d625f75996857482d726170020660548_field_mise_en_avant_principale_1.jpg

15437223d625f75996857482d726170020660548_field_mise_en_avant_principale_1.jpg

Dyr · 10-11-2019 11:53am

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Jesus, calm down, dude. It’s only a thread on a silly website. You’ll give yourself a hernia or irritable bowel syndrome or something.

I hope history isn’t a hobby of yours. You are so ideologically blinkered and bigoted that any attempts at analysis or nuance would be a complete folly.

lack of nuance aka "You're facts are too facty"

Say my name · 10-11-2019 11:54am

In 2159 will people still be wearing the poppy?

I get the remembrance thing and even learning a new generation that we should never let history repeat itself.

But there comes a time when it's healthier for people just to move on. There's no disrespect intended but even the survivors of war kept as much as possible away from their family so that they could grow up without knowing and not be tainted by the true horrors of war and man's inhumanity to man.

Adamcp898 · 10-11-2019 12:00pm

The cognitive dissonance displayed in this thread every year never ceases to entertain.

Cazale · 10-11-2019 12:02pm

Say my name wrote:

In 2159 will people still be wearing the poppy?

The British will always be involved in wars so they will always have veterans to remember.

dom40 · 10-11-2019 12:03pm

Sir Osis of Liver. wrote: »

Saw Louis Walsh wearing a poppy on tv earlier.

After the old knighthood eh Louis?

Louis has been wearing the poppy for years,did he and Westlife not launch the poppy appeal years ago?I see a lot of irish people with them on the telly,O Driscoll,Paul o Connell,wearing them during the rugby,Eamonn Homes,Norton,im sure i missed plenty more,feel free to add anymore.the thing that gets me is that do they have a choice or is it more forced upon them?

corner of hells · 10-11-2019 12:06pm

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Jesus, calm down, dude. It’s only a thread on a silly website. You’ll give yourself a hernia or irritable bowel syndrome or something.

I hope history isn’t a hobby of yours. You are so ideologically blinkered and bigoted that any attempts at analysis or nuance would be a complete folly.

He'll eventually have a fit or convulsion after working himself up into an apocalyptic rage , then recover in about an hour or two.

Your right it's a thread on a website, same ol' stuff each year.

lawred2 · 10-11-2019 12:11pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

Everyone says it’s for WW 1 & 2 but also covers the Boar wars where the lovely army created concentration camps which is where Hitler got the idea, they forget that bit of history

I with James McClean on this one

The Boar wars bother you?

What about British troops shooting unarmed British citizens in the back on British soil?

Shefwedfan · 10-11-2019 12:12pm

lawred2 wrote: »

The Boar wars bother you?

What about British troops shooting unarmed British citizens in the back on British soil?

I reference the boar war just because everyone loves to point to WW2 and concentration camps

Never realising it was the British who came up with them

10-11-2019 12:12pm

Deleted User wrote: »

Here we go again with the ignorance. The French remembrance symbol:

Bleuet_de_France

Here we go. A little history lesson.

“Artificial poppies were first sold in Britain in 1921 to raise money for the Earl Haig Fund in support of ex-servicemen and the families of those who had died in the conflict. They were supplied by Anna Guérin, who had been manufacturing the flowers in France to raise money for war orphans. Selling poppies proved so popular that in 1922 the British Legion founded a factory - staffed by disabled ex-servicemen - to produce its own. It continues to do so today.“ http://www.iwm.org.uk/history/why-we-wear-poppies-on-remembrance-day

“ The remembrance poppy is an artificial flower that has been used since 1921 to commemorate military personnel who have died during war. It represents a common or field poppy, Papaver rhoeas. The creation of the remembrance poppy was inspired by the poem "In Flanders Fields" written during World War 1, and promoted by Moina Michael and the “Originator of the Poppy Day”, Madame Guérin.[1] Prior to this, Madame Guérin had been raising funds for French and American war charities throughout World War I for widows, orphans, veterans, the Red Cross, charity organization Food for France, U.S. Liberty bonds and other causes.

After the Armistice that ended World War I, the French government formed the charity "La Ligue des Enfants de France et d’Amérique", with the poppy as its emblem. Madame Guérin created the American branch, called the "American and French Children’s League". Many organisations adopted the poppy as their memorial flower, after World War I ended. In 1919, Madame Guérin began holding Poppy Days, under the auspices of her charity.

Today, they are mostly used in the United Kingdom, Canada, Australia, the United States[citation needed] and New Zealand, to commemorate servicemen and women killed in all conflicts. Small remembrance poppies are often worn on clothing leading up to Remembrance Day/Armistice Day,[2] and poppy wreaths are often laid at war memorials. In Australia and New Zealand, they are also worn on Anzac Day.

The Royal British Legion's Poppy Appeal has caused some controversy, with some—including British Army veterans—arguing that the symbol is used excessively, is used to marshal support behind British military campaigns and that public figures are pressured to wear poppies.[3]”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Remembrance_poppy

Huntergonzo · 10-11-2019 12:17pm

Not really into the wearing of symbols, particularly political symbols. So I don't agree with the wearing of the poppy or easter lily etc

Nobody should be pressured into going along with this sort of stuff, leave the symbols to the symbol minded.

corner of hells · 10-11-2019 12:18pm

Shefwedfan wrote: »

I reference the boar war just because everyone loves to point to WW2 and concentration camps

Never realising it was the British who came up with them

You should probably read up a little more on them , Spanish forces used them in Cuba prior to the Boer wars , before that Native Americans were regularly moved from their lands to reservations , no one likes the talk of that however.

FrancieBrady · 10-11-2019 12:19pm

Say my name wrote: »

In 2159 will people still be wearing the poppy?

I get the remembrance thing and even learning a new generation that we should never let history repeat itself.

But there comes a time when it's healthier for people just to move on. There's no disrespect intended but even the survivors of war kept as much as possible away from their family so that they could grow up without knowing and not be tainted by the true horrors of war and man's inhumanity to man.

If the UK Brexits they won't be able to sustain the spend on their military. More so if the UK actually breaks up.
As the resurgence of the Poppy and any over the top celebrating of military achievements anywhere is essentially promoted to justify the huge spend (always follow the money) then you will see the wearing of it, fall away.
This debate didn't happen when I was growing up in the 70's and 80's and only some wore on TV, and nbody bothered in football. It ramped up significantly after Maggie's debacle in the South Seas, it will probably reach kitsch peak as the UK bravely exits the EU and self destructs.

P.S. My ambition in life is to get on one of these threads before Mattser arrives with his edgy/cutsey (never sure which it is) attempt at censorship.

Burning the Poppy - A thread.

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