Why do Irish people support English teams?

dundalkfc10 · 12-06-2019 7:34pm

Ultimate Seduction wrote: »

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Not moaning.

You say you couldnt give a **** etc about the LOI getting better, so technicaly you couldnt give a **** about our national team as the LOI is the starting point for a good % of them, and it will be more and more reliant on it considering English clubs are taking young Irish lads less and less each year

You've the wrong person here. Never said anything like that. I said I'd love to see teams from the league do well in Europe.

Yeh but you won't support it thus meaning you deep down couldn't care how the National team will fare out in a few years

Ultimate Seduction · 12-06-2019 7:45pm

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Yeh but you won't support it thus meaning you deep down couldn't care how the National team will fare out in a few years

That's some jump

mikeym · 12-06-2019 7:53pm

I support St Patricks athletic and Celtic cause of the queen

:D:D:D:D

Put the good players on the bench

8-10 · 12-06-2019 8:22pm

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Not moaning.

You say you couldnt give a **** etc about the LOI getting better, so technicaly you couldnt give a **** about our national team as the LOI is the starting point for a good % of them, and it will be more and more reliant on it considering English clubs are taking young Irish lads less and less each year

That was me who said he didn't care as much about it getting better as I do about the league that my team is in.

Maybe I don't see us strong a link between the LOI and the national team as you do. Sure a % of them play there but lots only play LOI as a stepping stone to the English leagues. To be honest id prefer to be less reliant on England for developing our players. English youngsters themselves are leaving for the Dutch, German, Scottish and Belgian leagues amongst others for a better chance. I'd like to see our young players look further afield too for more opportunities.

If LOI is going to get better and be a better option for them then that's great too but for me the important thing is getting them into a good set up and get good minutes at a decent level so whether that's here or abroad I don't think it matters. Look at other countries and you'll see they're increasingly getting young players into clubs in the countries of the top 5 European leagues because that's where the best coaching is and that's where the international teams pick their players from.

We're off on a tangent though. This thread is about the English league and why many of us Irish support it. And Irish players in the league is one of the many reasons people have.

Omackeral · 12-06-2019 8:27pm

OMM 0000 wrote: »

"Why do Irish people watch American movies?"

Perfectly fine angle if you think of watching movies and watching football on telly as one and the same. Plenty do. To me and millions worldwide, football isn't just something on telly though.

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 8:28pm

8-10 wrote: »

That was me who said he didn't care as much about it getting better as I do about the league that my team is in.

Maybe I don't see us strong a link between the LOI and the national team as you do. Sure a % of them play there but lots only play LOI as a stepping stone to the English leagues. To be honest id prefer to be less reliant on England for developing our players. English youngsters themselves are leaving for the Dutch, German, Scottish and Belgian leagues amongst others for a better chance. I'd like to see our young players look further afield too for more opportunities.

If LOI is going to get better and be a better option for them then that's great too but for me the important thing is getting them into a good set up and get good minutes at a decent level so whether that's here or abroad I don't think it matters. Look at other countries and you'll see they're increasingly getting young players into clubs in the countries of the top 5 European leagues because that's where the best coaching is and that's where the international teams pick their players from.

We're off on a tangent though. This thread is about the English league and why many of us Irish support it. And Irish players in the league is one of the many reasons people have.

You don't see a strong link between the national team and the LOI? Without the LOI our national team captain would be playing GAA for a club in Donegal just now, Enda Stevens wouldn't be playing. That's both our starting full backs. The apparent Lord and saviour Matt Doherty wouldn't be there, the list goes on and that's just current players go back through the years and some of our best ever players got to where they got to because of the LOI giving them a platform.

OMM 0000 · 12-06-2019 8:43pm

Omackeral wrote: »

Perfectly fine angle if you think of watching movies and watching football on telly as one and the same. Plenty do. To me and millions worldwide, football isn't just something on telly though.

I think a lot of people, me included, do not have the time to go to actual games.

So sitting at home, I can turn on the TV and watch some nice goals etc.

If the LOI had a highlights TV show which was well produced and had good presenters (imagine Bill O'Herlihy with Giles & Dunphy), I would watch it.

Has RTE ever tried that?

8-10 · 12-06-2019 8:43pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

You don't see a strong link between the national team and the LOI? Without the LOI our national team captain would be playing GAA for a club in Donegal just now, Enda Stevens wouldn't be playing. That's both our starting full backs. The apparent Lord and saviour Matt Doherty wouldn't be there, the list goes on and that's just current players go back through the years and some of our best ever players got to where they got to because of the LOI giving them a platform.

Between the national team and the level of the LOI, my god do you even read the context of my posts. I'm saying it's a stepping stone. If the best players are to go on and be internationals I think they will anyway, either in a top class LOI league or by moving to a better class league anyway.

Both Stevens and Coleman were in the English system for years before getting a full cap, same with Matt Doherty.

Yeah it's great there is a league here but the internationals are rarely plucked straight out of it.

If LOI was on par with a top league what I'm saying is you'd still have the likes of Coleman and Stevens picked for Ireland, as it stands I think the best players the LOI have to offer will still go on and make it at international level

Ultimate Seduction · 12-06-2019 8:56pm

8-10 wrote: »

Between the national team and the level of the LOI, my god do you even read the context of my posts. I'm saying it's a stepping stone. If the best players are to go on and be internationals I think they will anyway, either in a top class LOI league or by moving to a better class league anyway.

Both Stevens and Coleman were in the English system for years before getting a full cap, same with Matt Doherty.

Yeah it's great there is a league here but the internationals are rarely plucked straight out of it.

If LOI was on par with a top league what I'm saying is you'd still have the likes of Coleman and Stevens picked for Ireland, as it stands I think the best players the LOI have to offer will still go on and make it at international level

But they think us going to the matches will make the players better when it's always gonna be this standard with Britain next door buying any player that looks half decent.

8-10 · 12-06-2019 9:04pm

Ultimate Seduction wrote: »

But they think us going to the matches will make the players better when it's always gonna be this standard with Britain next door buying any player that looks half decent.

Would they be happy if we all went to games, league got as popular as the Premier League everyone builds 50,000 seater stadia and locals can't go anymore because of the amount of foreign fans flying in for every game and pushing up prices?

I don't get what the endgame is. Surely if it gets significantly better it will just attract the same type of supporters people who go to games now seem to dislike....why isn't it already considered ideal if the only people who go are these true pure soccer fans who aren't there for the selfies but for the love of the sport as a whole?

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 9:39pm

Ultimate Seduction wrote: »

But they think us going to the matches will make the players better when it's always gonna be this standard with Britain next door buying any player that looks half decent.

How do you not see the logic? Let's take Rovers for example. Say their average attendance goes from the current 3,000 to 8,000. Given they've attracted 7,000 this season and are based in Dublin that shouldn't be unrealistic in a country of our size with a normal attitude to its national league. Over the course of a season that's an extra million quid in ticket income alone for the club never mind all the advertising income it'd bring, including God forbid a tv deal, that money can then go to keeping players in the league so instead of League 1 being too financially good to turn down the Championship is then the minimum so the quality of player staying in the league goes up, transfer fees go up because suddenly English clubs have to do more than click their fingers to get players, performances in europe improve bringing in more money, attendances across the league increase because suddenly there's internationals coming to town, all this snowballs and eventually you get to a level where the standard of player is such that the international squad has a good percentage of it currently playing in the league. All this brings up the standard of football across the country, means kids have regular access to their heroes, kids aren't being shipped off away from home with no education at 16.

So yeah people going to games has a huge impact on the quality of players besides all the other benefits it would being to lots of different areas of Ireland not just the league.

Nobody expects a league like the EPL but something on par with the likes of Sweden, Denmark or Scotland isn't out of the question.

8-10 wrote: »

Between the national team and the level of the LOI, my god do you even read the context of my posts. I'm saying it's a stepping stone. If the best players are to go on and be internationals I think they will anyway, either in a top class LOI league or by moving to a better class league anyway.

Both Stevens and Coleman were in the English system for years before getting a full cap, same with Matt Doherty.

Yeah it's great there is a league here but the internationals are rarely plucked straight out of it.

If LOI was on par with a top league what I'm saying is you'd still have the likes of Coleman and Stevens picked for Ireland, as it stands I think the best players the LOI have to offer will still go on and make it at international level

Oh my God do you even read the context of my posts? I was pointing out it's more than a stepping stone, there's a strong link between it and the national team, there's players in our national squad that without it wouldn't be playing football at all without the league, that's not a stepping stone, it's way above that.

8-10 · 12-06-2019 9:44pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

Oh my God do you even read the context of my posts? I was pointing out it's more than a stepping stone, there's a strong link between it and the national team, there's players in our national squad that without it wouldn't be playing football at all without the league, that's not a stepping stone, it's way above that.

Nobody is saying anything about there being no league though? There is a league. Multiple divisions. And they're not going away

The question is how much does the level/quality of the league matter to the National team?

Ultimate Seduction · 12-06-2019 10:06pm

Majority of players go to England before they get near LOI. That's not gooing to change. Only worse it'll get. I support my local junior team in Desmond league go to alot of games does this count or do I have to support a LOI team

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 10:11pm

Ultimate Seduction wrote: »

Majority of players go to England before they get near LOI. That's not gooing to change. Only worse it'll get. I support my local junior team in Desmond league go to alot of games does this count or do I have to support a LOI team

That's already changing so you're showing your complete ignorance there.

Ultimate Seduction · 12-06-2019 10:13pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

That's already changing so you're showing your complete ignorance there.

There's less players going overall. The majority of ones that are get scouted at underage.facts . Bar the odd few.

Omackeral · 12-06-2019 10:21pm

OMM 0000 wrote: »

I think a lot of people, me included, do not have the time to go to actual games.

So sitting at home, I can turn on the TV and watch some nice goals etc.

That's grand yeah. I just wouldn't really consider that to be supporting in the true sense of the word.

Necro · 12-06-2019 10:23pm

8-10 wrote: »

Would they be happy if we all went to games, league got as popular as the Premier League everyone builds 50,000 seater stadia and locals can't go anymore because of the amount of foreign fans flying in for every game and pushing up prices?

I don't get what the endgame is. Surely if it gets significantly better it will just attract the same type of supporters people who go to games now seem to dislike....why isn't it already considered ideal if the only people who go are these true pure soccer fans who aren't there for the selfies but for the love of the sport as a whole?

It's an easy scapegoat tbf, blaming the lack of support from Irish people for whatever reason instead of looking at the total and utter mismanagement by the FAI, LOI execs and indeed the clubs themselves in self-promotion.

Honestly wonder do any of the clubs or the execs have a single marketing person with an ounce of talent.

It's the same with the national team, interest is way down and attendances are being supplemented by free tickets to schools, this is not a new thing.

But sure Delaney and his ilk would rather open an astro-turf pitch down in Kerry than actually do what he's been paid exorbitant amounts of money to do, which is manage and promote the sport in the country.

So instead of knocking fans for supporting Liverpool, Arsenal, whoever - throw your ire at those who run the sport here cos they're the ones letting you down.

8-10 · 12-06-2019 10:25pm

Omackeral wrote: »

That's grand yeah. I just wouldn't really consider that to be supporting in the true sense of the word.

Doesn't really matter though what you consider it. That's what fans do, they watch games and support their team. You can even listen to the radio commentary and support the team playing, you don't even have to watch. There's a blind man who goes to Anfield and has his mate describe to him what happens on the pitch.

I feel closer to Liverpool FC from my living room than any LOI side I've seen live. Others will be the complete opposite.

But we all experience games differently. I've honestly gotten really into a game before with radio commentary alone

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 10:28pm

Ultimate Seduction wrote: »

There's less players going overall. The majority of ones that are get scouted at underage.facts . Bar the odd few.

There are underage players turning down the option of joining English academies in favour of staying and playing for LOI underage teams. So yeah it's changing already.

Omackeral · 12-06-2019 10:29pm

To be honest 8-10, going to games pretty much is supporting a team. I'm not saying that for any moral superiority. I'm not saying it as a pro-LOI thing. Basically, you're literally supporting a team by paying in and shouting for them. Financially and from an encouragement POV. That applies to any team anywhere.

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 10:29pm

Necro wrote: »

It's an easy scapegoat tbf, blaming the lack of support from Irish people for whatever reason instead of looking at the total and utter mismanagement by the FAI, LOI execs and indeed the clubs themselves in self-promotion.

Honestly wonder do any of the clubs or the execs have a single marketing person with an ounce of talent.

It's the same with the national team, interest is way down and attendances are being supplemented by free tickets to schools, this is not a new thing.

But sure Delaney and his ilk would rather open an astro-turf pitch down in Kerry than actually do what he's been paid exorbitant amounts of money to do, which is manage and promote the sport in the country.

So instead of knocking fans for supporting Liverpool, Arsenal, whoever - throw your ire at those who run the sport here cos they're the ones letting you down.

I think you'll find LOI fans were the ones having a go at Delaney years ago and getting told to shut up by "fans" of English teams

8-10 · 12-06-2019 10:30pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

There are underage players turning down the option of joining English academies in favour of staying and playing for LOI underage teams. So yeah it's changing already.

Is that because of the good attendances?

8-10 · 12-06-2019 10:32pm

Omackeral wrote: »

To be honest 8-10, going to games pretty much is supporting a team. I'm not saying that for any moral superiority. I'm not saying it as a pro-LOI thing. Basically, you're literally supporting a team by paying in and shouting for them. Financially and from an encouragement POV. That applies to any team anywhere.

You pay for Sky/BT sports and they benefit financially too. But it's more than just financial support you give. There's a sense of community, discussions you have with work colleagues etc. Hanging flags, stickers on your car, social media

I feel a lot of pride supporting my club, particularly the past couple of seasons

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 10:37pm

8-10 wrote: »

Is that because of the good attendances?

Partially yeah. I know in rovers underage teams half of them at least could be in the English system just now but because Rovers are one of the better attended clubs and have a fan who is willing to loan the club money in the hope it leads to increased attendance they have been able to afford to invest in facilities and coaching staff and negotiate deals with schools to help keep these young players in Ireland. If the attendances were higher though a lot more could be invested and a lot more good could be done for the young footballers in Ireland both in football terms and mentally.

8-10 · 12-06-2019 10:40pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

Partially yeah. I know in rovers underage teams half of them at least could be in the English system just now but because Rovers are one of the better attended clubs and have a fan who is willing to loan the club money in the hope it leads to increased attendance they have been able to afford to invest in facilities and coaching staff and negotiate deals with schools to help keep these young players in Ireland. If the attendances were higher though a lot more could be invested and a lot more good could be done for the young footballers in Ireland both in football terms and mentally.

I agree with that. And id be happy to see it happen and get better and better

I just think it they're good enough they'll still make it regardless of the level of the domestic league. There's many examples of that, including many outside of Ireland

Necro · 12-06-2019 10:51pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

I think you'll find LOI fans were the ones having a go at Delaney years ago and getting told to shut up by "fans" of English teams

Why do you have to be so condescending to people who like different things to you???

Part of the reason I don't follow the LOI is because of the gombeens in charge.

Another part of it is because I take serious issue with the exclusivity thing that the clubs have going now right down to under 13, cherry-picking talent from the local clubs (the real grassroots) and not allowing them to play with their mates in their formative years. It's elitist and stupid, imo.

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 10:55pm

8-10 wrote: »

I agree with that. And id be happy to see it happen and get better and better

I just think it they're good enough they'll still make it regardless of the level of the domestic league. There's many examples of that, including many outside of Ireland

History hasn't backed that up though. Many seriously talented footballers haven't made it because the system currently involves players moving away from home at 15/16 with barely a junior cert to go live in digs in a foreign country on not very much money in the hope they'll be in the 5% or whatever ridiculously small percentage it is that gets offered a pro deal and then the even smaller percentage that gets offered a second deal. There are serious mental health issues with doing that to yound people, not just the leaving everything at so young but the pressure to make it, the boredom is a huge problem too and all this leads to a lot of seriously talented football falling into depression, turning to drink, drugs, gambling.
The only way to stop that is to have a strong league so players can stay home, get an education, play at a good level, get good coaching in good facilities and play competitive football which will not only benefit their development but will also mean that when they're older they can make the right decision for themselves and make a move that's good for them. This is the system that the Scandinavians have, the Belgians have, the Dutch have, why don't we have it? Because dave would rather sit in the pub and call the LOI ****e instead of supporting it thus starving the next generation of footballers in this country of support thus meaning we heavily rely on another country to do the work for us. That's just wrong.

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 11:00pm

Necro wrote: »

Why do you have to be so condescending to people who like different things to you???

Part of the reason I don't follow the LOI is because of the gombeens in charge.

Another part of it is because I take serious issue with the exclusivity thing that the clubs have going now right down to under 13, cherry-picking talent from the local clubs (the real grassroots) and not allowing them to play with their mates in their formative years. It's elitist and stupid, imo.

How is pointing out that LOI fans were the first ones the be anti Delaney condescending?

If by the gombeens in charge you mean the FAI, than you supporting the LOI is giving them the finger if anything.

Yeah because that's not exactly what the likes of Kevin's, Joeys, etc have been doing for decades already. I know a guy who traveled from sligo to play for a DDSL club for god sake, if anything the LOI underage structure stops what you're complaining about a bit. Most LOI clubs have partnerships with local clubs too to allow players to play with their mates for longer too.

Jim Gazebo · 12-06-2019 11:02pm

8-10 wrote: »

You pay for Sky/BT sports and they benefit financially too. But it's more than just financial support you give. There's a sense of community, discussions you have with work colleagues etc. Hanging flags, stickers on your car, social media

I feel a lot of pride supporting my club, particularly the past couple of seasons

God I hope Liverpool sink like a stone next season. My club. What is your relationship with Liverpool. You picked them. Because they were good. "my club". Your club is Cabinteely my friend.

Necro · 12-06-2019 11:05pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

How is pointing out that LOI fans were the first ones the be anti Delaney condescending?

If by the gombeens in charge you mean the FAI, than you supporting the LOI is giving them the finger if anything.

Yeah because that's not exactly what the likes of Kevin's, Joeys, etc have been doing for decades already. I know a guy who traveled from sligo to play for a DDSL club for god sake, if anything the LOI underage structure stops what you're complaining about a bit. Most LOI clubs have partnerships with local clubs too to allow players to play with their mates for longer too.

Not where I'm from.

Playing for DDSL does not stop that lad from Sligo playing for his local club, they're a development squad - it's not the same thing. A young 13 year old has to sign with Dundalk to play with them as I've been led to believe, barring him from playing with his local club - that's stupid imo.

Jim Gazebo · 12-06-2019 11:05pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

How is pointing out that LOI fans were the first ones the be anti Delaney condescending?

If by the gombeens in charge you mean the FAI, than you supporting the LOI is giving them the finger if anything.

Yeah because that's not exactly what the likes of Kevin's, Joeys, etc have been doing for decades already. I know a guy who traveled from sligo to play for a DDSL club for god sake, if anything the LOI underage structure stops what you're complaining about a bit. Most LOI clubs have partnerships with local clubs too to allow players to play with their mates for longer too.

It doesn't help far from dublin I think. In Cork it is causing issues, especially the gap. When you're not wanted by city at 14,16,18 a lot of guys don't go back to their original club or drop out altogether. I think it's hard on the local clubs who work hard to produce a talent to see them be taken with little credit. I think the LOI clubs could credit the local academies more.

The people supporting English teams never saw the Delaney issue because to them it was rosey, at that level he was signing songs and buying pints telling them about the problem child.

Jim Gazebo · 12-06-2019 11:06pm

Necro wrote: »

Not where I'm from.

Playing for DDSL does not stop that lad from Sligo playing for his local club, they're a development squad - it's not the same thing. A young 13 year old has to sign with Dundalk to play with them as I've been led to believe, barring him from playing with his local club - that's stupid imo.

What?! How can you be playing in the DDSL and for your local club? That is against the rules?

Do you have any idea how grassroots works?

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 11:07pm

Necro wrote: »

Not where I'm from.

Playing for DDSL does not stop that lad from Sligo playing for his local club, they're a development squad - it's not the same thing. A young 13 year old has to sign with Dundalk to play with them as I've been led to believe, barring him from playing with his local club - that's stupid imo.

Playing for a DDSL club quite literally does stop him playing for his local club. Also means he spends a lot of time travelling when he could be hanging around with his mates.

Necro · 12-06-2019 11:07pm

Jim Gazebo wrote: »

The people supporting English teams never saw the Delaney issue because to them it was rosey, at that level he was signing songs and buying pints telling them about the problem child.

Generalise much? I don't support an LOI team but I've been crowing about Delaney and his ilk for years myself, I refuse to part with any of my money to support that organisation, or any branch of it until they're all gone.

Jim Gazebo · 12-06-2019 11:07pm

Jim Gazebo wrote: »

What?! How can you be playing in the DDSL and for your local club? That is against the rules?

Do you have any idea how grassroots works?

I've misunderstood you I think - do you mean the sligo lad could play for his local sligo side and the sligo representative team?

Jim Gazebo · 12-06-2019 11:08pm

Necro wrote: »

Generalise much? I don't support an LOI team but I've been crowing about Delaney and his ilk for years myself, I refuse to part with any of my money to support that organisation, or any branch of it until they're all gone.

Like myself, glad to hear it and fair play.

Jim Gazebo · 12-06-2019 11:08pm

Necro wrote: »

Generalise much? I don't support an LOI team but I've been crowing about Delaney and his ilk for years myself, I refuse to part with any of my money to support that organisation, or any branch of it until they're all gone.

Like myself, glad to hear it and fair play.

Necro · 12-06-2019 11:10pm

Jim Gazebo wrote: »

What?! How can you be playing in the DDSL and for your local club? That is against the rules?

Do you have any idea how grassroots works?

D14Rugby wrote: »

Playing for a DDSL club quite literally does stop him playing for his local club. Also means he spends a lot of time travelling when he could be hanging around with his mates.

Nope, you're changing the argument now, both of you.

If the Sligo lad signs with a DDSL club then obviously he can't play with his local team, but what can you do about that.

DDSL have a development squad that tour the country, play in stuff like the Kennedy Cup etc, that's separate from the local club and he can play in that AND for his local club (although if he's playing for a Sligo club he'll be on the Sligo/Leitrim team)

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 11:10pm

Jim Gazebo wrote: »

It doesn't help far from dublin I think. In Cork it is causing issues, especially the gap. When you're not wanted by city at 14,16,18 a lot of guys don't go back to their original club or drop out altogether. I think it's hard on the local clubs who work hard to produce a talent to see them be taken with little credit. I think the LOI clubs could credit the local academies more.

The people supporting English teams never saw the Delaney issue because to them it was rosey, at that level he was signing songs and buying pints telling them about the problem child.

That's the system the FAI have put in place for whatever reason. Most Dublin clubs have got around it by having partnerships and the gap teams in the DDSL and all teams should do the same but the system has only been in place a few years and the FAI haven't done much to help the clubs work out the problems so it'll take a while to get it running smoothly as clubs get better at spotting and solving the problems.

Omackeral · 12-06-2019 11:11pm

8-10 wrote: »

You pay for Sky/BT sports and they benefit financially too. But it's more than just financial support you give. There's a sense of community, discussions you have with work colleagues etc. Hanging flags, stickers on your car, social media

Well... you have me there I suppose.

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 11:11pm

Necro wrote: »

Nope, you're changing the argument now, both of you.

If the Sligo lad signs with a DDSL club then obviously he can't play with his local team, but what can you do about that.

DDSL have a development squad that tour the country, play in stuff like the Kennedy Cup etc, that's separate from the local club and he can play in that AND for his local club (although if he's playing for a Sligo club he'll be on the Sligo/Leitrim team)

No you just can't read. Go read my original comment about the DDSL, as you'll see it's unedited.

Necro · 12-06-2019 11:12pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

No you just can't read. Go read my original comment about the DDSL, as you'll see it's unedited.

And back to the condescending :rolleyes:

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 11:13pm

Necro wrote: »

And back to the condescending :rolleyes:

I take it you read it then... Apology accepted.

Necro · 12-06-2019 11:18pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

I take it you read it then... Apology accepted.

You're deliberately misrepresenting what my point was.

My issue with these LOI clubs underage teams are that they specifically prohibit little Johnny from playing with his local club in my area, meaning he doesn't get to spend his formative years with the club that initially nurtured him, and spend time with his mates etc.

The youth development squads around the country don't disbar little Johnny from playing with his local club, but he still gets a taste of a higher level of football.

Bobblehats · 12-06-2019 11:24pm

I have an idea. How about we cobble together all the country’s finest talent and plough all the resourses into a super club that can compete on the world stage

They can represent Ireland too. They may not be amazing technically but the chemistry will be 99 across the board. Combined with the right application borne of rigorous fitness drills they will surely deliver

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 11:24pm

Necro wrote: »

You're deliberately misrepresenting what my point was.

My issue with these LOI clubs underage teams are that they specifically prohibit little Johnny from playing with his local club in my area, meaning he doesn't get to spend his formative years with the club that initially nurtured him, and spend time with his mates etc.

The youth development squads around the country don't disbar little Johnny from playing with his local club, but he still gets a taste of a higher level of football.

And you're deliberately ignoring getting angry because you didn't read what I said properly.

And here's the thing, the exact same thing has been happening for decades except on a worse scale because wherever you were in the country if you wanted to be noticed you had to play in the DDSL so had to commute to Dublin for training and matches. And even if you weren't able to go to the ddsl there are clubs all over the country that kids would be scouted by at young ages and encouraged to join because they had contacts to a scout or something meaning little Johnny wasn't playing with his mates anyway before the LOI underage structures.

dundalkfc10 · 12-06-2019 11:33pm

Necro wrote: »

D14Rugby wrote: »

How is pointing out that LOI fans were the first ones the be anti Delaney condescending?

If by the gombeens in charge you mean the FAI, than you supporting the LOI is giving them the finger if anything.

Yeah because that's not exactly what the likes of Kevin's, Joeys, etc have been doing for decades already. I know a guy who traveled from sligo to play for a DDSL club for god sake, if anything the LOI underage structure stops what you're complaining about a bit. Most LOI clubs have partnerships with local clubs too to allow players to play with their mates for longer too.

Not where I'm from.

Playing for DDSL does not stop that lad from Sligo playing for his local club, they're a development squad - it's not the same thing. A young 13 year old has to sign with Dundalk to play with them as I've been led to believe, barring him from playing with his local club - that's stupid imo.

If a Sligo lad signs for a DDSL team he cannot play for his local club in that season. Same way a lad in dundalk can't play with a Dundalk club and DDSL team like Kevin's.

On this point, Do you think in England the big clubs let local lads u 14s etc play with their local teams ?

Necro · 12-06-2019 11:35pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

And you're deliberately ignoring getting angry because you didn't read what I said properly.

And here's the thing, the exact same thing has been happening for decades except on a worse scale because wherever you were in the country if you wanted to be noticed you had to play in the DDSL so had to commute to Dublin for training and matches. And even if you weren't able to go to the ddsl there are clubs all over the country that kids would be scouted by at young ages and encouraged to join because they had contacts to a scout or something meaning little Johnny wasn't playing with his mates anyway before the LOI underage structures.

What has that got to do with anything I said?

There wasn't a problem with the DDSL hoovering up talent from my club decades ago, or even ten years ago.

Now that the LOI are building underage structures, there is a problem.

It forms part of the reason why I won't support my local LOI club, which was my initial point.

Omackeral · 12-06-2019 11:39pm

OMM 0000 wrote: »

I think a lot of people, me included, do not have the time to go to actual games.

So sitting at home, I can turn on the TV and watch some nice goals etc.

That's fine. My point is that sometimes teams, managers and players look to this figurative entity known as the 12th Man. My money is that they're talking about those in the various actual grounds, be they Anfield or Lansdowne, and not some fella with a remote in hand or streaming a game online.

D14Rugby · 12-06-2019 11:42pm

Necro wrote: »

What has that got to do with anything I said?

There wasn't a problem with the DDSL hoovering up talent from my club decades ago, or even ten years ago.

Now that the LOI are building underage structures, there is a problem.

It forms part of the reason why I won't support my local LOI club, which was my initial point.

Oh I forgot your local club was the only one we were talking about. Sorry about that :rolleyes:

It's a problem that the best players in areas get to play against the other best players in the country without having to commute to Dublin now?

Why do Irish people support English teams?

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