Mayo GAA Discussion Part 2

Why didn't Evan Regan start? Injured?

He was named in program.

Kevin

yop wrote: »

……………………………….
Anyway, onwards and upwards.... I can see no progress and I think for the 1st time in 20 years we are going to Division 2, though are we just having a blip or are we finally running out of legs and steam? ?Have these players gone back to the well too many times?
Time will tell but this more than any game over the last few has me scratching my head.

The bit in bold it what concerns me most.

Is it a blip or something more terminal?
I have always felt that the two All Ireland losses in ’12 and ’13 would knock the stuffing out of this team and that they would fade away.

We have seen it before, ‘96/’97 two losses then a 7 year layoff, ‘04/’06 two losses then a 6 year layoff.

But in ’14 and ’15 this team were competitive; they did not fade away like in ’98 or ’07.
And after the events of September last year I had almost turned 180 degrees on my assessment, i.e. this team had a lot more to give and a lot more fight in them for ’16.

But it’s hard to know now if they do or not. I have always said that league form is a good indication of Championship form, you are what you are, and right now Mayo are not good.
But they have players to come back and one would hope that this NFL is purely a bedding in period for Rochford and co., and to be fair with the exception of the Cork game they have been well in all the other games they lost.

They will have home games in the Championship if they progress, and the London game could be seen as another league game, a chance to get things right.

As for the remainder of the league we could do with Cork pulling away and leaving it up to ourselves and Monaghan, whom we win the tie breaker over.

Cork have Down and Kerry next, Down they should win and you never know about Kerry.

Monaghan have Kerry and home and Donegal away, I can’t see them winning both but they could win one.

We could get away with losing to Roscommon and beating Down and hoping Monaghan lose both their games but at the same time winning both Roscommon and Down does not guarantee us anything if it’s a 3 way tie with Cork and Monaghan.

Div 1 relegation has been decided by the kick of the ball more than once in the last few years.

Fr Tod Umptious wrote: »

I have always said that league form is a good indication of Championship form, you are what you are, and right now Mayo are not good.
But they have players to come back and one would hope that this NFL is purely a bedding in period for Rochford and co., and to be fair with the exception of the Cork game they have been well in all the other games they lost.

I agree that the league can be great for some teams to build confidence and momentum going into the summer (particularly teams that are new to the top flight), but I think other teams are championship teams and the league is just used as a platform for trying things out and seeing what works and what doesn't. Tyrone and Kerry would be two teams that spring to mind as teams that have still had good championships without doing particularly well in the league (Tyrone made an AI semi-final last year after being relegated from Div 1, Kerry won the AI in 2014 after just avoiding Div 1 relegation). Success or poor performances in the league doesn't necessarily guarantee anything going forward, especially when it comes to top tier teams.

So while it's entirely possible that Mayo have just run out of steam this year, I think it's equally (if not more) likely that minds are firmly on the summer and to have things coming together for the championship. They definitely still have a lot of work to do to catch up to where other teams are in terms of fitness levels and they're still missing a couple of very important players, not to mention they're probably still in an adjustment period getting used to a new managerial style, new personalities getting to know each other, etc. Instant gratification was never likely under the circumstances.

That isn't to gloss over the poor performance yesterday (or rather the poor second half performance more than anything). There are serious issues that need addressing in the coming weeks/months, particularly the ponderous nature of the forwards, accurate free-taking and how to get the best from AOS. I also thought DOC looked a wee bit knackered yesterday and might be due rest?

I guess what I'm trying to get at is that while there is clearly a way to go and vast improvements to be made, I wouldn't be willing to make any definite judgements on where we are or where we're ultimately going based on a sketchy league.

Btw, does anyone think that Cillian O'Connor is perhaps going to be captain for the year?

yop wrote: »

Have a watch on the Game On Sunday last night, Ciaran Whelan and Dermot Earley, neither from Mayo and their take on that. Neither had Mayo tints on.

I've heard it mentioned more than once from non-Mayo people. The radio bit that I was referring to above was mentioned by the lads on Newstalk, who certainly wouldn't have any reason to be wearing "Mayo tints". They've mentioned it in relation to other high-profile players too.

PressRun wrote: »

I agree that the league can be great for some teams to build confidence and momentum going into the summer (particularly teams that are new to the top flight), but I think other teams are championship teams and the league is just used as a platform for trying things out and seeing what works and what doesn't. Tyrone and Kerry would be two teams that spring to mind as teams that have still had good championships without doing particularly well in the league (Tyrone made an AI semi-final last year after being relegated from Div 1, Kerry won the AI in 2014 after just avoiding Div 1 relegation). Success or poor performances in the league doesn't necessarily guarantee anything going forward, especially when it comes to top tier teams.

So while it's entirely possible that Mayo have just run out of steam this year, I think it's equally (if not more) likely that minds are firmly on the summer and to have things coming together for the championship. They definitely still have a lot of work to do to catch up to where other teams are in terms of fitness levels and they're still missing a couple of very important players, not to mention they're probably still in an adjustment period getting used to a new managerial style, new personalities getting to know each other, etc. Instant gratification was never likely under the circumstances.

That isn't to gloss over the poor performance yesterday (or rather the poor second half performance more than anything). There are serious issues that need addressing in the coming weeks/months, particularly the ponderous nature of the forwards, accurate free-taking and how to get the best from AOS. I also thought DOC looked a wee bit knackered yesterday and might be due rest?

I guess what I'm trying to get at is that while there is clearly a way to go and vast improvements to be made, I wouldn't be willing to make any definite judgements on where we are or where we're ultimately going based on a sketchy league.

Btw, does anyone think that Cillian O'Connor is perhaps going to be captain for the year?

The way I look at it this
Unexpected good league form does not necessarily carry forward to the championship , however unexpected poor league form may often be an indication of something that is terminally wrong.

The former however seems to happen more often than the latter.
Recent examples have been Derry and Cork a few years back, and Mayo in 2010.
The reason for this maybe the some teams are playing the league with closer to their championship squad than others.

Now I’m not that up to speed with what is or what is not Roscommon’s championship 15, but are the teams that they are fielding in this NFL close to it ?

We know that Mayo have players like Cillian O’ Connor, Tom Cuniffe, Keith Higgins etc to come back,
Kerry have Anthony Maher, David Moran, James O’ Donoughe etc.
Dublin probably have half a team that could slot straight in.

yop wrote: »

Agree re the penalty, umpire could see it and the Sunday Game even hightlighted the abuse he gets, if that was Gooch, what would the result be???

Ah now! If you were at the match you may have noticed the fact that Ger Cafferkey had a fist full of Coopers jersey all day. It wasn't until Cooper was brought out the field and away from Cafferkey that he got into the game really. About time too. Donaghy bullied Cafferkey in those two games in 2014, he's come back much stronger and tougher for it IMO. O'Shea also let Cooper have a few thumps off the ball as well. Cooper deals with plenty abuse and has been dealing with it for 14 years!

I've said it before, O'Shea gets dragged a lot, but no more then Donaghy, Murphy and O'Gara. Big men for some reason find it hard to get frees in general. I think he actually got a few handy ones yesterday for me. Went down after grabbing Crowley's jersey at one stage, and another next to Fionn Fitzgerald. But then he should get frees other times and doesn't.

In the stands it seemed like he was barging with the ball prior to the penalty, but after watching it back, he was trying to avoid barging by spinning. The problem (as I have stated in the Kerry thread) was that he put the ball over the bar! If it had gone wide, the referee may well have pulled it back for a penalty under the advantage rule. However, as soon as the ball goes over the bar, he can't over-rule the score and give the penalty (imagine the complaints if the penalty was missed).

There should be an option for the attacking team in a situation like that.

By the way, on a personal note, not happy with Fionn's actions to get DOC sent off. We used to give out stink about Tyrone's use of those tactics in years gone by. O'Mahoney was at it vs Donegal, and Fionn kicking the ball away to delay time frustrated O'Connor. He was silly to lash out while on a yellow, but Fionn clearly was looking for the altrication.

Donaghy really isn't well liked around ye're parts! :P The biggest cheer of the day was when the red came out. It wasn't even a bad tackle really. Silly, but not massively dangerous. A silly one to make when on a yellow card anyway.
Andy Moran destroyed all the momentum that would have come with the sending off by blasting the free wide, and the game was won from then IMO. Brainless from an experienced guy.

Also, at 4 points down and a man to spare, what on earth was Lee Keegan doing sitting in the Full Back line, hands on hips beside a static Darren O'Sullivan. One of (if not the best) attacking wing backs in the country wasted. Poor tactical awareness from Rochford or else Keegan might not be fully right yet?

Tom Parsons had a great game. I thought Boyle played well,tracking Murphy, but Murphy cleverly dragged him out of position at times leaving gaps through the middle. Vaughan was pretty anonymous.

Hope we can beat Monaghan and give ye a chance to stay up. Was chatting to one of the Mayo players yesterday, and he is still thinking positively. He thinks Monaghan are kept to 6 points, Mayo can reach that figure and stay up on HTH.

DDC1990 wrote: »

Ah now! If you were at the match you may have noticed the fact that Ger Cafferkey had a fist full of Coopers jersey all day. It wasn't until Cooper was brought out the field and away from Cafferkey that he got into the game really. About time too. Donaghy bullied Cafferkey in those two games in 2014, he's come back much stronger and tougher for it IMO. O'Shea also let Cooper have a few thumps off the ball as well. Cooper deals with plenty abuse and has been dealing with it for 14 years!

I've said it before, O'Shea gets dragged a lot, but no more then Donaghy, Murphy and O'Gara. Big men for some reason find it hard to get frees in general. I think he actually got a few handy ones yesterday for me. Went down after grabbing Crowley's jersey at one stage, and another next to Fionn Fitzgerald. But then he should get frees other times and doesn't.

In the stands it seemed like he was barging with the ball prior to the penalty, but after watching it back, he was trying to avoid barging by spinning. The problem (as I have stated in the Kerry thread) was that he put the ball over the bar! If it had gone wide, the referee may well have pulled it back for a penalty under the advantage rule. However, as soon as the ball goes over the bar, he can't over-rule the score and give the penalty (imagine the complaints if the penalty was missed).

There should be an option for the attacking team in a situation like that.

By the way, on a personal note, not happy with Fionn's actions to get DOC sent off. We used to give out stink about Tyrone's use of those tactics in years gone by. O'Mahoney was at it vs Donegal, and Fionn kicking the ball away to delay time frustrated O'Connor. He was silly to lash out while on a yellow, but Fionn clearly was looking for the altrication.

Donaghy really isn't well liked around ye're parts! :P The biggest cheer of the day was when the red came out. It wasn't even a bad tackle really. Silly, but not massively dangerous. A silly one to make when on a yellow card anyway.
Andy Moran destroyed all the momentum that would have come with the sending off by blasting the free wide, and the game was won from then IMO. Brainless from an experienced guy.

Also, at 4 points down and a man to spare, what on earth was Lee Keegan doing sitting in the Full Back line, hands on hips beside a static Darren O'Sullivan. One of (if not the best) attacking wing backs in the country wasted. Poor tactical awareness from Rochford or else Keegan might not be fully right yet?

Tom Parsons had a great game. I thought Boyle played well,tracking Murphy, but Murphy cleverly dragged him out of position at times leaving gaps through the middle. Vaughan was pretty anonymous.

Hope we can beat Monaghan and give ye a chance to stay up. Was chatting to one of the Mayo players yesterday, and he is still thinking positively. He thinks Monaghan are kept to 6 points, Mayo can reach that figure and stay up on HTH.

Top post!TBF I thought Donaghy's red card was pretty harsh yesterday and he was outstanding to boot.

km79 wrote: »

Excellent analysis and very fair
You nailed it in the Andy Morab free
Absolutely ludicrous and shows lessons are not being learnt year on year !
On donaghy he is a bit of a pantomine villain but make no mistake he is admired by a LOT of mayo football folk ! We might have an AI or 2 if we had him instead of ye

That guy has such a big ego imo. He must love looking at himself in the mirror. He seems to want all the limelight himself and in match changing situations he seems to always go for the score himself when there are better options out there. He is a great footballer but he needs to be a bit more selfless imo.

James Horan is on Off The Ball at 7.45 chatting about our league campaign thus far.

seligehgit wrote: »

Top post!TBF I thought Donaghy's red card was pretty harsh yesterday and he was outstanding to boot.

Really ?
It was clearly a yellow at least and since it was his second he was gone.

Fr Tod Umptious wrote:

Really ? It was clearly a yellow at least and since it was his second he was gone.

Yeah I thought this as well. It wasn't a 100% yellow, but when you tackle at the shoulder/neck area you run the risk.

The first yellow was a bit harsh. Himself and AOS both having a go at each other, but Donaghy was singled out for the card.

Still I don't really have any complaints overall. Fitzmaurice should have whipped him off straight after the yellow given his tackling style. He was always going to be a marked man in the referees eyes, after last week.

seligehgit wrote: »

Lads FYI Aidan O Shea is on The Toughest Trade tonight @ 9.55 on RTE 2 trying his hand at American Football whilst ex NFL star Roberto Wallace heads to Breaffy.It should be interesting.I've seen the promo,Robert Hennelly togs out too in McHale Park.

Brendan Maher the Tipperary hurler swaps places with the fine ex English seam bowler Steve Harmison.


EDIT ACTUALLY HE'S NOT ON UNTIL NEXT WEEK

Just watching it and poor Roberto seems to be having it tough in Mayo compared to Aido in US.

seligehgit wrote:

It was very enjoyable,Aidan came across very well,much as expected.Very modest lad,he is a quick learner when it came to the american football skillset.Extremely high standards required for the draft.Given adequate time I've no doubt he'd make it as an american footballer.These guys are playing the game up to 15 years.....As a top gaelic footballer he has many of the attributes and skills necessary for same.

I enjoyed it a lot, both guys were great. AOS looked like the part, didn't make a fool of himself. Roberto is a smart cookie I'd say, and he played a full game.