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Target Practice

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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Thur
    Rest day, unscheduled.

    Today I said hello to one running legend and goodbye to another.

    On the way to dropping off my running gear to my parents house in the optimistic hope I could squeeze a run in between Ronnie and kids pick-up, I wondered if my dad would have some sad news for me this morning. Sure enough, he told me that he was not long off the phone to FC who had told him that Jim Mc had died during the night. Dad and Jim were lifelong friends. Not surprising, in terms of the obsession they both had with all things running. I'm not sure who had the edge re obsession.

    I asked dad if he remembered the great athlete Lillian Board. Cancer ravaged her and she died within a matter of months from diagnosis in 1970. I said to dad that this was very similar in the speed that they both succumbed. Jim, although ill at the time, competed in the Home Countries cross country last November. Lillian - 1968 Olympian and the 'Golden Girl' of British athletics - ran her last races in June 1970, including a relay world record in the 4x800m, but died from colorectal cancer on 26 December 1970.

    Funny, when I mentioned this, dad told me that Jim had been really, really upset when she died all those years ago and that when he had visited him two days ago - to say goodbye - he had spotted Lillian's biography peeking out of Jim's wardrobe or locker....

    Jim was a big part of my athletics experience as a junior. I trained with him, Gwen and Helen many a times in the PP in the 80s. It's not too often you get to train with an Olympian. Not that you'd ever hear that from Jim himself.

    When I first started going to Donore as a kid, the clubhouse was in Hospital Lane. I have such vivid memories of that lane, the cobblestones and the barbed wire on top of the high brick wall. I remember Maurice Ahern telling me to 'punch him, really punch him' hard in the stomach. Which I did, only he had neglected to tell me that his whole abdomen was encased in plaster of paris following surgery....
    The men's changing room was an old prefab style building. No women's facilities! They may have designated us a portaloo-style building at some stage before the move to the current premises in Chapelizod. Or maybe we were changing in portaloos :D

    Here, from Chapelizod, Jim went on to have really significant successes with 'his girls' on every level of commitment. He generally inspired complete loyalty and adoration.

    Myself, the pa, Jim and Gwen went to many a cross country race together, all over the country. Jim was of the old school: train hard, then train harder again. Race hard then harder again. Then he could go and drink 10 men under the table. And did :)
    He always bought me a beer or three post-race when dad - rightly or wrongly :) - was keeping a protective eye on me. Mind you, there was one particularly hairy time when dad drove up and nearly over a bridge after one post race stop-off coming back from Mullingar. We'll say no more about that...Many a song was sung on these trips and whenever I hear 'Maids when you're young, never wed an old man' I will always have a smile and a window opened briefly to happy and halcyon days.

    I had lost touch with Jim for a long time but saw more of him over the last 18 months or so when I started back on the race circuit. He always had a hug and kiss and some words of encouragement.
    People like Jim Mc don't come along too often. It's small comfort to his family and close friends right now but I hope their memories and the knowledge that they walked with someone special for a while comforts them in the months ahead. Jim, it was an absolute privilege. RIP.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,585 ✭✭✭nop98


    What a great post DG - sorry to hear about your and your dad's loss. :(

    I just Wikipedia'd the athlete you mentioned and it's a pretty devastating story.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,009 ✭✭✭Firedance


    + 1 to that, such lovely words, I didn't know Jim at all (my loss) but the words spoken about him on here and by a lot of my club mates who knew him well, all point towards an outstanding athlete but more importantly a lovely man, who dedicated his life to 'his girls'. May he rest in peace.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,768 ✭✭✭✭Murph_D


    A lovely tribute, sorry for your loss. I may be wrong but I think I may have shaken Jim's hand in the finishing chute after one or two race series events in recent years. RIP.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,121 ✭✭✭tang1


    Sorry for your loss DG, he was a great runner & massive loss to Donore Harriers. Last time I seen him he was tearing the roads of Kinnegad up last July doing there 5k.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,921 ✭✭✭Kennyg71


    Just talking to Gill about him this evening, she had said she was taking to
    Him at road relay last year, in between him busy runing from pilar to post
    encouraging on runners, she was just saying hard to believe his energy. An
    Outstanding Club Man till the end, will be great loss to all that knew him.

    Like so many Runners of his generation so humble, you'd never know you
    Are in the company of such stellar Athletes.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Thank you all, I'll pass on the kind thoughts to dad. He'll be pleased - but not surprised - to see the wide regard for Jim.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Fri
    Another unscheduled rest day. Thursday was meant to be 4-5 easy incl 6x200m so I had planned to do an easy 30 mins with strides instead. Didn't happen, 3yo still sick and coughing like a good un. Told myself I'd be fresh as a daisy for the 3k TT in the morning....

    Sat
    3k TT incorporated into parkrun
    Target: 11 mins
    Actual: 11:17


    Although a PB by 17 secs, I am quite deflated by this. However, I will accept - slightly ungraciously - that this is where I am right now.
    The first km was 3:34-5, target was 3:40 per km. I knew it was going to be hard work as my breathing was in ribbons at 500m but I don't think the first km pace had a huge impact overall. In fact, I heard M call out what could have been either 3:34 or 3:44, didn't quite catch it, and I remember mentally shrugging off whatever it might have been as in or around target pace. My clubmate and training partner ran a fabulous 10:54.

    I am a tiny bit sub-par form due to an impending cold; I kept falling asleep yesterday and last night had the beginnings of a real chesty cough. But, I am not counting that as a major impact. There are so many other components of racing to consider.

    - Physical strength:
    The layers and cycles of training with specificity to include:
    Strength
    Speed Endurance
    Speed

    - Tactics/
    Strategy, the ability to be flexible when needed with both
    Confidence to hold back when needed but also to surge when needed too.

    - Mental strength:
    The ability to relax
    The ability to embrace pain
    The ability to dig in
    The ability to access that other tank
    The ability to focus and not lose concentration even when the body is telling you it hurts

    - Generally
    Recovery and
    Sleep
    Diet
    Supplementary stuff

    - Racecraft
    Getting in the zone. Wrapping all the above up so it comes naturally and even unconsciously in a race: focussing, committing to the discomfort when the time comes, relaxing, digging in, knowing when to 'go'...

    And there are probably a few more elements. If I am absolutely honest with myself, there are lots of little 1%s from the above list where I could have increased my chances of achieving that 11 minutes.

    For example, working through the list, I am still laying down the cycles of training so while I am strong (stamina), I don't have the layers of training cycles to maximise my strength-endurance yet.
    Tactics and race strategy 'need work'. This goes with the mental aspect. While I have improved, I definitely let my mind drift slightly for about 400m mid-TT. I also allowed myself to get into 'no man's land' again today. I think I allow that to happen too often. I really tried to keep with S&M whisht TbL M&S today approaching the mile mark but my legs just weren't listening. Once that gap opens, it's gone, sayonara folks :(

    Mentally, I employed all the usual tricks today and that is definitely improving race-on-race but again, today my legs just weren't listening!

    Sleep and diet have been sub-par lately and this is my own fault. If I want to extract that little extra from my lovely hard-working body, I need to be kinder to it. Earlier bed and less crap. On the plus side, my alcohol consumption is practically teetotal these days. Instead of a bottle+ on a drinking night, these days frequently a bottle lasts me a week. Get me :cool:
    You also have to be strict with yourself about recovery and staying off your feet as much as possible after a hard session, something I'm not great on.

    Today, I wasn't able to open that extra tank all the way when approaching the finish. Don't know why. I've done it before when mentally and physically knackered. Couldn't today. I raised it a bit when I heard the footfall of the first park-runner behind me with 400 to go but couldn't 'let rip'.

    The supplementary - mobility etc stuff is improving but always a work in progress there :)

    The 'wrapping it all up' bit will come with more racing.

    Today's TT told me loud and clear, it's about so much more than just getting out and doing the running, doing the sessions. You have to support it all with the 1% here, the 1% there to maximise your efforts.

    As I said above, I'll take today....that's a measure of where I am....for now ;)

    Total incl w/u and w/d about 7.5 miles


  • Moderators, Computer Games Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 16,373 Mod ✭✭✭✭adrian522


    Great post up above there A. Only getting to it now!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,768 ✭✭✭✭Murph_D


    Well done on TT - very hard on yourself if you're coming down with something especially.

    Only one bottle of whiskey a week? Fair play! :)


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,936 ✭✭✭annapr


    Wait... That's a very disappointing... PB!? Good post.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Murph_D wrote: »
    Well done on TT - very hard on yourself if you're coming down with something especially.

    Only one bottle of whiskey a week? Fair play! :)

    Vodka actually :p Thanks :)


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,009 ✭✭✭Firedance


    hmmm, I think I want to give out to you for being too hard on yourself - I can see your points - however....

    Once that gap opens, it's gone, sayonara folks

    should you try running these solo so you don't see any gap? might be worth a shot next time...

    anyway, well done on your PB, its a Personal BEST after all, be kinder to yourself :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    annapr wrote: »
    Wait... That's a very disappointing... PB!? Good post.
    Firedance wrote: »
    hmmm, I think I want to give out to you for being too hard on yourself - I can see your points - however....

    Once that gap opens, it's gone, sayonara folks

    should you try running these solo so you don't see any gap? might be worth a shot next time...

    anyway, well done on your PB, its a Personal BEST after all, be kinder to yourself :)
    Hehe thank you both and yes, I know, no whinging about PBs :D

    Just reread my post there to check I wasn't whinging too much! I suppose what I was trying to do was to analyse why I'm not where I want to be. Tbh, the gap between me and S today was too much, especially for a 3k.
    The main thing that stands out was letting the gap open but my legs really weren't responding today. Before, I have mentally given in to the gap when it opened, today I turned on the mental side but just didn't have it physically. Ah well. Another day :) The silly thing is, I would have been happy with 11:10....well, 11:09 :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,921 ✭✭✭Kennyg71


    While there is progress to be had, may as well chase it down, well done on PB :)
    as usual very honest :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,451 ✭✭✭spaceylou


    I often feel when reading your log, especially posts like the one from today that you are probably the wisest person in the A/R Forum, if not on the entire site.

    Well done on PB, and thank you for honest analysis, although also - don't be too hard on yourself, a PB is a PB is a PB


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,355 ✭✭✭Bungy Girl


    Great write up, DG. Makes very interesting reading for those of us who can only dream of that sort of time! I admire that you never rest on your laurels, even after a PB, and are always looking to go one better. Mind yourself after that effort today, feet up and early to bed!


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,137 ✭✭✭El Caballo


    Just one to add that I think is of huge importance, an old cliche but having good old simple fun with racing.

    Sometimes, I think that getting too caught in the little details during a race causes us to get too introverted and within ourselves which can take away from the bigger picture. When I think back, all of the best races I have ever run where the ones where I was almost blank in my mind, relaxed and just having fun with it. No doubt the one percents are important but I feel they come more naturally when we go out and just have fun with it. I don't know, Maybe I've just lost my edge:D

    Well done on the PB, not what you might've wanted today but still moving in the right direction.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,900 ✭✭✭KielyUnusual


    You're an experienced runner and you should know the type of times you are capable of so achieving a PB sometimes just isn't enough. We do a 3k time trial down the club regular enough. Less regular now. I've sometimes tried to hit a time in these but I'm generally way off. Its a different environment and hard to push yourself to the max. Run a 3k in the grades or something similar and I'm sure you'd do a lot better. A time trial is a time trial. A race is a race ;)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Kennyg71 wrote: »
    While there is progress to be had, may as well chase it down, well done on PB :)
    as usual very honest :)
    Thanks G, and absolutely ;)
    spaceylou wrote: »
    I often feel when reading your log, especially posts like the one from today that you are probably the wisest person in the A/R Forum, if not on the entire site.

    Well done on PB, and thank you for honest analysis, although also - don't be too hard on yourself, a PB is a PB is a PB
    Ahhh...noooooo! :o But thanks and I won't :)
    Bungy Girl wrote: »
    Great write up, DG. Makes very interesting reading for those of us who can only dream of that sort of time! I admire that you never rest on your laurels, even after a PB, and are always looking to go one better. Mind yourself after that effort today, feet up and early to bed!
    Thanks BG, heh, now you wouldn't be implying that I wouldn't be happy with 11:09? ;)
    Yes, am starting to wind up for the night now....and actually be in bed for 9:30 :D
    El Caballo wrote: »
    Just one to add that I think is of huge importance, an old cliche but having good old simple fun with racing.

    Sometimes, I think that getting too caught in the little details during a race causes us to get too introverted and within ourselves which can take away from the bigger picture. When I think back, all of the best races I have ever run where the ones where I was almost blank in my mind, relaxed and just having fun with it. No doubt the one percents are important but I feel they come more naturally when we go out and just have fun with it. I don't know, Maybe I've just lost my edge:D

    Well done on the PB, not what you might've wanted today but still moving in the right direction.
    Thanks NE I mean EC. Is that a Juantorena reference?
    You are right....except I don't know how to have fun racing :eek: Yes, not sure if he said it in 'round 1' but Ronnie was talking about the 'floating' aspect of his best races. Would love to have that experience again!
    Unfortunately, today was 'all about the time'. Coachy wanted us to experience running at a certain pace and I suppose any enjoyment went when I realised I wasn't on the pace....maybe I just wasn't ready for that pace today.
    You're an experienced runner and you should know the type of times you are capable of so achieving a PB sometimes just isn't enough. We do a 3k time trial down the club regular enough. Less regular now. I've sometimes tried to hit a time in these but I'm generally way off. Its a different environment and hard to push yourself to the max. Run a 3k in the grades or something similar and I'm sure you'd do a lot better. A time trial is a time trial. A race is a race ;)
    Thanks KU, yeah there was little or no racing today, mostly me and the tarmac on my own so yes, a time trial which I tried to treat as a race. And failed at both :D
    Have just written out all the graded, IMC and national/regional lists you posted, showing them to coachy tomorrow :D


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,672 ✭✭✭hillsiderunner


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    Thanks NE I mean EC.

    I knew it!! (now ElC remember the new initials have no association with closing accounts)

    (great stuff as always DG)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Sun
    10 miles: hilly run with spontaneous progression, tempo and fast finish... :o:D
    Yeah we got a bollocking :)

    After the disappointment of yesterday, today was like a dream run. It should have been an easy run on one of our usual routes towards Greystones, around the Killruddery demesne and back along Quill Rd towards Kilmac and a loop around a back road to Bray. Fabulous misty morning for running, strange how a covering of grey mist can be very beautiful. It cleared about half way through.

    There is a long drag after the first mile and then a steep kilometre hill at about mile 3 up along the Glen of the Downs golf club. The hills sessions have really paid off as S and myself glided up this. In fact, the whole run I was holding myself back...ok, until Quill Rd and Kilmac when we got into the progression and fast finish bit: we were really motoring then, last mile was just under 6:20 pace. Of course I asked myself if I should have run harder yesterday but I know I couldn't have. No sign of the heavy legs of the last few days either. Magic.

    Coachy told us that 'we don't need to run our easy runs that hard' but smiled and agreed when I put it to him that, just sometimes, it's ok to let rip :) We have an easy week ahead and I think that contributed to it today, if we'd a hill session on Tuesday, no way would we have pushed it so hard.

    Weekly breakdown: about 28.5 miles incl
    4 days running
    1 hill session
    1 3k TT
    1 recovery run
    1 mlr

    Squats, sit ups, Myrtl and stretching boxes all ticked too.

    Week beg Mon 14th

    Rest
    Beginning of gastro bug: stomach cramps and flu-like achiness. At first I thought it was from something I ate - a shop bought fiery chicken wrap eaten on a completely empty stomach at 3pm. Hadn't eaten since breakfast at 7:30. I won't be trying Ososlo's intermittent fasting in a hurry, I HATE being hungry :mad:
    Cramps continued all night but with none of the other out-both-ends stuff that goes with food poisoning.

    Tue
    Achiness all over and continued cramps. Wisely or not, I decided to go ahead with the day's light session and to can it at any sign of 'not worth continuing' with this.

    5 miles:
    20 mins w/u (legs not great but kept pace v easy)
    6x200m on slight downhill (for leg turnover ;) ) with walk and jog back recovery
    10 mins w/d

    '200s' you say to yourself, 'ah only 6? Easy sesh....'

    200s are NOT easy, 200 is longer than you think! :D
    Despite legs not great on w/u and c/d these went ok and revved up from 38 first rep down to around 35. If you have to do a session under-par, 200s are the way to go; short, sharp and sweet.

    Wed
    2.5 mile angry run on way to pick up 5yo from school. Lots of out loud swearing and surging hard. Felt great :D
    Still crampy and achy but not on run.

    Thur
    Unscheduled rest
    Fartlek scheduled but postponed til Friday.
    Gastro hopefully on the way out.

    Fri
    Fartlek: 30 mins in total (incl rec) - 1/2/3/4/3/2/1 minute surges all sandwiched by 2 mins off
    Avg 6:30 per mile
    10 miles total incl 3mi w/u and around 2.5 c/d

    Satisfyingly good session. I did this in the GTs and tights on tarmac in Shanganagh Park. I know these three fields like back of my hand so was able to pick out roughly where each segment would take me to and was allowing roughly 400m for each 2 min rec. As it turned out, I was covering more than 400m on each 2 min recovery. I only really took my foot off the pedal on the recoveries straight after the 4 min surge. It didn't really hurt till the last two surges of 2 and 1 minutes.

    I used El C's tool of 'floating' and emptying the mind. It worked! Thanks El C! Maybe I have been overthinking the actual mechanics of running and not trusting that I can actually let it all wrap together without too much prompting. Still have to remind myself not to 'float off' mentally though :D

    A recovery run tomorrow and 12 miles on Sunday before the track work starts next week. Stretching, heel drops, squats, sit ups and mobility work all being done on a regular basis.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,383 ✭✭✭diego_b


    Love the angry run! I did one of those recently and pulled a muscle but thankfully cleared in a few days! Felt pretty silly afterwards but the run was great for a venting!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    diego_b wrote: »
    Love the angry run! I did one of those recently and pulled a muscle but thankfully cleared in a few days! Felt pretty silly afterwards but the run was great for a venting!

    They're great, aren't they?! Luckily mine was on a rural road so hopefully it went unheard and unseen! *hops over to your log to catch up and read about your angry run* :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,119 ✭✭✭Mrs Mc


    Nothing like an angry run helps me get through my working week on many an occasion !!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,383 ✭✭✭diego_b


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    diego_b wrote: »
    Love the angry run! I did one of those recently and pulled a muscle but thankfully cleared in a few days! Felt pretty silly afterwards but the run was great for a venting!

    They're great, aren't they?! Luckily mine was on a rural road so hopefully it went unheard and unseen! *hops over to your log to catch up and read about your angry run* :)

    Indeed you can't beat rural roads for such things!
    Side effect for me I have to tell many dogs to F off so good for a vent too. Every time I pick a new route I find even more dogs, I'm screwed if they gang up on me some day!
    Genuinely pick running routes some days as to which little so and so I want to deal with. Touch wood none has ever had a real go but you get right sneaky feckers that come out of nowhere!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    ^^^^ :D:D:D I growled (yes, growled!) at a little fecker crossing my path this afternoon and realised a lap later that 'the rat' may belong to one of the school mammies :o:D:D


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,009 ✭✭✭Firedance


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    ^^^^ :D:D:D I growled (yes, growled!) at a little fecker crossing my path this afternoon and realised a lap later that 'the rat' may belong to one of the school mammies :o:D:D

    Nooooooo! Poor doggy! Blame the owners not the dogs :D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Firedance wrote: »
    Nooooooo! Poor doggy! Blame the owners not the dogs :D

    Sorry FD, the growl stays...I love dogs, some of my best friends have been dogs, but not when I'm running :o:) And yes, I blame the owners too, how dare they unleash their dog on a spring day for some exercise in a vast public space.......


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,038 ✭✭✭Neady83


    Talk about a week with everything thrown at it, long run, fartlek, rage run, intervals and a tummy bug thrown in for good measure. I'd have been curled up in a ball with that bug, takes mental strength to get over that quickly, kudos.

    Are you seeing a difference in your racing or recoveries with all the stretching and mobility work?


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