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Is sexual abuse rampant in society?

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Comments

  • #32
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    haveringchick wrote: »
    That's the paedophiles main defence though.
    Which isnt a reason to dismiss the substance of that thesis.
    haveringchick wrote: »
    If it is the norm for humans to sodomise small children then why does the sodomy do such often fatal physical and emotional damage?
    If it was normal then why do the vast majority of adults have no desire to sodomise humiliate and denigrate a child?

    Being the norm doesnt mean all will have that disposition. It can be the norm even if only a small proportion do it. Some people do harm of all sorts to other people - this does seem the norm.
    The vaste majority of adults have no inclination for homosexuality, yet it is beyond dispute that a significant minority do. Homosexuality is 'normal'.


  • #33
    wexandproud
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,063 ✭✭✭wexandproud


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Which isnt a reason to dismiss the substance of that thesis.



    Being the norm doesnt mean all will have that disposition. It can be the norm even if only a small proportion do it. Some people do harm of all sorts to other people - this does seem the norm.
    The vaste majority of adults have no inclination for homosexuality, yet it is beyond dispute that a significant minority do. Homosexuality is 'normal'.

    we are as a society just starting to get a handle on what went on and now we have someone saying it could be 'normal '
    At least most people who are homosexual would wait until they are sexually aware or mature enough to engage in sexual activity , what chance did the kids have with these vile predators
    '.


  • #34
    haveringchick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,380 ✭✭✭haveringchick


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Which isnt a reason to dismiss the substance of that thesis.



    Being the norm doesnt mean all will have that disposition. It can be the norm even if only a small proportion do it. Some people do harm of all sorts to other people - this does seem the norm.
    The vaste majority of adults have no inclination for homosexuality, yet it is beyond dispute that a significant minority do. Homosexuality is 'normal'.

    Because I don't have the stomach for it I'm not going to entertain an argument in which, we've accepted that homosexuality is normal, thus, given enough time we will also accept that the rape of infants (it is rape you know, children can't give consent, and no, they can't tempt you, and no, they didn't enjoy being defiled by you) will be accepted as normal.


  • #35
    Canterelle
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 176 ✭✭Canterelle


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Which isnt a reason to dismiss the substance of that thesis.



    Being the norm doesnt mean all will have that disposition. It can be the norm even if only a small proportion do it. Some people do harm of all sorts to other people - this does seem the norm.
    The vaste majority of adults have no inclination for homosexuality, yet it is beyond dispute that a significant minority do. Homosexuality is 'normal'.

    Please do not equate homosexuality with child abuse. Axxhole. Sorry.


  • #36
    fatknacker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,342 ✭✭✭fatknacker


    If over 25% of the population have experienced sexual abuse, the surely a large percentage are also perpetrators.


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  • #37
    nacho libre
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭nacho libre


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Is is possible that it is the law that is out of step, and that 'abuse' (a rather bias laden term) is the norm for humans, and that it is only 'yesterday' in evolutionary terms that we have suddenly decided that it is abuse and a crime ?

    I see where you're going with this, you will conflate homosexual activity with paedophilia, by suggesting both are normal, but at one stage one was seen as abhorrent by many, so maybe the same will happen with paedophilia? well, i don't think so, because there is a crucial difference; homosexual activity between two adults is consensual, sexual activity between a child and adult is not consensual, therefore most people, aside from paedophiles, who act on their thoughts or those who wish to, will see it as abuse. With this in mind the use of the word abuse is not a biased laden term.


  • #38
    haveringchick
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,380 ✭✭✭haveringchick


    Canterelle wrote: »
    Please do not equate homosexuality with child abuse. Axxhole. Sorry.

    Don't be sorry. I'll say it too. A**hole.


  • #39
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,130 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    222233 wrote: »
    I'm just curious as to what constituted abuse at the time when many of these alleged crimes would have happened, I'm not talking about the blatant pedophiles but for example if my boss were to brush off me accidentally in work today in some cases that could constitute a form of abuse, were laws different then? And should that be taken into consideration when considering abuse cases today ?


    Look, no one is going to be agonising for years over whether to report someone for brushing off them. It's extremely rare for false accusations to be made and its attitudes like yours that stop people coming forward.


  • #40
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    Canterelle wrote: »
    Please do not equate homosexuality with child abuse. Axxhole. Sorry.
    haveringchick wrote: »
    Don't be sorry. I'll say it too. A**hole.



    I didnt equate them. Please reread my post and understand it, and apologise for the crude name calling.


  • #41
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,130 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    haveringchick wrote: »
    That's the paedophiles main defence though.
    If it is the norm for humans to sodomise small children then why does the sodomy do such often fatal physical and emotional damage?
    If it was normal then why do the vast majority of adults have no desire to sodomise humiliate and denigrate a child?



    He will probably say it is the stigma against child abuse in society that causes the emotional damage, not the abuse itself.

    Just because abuse is something people do, doesn't make it normal behaviour and it should never be considered as such given the amount of damage it causes.


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  • #42
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    nacho libre wrote: »
    I see where you're going with this, you will conflate homosexual activity with paedophilia, by suggesting both are normal, but at one stage one was seen as abhorrent by many, so maybe the same will happen with paedophilia? well, i don't think so, because there is a crucial difference; homosexual activity between two adults is consensual, sexual activity between a child and adult is not consensual, therefore most people, aside from paedophiles, who act on their thoughts or those who wish to, will see it as abuse. With this in mind the use of the word abuse is not a biased laden term.

    Thats not really where i was going actually. I was more questioning the use of the word 'normal'. If whatever naturally occurring trait, of which a tendency to child abuse undoubtedly seems to be one throughout the history of mankind, is indeed present in even a small but consistent portion of the population, then we must consider it a normal characteristic of being human. Though in this case, being one such as murder, etc, that the vast majority of the population abhor, civilisation and the rule of law brings us a society where we outlaw it and punish it to protect its potential victims. It still nevertheless remains an characteristic of the specie's instinct. Why, evolutionarily, I dont know.


  • #43
    Ice Maiden
    Closed Accounts Posts: 600 ✭✭✭Ice Maiden


    Well there was a time it was considered more normal than it is now - there is less and less acceptance of child sexual abuse as time goes on, so I do not think it will become the norm.


  • #44
    whatismyname
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,707 ✭✭✭whatismyname


    Graces7 wrote: »
    One problem is that abused people tend to go on to become abusers.

    Please don't...


  • #45
    arayess
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,707 ✭✭✭arayess


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Is is possible that it is the law that is out of step, and that 'abuse' (a rather bias laden term) is the norm for humans, and that it is only 'yesterday' in evolutionary terms that we have suddenly decided that it is abuse and a crime ?

    this is an interesting point but I disagree.

    That the law has caught up with protecting the person rather than accepting an act as normal.
    Certainly it seems more widespread than we'd like to believe but the overriding principal in recent times is to protect the person rather than allow the act.
    The consent aspect is absent here and we recognise as a society that you need a certain level of maturity to give consent .
    I've never seen an account where a child said that the sex with an adult was pleasant (despite the warblings of David Norris).
    Anything in court has always indicated fear and oppression to be the main traits of the act.
    Many things like robbery are normal but inflict suffering on other so the point falls down there.

    The same with rape , which was probably prevalent or rampant (to use the word in the OP's title) years ago as a common occurrence but the law now recognises that it's an attack on the person and legislates for this. Even now we legislate to protect within marriage.
    Canterelle wrote: »
    Please do not equate homosexuality with child abuse. Axxhole. Sorry.

    they didn't , you jumped on something without reading it.
    You should apologise


  • #46
    222233
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,114 ✭✭✭222233


    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    Look, no one is going to be agonising for years over whether to report someone for brushing off them. It's extremely rare for false accusations to be made and its attitudes like yours that stop people coming forward.

    I was simply asking what constituted abuse at the time, I don't have a bad attitude I just think there may be better ways of dealing with these cases.


  • #47
    Muahahaha
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,832 ✭✭✭✭Muahahaha


    I read before that something like 55% of sexual abuse that happens is perpetrated by someone within the family. What we see getting convicted in the courts may only the tip of the iceberg as many families would deal with allegations 'in-house' rather than getting the Gardai involved.


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