Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2015 Mod Note Post #2331

TheDoc · 19-02-2016 12:27PM

Surely Van Gaal can see the players flagging and floundering horrendously. As he said himself, not winning duels, last to every second ball. Be incredible if he just resigned, no quibbles or discussions, just handed in his resignation and left. Woodward clearly holding onto him for some bizzare reasoning at this stage.

Normally dropping a manager in a week with two upcoming knockout ties would be madness, but its actually madness keeping Van Gaal in place where the team will potentially exit two competitions.

Come this summer I do not want to see Van Gaal, Ryan Giggs, or Wayne Rooney at the club. Looking back Ferguson was giving Moyes the biggest break he would get. Free of Rooney, and outgoing Ferguson taking all the heat for it. Instead Moyes and Woodward did the opposite, and made Wayne Rooney one of the top 5 biggest paid football in the world. with the fees being paid by China we should cash in and send him off. And use his outragous salary to instead attract some world class talent like Neymar or Bale, or used to supplement the general squad recruitment.

And it will be last chance saloon for Woodward as well. If he doesn't get a plan in place and there being a clear trajectory of progress, he can **** off in 2017.

I'm now in that point of my fandom, where I've just ruled a line under some staff and players, and nothing is going to change my mind. I know most of you came to the Van Gaal conclusion quicker, but I'm there now.

bangkok · 19-02-2016 12:31PM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Bargains? If you want to be back to the top immediately then bargains can **** right off.
You can't have the best of both worlds.
All I hear are people saying "we want success, we want trophies now now now!"
Buying risk / potential is not going to give you that.
We have enough of potential (with the correct manager potential can lead to success) in the current squad so it's time to start taking the bull by the horns and buying big and mixing them into the team.
Kane has a proven goal-scoring record in the PL what more do you want?
This is actually a +point for Jose (I'm not all negative about him either) as at least he will go to the Board and say I want to spunk huge money on player X if we want to compete for the league next season.

players from Europe are a lot cheaper.

I would rather Ibrahimovic for 1 season than pay 60m for kane. I would love kane at the club, not for that price though.

Greizemann would cost around 50m. If Mourinho comes in Mata is gone. 25m Plus mata for Greizemann.

Sell Fellaini to China, 20m

Try and sign Mahrez from Leicester or Leroy Sane from Schalke for the right around 25m

Still need a centre half and a world class midfielder, you could get a relatively cheap centre back like Miranda from Inter Milan or Diego Godin from Athletico

then break the bank and go all out for Pogba

19-02-2016 12:35PM

bangkok wrote: »

players from Europe are a lot cheaper.

I would rather Ibrahimovic for 1 season than pay 60m for kane. I would love kane at the club, not for that price though.

Greizemann would cost around 50m. If Mourinho comes in Mata is gone. 25m Plus mata for Greizemann.

Sell Fellaini to China, 20m

Try and sign Mahrez from Leicester or Leroy Sane from Schalke for the right around 25m

Still need a centre half and a world class midfielder, you could get a relatively cheap centre back like Miranda from Inter Milan or Diego Godin from Athletico

then break the bank and go all out for Pogba

Sometimes your posts make my head sore

Ibra would carry insane wages and cost. And he's 34
Kane would probably cost the same or less and he's only 22 and I repeat he has a proven goal-scoring record in the PL (With the correct manager he could be developed and stay with the club for years)

Canadel · 19-02-2016 12:35PM

bangkok wrote: »

depending on the scouts etc you can pick up bargains...

Kante...5m
Mahrez 400k
rakitic 12m to barca
andre ayew free

probably loads more I cant even think of

harry kane was probably worth less than 5m 3 years ago, its up to United and the scouts to find the next harry kane. I would much rather pay 60m plus another 10 or 20m for a pogba or a bale

Problem at Utd is that money has become everything, even amongst the fans. I doubt you have to go back even two months to find many posts glorifying Ed Woodward for his ability to sign sponsorship deals with large brands like Adidas i.e. his job. All the while the football was a disaster and the transfer policy was turning out to be equally as disastrous. Yet he was being lauded for it. As if it was such a shock that these companies wanted to be associated with a worldwide brand like Utd. It was bizarre. Business is where Utd is now, and continues to be, but it was reputation that got it there. A reputation based on success. On trophies. There is only so long money can cover the cracks and continue to roll in. Yes, it can attract better players by offering better wages, but look at Di Maria and Falcao. Mercenaries. Money has its negatives too. Where was the scouting system concerning those two signings? Without using that money in a sensible manner regarding investment in the football side of things, it will become just as meaningless as the lack of success. If money is all Utd can offer, then why not go to teams with more money in the same league, why not go to China? Serious questions need to be asked right now at board level and amongst the fans. Thus far no answers are forthcoming and the club is slipping further and further into the abyss.

deaddonkey15 · 19-02-2016 12:37PM

bangkok wrote: »

players from Europe are a lot cheaper.

I would rather Ibrahimovic for 1 season than pay 60m for kane. I would love kane at the club, not for that price though.

Greizemann would cost around 50m. If Mourinho comes in Mata is gone. 25m Plus mata for Greizemann.

Sell Fellaini to China, 20m

Try and sign Mahrez from Leicester or Leroy Sane from Schalke for the right around 25m

Still need a centre half and a world class midfielder, you could get a relatively cheap centre back like Miranda from Inter Milan or Diego Godin from Athletico

then break the bank and go all out for Pogba

No good buying luxury players from the continent if we have no fighters in the squad. Need someone in the Keane/Vidic mould as much as we need a Griezmann or Mahrez, in fact probably more so.

bangkok · 19-02-2016 12:38PM

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

No good buying luxury players from the continent if we have no fighters in the squad. Need someone in the Keane/Vidic mould as much as we need a Griezmann or Mahrez, in fact probably more so.

Diego Godin would provide steal from the back, Pogba is a beast in the midfield, Ibra would be perfect for us for 1 season up top

bangkok · 19-02-2016 12:42PM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

Sometimes your posts make my head sore

Ibra would carry insane wages and cost. And he's 34
Kane would probably cost the same or less and he's only 22 and I repeat he has a proven goal-scoring record in the PL (With the correct manager he could be developed and stay with the club for years)

Wages yes probably looking at 200k a week, what costs? £10.4m for one season

Harry Kane, 60m transfer fee would also command wages around the same seeing as how he would be the 2nd most expensive transfer in premier league history. 5 year contract £52m + £60m transfer fee £112m total

also imagine Ibrahimovic United jersey sales for 1 season compared to Harry Kane...

Giggsy11 · 19-02-2016 12:44PM

Some of the posts are just laughable. It's on manager to use the players and improve them. Almost all the players are playing below their potential and worse than in their previous clubs. Can't blame Woodward, have to blame Van Gaal for not using them properly.

For example, Mahrez was not all that last season but this season he looked world beater, same with Vardy, Drinkwater, Huth. Firmino was poor when Rodgers was in charge but had some magical moments with Klopp.
Atletico madrid from having laughable defense to meanest defense and that too without signing anyone. Just Simeone knew how to use players.

I'm very much sure if we sign a proper manager who has clue on how to use players, our players look much better.

ElChe32 · 19-02-2016 12:44PM

Giggs can go and walk, sense of entitlement about him. Yes fantastic servant for the team but he had the option of going down the managerial path and working his way back to OT. Feck it even manage the u-18's u-21's. If he thinks he can just waltz into the hotseat off the back of sitting as a #2 I'll have no issue when he gets told thanks but no thanks.

Quandary · 19-02-2016 12:46PM

Giggsy11 wrote: »

I'm very much sure if we sign a proper manager who has clue on how to use players, our players look much better.

agree 100%

user2011 · 19-02-2016 12:47PM

Your Airbag wrote: »

I'm perfectly capable, you on the other hand.....

Ok I'll try a third time and lets see does the penny drop

It WAS a poor preformance but we were injury ravaged. So my first comment was about how poor the preformance was and then I acknowledged the injuries.

So a combination of BOTH. Sometimes we play poorly with a strong eleven, sometimes not. Thats the thing about football, lots of different factors come into it. So stop trying to put words into my mouth and listen.

Are you denying our injuries have an impact on the strenght and preformance levels of the team? Our injured first eleven would have been bettered than whats out there last night.

To ignore it all together is crazy, but hey, you just want the agree with me or your a fanboy stance, after all a UTD thread is not about discussion of such things right?

Listen to your own advice before trying to it dish out.

Think we're done here, enjoy your day.

Giggsy11 · 19-02-2016 12:48PM

Lord TSC wrote: »

https://twitter.com/Stirling061/status/700624545640640514

Ian Sterling (Vice-Chair of the Manchester United Supports Trust and IMUSA officer.): Reliably informed Giggs will walk if Mourinho appointed. Also, he won't take the job as interim. Reason for Woodward stalling?

Should let Giggs leave. Jose is not as horrible person as Giggs.

Kerrydude1981 · 19-02-2016 12:49PM

deaddonkey15 wrote: »

No good buying luxury players from the continent if we have no fighters in the squad. Need someone in the Keane/Vidic mould as much as we need a Griezmann or Mahrez, in fact probably more so.

Exactly,the team at the moment has no back bone,not enough lads that will stand up to be counted when the team is in a hole.

homerjay2005 · 19-02-2016 12:51PM

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Some of the posts are just laughable. It's on manager to use the players and improve them. Almost all the players are playing below their potential and worse than in their previous clubs. Can't blame Woodward, have to blame Van Gaal for not using them properly.

For example, Mahrez was not all that last season but this season he looked world beater, same with Vardy, Drinkwater, Huth. Firmino was poor when Rodgers was in charge but had some magical moments with Klopp.
Atletico madrid from having laughable defense to meanest defense and that too without signing anyone. Just Simeone knew how to use players.

I'm very much sure if we sign a proper manager who has clue on how to use players, our players look much better.

you have contradicted yourself completely here. on one hand you are blaming the manager and saying if we would have a proper manager things would look better, yet you are absolving Woodward from blame about who currently is our manager..

you not think its his job to see the failings and appoint said proper manager? as i already have said, lets ignore all other issues that people have towards Woodward, lets just focus on one - his current inability to sack a manager who would have been sacked by every other club in world football, many months ago.

i was happy to have Woodward remain at the club as head of commercial activity or accounting or whatever and have a proper CEO in place however with every passing day, it looks like perhaps for this club to progress we need him removed from the club completely as he looks increasing out of his depth when it comes to football matter at the top level.

he is excellent for accounting and signing new partnerships, but whats been allowed to happen in the last 3 months is totally unacceptable, unforgiveable and if it happened in any other large global identity, sackable. its quite sad as he could be a really good asset to the club, but now he is nothing more than a liability who is a key factor in us moving towards a mid-table PL side under his control.

Maximus Alexander · 19-02-2016 12:53PM

Now we're turning on a club legend for the sake of Jose fecking Mourinho over some random comment on twitter. :rolleyes:

Giggsy11 · 19-02-2016 12:54PM

homerjay2005 wrote: »

you have contradicted yourself completely here. on one hand you are blaming the manager and saying if we would have a proper manager things would look better, yet you are absolving Woodward from blame.

you not think its his job to see the failings and appoint said proper manager? as i already have said, lets ignore all other issues that people have towards Woodward, lets just focus on one - his current inability to sack a manage who would have been sacked by every other club in world football, many months ago.

i was happy to have Woodward remain at the club as head of commercial activity or accounting or whatever and have a proper CEO in place however with every passing day, it looks like perhaps for this club to progress we need him removed from the club completely as he looks increasing out of his depth when it comes to football matter at the top level.

he is excellent for accounting and signing new partnerships, but whats been allowed to happen in the last 3 months is totally unacceptable, unforgiveable and if it happened in any other large global identity, sackable. its quite sad as he could be a really good asset to the club, but now he is nothing more than a liability who is a key factor in us moving towards a mid-table PL side under his control.

I have already made is very clear that I blame Woodward for not sacking Van Gaal, not for signing those players who did well in their previous clubs. So there isn't any contradiction in my post as I was talking about transfer policy and use of players not Woodward as a CEO.

Lord TSC · 19-02-2016 12:56PM

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Now we're turning on a club legend for the sake of Jose fecking Mourinho over some random comment on twitter. :rolleyes:

In fairness, it's not just over a single twitter comment. The sentiment has been there for quiet a while now...

Trigger · 19-02-2016 12:56PM

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Now we're turning on a club legend for the sake of Jose fecking Mourinho over some random comment on twitter. :rolleyes:

So if the tweet/rumour is true, how do you reckon we solve the problem that is Giggs.

patmac · 19-02-2016 12:58PM

Kante would be the first name on the list to get, very much in the Keane/Viera mould, then build from there.

homerjay2005 · 19-02-2016 12:59PM

Maximus Alexander wrote: »

Now we're turning on a club legend for the sake of Jose fecking Mourinho over some random comment on twitter. :rolleyes:

who you talking about here, Giggs?

we dont know if its true or now (hence why many people have not commented on) but if it were to be true, then we have perhaps our reason why LVG is not being sacked.

i take it by your backing of Giggs, you also condone the multiple posters on here who have "turned" on another club legend by the name of Paul Scholes in recent months for simply stating how s*it out football is?

Giggsy11 · 19-02-2016 01:00PM

patmac wrote: »

Kante would be the first name on the list to get, very much in the Keane/Viera mould, then build from there.

Schneiderlin was like that at Southampton, averaging more tackles and interceptions than any player in the league.

bangkok · 19-02-2016 01:01PM

Nick Powell..... this is what we are dealing with

"No, I completely forgot - I was playing FIFA, if I was honest," Powell said when asked if he watched the 2-1 loss in the Europa League last-32.

"I did read the reports and, I don't know, it's hard. They're under pressure because the gaffer has come out and said it's the best way to qualify for the Champions League next year.

"They've had so many injuries, with Wazza (Wayne Rooney) going out and David (de Gea) was injured before the game.

"There's no excuse - they should have have won, but that's just the way it is."

It was an unusual admission from Powell - one which former Manchester United defender Steve Bruce laughed off as "typical Nick".

Pro. F · 19-02-2016 01:02PM

M!Ck^ wrote: »

There are more viable options that you may think;
Kane / Lukaku / Di Natale / Icardi / Aduriz / Ighalo / Eder / Higuan / Santos / Cavani / Vardy /

?!

Giggsy11 · 19-02-2016 01:04PM

Pro. F wrote: »

?!

I would highlight Icardi too

Maximus Alexander · 19-02-2016 01:04PM

astradave wrote: »

So if the tweet/rumour is true, how do you reckon we solve the problem that is Giggs.

If it were true and Giggs were somehow blocking the appointment of Jose I'd consider him a hero rather than a problem.

Maximus Alexander · 19-02-2016 01:06PM

homerjay2005 wrote: »

i take it by your backing of Giggs, you also condone the multiple posters on here who have "turned" on another club legend by the name of Paul Scholes in recent months for simply stating how s*it out football is?

On what basis do you take that?

The_Kew_Tour · 19-02-2016 01:07PM

Don't give a hoot what Giggs is sulking about if this is true.

No man is bigger then the club, never has or never will

Adamocovic · 19-02-2016 01:09PM

I think LVGs career and reputation are somehow keeping him his job. Other managers with less of a record would be gone at this point.

It really has been poor preparation to go into this year with a shallow squad depth. He can claim we are unlucky with injuries but surely the manager should prepare the squad by having the players there in case of injuries/form dips.

Even though I like LVG, this season has been a failure. Considering the amount spent and how his expectations or ambitions of the clubs finish have dropped so much it's surely a matter of time before he is gone.

Disappointing that it couldn't work out and worrying to how long before we are back to competiting.

Irishcrx · 19-02-2016 01:11PM

I'm beyond words really , just totally exasperated at everything that is going on at the club I love. Can't explain it , make sense of it. Seems the board have totally lost control and perspective altogether.

We all have our opinions on what we should be doing and hiring in an ideal situation , but the fact is we are far from in an ideal situation, we are at a crossroads now where we can either turn left and head down the Liverpool route for the next few seasons , squad gets worst , results continue this way , managers chop and change without ever adding anything , can't sign big players , Europa league at best.

Or the board grow some balls , drop the ego and fire LVG. I don't blame the man completely , it's a combination of everything , style of play , man management , transfer policy , lack of correct recruitment over the years, youth structure but the fact is he is not working out and the players have basically downed tools or can't arrest the decline with him in charge.

We need to challenge again , even in the short term we need to. We haven't really done it in 3-4 seasons now and how can you sell a global brand and attract the worlds best when your 6th or 7th every season , we need to at least stick our head back in the window and add a trophy or two...when we have done that , added some quality players then we can see where the chips fall and look long term , think about a Pocetthino or the likes.

But for what I said above , the here and now, the position we are , the laughing stock we have become , weather we all agree or like it or what not...Jose written all over it.

TheDoc · 19-02-2016 01:17PM

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Don't give a hoot what Giggs is sulking about if this is true.

No man is bigger then the club, never has or never will

I can rarely to never recall a situation where an assistant manager cast such a shadow over an established coach, and was essentially a replacement in waiting(in the eyes of the media and pundits)

The post Ferguson era has been a mess so far. Moyes had to contend with the Ferguson shadow, and Van Gaal is having to deal with Giggs.

I don't know what the relationship is like, or where Giggs stands. But there shouldn't be such a clamor for an assitant manager to take over, coming from fans, media, pundits or levels of the club.

For two regimes now Giggs has been an unnecessary distraction and side show, and as far as I'm concerned is as culpable as the managers involved, as he is part of the management team.

He should be cut along with Van Gaal, and allowed shape it in whatever PR way they want so that majority of fans don't comprehend what just happened.

I'm not saying this based on the tweet Lord TSC shared, it's just a clearly mental situation I've never been comfortable with. If he has grand designs to be a no.1 he needs to leave or be shown the door, to go work somewhere else and earn his crednetials and experience. If he stays at United post Van Gaal, then it should be under the clearest terms that he is an assistant and there is no opportunity to take the no.1 role, and that should be made clear by the club and the man himself, to stop this circus once and for all.

I don't see Everton, performing piss poorly this year, having a big circus about ditching Martinez and putting Duncan Ferguson in charge "because he understands the club".

Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2015 Mod Note Post #2331

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