Luas Drivers pay

bucketybuck · 10-02-2016 11:37AM

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I could probably do it blindfolded with one hand tied behind my back and my foot up my own hole, it's that easy.

You probably think you are being smart, but the cold reality is that on a scale of every job in Ireland, LUAS driver unquestionably falls at the "easier" end of the scale. Trying to pretend otherwise just makes you look silly.

Its a handy job that thousands would love the chance to do. Pretending otherwise is just denying reality.

sbsquarepants · 10-02-2016 11:37AM

Mint Sauce wrote: »

A Luas Tram may be on a smaller scale, but would be sure some of the same applies.

Its not exactly something you can swerve out of the way if the unexpected happens.

If the "unexpected" happens you don't need to worry too much - it's not your fault. All you need to worry about is red = stop, green = go keep an eye out for muppets on the track and remeber they also = stop.
It's hardly putting a man on the moon

screamer · 10-02-2016 11:38AM

Anyone aware how much train drivers are paid? Too much. It's this ridiculous culture of over paying non skilled jobs that cause the cost of public transport to be extortionate. So no they don't deserve extra pay for this type of job. If they don't like the increments move to other jobs like lots of people have to but do not over remunerate this sort of job it's simply not justifiable.

Lau2976 · 10-02-2016 11:42AM

I think it's painfully highlighting an unfortunate mindset of certain groups of people in this country.

Often times people who have been to the "university of life" or "college of hard knocks" who work low skilled jobs and expect to earn more then graduates.

The fundemental reason we pay graduates more is because they are seen as higher skilled and in more demand. Luas workers are not and should be receiving salaries that reflect that. Financial incentives can be very important for people when choosing a career, of course for others they just live what they do, why would someone spends years and get into debt to become a doctor when they can plod along driving a luas and earn more then they'd start out in after 5 years of education?

If anything there pay should be decreased. Right now the luas' route is quite minimal and the tickets are more expensive then the bus'. Their security isn't great and the customer service is crap.

fullstop · 10-02-2016 11:44AM

The Backwards Man wrote: »

Aye, that's what he said. Have to hold my hands up and bow his superior knowledge about how easy a job neither of us have ever done is. Credit where credit's due and all that.

Aye, I have to hold my hands up and bow to your superior knowledge about how difficult a job neither of us have ever done is. Credit where credit's due and all that.

The Backwards Man · 10-02-2016 11:50AM

bucketybuck wrote: »

You probably think you are being smart, but the cold reality is that on a scale of every job in Ireland, LUAS driver unquestionably falls at the "easier" end of the scale. Trying to pretend otherwise just makes you look silly.

Its a handy job that thousands would love the chance to do. Pretending otherwise is just denying reality.

I wouldn't call it the hardest job in the world but any means, granted, but it amuses me how anyone can call any job that requires alertness and full concentration at all times in a monotonous and repetitive environment 'easy'. Anybody that thinks that wouldn't know a day's work if it hit them on the head in my opinion.

Lau2976 · 10-02-2016 11:54AM

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I wouldn't call it the hardest job in the world but any means, granted, but it amuses me how anyone can call any job that requires alertness and full concentration at all times in a monotonous and repetitive environment 'easy'. Anybody that thinks that wouldn't know a day's work if it hit them on the head in my opinion.

Anybody dealing with public safety does that. Quality control in factories, fast food workers, other driving professions, etc. do all those workers deserve that type of pay?

Saint Sonner · 10-02-2016 11:56AM

I think the point is being missed in all of this – I think the drivers should be ashamed of themselves if they won’t do this job for between 36k-42k with bonuses and other benefits. They’re a disgrace as there are plenty of people out there desperate for jobs.

I wish the public would boycott the luas until such times as the drivers and union had manners!

Howard the Duck · 10-02-2016 12:01PM

Isn't the company running at a loss at the moment? If i worked for a private company that were making a loss i wouldn't think about asking for a large raise.
Also any increase on wages will be passed on to the customer with increases in tickets prices, i think the luas is expensive enough already more increases would be unreasonable i think.

bucketybuck · 10-02-2016 12:03PM

The Backwards Man wrote: »

I wouldn't call it the hardest job in the world but any means, granted, but it amuses me how anyone can call any job that requires alertness and full concentration at all times in a monotonous and repetitive environment 'easy'. Anybody that thinks that wouldn't know a day's work if it hit them on the head in my opinion.

Because everybody else knows that "Easy" is relative. It isn't a difficult concept.

Lollypop ladies need alertness and full concentration as well, but if news broke that they wanted €60000 p/a then the difficulty of their job and their level of training would also be put into a little perspective.

And your last line is just cringeworthy. It is far more likely that the people considering the job of LUAS driver to be relatively straightforward are comparing it to their own, more complicated jobs. It is only the lazy, entitled and deluded that would consider it to be a difficult job worthy of the figures quoted.

snickerpuss · 10-02-2016 12:06PM

screamer wrote: »

Anyone aware how much train drivers are paid? Too much. It's this ridiculous culture of over paying non skilled jobs that cause the cost of public transport to be extortionate. So no they don't deserve extra pay for this type of job. If they don't like the increments move to other jobs like lots of people have to but do not over remunerate this sort of job it's simply not justifiable.

So why are train drivers in the UK in private companies on similar amounts? Train driving in general is a well paid job. It isn't the same as driving a Luas, however.

JustShon · 10-02-2016 12:08PM

snickerpuss wrote: »

So why are train drivers in the UK in private companies on similar amounts? Train driving in general is a well paid job. It isn't the same as driving a Luas, however.

They're not actually, they're paid more. They get around £60k and our train drivers get around €60k.

Doesn't detract from your point, just worth pointing out.

However, for me the key point is that these are private companies paying those kinds of wages. Nobody's tax is funding those ridiculous wages, the train companies have to maintain themselves. If our train drivers strike for more money and the fares can't cover it you can be sure that extra money needed will come out of something else; healthcare, the gards, taxpayers' wages.

snickerpuss · 10-02-2016 12:14PM

JustShon wrote: »

They're not actually, they're paid more. They get around £60k and our train drivers get around €60k.

Doesn't detract from your point, just worth pointing out.

However, for me the key point is that these are private companies paying those kinds of wages. Nobody's tax is funding those ridiculous wages, the train companies have to maintain themselves. If our train drivers strike for more money and the fares can't cover it you can be sure that extra money needed will come out of something else; healthcare, the gards, taxpayers' wages.

The top of the 10 year pay scale for train drivers here is about €55k not 60. Also worth pointing out

Equally, it's good to point out that Irish Rail is underfunded when compared to other state railways around Europe. Fares could never fully fund the railway or all public transport and nor should they. It's a public service like the heath system/education etc. It's not there for profit.

VinLieger · 10-02-2016 12:26PM

Zero sympathy for them. If Transdev fired them and had to shut down operations for however many weeks to train new drivers id have less of a problem with being inconvenienced than I do cus of these delusional greedy eejits

Cookie_Dough · 10-02-2016 12:27PM

Driving a LUAS is hardly rocket science.

Demanding €60K+ for pulling a lever and following a track!

They DON'T interact with other traffic and if they do it's probably the result of a car on the track which probably wouldn't be regarded as their fault

They DON'T interact with passengers as they're locked safely in the drivers station at the front of the LUAS. I also thought the passengers were dealt with by security at the each stop and this was a private security on behalf of LUAS rather than being LUAS employees.

I'm sure learning the route is not that difficult, they're short enough in comparison with train routes from one end of the country to another.

As for the dramatics of having "100s and 1000s" of passengers lives precariously in their hands, bus drivers have the same and they have to deal with passengers, other traffic, pedestrians as well as cyclists on a daily basis, so do they also not deserve a big salary?

I would also think there is more skill to being a train driver due to the many different and long routes (esp the tube in London) so the comparison with Tube drivers is also pointless.

JustShon · 10-02-2016 12:27PM

snickerpuss wrote: »

The top of the 10 year pay scale for train drivers here is about €55k not 60. Also worth pointing out

Equally, it's good to point out that Irish Rail is underfunded when compared to other state railways around Europe. Fares could never fully fund the railway or all public transport and nor should they. It's a public service like the heath system/education etc. It's not there for profit.

Then UK train drivers are ahead of ours even more than I thought.

I agree, it's a public service and should be partially funded but I don't agree with Luas drivers / train drivers / bus drivers every so often deciding they want more money, holding the rest of us to ransom for that more money and then the rest of us also pay for the resulting increase in their wages through both taxes and resulting fare increases.

It's greedy is what it is. The drivers' cost of living hasn't risen by the amount of extra wages they want. They have no reasonable basis for wanting more pay beyond greed.

Michael D Not Higgins · 10-02-2016 12:49PM

Tram drivers in the UK start on £20,000, that's the benchmark they should be looking at.

snickerpuss · 10-02-2016 01:08PM

JustShon wrote: »

Then UK train drivers are ahead of ours even more than I thought.

I agree, it's a public service and should be partially funded but I don't agree with Luas drivers / train drivers / bus drivers every so often deciding they want more money, holding the rest of us to ransom for that more money and then the rest of us also pay for the resulting increase in their wages through both taxes and resulting fare increases.

It's greedy is what it is. The drivers' cost of living hasn't risen by the amount of extra wages they want. They have no reasonable basis for wanting more pay beyond greed.

Yes I agree with you fully there. I didn't support the train driver's strikes, I think they are being paid what they are worth and should be happy with that!

tobsey · 10-02-2016 01:20PM

If two Luas work together for 9 years, decide to buy a house together, the max they can get is about 260k. That buys feck all in Dublin. Certainly not a comfortable family home.

That's probably not Transdev's fault, or the Luas customer's fault, but it's the reality. 42k in Dublin is very different to 42k in the rest of the country.

SEPT 23 1989 · 10-02-2016 01:25PM

tobsey wrote: »

If two Luas work together for 9 years, decide to buy a house together, the max they can get is about 260k. That buys feck all in Dublin. Certainly not a comfortable family home.

That's probably not Transdev's fault, or the Luas customer's fault, but it's the reality. 42k in Dublin is very different to 42k in the rest of the country.

thats why this country is fecked and will never be competitive

what sort of house should a luas driver own 400-500k?

eeguy · 10-02-2016 01:25PM

tobsey wrote: »

If two Luas work together for 9 years, decide to buy a house together, the max mortgage they can get is about 260k. That buys feck all in Dublin. Certainly not a comfortable family home.

That's probably not Transdev's fault, or the Luas customer's fault, but it's the reality. 42k in Dublin is very different to 42k in the rest of the country.

Maybe they should spend a few years saving like the rest of us.

heebusjeebus · 10-02-2016 01:25PM

tobsey wrote: »

If two Luas work together for 9 years, decide to buy a house together, the max mortgage they can get is about 260k. That buys feck all in Dublin. Certainly not a comfortable family home.

That's probably not Transdev's fault, or the Luas customer's fault, but it's the reality. 42k in Dublin is very different to 42k in the rest of the country.

What does that matter? Why do they have to buy in Dublin?
The depots are close to the M50 so they dont need to live in Dublin city centre anyway.

Greyian · 10-02-2016 01:34PM

tobsey wrote: »

If two Luas work together for 9 years, decide to buy a house together, the max they can get is about 260k. That buys feck all in Dublin. Certainly not a comfortable family home.

That's probably not Transdev's fault, or the Luas customer's fault, but it's the reality. 42k in Dublin is very different to 42k in the rest of the country.

42k*2 => 84k
84k*3.5 => 294k

In order to secure the mortgage of 294k, they'd need:
73.5k in savings if they are not FTBs
46k in savings if they are first time buyers.

So if they are first time buyers, they could get a property for 340k, or 367,500 if they are not first time buyers.

If they hadn't saved sufficient deposits to get the full-sized mortgage (3.5*joint income)...well, that's their own fault really.

Michael D Not Higgins · 10-02-2016 01:34PM

tobsey wrote: »

If two Luas work together for 9 years, decide to buy a house together, the max they can get is about 260k. That buys feck all in Dublin. Certainly not a comfortable family home.

That's probably not Transdev's fault, or the Luas customer's fault, but it's the reality. 42k in Dublin is very different to 42k in the rest of the country.

Your maths are well off on this one. If they're each earning 42k, the max they can borrow is 294k but they'd also need a deposit of nearly 50k for a house price of 340k.

By the way this is well above the average household income in Ireland and is well able to buy a house in Dublin.

JustShon · 10-02-2016 01:35PM

tobsey wrote: »

If two Luas work together for 9 years, decide to buy a house together, the max mortgage they can get is about 260k. That buys feck all in Dublin. Certainly not a comfortable family home.

That's probably not Transdev's fault, or the Luas customer's fault, but it's the reality. 42k in Dublin is very different to 42k in the rest of the country.

Replace Luas driver with various other professions here, replace the €42k with the significantly lower wages of those professions and see if your point still holds water.

Permabear · 10-02-2016 01:45PM

This post has been deleted.

JustShon · 10-02-2016 01:53PM

Just heard on the radio that apparently it's to compensate for "anti-social hours."

I used to work in a cinema at very anti-social hours and I did it for minimum wage. Are we going to start paying cinema staff €42k per year now? What about workers in 24 hour McDonalds etc?

If they don't like anti-social hours they should get a 9 - 5 office job and take a pay of around €28k starting if you're lucky and have a qualification of some kind, or closer to minimum wage if you have no qualifications. Do these guys live in the real world?

CosmicSmash · 10-02-2016 01:54PM

Lau2976 wrote: »

I think it's painfully highlighting an unfortunate mindset of certain groups of people in this country.

Often times people who have been to the "university of life" or "college of hard knocks" who work low skilled jobs and expect to earn more then graduates. .

How dare anybody that hasn't been through college demand anything more than minimum wage. Just remember a lot of those people that have been to the university of life or college of hard knocks have probably subsided a lot of graduates. Not everybody is in a financial position to send their children to college.You come across as being very condescending in your post by the way, I just thought I'd let you know.

screamer · 10-02-2016 01:55PM

tobsey wrote: »

If two Luas work together for 9 years, decide to buy a house together, the max they can get is about 260k. That buys feck all in Dublin. Certainly not a comfortable family home.

That's probably not Transdev's fault, or the Luas customer's fault, but it's the reality. 42k in Dublin is very different to 42k in the rest of the country.

Commute then just because you want to live in Dublin doesn't mean you can ask the commuters.
You wouldn't get 42k in other parts id the country for this sort of job and if you did there would be people snapping your hand off for it. It's all relative.

JustShon · 10-02-2016 01:57PM

CosmicSmash wrote: »

How dare anybody that hasn't been through college demand anything more than minimum wage. Just remember a lot of those people that have been to the university of life or college of hard knocks have probably subsided a lot of graduates. Not everybody is in a financial position to send their children to college.You come across as being very condescending in your post by the way, I just thought I'd let you know.

They're not demanding more than minimum wage, they're demanding more than graduates. They're expecting to earn more for driving a vehicle that doesn't have to be steered than someone who develops websites and software.

Luas Drivers pay

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