Garda 'who lost her ambition due to PTSD awarded €75,000

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 15-12-2015 8:51pm

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/no-jail-for-man-who-left-female-garda-with-severe-injuries-647521.html

I mean, I guess it's just part of the job after all. 240 hours community service for 18 months out of work, 2 operations, and no longer being able to partake in your sports team. Why would you be even bothered trying to keep the peace when this is what happens when a case gets to court? She was dead right. Hope she enjoys spending every cent of it

duffman3833 · 15-12-2015 8:55pm

LexieOnRale wrote: »

http://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/no-jail-for-man-who-left-female-garda-with-severe-injuries-647521.html

I mean, I guess it's just part of the job after all. 240 hours community service for 18 months out of work, 2 operations, and no longer being able to partake in your sports team. Why would you be even bothered trying to keep the peace when this is what happens when a case gets to court? She was dead right. Hope she enjoys spending every cent of it

the injuries seem to be a lot worse as it effected her hip and knee but it doesn't mention about her claiming any money, a letter of apology that's all

cassid · 15-12-2015 8:59pm

The articles says before the assault that she was a confident Garda, it can take one event to change how you feel about yourself and the world you live in and this event was the assault in her case. If I was assaulted I would feel very vulnerable afterwards and she could have felt the same, she is a mother as well and you have stay safe and well so you can look after your children. I could see how the assault could effect her and it is easy to cast our opinion when we don't know her inner thoughts.

Not all counsellors are suited to treat PTSD, she might have felt she was getting nowhere.

Going to therapy for some people is not easy and then admitting to family, friends you are going to therapy can be met with mixed emotions, not everybody can be supportive. There can be some pull yourself together attitude to mental health. She may not have the most supportive environment around her.

marklazarcovic · 15-12-2015 9:00pm

anytime i see one of these threads i get the jist of 'FAAAAAACK I WISH ID GET SOMETHING' of them.

steddyeddy · 15-12-2015 9:01pm

PTSD is pretty serious OP and 75k is nothing really.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 15-12-2015 9:02pm

duffman3833 wrote: »

the injuries seem to be a lot worse as it effected her hip and knee but it doesn't mention about her claiming any money, a letter of apology that's all

Ah ok, I see.
Have you ever had your nose broken in an assault? Ever get up to go to work and have someone smash your face in?

Gatling · 15-12-2015 9:04pm

duffman3833 wrote: »

but it doesn't mention about her claiming any money,

That comes at a later date wouldn't be mentioned in a criminal case

SpaceSasqwatch · 15-12-2015 9:04pm

duffman3833 wrote: »

I wouldnt be looking for money tbh, just get the person behindwith bars that did it

FYP

duffman3833 · 15-12-2015 9:05pm

steddyeddy wrote: »

PTSD is pretty serious OP and 75k is nothing really.

i understand it can be serious but you have to question why make a claim? Is money the cure for PTSD? She had help but ended the therapy and decided to try claim and get money. Im sure there is more details to this story were missing, but from what i read, i think there is something not right about it

CamperMan · 15-12-2015 9:07pm

henryporter wrote: »

Let us know how you feel after you get assaulted OP

being a Gardai.. getting punched now and then should be expected in the line of duty..

mynamejeff · 15-12-2015 9:21pm

CamperMan wrote: »

being a Gardai.. getting punched now and then should be expected in the line of duty..

and should they be allowed to defend them selfs ? punch back ? or just take it goodnaturedly

what about nurses ? paramedics ? prison officers ?

considering that police are now considered a legitimate target by all sorts of scumbags and political nutjobs

RDM_83 again · 15-12-2015 9:22pm

marklazarcovic wrote: »

anytime i see one of these threads i get the jist of 'FAAAAAACK I WISH ID GET SOMETHING' of them.

True thats because many posters here will have suffered injury at this level or worse at the hands of scumbags and not seen a penny (and an awful lot of the time not even seen them charged)

ScumLord wrote: »

I don't think it would have made much difference here. The big GAA guard could just as easily been cold clocked if he was on his own with a violent criminal. If the issue here is she was left on her own, then she's fully entitled to the payment. No guard should be left vulnerable like that.

The GAA part was because some one who has been involved in hard physical contact sports would likely have taken a few sly or not so sly smacks on the field and been back out playing in a couple of weeks (not saying people should be assaulted in sports but it does happen)

15-12-2015 9:35pm

CamperMan wrote: »

being a Gardai.. getting punched now and then should be expected in the line of duty..

As has been stated here already, it is not part of the job description. No innocent person deserves to be assaulted ever, no matter whether they're at work, in uniform or not, or just walking down the street.
It says a lot about society when they think it's perfectly normal & expected for their guardians of the peace to be assaulted as part of their job.

Gardai expect to deal with criminals, that doesn't mean it ok for them to be assaulted by those criminals.

discus · 15-12-2015 9:41pm

CamperMan wrote: »

being a Gardai.. getting punched now and then should be expected in the line of duty..

Gardai are OUR team. They are the ones we pay to keep things in shape. Look at how life is like in the ****ty south american countries or africa, when you don't have decent men and women keeping law and order.

We shouldn't be questioning why she claimed, we should be questioning why someone thought it was acceptable to assault a Garda.

Icepick · 16-12-2015 9:26am

If a random assault is an extraordinary event and guards can get a fortune from the taxpayer afterwards, it's time to adjust their pension and salary entitlements in line with everybody else as the only justification is gone.

Icepick · 16-12-2015 9:28am

discus wrote: »

Gardai are OUR team. They are the ones we pay to keep things in shape. Look at how life is like in the ****ty south american countries or africa, when you don't have decent men and women keeping law and order.

We shouldn't be questioning why she claimed, we should be questioning why someone thought it was acceptable to assault a Garda.

If you think the only difference is the law and order, you have very little trust in human progress.

16-12-2015 9:34am

duffman3833 wrote: »

i understand it can be serious but you have to question why make a claim? Is money the cure for PTSD?

No more or less than it cures a broken arm or a back injury. Damages are not simply based on medical expenses.

Valetta · 16-12-2015 9:46am

Icepick wrote: »

If a random assault is an extraordinary event and guards can get a fortune from the taxpayer afterwards, it's time to adjust their pension and salary entitlements in line with everybody else as the only justification is gone.

How exactly are their pension and salary entitlements not in line with "everybody else" (who does this include?) ?

And since when was €75k a fortune?

gctest50 · 16-12-2015 9:50am

Icepick wrote: »

If a random assault is an extraordinary event and guards can get a fortune from the taxpayer afterwards, it's time to adjust their pension and salary entitlements in line with everybody else as the only justification is gone.

* water, water, water, eircode, eircode crap again ?

based on 1,000,000 taxpayers :

75,000 ÷ 1,000,000 = ?????

*

2Mad2BeMad · 16-12-2015 1:59pm

esforum wrote: »

I guarantee without any doubt this does not happen.

Secondly. You need not be a Garda, walk upto a scumbag and insult them, same result

Will I get 75k though?

superfurry1 · 16-12-2015 2:08pm

I do feel sorry for her with a broken nose she has little or no chance of getting on crimecall even as one of the guards pretending to be on a phone, and potentially meeting Mr Poppin'fresh :P

NachoBusiness · 16-12-2015 2:25pm

PTSD is over-diagnosed, based on my own experiences - but I do believe it exists.

Even if this woman doesn't have it though, I still think she deserves the €75k for her physical injuries.

asherbassad · 16-12-2015 2:37pm

BrokenArrows wrote: »

Bit of bull**** to be fair.

Joining the Gardai has a certain amount of danger to it. You shouldn't be allowed to sue for doing your job and the down sides that come with it.

The Gardai should be giving her free counseling and nothing more.

Can the employee who started working for Lidl as a cash register sue because they lost ambition for management due to dealing with ****ty customers all day.

I love this. Any chance to turn the tables on a victim.
I can imagine in another thread if someone was getting the tar beaten out of them by a Garda you'd be all "The Gardai do a dangerous job to protect us all.....WAAAHHH....they shouldn't have to deal with scrotes! ...WAAAHH!!"

Then the next day the same Garda is beating a "scrote" and gets a broken nose and then gets compensation and you're all "WAAAAHHH...he shouldn't have joined the force if he didn't expect some danger...WAAAAHH! Shouldn't be getting anything!! WAAAHHH!"

Little CuChulainn · 16-12-2015 2:44pm

duffman3833 wrote: »

i understand it can be serious but you have to question why make a claim? Is money the cure for PTSD? She had help but ended the therapy and decided to try claim and get money. Im sure there is more details to this story were missing, but from what i read, i think there is something not right about it

Medical expenses and loss of earnings make up a good portion of Garda compensation cases. Most Gardaí would be happy if the state covered their wages and medical bills after an injury on duty, especially if they are only out for a few weeks. Unfortunately the state won't do this so the Garda has to hire a solicitor and sue the state. Great system really.

Mesrine65 · 16-12-2015 3:03pm

NachoBusiness wrote: »

PTSD is over-diagnosed, based on my own experiences - but I do believe it exists.

May I ask what your own experiences are NB?

I'm a combat veteran who was diagnosed with PTSD 15 years after the events, that was exacerbated by the sudden death of my son...it definitely exists, I can assure you.

It's no fun reliving traumatic events...distressing thoughts, nightmares & flashbacks where you feel like it’s happening again.

Experiencing extreme emotional & physical reactions, panic attacks, uncontrollable shaking, heart palpitations...suicidal thoughts, self harming etc.

Negative changes in thoughts & mood, persistent feelings of fear, guilt, shame.

Diminished ability to experience positive emotions & feeling detached from others, withdrawing from friends & family, losing interest in everyday activities.

Irritability, anger, reckless behavior, hypervigilance were all part & parcel of the experience for me.

Cognitive behaviour therapy with a good therapist, regulation of meds (a long time finding the correct meds/dosage) & the support of my OH/family, brought me back from the brink, the only alternative for me was ending the pain by whatever means...

An intervention by my OH/family saved me from taking the alternative option, an option in my mind that was always only a mood swing away.

esforum · 16-12-2015 3:07pm

2Mad2BeMad wrote: »

Will I get 75k though?

well sure that completely depends doesnt it? How effected were you? Are you female? physically obvious injuries on the face attract a higher compensation for women than men as its considered harsher them being the fairer sex compared to us ugly-as-sin-from-birth men then theres the emotional damage.

Anyone with training or experience in emotional / mental trauma will tell you people respond in different ways. Some people would brush themselves off from an incident like this but carry it internally for life, others may be visible upset and unable to function similar in some respects to rape victims. An emotional or visible manner of a victim following an assault cannot be taken as an indication of the level of trauma. Thats why the experts are paid so generously to get to the root of the issue

Sleepy · 16-12-2015 3:07pm

Why are the state paying the compensation rather than the scumbag who hit her?

Lone Stone · 16-12-2015 3:14pm

Having had PTSD brought on by being held up in an armed robery when i was in my early 20's i know how hard and life destroying it can be, but i wasnt a gardi and i kinda think its your job to be in those situations you signed up for it surely that would involve a lot of training and preparation for such situations that said you never know how you will react once your in one, but i dont get how she is compensated for it resulting in not getting a promotion.. did she have to leave her job over it ? if so then fair enough other wise its just a bit strange.

esforum · 16-12-2015 3:27pm

jmayo wrote: »

Ahh FFS.
If someone was disabled to such and extent they had to be in a wheelchair it is taken as a given that they will receive compensation.

If you want to be the person that decides this, get a medical or law degree then become a doctor or lawyer or barrister or judge because 2 doctors, 1 psychiatrist, at least 2 solicitors, 2 barristers and a Judge all agreed that she deserved compensation

jmayo wrote: »

Ahh FFS.
It is kinda of expected that being a police officer means you are liable to run into criminals, some of whom could be violent.
It is like saying a fire man isn't expected to be exposed to fire..

I assume then that you disagree with the families of the firemen in Bray getting compensated and the council being prosecuted? they were killed in a fire after all.

Being exposed to and being injured or killed by are not the same thing.

jmayo wrote: »

Ahh FFS.
This lady was no Garda Golden and please don't try and spin it as such.
:mad:

Yes, yes she is. She risked her safety for others in the line of duty and you can pretend to be offended or angry, you are the one belittling my colleagues.

jmayo wrote: »

Ahh FFS.
No this case is much like the army band milking the state because they claimed they got deaf from playing their instruments.

You do realise that was actually not true dont you? That army deafness claims were because the military didnt issue the correct ear protection during live round training despite a law from the 1950's saying they had to? It was plain and simple employer negligence simple as. No different to the guy on tv who falls because he was given the wrong ladder.

You are just one bitter bitter, drag everyone down person.

BenedrylPete · 16-12-2015 3:35pm

Somebody nicked her mojo baby.

esforum · 16-12-2015 3:49pm

Sleepy wrote: »

Why are the state paying the compensation rather than the scumbag who hit her?

why does the motor insurance bureau and not the uninsured driver pay out if you are hit by one?

Why do we have a Scheme of Compensation for Personal Injuries Criminally Inflicted?

osarusan · 16-12-2015 4:26pm

Is she suing the state because the state was at fault in this particular case, or is that just the terminology used to describe how a garda gets compensated after receiving an injury?

16-12-2015 4:31pm

osarusan wrote: »

Is she suing the state because the state was at fault in this particular case, or is that just the terminology used to describe how a garda gets compensated after receiving an injury?

Presumably a case taken under the Garda Siochana Compensation Act, they always just say suing the state.

esforum · 17-12-2015 11:19am

Bethany Flaky Tendon wrote: »

No.

Cops have always been quick to sue.

Really? Can you supply evidence that supports this claim that Gardai are quick to sue more or even equal to other services?

Bear in mind during the last CSO statistics Gardai were found the be amongst the best performers when it came to missed days due to being sick and/or injured

osarusan · 17-12-2015 11:44am

bubblypop wrote: »

Presumably a case taken under the Garda Siochana Compensation Act, they always just say suing the state.

So this is just standard practice when a garda gets compensated for injuries received while on the job?

If so, I don't see any problem with it at all.

Paramite Pie · 17-12-2015 1:09pm

RayM wrote: »

If one of those customers punches him or her in the face, resulting in an injury that required surgery and harmed their future promotion chances, then yes, definitely.

And who do they sue exactly? The assailant or the workplace? If you say the latter then your just being ridiculous. But by all means sue the person who harmed you.

One eyed Jack wrote: »

Hopefully it might have AGS review their procedures to protect Gardaí in carrying out their duties without risk of being assaulted. No Garda should have to accept the risk of being assaulted.

The article gives no evidence to indicate that AGS procedures were at fault. You can only minimise the risk of assault so much -- people are unpredictable.

Paulzx wrote: »

What?..................that someone who gets assaulted and injured receives compensation?

I think that precedant has been set long ago

But they didn't sue the person who assaulted them??

Paulzx wrote: »

Being a Guard means there is distinct possability that there can be dangers whilst on duty. It doesn't mean that the consequences of these dangers can just be written off as "part of the job" if there are long term affects

Sometimes there isn't someone to blame when things go wrong, the impression the article gives is that the AGS provided all that they could to assist the Garda.

esforum · 17-12-2015 3:51pm

Paramite Pie wrote: »

And who do they sue exactly? The assailant or the workplace? If you say the latter then your just being ridiculous.

http://img.chan4chan.com/img/2009-11-07/mofoyh4au3.gif

Paramite Pie · 17-12-2015 3:59pm

esforum wrote: »

http://img.chan4chan.com/img/2009-11-07/mofoyh4au3.gif

I did - I'm well aware the state is the one being sued -- but I can't see how anyone could justify it, unless AGS could be found to be at fault.

17-12-2015 4:01pm

Paramite Pie wrote: »

I did - I'm well aware the state is the one being sued -- but I can't see how anyone could justify it, unless AGS could be found to be at fault.

She took a claim under the Garda Compensation Act.

osarusan · 17-12-2015 4:01pm

Paramite Pie wrote: »

I did - I'm well aware the state is the one being sued -- but I can't see how anyone could justify it, unless AGS could be found to be at fault.

Somebody suggested that this is just the process by which gardai are compensated for injuries which happen on the job (rather than there being a claim of some kind of fault/failure on their part).

esforum · 17-12-2015 5:32pm

Paramite Pie wrote: »

I did - I'm well aware the state is the one being sued -- but I can't see how anyone could justify it, unless AGS could be found to be at fault.

Read it again, its been explained time anf time again that

A, Its under the Garda compensation Act

B, That where an incident occurs in a premises the premises can be sued

c, Even where theres no third party that can be held liable theres a victim compensation system

Icepick · 19-12-2015 1:15pm

Valetta wrote: »

How exactly are their pension and salary entitlements not in line with "everybody else" (who does this include?) ?

A member who joined after the 1st April 2004 may retire on reaching 55 years of age subject to having completed 30 years approved service.

A member who joined before 1st April 2004 may retire on reaching 50 years of age subject to having completed 30 years approved service.

whereas

The State Pension (Contributory) is paid to people from the age of 66 who have enough Irish social insurance contributions. It is not means-tested. You can have other income and still get a State Pension (Contributory). This pension is taxable but you are unlikely to pay tax if it is your only income.

and

THE cost of buying a garda's pension on the open market would amount to €1.1m, new figures reveal.

But the garda will only have contributed €110,000, or 10pc, to their pension even after the imposition of the pensions levy, according to research carried out by actuary Fiona Daly of Rubicon Investment Consulting.

Valetta wrote: »

And since when was €75k a fortune?

€75k from a party that didn't cause this is a fortune
€75k for a broken nose is a fortune

melissak · 19-12-2015 9:44pm

How does this compensation compare to say a doctor/nurse/other civil servant taking a similar case? She was assaulted at work and is absolutely entitled to claim compensation like anyone else. Whether the judge gave her the appropriate compensation I do not know
What the norm would be but I have heard of some huge payouts for more minor incidents.

esforum · 19-12-2015 10:02pm

Icepick wrote: »

and

€75k from a party that didn't cause this is a fortune
€75k for a broken nose is a fortune

Just too point out, there was never any actual evidence to back up this miracle 1.1 million figure. Garda rank pension is between 16 and 20 grand per annum. The way they are calculated, some allowance but not all are pensionable so some will have a better pension than others.

The number used in the article is that you will have a pensionable pay on retirement of over 52 grand per year. No one of Garda rank is earning that much pensionable. yeah with overtime and all their allowances they will but only about half the earnings are taken into consideration for pension calculations.

now, Gardai pay 6% every week to their pensions and also pay 7% pension levy which is basically a public sector tax so they are paying 13% per week towards a thing with 'pension' in the name. Which again, puts the numbers in the article off as they claim gardai only pay 3% per week towards their pension.

Garda pensions are taxable just like everyone elses

Now, the one that really boils my piss when it comes to rag reporting. Unlike a private pension, Gardai cannot also avail of the state pension even though they pay full PRSI, again a little fact that wasnt allowed get in the way of bull**** journalism who used a two man band in a new company to make a startling finding. The company wasnt nuetral and they were using a lot of grossly overestimated guesses. take that 166 per week or 8500 per annum out of garda pensions and what they are actually getting over and above their prsi paid pension is possible 12 grand per year. Just how ****ing long do they think Gardai live after retirement?

Considering they are unlikely to be made redundant and most have private medical insurance (everyone would if O'Reilly had his way) and you have to wonder what they are paying PRSi for in the first place.

Before I joined AGS I was paying 8% per week into a private fund and it was based on needing 1/2 retirement pay in addition to the old age pension.

But besides all that, AGS is recruiting. if its a great job with huge money for easy work, join!

Icepick · 20-12-2015 11:04am

esforum wrote: »

Just too point out, there was never any actual evidence to back up this miracle 1.1 million figure. Garda rank pension is between 16 and 20 grand per annum. The way they are calculated, some allowance but not all are pensionable so some will have a better pension than others.

The number used in the article is that you will have a pensionable pay on retirement of over 52 grand per year. No one of Garda rank is earning that much pensionable. yeah with overtime and all their allowances they will but only about half the earnings are taken into consideration for pension calculations.

now, Gardai pay 6% every week to their pensions and also pay 7% pension levy which is basically a public sector tax so they are paying 13% per week towards a thing with 'pension' in the name. Which again, puts the numbers in the article off as they claim gardai only pay 3% per week towards their pension.

Garda pensions are taxable just like everyone elses

Now, the one that really boils my piss when it comes to rag reporting. Unlike a private pension, Gardai cannot also avail of the state pension even though they pay full PRSI, again a little fact that wasnt allowed get in the way of bull**** journalism who used a two man band in a new company to make a startling finding. The company wasnt nuetral and they were using a lot of grossly overestimated guesses. take that 166 per week or 8500 per annum out of garda pensions and what they are actually getting over and above their prsi paid pension is possible 12 grand per year. Just how ****ing long do they think Gardai live after retirement?

Considering they are unlikely to be made redundant and most have private medical insurance (everyone would if O'Reilly had his way) and you have to wonder what they are paying PRSi for in the first place.

Before I joined AGS I was paying 8% per week into a private fund and it was based on needing 1/2 retirement pay in addition to the old age pension.

But besides all that, AGS is recruiting. if its a great job with huge money for easy work, join!

No justification to retire at 50/55 still.

Little CuChulainn · 20-12-2015 3:26pm

Icepick wrote: »

No justification to retire at 50/55 still.

That the best response you can muster?

mynamejeff · 20-12-2015 5:56pm

Icepick wrote: »

No justification to retire at 50/55 still.

30 or 35 years of working 10 hour days min 6 days on four days off.

Finishing at 7 am and that counts as your off day.

At the beck and call of the courts Judges an solicitors regardless of roosters.

Basic unsuitable or flat out lack of equipment

One of the smallest per capita in Europe (armed and unarmed )

Lack of political support

Lack of judicial support

Near mathematical certainty that you will be assaulted at least twice during your term of employment

Having 23 percent of you wage cut halfway through your contract while legally disqualified from taking part in the negotiations

Dealing with Physically and mentally draining situations on a daily and weekly basis

Sure they signed up for it right ?

thebaz · 20-12-2015 7:29pm

henryporter wrote: »

Let us know how you feel after you get assaulted OP

I've had numerous punches to the nose - including from a member of the Garda - this is just another example of our crazy nanny state , violence is part of life , especially if you join the defence force, but in Ireland we expect to be compensated for any of lifes ills.

mynamejeff · 20-12-2015 7:36pm

thebaz wrote: »

I've had numerous punches to the nose - including from a member of the Garda - this is just another example of our crazy nanny state , violence is part of life , especially if you join the defence force, but in Ireland we expect to be compensated for any of lifes ills.

So people keep punching you in the face eh ? hmmmmm

thebaz · 20-12-2015 7:42pm

mynamejeff wrote: »

So people keep punching you in the face eh ? hmmmmm

over the years , had a few digs , playing football, rugby , and when I used to drink , especially London 20 years ago , nearly every weekend there would be a punch up in the bar , nothing too serious

Garda 'who lost her ambition due to PTSD awarded €75,000

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