Pregnant and moving to Ireland to start a new job. Should I tell?

armabelle · 11-12-2015 05:42PM #1

Hi everyone. My wife and I are moving to Ireland because she got a job offer and is due to begin in one month. Just recently we found out that she is 9 weeks pregnant and that we are going to have our 2nd baby. As happy as we are about this news we are also concerned about what this means for her job and how her employer may react while discovering this during her probation period which is 6 to 10 months long. Should we say something before we go over or just go and say something only when it is absolutely necessary?

thanks in advance

Stheno · 11-12-2015 06:34PM

She is probably best to tell them when she starts, from a health and safety perspective if nothing else.

She cannot be let go because she is pregnant, however I'm unsure if she can be let go during probation if there are performance related issues, most companies would be wary of doing so if a woman is pregnant as they would potentially face a claim.

What sort of company is it? Large/small/multinational? Does the company provide maternity benefits?

Bandana boy · 11-12-2015 06:38PM

It would be pretty rare for Maternity benefits to kick in your first year anyway .My company has one of the most generous in the market but you only get access after your 3rd year.

So as it will not likely cost them money ,I do not see a huge issue I would tell at 3 months as is standard.

I have one of my team who told me one week in too a new job that she was pregnant , was zero issue and most companies would be very progressive on this topic these days.

screamer · 11-12-2015 06:54PM

Be honest. Yes they can't let her go because she is pregnant but they can let her go for a load of other reasons up to the first 12 months as a new employee you have very few rights and employer can just let you go if they want to and very little you can do about it.

jimmycrackcorm · 11-12-2015 11:55PM

screamer wrote:

Be honest. Yes they can't let her go because she is pregnant but they can let her go for a load of other reasons up to the first 12 months as a new employee you have very few rights and employer can just let you go if they want to and very little you can do about it.

No sane employer would let a pregnant woman go during probation as it leaves an open question about pregnancy being the real reason. However she could definitely expect to have the probation extended.

davo10 · 12-12-2015 08:58AM

You should tell them of a number of reasons:
• Health & Safety, they have to do a work place risk assessment for you.
• Courtesy, they have placed their faith in you when they hired you, they deserve to be informed as early as possible that special arrangements may be necessary and that any projects you start, you may not be able to complete while on maternity leave.
• As long as you don't tell them, they don't "know" you are pregnant but once they suspect you are, they can let you go for performance issues and then claim they were unaware you were pregnant as you did not notify them. The potential for morning sickness and the refusal to take alcohol at work related social events are giveaways long before the bump shows.

armabelle · 12-12-2015 12:47PM

Stheno wrote: »

She is probably best to tell them when she starts, from a health and safety perspective if nothing else.

She cannot be let go because she is pregnant, however I'm unsure if she can be let go during probation if there are performance related issues, most companies would be wary of doing so if a woman is pregnant as they would potentially face a claim.

What sort of company is it? Large/small/multinational? Does the company provide maternity benefits?

Hi and thanks for getting back to me. The company is a big multinational company and there is nothing in the contract that speaks about maternity benefits. Is this weird? We thought about asking the HR guy could be the same as telling them that she is pregnant so not sure that that is the way to go since she hasnt even begun working. Since by law you are only required to give 15 weeks, we would like to do that or at least let her start the job before she tells in the hope that her performance will shine out the fact that she needs to go on leave during her probation.

armabelle · 12-12-2015 12:51PM

Bandana boy wrote: »

It would be pretty rare for Maternity benefits to kick in your first year anyway .My company has one of the most generous in the market but you only get access after your 3rd year.

So as it will not likely cost them money ,I do not see a huge issue I would tell at 3 months as is standard.

I have one of my team who told me one week in too a new job that she was pregnant , was zero issue and most companies would be very progressive on this topic these days.

This makes sense thank you. What you said about the maternity benefits also might explain why nothing is mentioned in the contract? It is probable that there are no benefits....yet. We don't mind not receiving benefits but we just don't want her to lose her job. Since we are mostly moving to Ireland for work and this is a big commitment we are being cautious.

armabelle · 12-12-2015 01:08PM

jimmycrackcorm wrote: »

No sane employer would let a pregnant woman go during probation as it leaves an open question about pregnancy being the real reason. However she could definitely expect to have the probation extended.

In the "Maternity Protection Act" it says that if she has to go on leave during probation she would have to complete the leave when she returns which is fine by us. As I said above, we don't really care about the benefits and don't even feel entitled to receive any benefits from anybody. All we want is for her to not be discriminated against and for her to keep her job after she has the baby. Since the company does not pay her maternity leave (it seems), they don't really lose out in that way but they will lose having her at work which may or may not be a problem for them and it if is a problem for them it may or may not be a problem enough for them to get rid of her for "other" made-up reasons.

The thing is, when she starts work she will be in her 2nd trimester so will definitely show she is pregnant somewhat. Maybe she could hide it for a while but not too long. I guess you could say "so what?" but we just don't know at what point it is best to tell them.

armabelle · 12-12-2015 01:16PM

davo10 wrote: »

You should tell them of a number of reasons:

• As long as you don't tell them, they don't "know" you are pregnant but once they suspect you are, they can let you go for performance issues and then claim they were unaware you were pregnant as you did not notify them. The potential for morning sickness and the refusal to take alcohol at work related social events are giveaways long before the bump shows.

This is a good point but I keep thinking that if she starts working and tells them after a month or two....

1) They will see she is good at her job
2) They will know her in person
3) A replacement person will be out of the picture. In recruitment there is usually a runner-up. someone who didn't get the job that might still be interested. It would be easy to fall back on this person now IMO.

What do you think?

cerastes · 12-12-2015 01:16PM

davo10 wrote: »

You should tell them of a number of reasons:
• Health & Safety, they have to do a work place risk assessment for you.
• Courtesy, they have placed their faith in you when they hired you, they deserve to be informed as early as possible that special arrangements may be necessary and that any projects you start, you may not be able to complete while on maternity leave.
• As long as you don't tell them, they don't "know" you are pregnant but once they suspect you are, they can let you go for performance issues and then claim they were unaware you were pregnant as you did not notify them. The potential for morning sickness and the refusal to take alcohol at work related social events are giveaways long before the bump shows.

Personally I think its all very deceitful of the OP, I dont think this kind of thing should be tolerable, either knowing or suspecting you might be pregnant and holding out till inevitable benefits kick in.
Some other poster said 3 years, before benefits kick in, I think that sounds like a lot but I think of at least 1 year, in line with when other rights kick in. It's unfair to the employer, mostly I wouldn't be so willing to defend employers but, this is outright deceit and Ive come across examples of it where people have blantantly strung jobs along using this example, it ends up being carried on the shoulders of other employees and the employer.
As for decline alcohol at work events, thats a matter of individual choice to drink or not.

armabelle · 12-12-2015 01:19PM

cerastes wrote: »

Personally I think its all very deceitful of the OP, I dont think this kind of thing should be tolerable, either knowing or suspecting you might be pregnant and holding out till inevitable benefits kick in.
Some other poster said 3 years, before benefits kick in, I think that sounds like a lot but I think of at least 1 year, in line with when other rights kick in. It's unfair to the employer, mostly I wouldn't be so willing to defend employers but, this is outright deceit and Ive come across examples of it where people have blantantly strung jobs along using this example, it ends up being carried on the shoulders of other employees and the employer.
As for decline alcohol at work events, thats a matter of individual choice to drink or not.

Please can you read my other posts. I am sure you will withdraw what you said here. We don't care about benefits.

davo10 · 12-12-2015 01:20PM

Op, your partner only has protection from being discriminated against once she officially informs her employer of her pregnancy. Until you inform them, she is not protected so if the terminate her contract before you inform them, you will not be able to claim discrimination as technically they do not know she is pregnant. If they guess she is and get pissed off that you didn't inform them and terminate her contract, they could claim no discriminated existed as they did not know she was pregnant.

Look, you are going to have to tell them at some stage, if you want protection from potential discrimination, then tell them immediately.

armabelle · 12-12-2015 01:24PM

davo10 wrote: »

Op, your partner only has protection from being discriminated against once she officially informs her employer of her pregnancy. Until you inform them, she is not protected so if the terminate her contract before you inform them, you will not be able to claim discrimination as technically they do not know she is pregnant. If they guess she is and get pissed off that you didn't inform them and terminate her contract, they could claim no discriminated existed as they did not know she was pregnant.

Look, you are going to have to tell them at some stage, if you want protection from potential discrimination, then tell them immediately.

I hear you but I think we will at least wait until she begins working. Hmmmm...What about starting work and then telling them in the 1st week or two? They couldn't possible know in such a short space that she was pregnant. That way they will meet her and she will be part of the team etc etc?

I have to also tell you a funny story.... this is not the first time something like this has happened. About two years ago, she was offered a job for the same company and she had just found out she was pregnant with our first child. At the time she was employed and didn't want to lose her current job by going into a probation in a new job. She also did not want to hide anything. What happened? She told and they didn't hire her. In this case she did not have a contract yet but they had selected her. She was sure about that. We felt so stupid because we should have waited to have the contract so they could not use the one excuse that they did use which was that they found a local candidate more suitable (she was in another country at the time)

so having said that, please try understand our concern...What would you do?

davo10 · 12-12-2015 01:29PM

armabelle wrote: »

I hear you but I think we will at least wait until she begins working. Hmmmm...What about starting work and then telling them in the 1st week or two? They couldn't possible know in such a short space that she was pregnant. That way they will meet her and she will be part of the team etc etc?

If she works with other women, they will know. Once the contract is signed, you cannot be discriminated against. Is your partner employed in a contract of indefinite duration or is it a fixed term contract?

Lisha · 12-12-2015 01:29PM

For the best chance for your wife to keep the job in the long run I would say to tell them ASAP.
Anything else just looks dishonest and leaves a bad taste in the employers mouth.

armabelle · 12-12-2015 01:31PM

davo10 wrote: »

If she works with other women, they will know. Once the contract is signed, you cannot be discriminated against. Is your partner employed in a contract of indefinite duration or is it a fixed term contract?

Indefinite contract but the contract does say that there is a probation for 6 months which can be extended to 10 months

armabelle · 12-12-2015 01:32PM

Lisha wrote: »

For the best chance for your wife to keep the job in the long run I would say to tell them ASAP.
Anything else just looks dishonest and leaves a bad taste in the employers mouth.

hey Lisha thanks a lot for your reply and suggestion... please read my post above and try to understand what that tasted like two years ago LOL. Would you still tell them ASAP?

davo10 · 12-12-2015 01:34PM

armabelle wrote: »

hey Lisha thanks a lot for your reply and suggestion... please read my post above and try to understand what that tasted like two years ago LOL. Would you still tell them ASAP?

Ok, let's look at this another way, what benefit is it to you not to tell them if the contract is already signed? The longer you don't tell them, the less protection against discrimination your wife has as well as health & safety/risk assessment issues.

armabelle · 12-12-2015 01:59PM

davo10 wrote: »

Ok, let's look at this another way, what benefit is it to you not to tell them if the contract is already signed? The longer you don't tell them, the less protection against discrimination your wife has as well as health & safety/risk assessment issues.

The only things I can think of are what I said in the post above:

1) They will see she is good at her job
2) They will know her in person
3) A replacement person will be out of the picture. In recruitment there is usually a runner-up. someone who didn't get the job that might still be interested. It would be easy to fall back on this person now IMO.

davo10 · 12-12-2015 02:24PM

armabelle wrote: »

The only things I can think of are what I said in the post above:

1) They will see she is good at her job
2) They will know her in person
3) A replacement person will be out of the picture. In recruitment there is usually a runner-up. someone who didn't get the job that might still be interested. It would be easy to fall back on this person now IMO.

Has she signed the contract?
The 3 points above really don't matter as they cannot discriminate against her just because she is pregnant once they are told. I understand your reluctance but I think it shows a lack of courtesy, puts the company in a bind in terms of H&S and has the potential to really piss them off. But again, my main concern for you both is hat until you inform them, they can terminate her contract for no reason during the probationary period, if they hear a whisper then they can get there action in before you get the protection your wife is entitled too.

Mrs OBumble · 12-12-2015 07:30PM

armabelle wrote: »

Please can you read my other posts. I am sure you will withdraw what you said here. We don't care about benefits.

It's not only about benefits.

It's also return on investment for the initial training she will get. she will work for 3-6 months and then disappearing maternity leave for months. The company hired someone to do the job,not to swan off on leave.

armabelle · 12-12-2015 09:54PM

davo10 wrote: »

Has she signed the contract?
The 3 points above really don't matter as they cannot discriminate against her just because she is pregnant once they are told. I understand your reluctance but I think it shows a lack of courtesy, puts the company in a bind in terms of H&S and has the potential to really piss them off. But again, my main concern for you both is hat until you inform them, they can terminate her contract for no reason during the probationary period, if they hear a whisper then they can get there action in before you get the protection your wife is entitled too.

Yes she has signed the contract. OK thanks we will definitely consider your suggestion.

armabelle · 12-12-2015 09:55PM

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

It's not only about benefits.

It's also return on investment for the initial training she will get. she will work for 3-6 months and then disappearing maternity leave for months. The company hired someone to do the job,not to swan off on leave.

If she goes on leave for three months and works for twenty years in the company thereafter and excels at her job then what difference does it make. I think companies look at the big picture as well.

lazeedaisy · 12-12-2015 10:11PM

armabelle wrote: »

hey Lisha thanks a lot for your reply and suggestion... please read my post above and try to understand what that tasted like two years ago LOL. Would you still tell them ASAP?

You ask for opinions, you give us lots of info, you get advice and tell us to read your own posts...

....you obviously want us to agree with your opinion, so what's the point of asking then!

When you come on a forum looking for advise, you actually need to read the advice.....

What your wife is doing, whilst not illegal, does not make for good working relations, along with being in a new country, with a toddler, she will have to cope with however the reception will be, be upfront, why can you not nderstand that advice?

maryfred · 12-12-2015 10:41PM

armabelle wrote: »

The only things I can think of are what I said in the post above:

1) They will see she is good at her job
2) They will know her in person
3) A replacement person will be out of the picture. In recruitment there is usually a runner-up. someone who didn't get the job that might still be interested. It would be easy to fall back on this person now IMO.

The probation period is to see if someone is good at their job and is a good fit for the team. No manager or employer is going to know this in a week or two. Nor will they know her in person.
What happens if she has a hospital appointment or needs to see a doctor or needs sick leave for a pregnancy related issue before she tells them.
They're possibly going to need a replacement person anyway because your wife will be out on maternity leave for 6 months.
Speaking of your wife, you're posts seem to me to suggest that you're the one making the decision. What does she think?
You seem to have your mind made up. IMO I think it will be a bad start to your wife's relationship with this company not to tell them immediately.

Lisha · 12-12-2015 10:43PM

armabelle wrote: »

hey Lisha thanks a lot for your reply and suggestion... please read my post above and try to understand what that tasted like two years ago LOL. Would you still tell them ASAP?

I would be honest from the start.
You asked for opinions and that is mine.

Best if luck to you with everything by the way

armabelle · 13-12-2015 09:56AM

lazeedaisy wrote: »

You ask for opinions, you give us lots of info, you get advice and tell us to read your own posts...

....you obviously want us to agree with your opinion, so what's the point of asking then!

When you come on a forum looking for advise, you actually need to read the advice.....

What your wife is doing, whilst not illegal, does not make for good working relations, along with being in a new country, with a toddler, she will have to cope with however the reception will be, be upfront, why can you not nderstand that advice?

I definitely don't want anyone to agree with me. I want honest advice. Me asking you to read my post is not "obviously" anything. I just wanted to share a story about what happened to us in the past.

armabelle · 13-12-2015 09:57AM

maryfred wrote: »

The probation period is to see if someone is good at their job and is a good fit for the team. No manager or employer is going to know this in a week or two. Nor will they know her in person.
What happens if she has a hospital appointment or needs to see a doctor or needs sick leave for a pregnancy related issue before she tells them.
They're possibly going to need a replacement person anyway because your wife will be out on maternity leave for 6 months.
Speaking of your wife, you're posts seem to me to suggest that you're the one making the decision. What does she think?
You seem to have your mind made up. IMO I think it will be a bad start to your wife's relationship with this company not to tell them immediately.

Maybe it appears this way because I am the one writing LOL. Thanks for your help!

armabelle · 13-12-2015 09:59AM

Lisha wrote: »

I would be honest from the start.
You asked for opinions and that is mine.

Best if luck to you with everything by the way

Thanks Lisha! We really appreciate it

Neon_Lights · 13-12-2015 10:09AM

She may as well take the job, she'd have difficulty here getting an abortion

The employer can hardly say you can't have kids, although it may be looked on disfavourably in some companies who will try and get rid of during probation

Pregnant and moving to Ireland to start a new job. Should I tell?

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