Manchester United Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2015 - Mod Note Post 7373

Mitch Connor · 05-12-2015 11:21PM

papers tomorrow saying weare not looking at Pep and are going to stick with LVG.

Also links us to Kane.

Another paper says LVG has stated (again) that the players are not good enough.

The_Kew_Tour · 05-12-2015 11:23PM

Not surprised about LVG staying. He with us for 3 seasons, for good or bad.

Flint Fredstone · 05-12-2015 11:24PM

Lord TSC wrote: »

The goal for this season is to challenge for the title. Right now, we're only 3 points behind league leaders Leicester, and one behind City and Arsenal. So you can say that he's currently on track to accomplish the goal set out for him.

If other teams were preforming better, then the same points total we have now might have us far behind and not achieving the goal. The performance of other teams absolutely is impacting on people's views of LVG.

The performance of other teams is relevant anyway. It shows the strength of the league when the so called top teams are finding it hard, it would be a different story if they were winning comfortably while we struggled.

Alex Meier · 05-12-2015 11:28PM

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

The performance of other teams is relevant anyway. It shows the strength of the league when the so called top teams are finding it hard, it would be a different story if they were winning comfortably while we struggled.

The strength of the league?

The EPL is on the verge of losing its fourth Champions League spot from the Italians.

This suggests that standards have fallen among the better teams recently and the rest of the league have caught up

Cantona's Collars · 05-12-2015 11:31PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

papers tomorrow saying weare not looking at Pep and are going to stick with LVG.

Also links us to Kane.

Another paper says LVG has stated (again) that the players are not good enough.

Papers only going with what club officials said this morning,TLDR: "Sticking by LVG but looking at options for when he leaves (LVG has already given a time),money will be spent in January."

Flint Fredstone · 05-12-2015 11:34PM

Alex Meier wrote: »

The strength of the league?

The EPL is on the verge of losing its fourth Champions League spot from the Italians.

This suggests that standards have fallen among the better teams recently and the rest of the league have caught up

It's a bit of both. The top teams have fallen off a bit but the rest have gotten much better. There is strength right the way through the league, more than the others imo.

Mitch Connor · 05-12-2015 11:34PM

Comments from LVG in the papers appear to be blaming the players and their lack of quality - rather than anything he has done or failed to do.

Mitch Connor · 05-12-2015 11:38PM

Flint Fredstone wrote: »

It's a bit of both. The top teams have fallen off a bit but the rest have gotten much better. There is strength right the way through the league, more than the others imo.

West Ham are actually a good example. Payet was a very well thought of player in France, at one of the top clubs and West Ham were able to bully them in to selling him to them. The standard of the mid table sides is improving greatly.

I would also contend that United, City and Chelsea (in particular) are simply playing rubbish football and being punished to varying degrees. With the caliber of player each club has they should all be performing a lot better but whatever the reason is, they simply aren't performing to standard. Maybe it is down to arrogance and complacency.

jayo26 · 05-12-2015 11:38PM

Alex Meier wrote: »

The strength of the league?

The EPL is on the verge of losing its fourth Champions League spot from the Italians.

This suggests that standards have fallen among the better teams recently and the rest of the league have caught up

Well that's exactly what has happened looat some of the so called mid tabled clubs you have everton with lukaku and delefeou who would push to be reguar starters for the regular top four, then you have stoke with bojan and shaqiri who would do the same or lose enough to it, you have Leicester with fantastic team spirit and some quality players, the list goes on.

The problem is that the Champions league squads arent as good as the Spanish top two or juventus and bayern and other top european sides. But if you compair mid table level squads id say premier league has more dept but then again this doesnt show in europa league trophies.

Alex Meier · 05-12-2015 11:41PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Comments from LVG in the papers appear to be blaming the players and their lack of quality - rather than anything he has done or failed to do.

Awful if true.

Rayne Wooney · 05-12-2015 11:44PM

It's a poor craftsman that blames his tools

Lord TSC · 05-12-2015 11:46PM

Has any manager ever come out and say "God yeah, I am really struggling, aren't I?"

Cantona's Collars · 05-12-2015 11:48PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Comments from LVG in the papers appear to be blaming the players and their lack of quality - rather than anything he has done or failed to do.

Sounds like a certain ex Ireland manager.

Some of the back pages:

ronjo · 05-12-2015 11:49PM

Lord TSC wrote: »

Has any manager ever come out and say "God yeah, I am really struggling, aren't I?"

I remember Keegan doing it when he quit England.

Alex Meier · 05-12-2015 11:51PM

Let's face it - Pep choose Bayern Munich over United even when Fergie was wooing him in New York etc. .

I doubt they want it to be known that they want him again. . . But no one at Man U could possibly be disappointed with Guardiola at OT even if it meant sacking LvG

kstand · 05-12-2015 11:54PM

I paid £55 for a Christmas tree today. I did a 5er on our game ending 0-0. So thanks LVG, it only cost me a 5er on top of the 5er I done on the bet.

Alex Meier · 05-12-2015 11:55PM

kstand wrote: »

I paid £55 for a Christmas tree today. I did a 5er on our game ending 0-0. So thanks LVG, it only cost me a 5er on top of the 5er I done on the bet.

0-0 in Wolfsburg?

StringerBell · 05-12-2015 11:56PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

papers tomorrow saying weare not looking at Pep and are going to stick with LVG.

Also links us to Kane.

Another paper says LVG has stated (again) that the players are not good enough.

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Comments from LVG in the papers appear to be blaming the players and their lack of quality - rather than anything he has done or failed to do.

Did you forget you posted it a few minutes beforehand?

kstand · 05-12-2015 11:58PM

Alex Meier wrote: »

0-0 in Wolfsburg?

It'll soften the blow

StringerBell · 06-12-2015 12:03AM

If there are quotes, read that word again, actual bonafide quotes, from Van Gaal saying he has done nothing wrong, or failed in any aspect, and the players are to blame for everything I will be quite surprised.

If instead they are quotes, like we got after the match that say the players need to finish better, that the chances were created and not finished and that is down to the individual player more then anything else, I will not be quite surprised.

How do we think I will be feeling tomorrow morning as I take my coffee? Like certain people enjoy sensationalising ****e and often look foolish, or stunned that the manager would do something so silly. Even Fergie who considered himself to be pretty infallible at least blamed officials and the like during our barren period around 04-06

Speak Now · 06-12-2015 12:05AM

kstand wrote: »

I paid £55 for a Christmas tree today. I did a 5er on our game ending 0-0. So thanks LVG, it only cost me a 5er on top of the 5er I done on the bet.

Here's a tip , always back no goalscorer instead of 0-0. Same price and you'd still get paid if it was 1-0 with an own goal.

kstand · 06-12-2015 12:08AM

Jerry Seinfeld wrote: »

Here's a tip , always back no goalscorer instead of 0-0. Same price and you'd still get paid if it was 1-0 with an own goal.

I'm behind the times pal! Still have my Christmas tree though. I

Lord TSC · 06-12-2015 12:12AM

Are we shocked the official line from United would be "LVG is our manager, why would we be after Pep?"

How unprofessional would it be to be briefing otherwise? Until he goes, be that tomorrow or in 18 months, that should 100% be the official line coming from the briefings. Undermining the manager would be an idiotic move to make, regardless of what state the team is in. Now, whats said behind the scenes is a different matter...

Headshot · 06-12-2015 12:13AM

I find it very hard to trust LVG with money in January after the rubbish summer spending overall

Pro. F · 06-12-2015 12:15AM

StringerBell wrote: »

I am interested though, I have never used it though so would you mind breaking down the parameters for it and how exactly it comes to conclusions? It seems like football in particular has so many variables involved when it comes to goals that I am interested to see what method is used to reach consensus, and why you personally give it so much credit to refer to it as very useful?

The idea is that you count up the chances and give each one a weighting based on things like shot location and type, type of pass that created the chance and type of play that led to the pass. It's basically just a much more detailed version of chances created. Like you say, there are many variables in football, so that complicates everything. But when you get to thinking about it, there are actually plenty of simple factors where you can be relatively confident in saying that one type of chance is more likely to cause a goal when compared to another.

The more I've looked at expected goals the more impressed I've been by how reliable it is. Like any time I check a particular chance - to see how it rates on expected goals compared to the eyeball test - it's rare that the xG rating is much different from what I'm seeing myself. I still wouldn't take it as definitive for any one game, rather it's just a useful summary where I'd say you should still double check if something seems odd. But when looking over a number of games, so the small level of error can be mitigated by the larger sample, imo it becomes really useful, and miles better than chances created.

There are a few different expected goals models going around. The one that I posted comes from Michael Caley. Methodology (which imo makes a lot of sense) here. He posts up expected goals charts after games on twitter regularly here. And there's rankings tables for EPL here.

kstand · 06-12-2015 12:16AM

Headshot wrote: »

I find it very hard to trust LVG with money in January after the rubbish summer spending overall

I don't think he signs bad players. I just think hes a total ar$ehole and doesn't have the ability to get through to them anymore.

Cantona's Collars · 06-12-2015 12:17AM

Phil Neville got a 1-1 draw with Barca this evening despite Valencia missing 10 players from the squad and having to call up junior players to fill the bench.

Alex Meier · 06-12-2015 12:18AM

kstand wrote: »

I don't think he signs bad players. I just think hes a total ar$ehole and doesn't have the ability to get through to them anymore.

It appears he doesn't have a great relationship with his players

He did lose his job at BM when it looked like they weren't going to make the CL

kstand · 06-12-2015 12:20AM

Graveyard shift on MOTD - anyone surprised?
Van Gaal Out.

kstand · 06-12-2015 12:26AM

Alex Meier wrote: »

It appears he doesn't have a great relationship with his players

He did lose his job at BM when it looked like they weren't going to make the CL

I lived in Manchester in the 90s when he had one of his stints with Barca. He managed to completely split the Barca dressing room - he had 5 I think Dutch internationals and possibly more in the team/squad. I remember reading an article in 4-4-2 or some magazine about it at the time - mainly about how impossible it was deemed to be to mess up that squad and how horribly arrogant he was. When I heard he was short-listed when Fergie talked about retiring I was livid. And now we have him.