Shootings in Paris - MOD NOTE UPDATED - READ OP

Custardpi · 14-11-2015 01:42PM

Amirani wrote: »

I think the West needs to change their stance on Assad. They need to give the governments of Iraq and Syria the support they need to sort out the ISIS situation.

While much of what Assad has done is barbaric, the current situation of a failed state that is powerless to enforce its autonomy is useless to everyone. The only end game to me that has any prospect of success is Assad regaining control of all of Syria. Bombing eastern Syria into oblivion fixes nothing.

Unfortunately for Syrians chances are that the way to Assad regaining control will involve eastern Syria being bombed into oblivion. Sadly I can't see the situation being resolved peacefully, however one might wish otherwise.

hatrickpatrick · 14-11-2015 01:42PM

Ctrl Alt Delete wrote: »

I'm not ignoring that fact, because the fact is plain as day that civilians are already being killed in Iraq and Syria and so will not make a blind bit of different.

Iraq Civilian Casualties: 150,772
Syrian Civilian Casualties: 90,000+

That doesn't justify us dropping bombs indiscriminately and putting further civilian lives at risk. There is no acceptable justification for doing that. I agree with attacking Isis, I just don't agree with the kind of "shock and awe" crap which many on the right advocate.

BoJack Horseman · 14-11-2015 01:43PM

c montgomery wrote: »

Play the race card, report poster and claim victimisation, and your one of the tolerant ones??!!

Crying hysterically and reporting lots of posts is the easiest way to get a thread locked.

Eoin247 · 14-11-2015 01:43PM

_oveless_ wrote: »

you're not even hiding your racism any more consider yourself reported

I find your comments and general lack of sympathy for the French victims far more offensive than this guy's comment. Nobody should be banned from this thread for voicing their opinion, but if there was a list for banning then you should be at the top.

namloc1980 · 14-11-2015 01:43PM

_oveless_ wrote: »

you're not even hiding your racism any more consider yourself reported

You don't know what racism is, do you?

merryberry · 14-11-2015 01:44PM

Why are jihadist groups allowed social media space such as twitter to promote their hatred bile and welcome this attacks

My name is URL · 14-11-2015 01:44PM

Rightwing wrote: »

Now, Muslims here wearing these black rags around their heads should be given the choice, 'Love, wear that rag around your head where ever you came from, or else bin it'. Anyone who doesn't conform can then be identifed as a threat to society and promptly deported.

So your plan to prevent the west from becoming an oppressive place for women like certain ME countries, is to make it an oppressive place for women, where they are not allowed to dress as they please?

Just about sums up the illogical mindsets of the uber-reactionaries

smash · 14-11-2015 01:44PM

_oveless_ wrote: »

millions of people die every day just because theses are white and european they should not get special treatment, if people werent left in camps to rot on the borders of europe then maybe things like this wouldnt have happened #refugeeswelcome

Holy shít. You're a sick and twisted individual!

walshyn93 · 14-11-2015 01:44PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

It doesn't even matter whether Christian extremists or not, the point I'm making is that if you use the Qu'ran's content to say "Islam is a violent religion" but refuse to apply the same criteria to the Bible (the old testament as well as new) then you're a flaming hypocrite, simple as.

Not if you use the content in conjunction with the actions of its followers. The followers of Islam are blowing up Paris and the followers of Christianity are standing out in the cold with "refugee welcome" signs.

And before you say anything, western military actions are not guided by religion in any way shape or form. In fact if it transpired it were I'm sure there'd be resignations and inquiries conducted.

_oveless_ · 14-11-2015 01:45PM

namloc1980 wrote: »

You don't know what racism is, do you?

racism is power + privilege

not yet · 14-11-2015 01:45PM

_oveless_ wrote: »

millions of people die every day just because theses are white and european they should not get special treatment, if people werent left in camps to rot on the borders of europe then maybe things like this wouldnt have happened #refugeeswelcome

#pissoffyoudeludedfruitcake

c montgomery · 14-11-2015 01:45PM

efb wrote: »

Based on what???

That's like saying London was safer in the 80s/90s without Irish

8 muslims supported by a network of more Muslims killed over 140 people in Paris last night in the name of IS.
If they were no muslims in Paris last night there would have been no killing.
Pretty simple really

Bannasidhe · 14-11-2015 01:46PM

Ctrl Alt Delete wrote: »

you CANNOT appeal and talk to people who DO NOT want to talk and are 100% intent on violence its really that simple

It's not hyberbole and it speaks volumes about you that you can dismiss it as such. It's the exact same situation now as pre WW2.

This poor man below is about to be killed and there is about another 4,000 after him to come as well as the 999 odd that went before him who were killed for refusing to convert to islam. Tell me whats hyperbole about that image.

Tell me in all your wisdom how do you talk to people in the image below?

Do stop shouting dear.

What exactly do you think we should do then?

Suspend civil liberties?

For everyone or just Muslims?

I believe suspending the civil liberties of a particular group of people pre-WWII was the cause of some major difficulties... and deaths...

Do we (as in The West) invade some part of the ME we haven't already invaded?
What then?
Do we stay and 'rule' them as colonies?
Do we stay until they can 'rule' themselves according to the template we provide?

Do we continue to repeat the same tactics we have used time and time again and hope for a different result this time?

Do you advocate that in order to defeat this religious fascism we ourselves become fascist because quite frankly that smells like a win for the extremists to me.

How about we (The West) stop doing business with Saudi Arabia?
How about we stop selling arms to ALL various factions in the ME?
How about we mind our own business and let other countries sort out their own affairs and stop pretending we give flying about exporting 'democracy' and are really only indulging in 'wanna be in my gang' as we have done for centuries.

Ireland and the UK have had to sort out the NI situation without the rest of the West 'putting boots on the ground' - people eventually sat down and began to talk to each other! Back in the worst days of the Troubles (a fancy name for what was in essence a civil war) who ever thought Martin MacGuinness would be in government with Ian Paisley?

Eoin247 · 14-11-2015 01:46PM

_oveless_ wrote: »

racism is power + privilege

Lol, at first I thought you were serious. But surely you must be a troll.

Ctrl Alt Delete · 14-11-2015 01:47PM

c montgomery wrote: »

8 muslims supported by a network of more Muslims killed over 140 people in Paris last night in the name of IS.
If they were no muslims in Paris last night there would have been no killing.
Pretty simple really

I 100% disagree with that, the attacks would occur regardless of the amount of muslims in a country

conorhal · 14-11-2015 01:47PM

Amirani wrote: »

I think the West needs to change their stance on Assad. They need to give the governments of Iraq and Syria the support they need to sort out the ISIS situation.

While much of what Assad has done is barbaric, the current situation of a failed state that is powerless to enforce its autonomy is useless to everyone. The only end game to me that has any prospect of success is Assad regaining control of all of Syria. Bombing eastern Syria into oblivion fixes nothing.

There's the usual lack of joined up thinking on display by our knee jerk Western governments. Have any of them stopped to ask themselves WHY Assad has done barbaric things or how it came to that?
The answer is very simple and it comes down to the Muslim Brotherhood's actions in Syria over the decades. When Assad's grandfather came to power he was, like Ataturk in Turkey a modernizer and reformer that wanted to drag his nation into the 20th Century. The islamists preferred the 9th Century and made numerous attempts to kill both him and Assad's father.
Well if you live under the constant threat of assassination you're probably going to be pretty paranoid and your response is likely to be brutal.
Make no mistake, it isn't the West that has created this monster, it's political Islam.

walshyn93 · 14-11-2015 01:47PM

_oveless_ wrote: »

racism is power + privilege

Get the **** out of here with that racist antiwhite bull****. That's a formula created and perpetuated by subversive academics to make it so only white people can be racist.

namloc1980 · 14-11-2015 01:47PM

Ctrl Alt Delete wrote: »

I'm not ignoring that fact, because the fact is plain as day that civilians are already being killed in Iraq and Syria and so will not make a blind bit of difference and thats the actual fact that the "won't someone think of the civlians brigade" are ignoring.

Iraq Civilian Casualties: 150,772
Syrian Civilian Casualties: 90,000+

And to be clear the vast majority of those civilian deaths are perpetrated by Muslim extremists against Muslims. These extremists don't care about life or who they kill. There is no reasoning or negotiating with them. Violence is the only thing they understand.

captbarnacles · 14-11-2015 01:47PM

_oveless_ wrote: »

you're not even hiding your racism any more consider yourself reported

The real victim is.........Islam !?

Oh and on an unrelated note leavingirl is apparently a 9/11 truther. Amazing.

stefanovich · 14-11-2015 01:47PM

smash wrote: »

Holy shít. You're a sick and twisted individual!

Don't take the bait. No real person could be that delusional.

Canadel · 14-11-2015 01:47PM

c montgomery wrote: »

8 muslims supported by a network of more Muslims killed over 140 people in Paris last night in the name of IS.
If they were no muslims in Paris last night there would have been no killing.
Pretty simple really

If there were no terrorists in Paris last night there would have been no killings. Pretty simple really.

colossus-x · 14-11-2015 01:47PM

_oveless_ wrote: »

It will incite racist hate speech, Islam is the victim here it will be under attack now because of these unfortunate events, as well as the fact that one of the attackers was confirmed to be syrian it will lead people to reject refugees from here which is dangerously racist. we need to ignore and resist the people speaking out against islam, migration and multiculturalism and push for greater powers for the authorities against these people. these people are marginalized and are lashing out we need to be more inclusive and tolerant only then will we prevent these kinds of unfortunate situations in the future.

Islam is the victim ? Islam is just an idea in your mind and is alive and well unlike the victims lying dead in Paris as a result of this: Islam-->Muslim-->Islamist-->Extremist-->Terrorist.

Paramite Pie · 14-11-2015 01:48PM

screamer wrote: »

Scary but true let's all thank Angela for this. The damage she will have done to Europe will be unprecedented and history will remember her unkindly. Unfortunately that history has yet to be written with many more tragedies to come I fear.

Umm... your naive if you think this attack was organised within the last few months or by new arrivals. The guys were likely here a lot longer -- maybe even born in France and radicalised there.

Most of Angela's migrants haven't arrived yet either. Your post is highly reactionary nonsense -- there were jihadists in europe for years before Merkel even got into power. We all unfortunately knew this. This attack was going to happen anyways.

They've plenty of recruits as is -- migrants not withstanding.

Amirani · 14-11-2015 01:48PM

Custardpi wrote: »

Unfortunately for Syrians chances are that the way to Assad regaining control will involve eastern Syria being bombed into oblivion. Sadly I can't see the situation being resolved peacefully, however one might wish otherwise.

That's probably the case. Still, I think it does make a difference if it's regional Governments that do it instead of the French and the Americans.

Custardpi · 14-11-2015 01:49PM

merryberry wrote: »

Why are jihadist groups allowed social media space such as twitter to promote their hatred bile and welcome this attacks

To be honest I'm happy enough for them to have that space . If people are dumb enough to publically out themselves as ISIS supporters that saves time for the intelligence services, who can target their resources in a more efficient manner than simply mass trawling through innocent people's webcams or whatever.

evolving_doors · 14-11-2015 01:49PM

_oveless_ wrote: »

millions of people die every day just because theses are white and european they should not get special treatment, if people werent left in camps to rot on the borders of europe then maybe things like this wouldnt have happened #refugeeswelcome

Ya sure, tell the police and ambulances to turn around and go home from' the stadium. No special treatment allowed.

c montgomery · 14-11-2015 01:49PM

Ctrl Alt Delete wrote: »

I 100% disagree with that, the attacks would occur regardless of the amount of muslims in a country

Your entitled to your opinion no matter how wrong it may be.

Ctrl Alt Delete · 14-11-2015 01:49PM

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Do stop shouting dear.

Just to educate you a bit more dear shouting is using CAPS , emphasis is using bold fonts

I've already outlined what I would support. I've yet to see you outline a response better than appeasement and talking to them over a cup of tea

smash · 14-11-2015 01:49PM

stefanovich wrote: »

Don't take the bait. No real person could be that delusional.

8 real people were that delusional last night, and took the lives of over 100 innocent victims.

14-11-2015 01:49PM

Just watched the video on Sky that was filmed by a journalist at the back of the theatre. ****! It's harrowing. A woman hanging onto a rail for dear life, innocent people gunned down below her.

The journalist who filmed it was in an upstairs window in a building opposite. He was also subsequently shot.

Shootings in Paris - MOD NOTE UPDATED - READ OP

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