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WHO: bacon is 'as big a cancer threat as smoking'

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Comments

  • #62
    BrianD3
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,037 ✭✭✭BrianD3


    This idea about cured and processed meats has been around for a few years - anyone who is interested should read up on gastric (stomach) cancer and how incidence rates have been decreasing steadily for several decades.

    There are a few theories as to why this is - one is that it has coincided with refrigerators becoming widely available resulting in less need for cured meats. Another theory (which is probably more widely accepted) is that there is a strong link between gastric cancer and Helicobacter Pylori infection and that these infections are being better controlled thanks to antibiotics etc.

    Personally I can live without sausage and bacon but I do consume a lot of beef burgers and eat a fair amount of ham and turkey deli meats. I do sometimes think that I may be doing myself harm by doing this.


  • #63
    GrayFox208
    Closed Accounts Posts: 335 ✭✭GrayFox208


    Remember when the WHO thought being gay was an illness? Yeah so do I.


  • #64
    shamrock2004
    Closed Accounts Posts: 603 ✭✭✭shamrock2004


    Let's not forget the recent US study which concluded that 2/3 of instances of cancer are down to "bad luck", not bad genes

    http://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/jan/02/two-thirds-adult-cancers-bad-luck


  • #65
    myshirt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,245 ✭✭✭myshirt


    There was a time there where I'd eat a pound of Mathersons sausages, and I'll tell you - the last one was just as nice as the first one.

    Not anymore however.


  • #66
    Vowel Movement
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 299 ✭✭Vowel Movement




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  • #67
    Maximus Alexander
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,080 ✭✭✭✭Maximus Alexander


    If eating bacon is wrong, I don't want to be right.


  • #68
    anothernight
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,539 ✭✭✭anothernight


    It appears from the OP's cancer rates world map that southern European countries have a slightly lower incidence of cancer than the rest of western Europe. I would've thought that the likes of Italy, Portugal and Spain ate a lot more processed meats than the Irish or the British?

    In Spain at least, cancer incidence correlates with a decreased consumption of fresh fruit and vegetables, not so much with an increased consumption of chorizo, jamón, salchichón, etc. Having said that, their most frequent cancer is bowel cancer, so maybe the WHO has a point.


  • #69
    donegaLroad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,379 ✭✭✭donegaLroad


    anothernight wrote: »
    It appears from the OP's cancer rates world map that southern European countries have a slightly lower incidence of cancer than the rest of western Europe. I would've thought that the likes of Italy, Portugal and Spain ate a lot more processed meats than the Irish or the British?

    In Spain at least, cancer incidence correlates with a decreased consumption of fresh fruit and vegetables, not so much with an increased consumption of chorizo, jamón, salchichón, etc. Having said that, their most frequent cancer is bowel cancer, so maybe the WHO has a point.

    I noticed this about the southern European countries.. maybe it has something to do with genetics and their close geographic proximity to North Africa where there is very low incidence of cancer.


  • #70
    anothernight
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,539 ✭✭✭anothernight


    donegaLroad wrote: »
    I noticed this about the southern European countries.. maybe it has something to do with genetics and their close geographic proximity to North Africa where there is very low incidence of cancer.

    The 'official' line is that their Mediterranean diet helps prevent cancer through high consumption of fruit and vegetables, as well as fish and olive oil.


  • #71
    Tarzana2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,553 ✭✭✭Tarzana2


    Teafor two12345 wrote: »
    I am no expert but i think cancer is a generic term for a lot of different illnesses.

    They are all cancer though. They all result in the same thing, uncontrolled cell growth and metastasis if left unchecked, whatever causes them.


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  • #72
    Tarzana2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,553 ✭✭✭Tarzana2


    shamrock2004 wrote: »
    Let's not forget the recent US study which concluded that 2/3 of instances of cancer are down to "bad luck", not bad genes

    http://www.theguardian.com/society/2015/jan/02/two-thirds-adult-cancers-bad-luck

    I'll take that. Much easier to stomach than the idea that I gave it to myself somehow.


  • #73
    fiachr_a
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,204 ✭✭✭fiachr_a


    Bongalongherb wrote: »
    What makes me laugh with most folk is that they have whined for so long to stop people smoking but yet are happy to breath in carbon monoxide - dioxide every day they are out walking or jogging. You'll get your healthy dose of cancer there.
    The same people who give strange looks in the street when you wear a big coat on a sunny day. Skin cancer is the commonest one and you don't get that from eating hotdogs or smoking.


  • #74
    Massimo Cassagrande
    Closed Accounts Posts: 626 ✭✭✭Massimo Cassagrande


    In 1890, life expectancy for a male was 42, ish. I.e, yer average joe bloggs carked it around that age. Nowadays, it's up around 70 or 80. Or possibly slightly lower....but upshot, people get to a bigger age. Even with bacon, smoking, drinking etc etc...and everyone's gonna die of something.

    All them crispy, greasy memories..worth the risk..


  • #75
    Qualitymark
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,824 ✭✭✭Qualitymark


    Teafor two12345 wrote: »
    Interesting fact here actually but Japan has the lowest death from cancer rates in the world or one of the lowest anyway. But conversely has a similar occurrence of cancer rate to anywhere in the developed world. This is because they have a great health system and early detection rates.

    Maybe also because they're skinny as laths, they cycle everywhere and eat a diet high in fish and vegetables.

    One cancer they get a lot is stomach cancer, thought to be because they eat pickles at every meal.

    I think they have more success in curing cancer not so much from high detection rates (Japanese doctors are brutes, and you're not encouraged to go to the doc unless you're half dead anyway) as because of that healthy lifestyle, which means cancers only arrive when people are old and their cell division slower, and so the cancers don't spread so ragingly fast.


  • #76
    Rezident
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,844 ✭✭✭Rezident


    Obviously nothing wrong with lean meat. Remember when eating fat was supposed to be bad for you?


  • #77
    Junkyard Tom
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,115 ✭✭✭✭Junkyard Tom


    Massimo Cassagrande wrote: »
    In 1890, life expectancy for a male was 42, ish.

    If you survived childhood your lifespan wasn't hugely different to what it is now.

    [not-googled]


  • #78
    Bongalongherb
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,766 ✭✭✭Bongalongherb


    Sunflower 27 wrote: »
    How many bacon farmers and their family members have died from cancer? Serious question.

    These sorts of reports could cripple the industry. While the majority here can joke, many people will actually stop eating it now.

    I don't think so sunflower. These scare-tactics have been used for decades and in some cases have enabled the uneducated to believe everything that they read.

    Sizzle that bacon and enjoy if a person is such inclined to. I can smell the aroma from here, delicious indeed, life is too short.


  • #79
    ejabrod
    Closed Accounts Posts: 478 ✭✭ejabrod


    Harry Palmr wrote: »
    It's been known for some years that processed meat (esp sausages) ...

    There's a big difference between pork and sausages. Sausages contain a certain % of bacon, the rest is all kinds of shít.

    IMO, if the WHO are saying it's 'bad' for you, it's probably the opposite (if you don't know what I'm talking about do a little research into the WHO, its board, financial sponsors etc and also look up Codex Alimentarius)


    BTW, this is my opinion - which I'm entitled to.


  • #80
    Massimo Cassagrande
    Closed Accounts Posts: 626 ✭✭✭Massimo Cassagrande


    Junkyard Tom wrote: »
    If you survived childhood your lifespan wasn't hugely different to what it is now.

    [not-googled]

    Err, no.

    Go google. :)


  • #81
    Nichard Dixon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 386 ✭✭Nichard Dixon


    GrayFox208 wrote: »
    Remember when the WHO thought being gay was an illness? Yeah so do I.

    Presumably the gay lobby is more influential than the bacon processors.


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  • #82
    Junkyard Tom
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,115 ✭✭✭✭Junkyard Tom


    Massimo Cassagrande wrote: »
    Err, no.

    Err, yeah.
    the majority of the reported prolonging of life is due to reducing childhood mortality. Comparing just life expectancy for 20 year-olds, in 1850 a young man could expect to live to 60.1.

    https://gcanyon.wordpress.com/2009/06/25/life-expectancy-in-the-1800s-not-as-bad-as-reported/


  • #83
    rubadub
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,387 ✭✭✭✭rubadub


    regard processed meat as "carcinogenic to humans", the highest of five possible rankings, shared with alcohol, asbestos, arsenic and cigarettes.
    I would like to see the full list. If its at the highest rating then of course the more obvious things are in there, but it is certainly not saying its all the same level of risk. I suspect many other things might be up there, like BBQ'd food or stuff put in a hot oven, but would have sounded far less sensational than comparing it to asbestos.


  • #84
    Boring username
    Closed Accounts Posts: 679 ✭✭✭Boring username


    11:45am -The Indo have just deemed this as breaking news if you don't mind. A full 3 days after the story first made the papers. They don't miss much do they?


    Breaking: Red meat 'probably carcinogenic', processed meat such as ham and sausages 'is carcinogenic' - WHO

    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/breaking-red-meat-probably-carcinogenic-processed-meat-such-as-ham-and-sausages-is-carcinogenic-who-34141786.html


    Proof, yet again, that the imbeciles and useless idiots are now occupying all the major positions of power.


  • #85
    strelok
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 1,162 ✭✭✭strelok


    Boring username wrote: »
    11:45am -The Indo have just deemed this as breaking news if you don't mind. A full 3 days after the story first made the papers. They don't miss much do they?


    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/breaking-red-meat-probably-carcinogenic-processed-meat-such-as-ham-and-sausages-is-carcinogenic-who-34141786.html


    Proof, yet again, that the imbeciles and useless idiots are now occupying all the major positions of power.


    far more likely to have a lot of people eating bacon and sausages as part of their post-drinking breakfast on the monday morning of a bank holiday weekend


  • #86
    donegaLroad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,379 ✭✭✭donegaLroad


    Boring username wrote: »
    11:45am -The Indo have just deemed this as breaking news if you don't mind. A full 3 days after the story first made the papers. They don't miss much do they?





    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/breaking-red-meat-probably-carcinogenic-processed-meat-such-as-ham-and-sausages-is-carcinogenic-who-34141786.html


    Proof, yet again, that the imbeciles and useless idiots are now occupying all the major positions of power.

    boards.ie, first for breaking news :)


  • #87
    Boring username
    Closed Accounts Posts: 679 ✭✭✭Boring username


    donegaLroad wrote: »
    boards.ie, first for breaking news :)


    Wait, hold the front page! They've now bumped it up to the main story: Confirmed: Eating sausages, ham, corned beef and hot dogs can cause cancer


    See, this is what happens when you let that smelly vegan intern student cover the bank holiday skeleton crew slot.


  • #88
    Tar.Aldarion
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 60,119 Mod ✭✭✭✭Tar.Aldarion


    rubadub wrote: »
    I would like to see the full list. If its at the highest rating then of course the more obvious things are in there, but it is certainly not saying its all the same level of risk. I suspect many other things might be up there, like BBQ'd food or stuff put in a hot oven, but would have sounded far less sensational than comparing it to asbestos.

    Not completely up to date but here are the others, meat has been climbing the ranks for decades and this is not new knowledge, cancer institutes have had this stance for a long time about meat (red meat now going up to the second highest threat to humans while rasher sausages etc being number at number 1):

    The comments on this thread are remarkably similar to the ones when smoking was announced as a carcinogen.
    Acetaldehyde (from consuming alcoholic beverages)
    Acheson process, occupational exposure associated with
    Acid mists, strong inorganic
    Aflatoxins
    Alcoholic beverages
    Aluminum production
    4-Aminobiphenyl
    Areca nut
    Aristolochic acid (and plants containing it)
    Arsenic and inorganic arsenic compounds
    Asbestos (all forms) and mineral substances (such as talc or vermiculite) that contain asbestos
    Auramine production
    Azathioprine
    Benzene
    Benzidine and dyes metabolized to benzidine
    Benzo[a]pyrene
    Beryllium and beryllium compounds
    Betel quid, with or without tobacco
    Bis(chloromethyl)ether and chloromethyl methyl ether (technical-grade)
    Busulfan
    1,3-Butadiene
    Cadmium and cadmium compounds
    Chlorambucil
    Chlornaphazine
    Chromium (VI) compounds
    Clonorchis sinensis (infection with), also known as the Chinese liver fluke
    Coal, indoor emissions from household combustion
    Coal gasification
    Coal-tar distillation
    Coal-tar pitch
    Coke production
    Cyclophosphamide
    Cyclosporine
    1,2-Dichloropropane
    Diethylstilbestrol
    Engine exhaust, diesel
    Epstein-Barr virus (infection with)
    Erionite
    Estrogen postmenopausal therapy
    Estrogen-progestogen postmenopausal therapy (combined)
    Estrogen-progestogen oral contraceptives (combined) (Note: There is also convincing evidence in humans that these agents confer a protective effect against cancer in the endometrium and ovary)
    Ethanol in alcoholic beverages
    Ethylene oxide
    Etoposide
    Etoposide in combination with cisplatin and bleomycin
    Fission products, including strontium-90
    Fluoro-edenite fibrous amphibole
    Formaldehyde
    Haematite mining (underground)
    Helicobacter pylori (infection with)
    Hepatitis B virus (chronic infection with)
    Hepatitis C virus (chronic infection with)
    Human immunodeficiency virus type 1 (HIV-1) (infection with)
    Human papilloma virus (HPV) types 16, 18, 31, 33, 35, 39, 45, 51, 52, 56, 58, 59 (infection with) (Note: The HPV types that have been classified as carcinogenic to humans can differ by an order of magnitude in risk for cervical cancer)
    Human T-cell lymphotropic virus type I (HTLV-1) (infection with)
    Ionizing radiation (all types)
    Iron and steel founding (workplace exposure)
    Isopropyl alcohol manufacture using strong acids
    Kaposi sarcoma herpesvirus (KSHV), also known as human herpesvirus 8 (HHV-8) (infection with)
    Leather dust
    Magenta production
    Melphalan
    Methoxsalen (8-methoxypsoralen) plus ultraviolet A radiation, also known as PUVA
    4,4'-Methylenebis(chloroaniline) (MOCA)
    Mineral oils, untreated or mildly treated
    MOPP and other combined chemotherapy including alkylating agents
    2-Naphthylamine
    Neutron radiation
    Nickel compounds
    N'-Nitrosonornicotine (NNN) and 4-(N-Nitrosomethylamino)-1-(3-pyridyl)-1-butanone (NNK)
    Opisthorchis viverrini (infection with), also known as the Southeast Asian liver fluke
    Outdoor air pollution and the particulate matter in it
    Painter (workplace exposure as a)
    3,4,5,3',4'-Pentachlorobiphenyl (PCB-126)
    2,3,4,7,8-Pentachlorodibenzofuran
    Phenacetin (and mixtures containing it)
    Phosphorus-32, as phosphate
    Plutonium
    Polychlorinated biphenyls (PCBs), dioxin-like, with a Toxicity Equivalency Factor according to WHO (PCBs 77, 81, 105, 114, 118, 123, 126, 156, 157, 167, 169, 189)
    Radioiodines, including iodine-131
    Radionuclides, alpha-particle-emitting, internally deposited (Note: Specific radionuclides for which there is sufficient evidence for carcinogenicity to humans are also listed individually as Group 1 agents)
    Radionuclides, beta-particle-emitting, internally deposited (Note: Specific radionuclides for which there is sufficient evidence for carcinogenicity to humans are also listed individually as Group 1 agents)
    Radium-224 and its decay products
    Radium-226 and its decay products
    Radium-228 and its decay products
    Radon-222 and its decay products
    Rubber manufacturing industry
    Salted fish (Chinese-style)
    Schistosoma haematobium (infection with)
    Semustine (methyl-CCNU)
    Shale oils
    Silica dust, crystalline, in the form of quartz or cristobalite
    Solar radiation
    Soot (as found in workplace exposure of chimney sweeps)
    Sulfur mustard
    Tamoxifen (Note: There is also conclusive evidence that tamoxifen reduces the risk of contralateral breast cancer in breast cancer patients)
    2,3,7,8-Tetrachlorodibenzo-para-dioxin
    Thiotepa
    Thorium-232 and its decay products
    Tobacco, smokeless
    Tobacco smoke, secondhand
    Tobacco smoking
    ortho-Toluidine
    Treosulfan
    Trichloroethylene
    Ultraviolet (UV) radiation, including UVA, UVB, and UVC rays
    Ultraviolet-emitting tanning devices
    Vinyl chloride
    Wood dust
    X- and Gamma-radiation


  • #89
    Eugene Norman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,191 ✭✭✭Eugene Norman


    Boring username wrote: »
    11:45am -The Indo have just deemed this as breaking news if you don't mind. A full 3 days after the story first made the papers. They don't miss much do they?





    http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/health/breaking-red-meat-probably-carcinogenic-processed-meat-such-as-ham-and-sausages-is-carcinogenic-who-34141786.html


    Proof, yet again, that the imbeciles and useless idiots are now occupying all the major positions of power.

    The statement was released officially today. It was leaked a few days ago.


  • #90
    mzungu
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 6,311 Mod ✭✭✭✭mzungu


    Even RTE news this morning were covering it. Slow news day.


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  • #91
    Teafor two12345
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 410 ✭✭Teafor two12345


    It's probably not you know.


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