DCM 2015: Mentored Novices Thread

PJD wrote: »

Is it still too early to mention the weather?? Yr.no is showing it to be damp, cool and breezy. Can live with that more than a heatwave!!

Too early :mad: Focus on the toenails man!

chrislad wrote: »

I think we got the all clear to talk about that now

Nope :mad:

frash wrote: »

Not until tomorrow

Top of the class. Frash knows what day it is

Phoebas wrote: »

I mentioned it once, but I think I got away with it.

Your card is marked Phoebz

OFFICIAL CUT
https://www.facebook.com/video.php?v=10153689960213185&set=vb.291874688184&type=2&theater

THE EXPERIENCED CUT
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97315716&postcount=5991
Thanks yaboya

THE PERSONAL NOVICES CUT

Miles 0-3
Denis b: Mile 1-2 Downhill to flat with great road surface. Will be well sheltered with the crowds. Containment on this section.. let space emerge and dont get carried away. Steady up on 100m steep incline on Patrick Street and steady down to Liffey on steep short decline.

Miles 2-3 - Some steep ascents & descents in these miles. You climb up from St Patrick's Cathedral to 'High' Street, before almost immediately plunging back down to the quays. This is followed by another more gradual (but steep) climb through Stoneybatter and Aughrim Street up to the NCR. The main thing here is to keep the effort you've dialled in from the first mile consistent. Don't worry about the mile splits. Since you'll be so full of energy and amongst a huge crowd at such an early stage it will be easy to hold PMP going up the inclines, but don't do this as you'll almost certainly pay for it in the second half. Loads of time to get those seconds back later. For once ignore your trusty leader (Sorry Dubgal ) and use your Garmin here to ensure you're not moving too quickly.

Unaaine: Having not covered the route from miles 0-3, I’m only guessing that it will be a slow enough start to DCM and am anticipating to be running PMP + 10/15 secs for these first few miles. I will definitely not be pushing myself and my (cunning) plan psychologically is to treat this part as a warm up to my ‘usual’ 20 miles lsr!

Singer: Miles 0-1: Should be fast because of enthusiasm and wide streets, but no doubt will be full of crowds and general mayhem. Planning on not getting too stressed here...
Miles 1-2: Drag up to High Street is tough enough, but early so no doubt we'll all power through. I guess don't waste too much energy here.
Miles 2-3: Some difficulties here - the downhill on Bridge Street to the quays is pretty steep, followed by a drag up Manor St., and then into a quite narrow Aughrim St., which is all uphill.

TFGR on
Mile 1 https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/01-patrick-street.jpg
https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/02-high-street.jpg https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/03-bridge-street.jpg
https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/04-ushers-quay.jpg

Mile 2 https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/05-blackhall-place.jpg
https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/06-manor-street.jpg
https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/07-aughrim-street.jpg

Mile 3 https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/08-north-circular-road.jpg
https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/09-north-road-phoenix-park.jpg
https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/10-zoo-bypass-lords-walk.jpg

Miles 3-7
Denis b: Mile 2-7.5 Pretty well all uphill although only marginally so over a long distance. Stoneybatter to North Circular Road is the steepest section but is sheltered from prevailing winds. Aughrim Street is pretty narrow. Cannot imagine too much passing room here. Passing Garda HQ and west along Chesterfield Ave puts us into the prevailing wind for a few miles so take Smashiners advice and find shelter behind some group at your pace. It good be a nice investment in this early part of the race.

Unaaine: So joining the route at NCR at roughly mile 3, this is a short flat section after what I’m guessing will have been a bit of a drag up Manor + Aughrim Streets. Turning into the PP through narrow gates and onto a narrow section of road I’m expecting to meet some congestion and there’s a little drag uphill passing Garda HQ and turning left onto Lord’s Walk (zoo carpark area). When I ran this section last Saturday there was a swirly breeze so I’ll still be running at PMP + at this stage. It doesn’t last for long though and once onto Lord’s Walk there's a bit of a breather on this short flat section. Turning right onto Chesterfield Avenue it’s straight here up to Castleknock gates and up through the village to Myos Pub. I do a lot of running in the PP and am very familiar with this stretch of road and I always find it a bit of a drag. However I think the route last year in through the main gates at parkgate street would have been much harder and combined with not having to run the length of Chesterfield avenue this change of route will reduce the monotony as well. Though I’m sure that the crowds and the cheering on the day will help to make it pass quicker than usual. The road flattens out a little after the Aras roundabout and it goes up again slightly through the Castleknock gate and on through the village. After a tight enough left turn at Myos the road narrows again and goes uphill slightly for a few hundred metres. When I ran these miles last weekend the drag overall really wasn’t that bad and the breeze was there but minimal. I’ll also be thinking of trying to tuck in behind a group and benefit from the shelter but I’ve never yet managed to do this successfully in any other race. I’d still expect to be behind target by mile 7 though and I won’t be aiming to hit PMP through any of these miles.

.Miles 5-7 - Almost three miles in a straight line up Chesterfield Avenue to Castleknock. Road is significantly wider here which should ease any congestion and allow you to get back into your rhythm. Slight drag all the way up but nothing major.

Singer: Miles 3-4: Should be wide enough on the NCR, but once into the park things get pretty narrow again.
Miles 4-5-6: Slight uphill all the way through Chesterfield Avenue. Good surface and plenty of space, so should be comfortable, though don't waste too much energy here.

TFGR on
Mile 4, 5 and 6 https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/11-chesterfield-avenue.jpg
Mile 6 https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/12-castleknock-road.jpg

Miles 7-10:
Denis b: Mile 7.5-10 Sweet section where I will be happy to make up any time I need, within reason. Prevailing wind behind us and we sweep back into the park before exiting to the Liffey. Might be worth checking out downhill running form to save the quads. Feel free to take revenge on the Upper Glen Road for all the hearthache it gave us in the Race Series

Unaaine: After mile 7 it’s onto Tower Road and the welcome start of some downhill sections of road. I’m planning to up the pace here, though not sure by how much. Maybe PMP - 10/15 secs is the way to go but I’ve haven’t discussed this with anyone yet. I will be especially concentrating on relaxing and allowing forward momentum to do some of the work. I have had experience of forcing myself to slow on a steep downhill before and injured my quads. So it’ll be about relaxing, smiling and positive thinking and making up some of the time lost over the previous miles. According to the DCM route map it’s roughly a mile of downhill here before we turn back into the Park through the Knockmaroon gate. The road goes uphill again but only for a short section until for once in a race we go the opposite way down the Upper Glen Road for roughly a mile and a half or so until exiting the Park for the last time at Chapelizod gate. As far as I remember it’s flat enough along Chapelizod Road over the bridge in the village turning onto St Laurence’s Road at the 10 mile mark. I hope to be approaching PMP by this point, but if I’m not, I’m not going to worry.

Singer: Miles: 7-8-9: More uphill to Castleknock, but expecting good support. Generally downhill down to and through the park (nice to be doing that goddamn hill at the end of the 5/10/13.1 races in reverse )

TFGR on
Mile 7 https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/13-college-road.jpg
https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/14-tower-road.jpg
Miles 8 and 9 https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/15-knockmaroon-and-upper-glen-road.jpg
Mile 9 https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/16-chapelizod-road.jpg


Miles 10 - 13
Denis b: Mile 10-13 Over the Liffey at Chapelizod and catch breath for the St. Lawrence Road hill which brings you under the Dual Carriageway. Will be taking it easy here and just maintain the effort as the next 2 miles are flat enough, bar a very short hill or two in Kilmainham. I imagine that the running crowd will have thinned out so think about the bends ahead and line up to your advantage. Again it is fairly sheltered along this section and prevailing winds (south-west) should be behind us, generally speaking.

Unaaine: Then there’s the first ‘proper’ hill at the end of St Laurence’s Road. I’ve done this a few times during the LSRs and haven’t found it too bad. I’ve also done some hill training with my club and while my instinct would be to power up it and get it over with I think I’ll be dropping the pace and keeping the effort level consistent. I think it’s too early and the race ahead too much of an unknown for me to be thinking of any doing else. There’s a left turn then onto Sarsfield Road and a welcome stretch of flat road until the right turn under an overpass(?)/bridge onto Inchicore Road. To me this looks worse than it is but again I’ll be dropping the pace here. Straight again until the right turn at Kilmainham Gaol and another short enough uphill until the left turn onto SCR. Nothing too memorable in this stretch for me which winds right around by james Hospital and through Rialto until up and over the bump at the canal at Dolphin’s Barn.

TFGR on
Mile 10 https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/17-st-laurence-road.jpg
https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/18-sarsfield-road.jpg
Mile 11 https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/19-inchicore-road.jpg
https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/20-inchicore-to-south-circular-road.jpg
Mile 12 https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/21-south-circular-road.jpg
And beyond....
https://thisfatgirlruns.files.wordpress.com/2015/10/22-the-future-is-unknown.jpg

Miles 13 - 15
Denis b: Mile 13-15 Think SMASHINER here. Its Crumlin Road time up to Walkinstown Roundabout. It is a long but gentle rise with two very short less gentle rises at the very start. If its windy get behind SMASHINER. Once you pass the hospital things improve but it is very exposed to the south west. This section bridges the half way point so most of us will still be conserving some energy. That kind of encapsulates my approach on this section - mark time and enjoy the company.

Unaaine: Passing the halfway (yay!) mark, I’ve run this section encompassing the Crumlin Road on a few occasions and have had different experiences each time. For me this could be the make or break in terms of creating problems for later on. Once or twice I encountered a pretty stiff wind and while I felt that my effort level was high when I checked my pace it was unbelievably slow. On other occasions it was actually not too bad. It is a drag though for the 2 miles to the Walkinstown Roundabout so I won’t be hoping for PMP here either and if it’s windy the pace will be very very conservative. Not a lot more to say about this section - it’s long, boring and usually windy. If the brain is still working at this point I think it will be time to dig deep and focus.

Miles 15 - 20
Denis b: Mile 15-20 Subject to advice I am going to be a little bolder on this section. It feels as though it is nearly all flat to ever so slightly downhill at times and again the wind, if any, should be behind us. I imagine that there will be a lot of support along here as people can also get out from the start and then back into town for the finish quite easily. Orwell Park is quite a narrow section and as you exit it there follows a short downhill section. Water and gel up here.

Unaaine: Turning left onto Cromwellsfort Road after the Walkinstown Roundabout if my memory serves me correctly this is an okay though long-ish section down to KCR. And it must be flat or downhill if I’m visualising it as ‘down’ to KCR. A right turn then onto Fortfield Road and then a quick left turn and for some reason I don’t like this section at all. Can’t put my finger on it but it just seems longer and tougher than it should. The route turns left at Terenure College/Bushy Park onto Templeogue Road and again it seems flat but I remember checking my pace here once or twice and it never reflects this. It is definitely faster and a relief once the route turns right onto Terenure Road East following into Orwell Park and Darty Road and all the way to Milltown is pretty okay overall. Then there’s a hill at Milltown after the underpass and it’s pretty steep and looks daunting. I’m hoping to be able to draw on the benefits of the ‘easier’ miles beforehand to get up and over this one. But really no idea how this is going to pan out on the day as I’ve only ever hit it at 16 miles and not 20 so I guess it’ll be slow and well below PMP. It’s a right turn then onto a flatter Clonskeagh Road and a chance to draw breath again.

Miles 20 - 23
Denis b: Mile 20-22.25ish Man up time!!! This is what we trained for. Nothing that cant be done but will have to concentrate hard. Short steep sections at Milltown and end of Roebuck ( 40 and 50 double strides will pile you over each respectively). The rest of this section is on a gentle uphill section most of the way. Its not so bad but its late in the race. I have tried to run this section a few times late in my LSR's and it worked fine. The Roebuck hill did require a bit of grit to be fair.

Unaaine: This section is a series of gradual inclines interspersed with flatter sections (breathers) which I’m guessing will be challenging enough given the miles already in the legs. The route winds around the perimeter of UCD with a left turn onto Roebuck Road culminating in the hill at the end - called Heartbreak Hill by some. On my LSRs I’ve never found this hill too bad and have managed to get up it with an increase in cadence and a small increase in effort. But again given the stage we’ll hit it at it will be ‘interesting’ to see how much more it will hurt on the day. Foster’s Avenue is a welcome flat or downhill I think and mile 23 is a left turn onto the Stillorgan Dual Carriageway and up and over the flyover at UCD.

Yaboya on 'Heartbreak Hill'
"I came around towards the famous Roebuck Hill and started to get a bit annoyed that it had such an unearned reputation. I saw people ahead of me stopping to a walk, so decided I wasn't putting up with this sh*t. I ran up it as fast as I could, through the Wall of Support trying to make eye contact with someone in the crowd so I could say: "Heartbreak Hill my b*%&@x".

Miles 23 - 26.2+
Denis b: Mile 22.25 to Finish Relatively straight forward with the sweep of Fosters Ave in front of you. Watch the speed ramps on Nutley Lane... so easy to catch one with tired dragging legs. Again I think this is the give it whatever you have left section but I would be careful with the Stillorgan Road as it can be very exposed if its blowing from the west.

Singer: Miles 23-24: Still more downhill, then a slightly annoying drag up to the UCD flyover. I'm sure at this stage "slightly annoying" will mean "completely head wrecking" but it's the last hill...
Miles 24-26: Slight downhill on wide enough road, some nice landmarks to pass and straight on through to...
Miles 26 - 26.2: ...an easy sprint to the finish line, even though it's slightly uphill, to Merrion Square, the gateway to McGrattan's

Unaaine: Coming off the UCD flyover (downhill obviously) there’s a barely noticeable incline up to the right turn onto Nutley Lane. This is a nice stretch - flat to downhill and then a right turn at Merrion S.C. onto Merrion Road. Not a huge fan of this section as it seems long and I’ve only run it towards the end of the LSRs when the legs were feeling heavy. Past the RDS onto Northumberland Road and the end is in sight. The pseudo finish is at the intersection of Mount Street and Merrion Square where we will all be immediately upping the pace to PMP -100% to slake our thirst in McGrattans.

YOUR APPROACH, some tips:
Clearlier on dividing the race up:
"Somewhere between 10 and 13 miles is where you should first feel that you've done a bit of work, not much but it stops being a jog at around this point, this is where you start to focus a little more - still enjoying it though.

By 20 miles you'll be tired but still controlled as you start to enter into uncharted territory. Keep it steady at this point and you'll be passing runners left, right and centre. The effort levels required to maintain pace will start to rise, let that happen but don't try to push on until the last 4 miles.... to finish strong."

Murph D posted this a while back and it's definitely worth a read:
http://old.centralparktc.org/training/coach01.htm

It really is a 20 mile warm up for a 6 mile race! Keep the racing line, i.e., take the shortest option from point A to point B, this includes not weaving

USING A PACING GROUP
From what I've heard and seen, boardsie pacers (and the whole Dublin crew) are the best and most reliable pacers, bar none. They're like tins of Ronseal: do exactly what they say they will. However, like both meno and clearlier advise, you need to take responsibility for your own race. They're there as a guide, just like your gps etc. Saying that, I just have to run in one of marthastew's pacing groups one day The 4:30 group is looking pretty cool too this year

See meno here for general pacing approach:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97357128&postcount=6243

Clearlier and Neady on using pacers as a guide:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97360233&postcount=6256

"You'll notice I've not mentioned the pacers much so far. Pacers are great and fantastic and the boardsies doing DCM are some of the best but remember, they're running at their own rhythm not yours. You should use them as a guide as to how well you're doing rather than how fast you should be running for at least the first 20 miles. In the meantime you can settle into your own rhythm and focus on your own performance. If you can do that I think that you'll run a great race."

You can slot in with them, behind them or in front. But you'll never be too far from a pacing group

INDEX/INDIVIDUAL OVERVIEWS:

Annapr
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97220723&postcount=33

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97222775&postcount=34

Beepbeep and belcarra
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97431008&postcount=177

Denis b
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97358474&postcount=6250

Singer
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97313382&postcount=5973

Smashiner on yaboya
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97319507&postcount=6002

TFGR
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97321050&postcount=6007

Tunguska legendary post, 2014 (course has changed, do not commit this to memory :eek: )
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=92595815&postcount=754

Unaaine
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97432428&postcount=6728

Yaboya
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97315716&postcount=5991

YABOYA LAST YR ON Heartbreak Hill
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=97321592&postcount=6015


Thanks everyone for your excellent contributions! This is your (calm and focused ) bedtime reading Novices