Fire at a halting site in Dublin Mod Warning Post #1

Means Of Escape · 13-10-2015 09:04PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

Theeeeere it is

As long as they're not hurting anybody they should be free to live whatever way they want to live.

I'm always astounded by these threads. Travellers seem to be the one group that it's still ok to generalise about. Make such sweeping generalisations about Muslims, Northerners, Poles, or <insert ethnic / demographic sub-division here> and you'll (rightly) be attacked by other users, if not actually banned from whatever website you're posting on. Make the thinly veiled assumption that "travellers = trouble" and it's perfectly socially acceptable.

Rather depressing, really. I find it pretty bizarre how socially acceptable it is to stereotype and discriminate against two specific social groups in Ireland - travellers and people from "rough" areas or areas with a lot of council housing. When you actually meet some of these people it just makes you angry that society has decided it's ok to view them as second class citizens. I 100% guarantee you that the people who are objecting to this would be the same people who would object to the building of council flats on the same site. Probably the sort who would nonsensically tell you to "be careful" and "watch your back" if you casually mentioned that you were visiting a friend in somewhere like Gardiner St or Crumlin.

Idiots one and all.

And as idiots people should rejoice living beside a community who openly box each other in front of their children, burn refuse , allow horses to graze in communal areas ,litter with impunity etc etc and this is the case more often than not

It's clear that the barricades are up to prevent this type of behaviour arriving on their doorstep
Most in that estate have a mortgage and I'll bet the value of their properties would plummet if there was a permanent placement made there for the reasons listed

eviltwin · 13-10-2015 09:15PM

Maybe people who actually bother to earn a living and contribute to society are sick of the usual scroungers getting special treatment.

arybvtcw0eolkf · 13-10-2015 10:03PM

This thread has turned very nasty, and the burials haven't even begun yet.

For shame on some of you, for shame.

whatismyname · 13-10-2015 10:11PM

Maren Agreeable Cotton wrote: »

This thread has turned very nasty, and the burials haven't even begun yet.

For shame on some of you, for shame.

Agreed, and it's only mild compared to what's being said on the other thread about it.

The lack of empathy and humanity from people has stunned me.

The Talking Bread · 13-10-2015 10:13PM

Maren Agreeable Cotton wrote: »

This thread has turned very nasty, and the burials haven't even begun yet.

For shame on some of you, for shame.

I agree. But I don't think the residents deserve the vitriol being leveled at them.

13-10-2015 10:14PM

Mod

This thread is about 10 people who lost their lives, many of them just children.

If there is as much as a hint of bigotry from here on in, there will be no further warnings, and no further cards. Straight out bans will be handed out.

end of the road · 13-10-2015 10:30PM

The Talking Bread wrote: »

Yes travellers have rights but there also needs to be a conforming to society.

there doesn't. nobody has to "conform" to anything. all you have to do is not break the law, and for those who do we have systems in place to deal with such people. the systems need proper resources and funding.

end of the road · 13-10-2015 10:35PM

Means Of Escape wrote: »

Attitude to education is a good starting point

we have systems to deal with all problems within the traveling community, the same ones that deal with all problems. if they are failing, its up to the relevant authorities to fix the systems and weed out such failings

darkpagandeath · 13-10-2015 10:37PM

RIP, I really hope it was not an Electrical fire.

whatismyname · 13-10-2015 10:39PM

It's a long while since I've heard quite such an ignorant prejudiced twat than the male caller (Derek I think) speaking on FM104. He's probably no different than what some people here, and on the other traveller thread would be like if they'd called in, but hearing out loud quite what he's spewing is just a bit 'wow'.

Annasopra · 13-10-2015 10:40PM

Means Of Escape wrote: »

When settled folk reside close to the travelling community on a long term basis it always ends in tears

Poles apart in every respect .

And yet this family who died were praised to the hilt by neighbours

tomwaterford · 13-10-2015 10:41PM

whatismyname wrote: »

It's a long while since I've heard quite such an ignorant prejudiced twat than the male caller John (or it might have been Derek, sorry, anyone listening will probably know the guy I mean) speaking on FM104. He's probably no different than what some people here, and on the other traveller thread would be like if they'd called in, but hearing out loud quite what he's spewing is just a bit 'wow'.

Most possibly is someone posting here as I doubt there's that many bigots in ireland!

Annasopra · 13-10-2015 10:41PM

Means Of Escape wrote: »

Attitude to education is a good starting point

So. Your answer is no then.

end of the road · 13-10-2015 10:42PM

Means Of Escape wrote: »

And as idiots people should rejoice living beside a community who openly box each other in front of their children, burn refuse , allow horses to graze in communal areas ,litter with impunity etc etc and this is the case more often than not

so, basically things you can get the odd time in an estate? we have laws to deal with them. if the gardai aren't enforcing or can't enforce, thats up to the relevant people to deal with.

Means Of Escape wrote: »

It's clear that the barricades are up to prevent this type of behaviour arriving on their doorstep

they are blocking a council site, so they are possibly commiting a crime and should be removed hard. i don't care what their reasons are, plenty of systems in place to raise objections. they are most likely looking for attention and nothing more.

Means Of Escape wrote: »

Most in that estate have a mortgage and I'll bet the value of their properties would plummet if there was a permanent placement made there for the reasons listed

i'm afraid thats just life. property values can go down as well as up. if you chose to get a mortgage you would know this. you would also know that a mortgage only entitles you to ownership of the house upon repayment in full and nothing more.

whatismyname · 13-10-2015 10:42PM

tomwaterford wrote: »

Most possibly is someone posting here as I doubt there's that many bigots in ireland!

It wouldn't surprise me if he was someone from here to be honest. But jeez it's just like 'what the heck'.

Edit: Derek was saying practically identical stuff to some of what was on here. Practically word for word - so I think he either was from here, or was reading the threads here.

whatismyname · 13-10-2015 10:44PM

Very glad to hear a friend of the people who've died call in and speak in support of them and what good people they are. Their family is ultimately who this is about. The people who've died aren't here to speak for themselves, and I very much doubt there families would be in much of a fit state to, so I was glad to hear their friend called in.

blackwhite · 13-10-2015 10:44PM

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

And yet this family who died were praised to the hilt by neighbours

I play with a sports club in the area. There's a lot of mixed reports locally tbh.

Whether it's a case of people not being willing to say anything to the media, or the media not reporting any negatives, is another matter.

The Talking Bread · 13-10-2015 10:51PM

whatismyname wrote: »

It's a long while since I've heard quite such an ignorant prejudiced twat than the male caller (Derek I think) speaking on FM104. He's probably no different than what some people here, and on the other traveller thread would be like if they'd called in, but hearing out loud quite what he's spewing is just a bit 'wow'.

Not one person on either of the threads has shown that level of hatred or prejudice towards travellers. He quite oobviously is uneducated and not the full shilling. I tuned in for five minutes and turned off. Talk shows giving a voice to such hateful people are the reason such talk shows are garbage. And then comparing people like me who have stood up for the rights of the residents whilst also showing respect for the travelling community to such a man is very unfair.

VinLieger · 13-10-2015 10:53PM

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

And yet this family who died were praised to the hilt by neighbours

We all know nobody in ireland dies a sinner.

Sure the guys who robbed a taxi with a screwdriver and then died after crashing were pretty much beatified, same with the guy trying to rob his mates house but got stuck in a door and died of hypothermia, even his friend who he was actively robbing at the time of his death wouldn't say a bad thing about him

Kiwi in IE · 13-10-2015 10:53PM

I am not sure why it seems to be acceptable to be so prejudice, bigoted and nasty about this particular group of people. Are there any non traveller Irish people who litter, have loose animals, commit crimes, get into fights, fail to conform to social 'norms' or make noise? If the answer is yes, then is it then OK to asign these attributes to ALL non traveller Irish people, at all times, under all circumstances, forever after?

The Talking Bread · 13-10-2015 10:54PM

whatismyname wrote: »

It wouldn't surprise me if he was someone from here to be honest. But jeez it's just like 'what the heck'.

Edit: Derek was saying practically identical stuff to some of what was on here. Practically word for word - so I think he either was from here, or was reading the threads here.

What nonsense. What he was saying was just hyperbolic racist nonsense. Get off your high chair.

whatismyname · 13-10-2015 10:54PM

The Talking Bread wrote: »

Not one person on either of the threads has shown that level of hatred or prejudice towards travellers. He quite oobviously is uneducated and not the full shilling. I tuned in for five minutes and turned off. Talk shows giving a voice to such hateful people are the reason such talk shows are garbage. And then comparing people like me who have stood up for the rights of the residents whilst also showing respect for the travelling community to such a man is very unfair.

I'm not sure from your post if you believe that 'I' compared him to you / some others who did the same (understood why people were protesting, but still showing respect for travellers).

Just in case, I'd like to clarify that that's definitely not what I was doing, but apologise if it seemed that way.

Azalea · 13-10-2015 10:59PM

The Talking Bread wrote: »

Not one person on either of the threads has shown that level of hatred or prejudice towards travellers. He quite oobviously is uneducated and not the full shilling. I tuned in for five minutes and turned off. Talk shows giving a voice to such hateful people are the reason such talk shows are garbage.

I reckon those shows plant wind-up artists. I know there is an incredible level of ignorance and stupidity out there, but some folk phoning talk-shows don't seem for real at all.

Spanish Eyes · 13-10-2015 11:01PM

Was the other thread about the digger coming in to the cul de sac to make a new halting site closed? Can't make a comment or anything.

I didn't see any warning or closedown from the mods. Just wondered if I am feeling Ok

whatismyname · 13-10-2015 11:01PM

Hatless wrote: »

I reckon those shows plant wind-up artists. I know there is an incredible level of ignorance and stupidity out there, but some folk phoning talk-shows don't seem for real at all.

No idea if it's what happens here, but yes I'd absolutely agree that it no doubt sometimes happens.

The Talking Bread · 13-10-2015 11:03PM

Kiwi in IE wrote: »

I am not sure why it seems to be acceptable to be so prejudice, bigoted and nasty about this particular group of people. Are there any non traveller Irish people who litter, have loose animals, commit crimes, get into fights, fail to conform to social 'norms' or make noise? If the answer is yes, then is it then OK to asign these attributes to ALL non traveller Irish people, at all times, under all circumstances, forever after?

The issue at hand is this group of residents don't want a halting site on their doorstep. There is NO such thing nowadays as temporary halting sites. I guarantee you there are far more suitable sites than in a residential cul de sac. I've had travellers work for me, I've bought gates, sold items etc. Most are decent people. Family people, honourable, and hard working and smater than the averge joe soap. But sadly a lot don't respect society or society's laws and that is the fear that is causing the protests.

The Talking Bread · 13-10-2015 11:07PM

whatismyname wrote: »

I'm not sure from your post if you believe that 'I' compared him to you / some others who did the same (understood why people were protesting, but still showing respect for travellers).

Just in case, I'd like to clarify that that's definitely not what I was doing, but apologise if it seemed that way.

Fair enough but you compared a lot of people on the thread who have balanced this debate by offering the view of the residents it seems to that plank. I didn't see any comment on these threads that would incite you to make such a comparison to be honest. He was just a head the ball. And probably a plant.

whatismyname · 13-10-2015 11:12PM

The Talking Bread wrote: »

Fair enough but you compared a lot of people on the thread who have balanced this debate by offering the view of the residents it seems to that plank. I didn't see any comment on these threads that would incite you to make such a comparison to be honest. He was just a head the ball. And probably a plant.

I didn't compare 'a lot'. I used the word 'some'.

There was some despecibale very prejudiced things said, that were very similar to some of what he said.

I looked back over your posts, and the ones I'm referring to were fairly different from the type of stuff you were said.

You didn't see any comment on the threads (it was really the other one I saw the worst stuff) that would incite me (or, I'm guessing the person whose post I was responding to) to make a comparison to this man, but I saw quite a few, particularly when some of the stuff he was said was near identical.

But I'm sorry I really don't want to get into a tit for tat of quoting those posts to you. Especially not on this thread where whoops has pointed out that the thread relates to 10 people who have died, and that is the focus of this thread, so I think that me quoting the posts I'm thinking of would be derailing the thread.

But there was 'some' that were fairly shocking. I never said 'a lot' just some, and I never made any comparison to you. All the best.

Kiwi in IE · 13-10-2015 11:13PM

The Talking Bread wrote: »

But sadly a lot don't respect society or society's laws and that is the fear that is causing the protests.

Respect must be earned. Has society somehow failed to earn their respect?
If I were a member of a group who were treated by society the way the travelling community seem to be treated, I wouldn't respect it either! Chicken/Egg?

efb · 13-10-2015 11:45PM

The Talking Bread wrote: »

Every second person seems to have a peaceful halting site at the end of their road now it seems.

are you insinuating Im lying?

Fire at a halting site in Dublin *Mod Warning Post #1*

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Fire at a halting site in Dublin Mod Warning Post #1