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DCM 2015: Mentored Novices Thread

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 259 ✭✭duffer247



    First 10 miles were great.

    It's a small thing @TFGR I know, but just to be able to say the above is amazing,most normal people would be like 'what the?'
    Hope you're feeling better


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,585 ✭✭✭nop98


    duffer247 wrote: »
    It's a small thing @TFGR I know, but just to be able to say the above is amazing,most normal people would be like 'what the?'
    Hope you're feeling better

    +1 to this. Another good couple of miles banked, even tho it isn't the number you had hoped to clock-up. Don't let one bad run knock you for six, you've more than enough banked by now. I like Feena's advice too, to just grab an easy couple of miles soon (probably Garminless) just to get the mojo back.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 259 ✭✭duffer247


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    Thanks for picking that up meno. I think this issue came up a few weeks ago and I may or may not have posted this so just in case am posting it again :)

    Does the same go for hamstrings and foam rolling?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 785 ✭✭✭Notwork Error


    duffer247 wrote: »
    Does the same go for hamstrings and foam rolling?

    Nope, the hamstrings are muscles, roll away. The it band is different because it's a long string of connective tissue with huge tensile strength and is very difficult to stretch. My sports therapists says that it's not actually the IT band that is tight, it's the glutes and TfL that are right which pull on the IT band and cause friction at the hip or the knee. Rolling and/or strecting the hips and glutes should provide more relief than rolling the band.


    Well done to everyone on their long runs, all the hard work is done now, time to recover:)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    BnMtYUUCEAAA6fG.jpg


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 377 ✭✭Phoole


    LSR done. Athlone 3/4 marathon. I ran the entire thing at an average of 9.49 per mile. Chuffed I didn't stop at all, except the one time to stretch a hamstring cramp at mile 19. It really helps being in a group. Never felt pain like the first 30 mins after the run. I could barely walk!! :eek:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,199 ✭✭✭denis b


    TFGR

    That is your tough run done. Would also agree with Feena M's advice, to just look forward to your next run and let it be an inspiring and relaxed run. We are all at the edge of reason and health but we have time to recover now.


  • Posts: 53,068 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Bit jealous of all you taperers as I set off for an hour and some hill sprints before work :P


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,776 ✭✭✭This Fat Girl Runs


    You guys are the best. Seriously!

    I have a massive headache today, no surprise. Can't take the day off work though so will have to endure it.

    Next run will be Wednesday. I will take your advice and just run for the sake of running. No worry about pace, no Garmin, no purpose. Just run. I'll enjoy that.

    Congrats to all on the long runs and race! Really this is a great group and I'm proud to be a part of it!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,459 ✭✭✭ZV Yoda


    Did my 20 mile yesterday. Was running with my mate. Original plan was to run the DCM course, but we both agreed that all the stop-starting, traffic lights & dodgy kerbs weren't worth the hassle. Instead we ran in the Phoenix Park. I don't have the exact time (Garmin ran out of battery), but we did it in under 3:30, so the pace was spot on for an lsr.

    I felt very comfortable for the first 17 miles. The last 3 were tough. The gels seemed to work out well (although I only took 3 and I think I'll need to take more than that). Wore the water belt, so hydration was fine. Lots of positives to take away. This was by far my longest run and the longest time on my feet.

    On the downside, I was absolutely shattered when I got home. Epsom salts bath helped loosed the legs a little bit. The knees were sore too. I was knackered all day. Dozed off a couple of times in the afternoon. It's as if all the training miles hit me at once. Woke up this morning & the legs were still wrecked. Knees are tender, so Ill try to keep off my feet as much as possible.

    Well done to everybody else on their week-end running. Sounds like quite a few of us are battle damaged at this stage.

    Thanks be to Jaysus for the taper. That's all I can say.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,776 ✭✭✭This Fat Girl Runs


    Headache turned into migraine complete with lightning aura and nausea. Can't leave work though. Wishing we could at least turn off the lights in my section!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,038 ✭✭✭Neady83


    Headache turned into migraine complete with lightning aura and nausea. Can't leave work though. Wishing we could at least turn off the lights in my section!

    Awh TFGR so sorry to hear that, I don't suffer much from migraines so I've no advice to offer. My heart went out to you reading your LSR report last night. You kept going though and that's the main thing, it will stand to you on the day and you definitely won't be running alone on the big day :)

    You've been give some stellar advice above especially in relation to joining a FitforLife running group, they offer great camaraderie and you know for sure that you will have others to run with two days of the week.

    Hope you're feeling better soon :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,636 ✭✭✭frash


    Getting in the first 'taper doubts' post.

    "Trust in the plan", they'll say.
    Thing is I didn't follow a plan exactly. Yeah it was 3 midweek runs every week with a LSR at the weekend but I didn't keep the percentage to 35% (or even 50%) some weeks.

    My highest mileage for one week (Mon-Sun) was 37 miles but that was back in August although I did have to do 2 LSRs in one week last week so I guess the highest is 52 miles but that was really down to how a 33 mile week was followed by a 35 mile week. (sorry for the rambling sentence but hopefully it makes sense)

    Total since the plan started is 425.

    I worry about endurance - can I keep the pmp (10:18) up for 26.2 miles?
    Should I go with the 4:30 pacer and potential end up loosing them and finishing in 4:40 or should I go with the 4:40 and hopefully stay with them or might I end up at 4:50 / 5:00?

    My HM PB is 2:02:41 but that was from last year's race series HM (when I was actually running less due to injury).
    This year I all but gave up once I lost the 2 hour pacers at 11.5 miles to finish in 2:06 even though I'd done the tougher RnR HM in August in 2:03.

    I'm not really expecting anyone to reply to tell me the answers to any of the above but if you feel any kind of similar doubts you might hit the 'thanks' button.

    Haven't ran since Thursday (was away for the weekend) so maybe 5 miles at PMP at lunchtime will clear some of these doubts.

    I'm off the booze now until after the big day - another challenge!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,776 ✭✭✭This Fat Girl Runs


    Neady83 wrote: »
    Awh TFGR so sorry to hear that, I don't suffer much from migraines so I've no advice to offer. My heart went out to you reading your LSR report last night. You kept going though and that's the main thing, it will stand to you on the day and you definitely won't be running alone on the big day :)

    You've been give some stellar advice above especially in relation to joining a FitforLife running group, they offer great camaraderie and you know for sure that you will have others to run with two days of the week.

    Hope you're feeling better soon :)

    Thank you! I don't often get migraines these days. I used to a lot but once I cut out caffeine (about 3 and a half years ago) they reduced dramatically. Will just grin and bear it. Unfortunately someone else called in sick today and as I've to cover for them I don't have a choice.

    I will look up FitforLife. I did try to join a running group a while ago but they didn't want me. Hopefully FitforLife will take slow runners like me and run in my area!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 161 ✭✭JacEim


    Running after flying is NOT good!!!

    Had planned to run on Saturday morning as was travelling to US on Sunday morning early. Plan scuppered as U10's had a football blitz on Sat am (they hadn't won a game all year and won all three games in the blitz... They were thrilled!!!)
    I've been travelling so much lately that I really wanted to spend the rest of the day with the family and couldn't take another three hours out for 'myself' on Sat pm. Had a 'date' with the Mrs on Sat night so 5 pints later I crawled into bed at 2am.
    Up at 5.30 to fly to London & NY - the only positive being the nice bowl of porridge in Heathrow after my hangover headache had gone. Got a couple of hours sleep on the long flight and eventually got to my hotel around 7.30pm Irish time. The hotel was off a highway and was about 3M from the nearest paths / safe running location.
    Really thought about not running but after a HTFU moment resigned myself to the dreaded hotel gym. Schedule was for 15M but I had planned to run 20M on Sat morning.
    Brought water and even a change of T shirt with me to the gym (luckily nobody else there) and set off. Kept the pace deliberately slower than normal as I'm sure the long flight is hard on the body so was running just under 9.00 miles (slowest for any of my LSR's)
    Did the first hour, treadmill shutdown and had to restart again.., took opportunity to get fresh towels and start again (even put a towel around my neck just under my top as I was afraid of major nipple bleed with the heavy sweat). Did the second hour and treadmill shut down again. Changed the tshirt in the gym - and fortunately no one there to witness. Over the course of this training I think my body shape is now starting to resemble Gru from Despicable me.... Skinny legs carrying a 'flabby' torso :)
    Started up the machine for the third hour and needed to do all of it to get up to the 20M... But at 16.5M the mind and body said ENOUGH!!!
    Even though I had a TV to watch the adverts broken by some actual TV shows, it was an absolutely awful run - my energy levels were terrible, really thirsty throughout, boring, boring, boring and my left foot and knees got pretty sore!!!

    I didn't do the 20 as I wanted, BUT, I did more than the 15 that were in my plan.
    Was ravenous afterwards, and in an effort to be healthy I just got a meat sandwich from Subway.... But had the 12" :)

    Felt pretty good going to bed, thought I wouldn't get out at all this weekend, so glad I did get the miles into the legs, I know this will stand to me.

    Keep on running everyone!!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,804 ✭✭✭eyeball kid


    16.5 miles on a treadmill, fair play. Don't think I could handle 5km on one.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,388 ✭✭✭diego_b


    Fine running to get that all on a treadmill, I did 42.5KM on an exercise bike in around 75mins and it is fair boring!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 161 ✭✭JacEim


    if there had been others in the gym it might not have been so bad. It felt like literally 5 mins of TV followed by 5 mins of ads - crazy!!!

    It was pretty warm in there also - I like to think of it as building mental strength for DCM... :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 107 ✭✭Peter D61


    Athlone 3/4 done yesterday, average pace 10:52. My longest run so far. I was surprised by the number of hills on the course and struggled for the last 4 miles or so. No problems other than the toe issues hanging on since the 1/2. Hoping the taper will give them time to heal. One more long run left, bring it on.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,272 ✭✭✭Dubgal72


    Hello Novices. And here we are, at the penultimate stage. Well done each and every one of you. Individually, you have covered hundreds of miles to get here. You have nurtured niggles, meticulously planned, forsaken wild nights out (you have, haven't you?!), learned all about good pain and bad pain, collapsed in pools of sweat, doubted yourselves, despaired, shed tears of joy and tears of agony... and then ultimately surpassed your wildest expectations.

    We're nearly there.

    But let's not collapse in a heap of relief just yet :D The next three weeks remain a very significant part of your training. You still have plenty of work to do, but like you have found re your training for the marathon, it's not all about simply getting out to run. Tapering for a marathon takes a little bit of the focus off the hard slog of miles and miles. And, like you will have found along your odyssey, the mental part of marathon preparation requires just as much training. So over the next three weeks:
    - you will very likely find yourselves doubting your ability to complete what's ahead
    - you may start to worry that you haven't done enough
    - you will definitely start to freak that you are losing too much fitness

    1) DON'T
    2) YOU HAVE
    3) YOU MOST CERTAINLY WON'T

    So here's a basic guide for the weeks ahead. Where I've taken directly from t'internet, I've included links below for acknowledgement and some further reading. That doesn't mean a complete endorsement of the whole article. For example, some of these articles suggest doing x and y workouts 10 days out. Ignore these bits :rolleyes: We're

    STICKING TO THE PLAN :D

    WHAT is a taper?
    "The marathon taper is a delicate balance of maintaining fitness while promoting recovery." The boards and Hal tapers you are following have been designed to gradually decrease in mileage but will also keep the necessary systems ticking over at just the right intensity.

    WHO tapers? YOU :D

    WHEN?
    In the period before your marathon - 2-3 weeks - for our purposes as novices, it's three weeks/immediately after the last lsr.

    WHY?
    A proper taper can mean an improvement of 3%
    The next few weeks are when your bodies will maximise the adaptations made from all your hard work.
    Your bodies will also recover, repair and rejuvenate in order to arrive at the start line refreshed and ready to go i.e., your muscle glycogen levels and other micro depletions will top up, damaged muscle tissue will repair and fully adapt to its new, stronger and more efficient state.
    Your immune systems will top up too, leaving you less vulnerable to colds and general illness.

    You don't need to make any new adaptations through training now. Your body has done all the work.

    TRUST IN THE PLAN :D

    HOW?

    IN A RELAXED MANNER (remember, breathe, run tall, smile...RELAX)

    - anxiety about taper time is strictly not allowed, ok?!!

    You will waste a significant amount of nervous energy by worrying. You will need this energy on the 26th. You know this, I know this, so save that energy for then
    I'm will recommend in weeks T-2 and T-1 that you take a boards break. Not a complete break, we'll still be posting, but maybe check in less than you do presently. Again, it's a nervous energy thing.

    - Speculative weather forecasts are not allowed until five days to go. Seriously. You will drive yourselves demented.....

    - All furniture making, moving and anything furniture-related except sitting, eating and sleeping on it is.....yes, you got it, not allowed

    - Make a plan of non running-related things to do over the next three weeks and few days. Cinema, go out for dinner, casual evening walk (you can actually stop at that ice cream stand now )...to fill the space where you normally would have been running.

    - Ease back/take a break from cross training. Yoga and pilates are ok until week T-2. Drop the lower leg work this week, any upper body work will be ok until next week.
    Do, however, keep stretching and maintain your abdominal work.

    - Try not to stress about weight gain. An increase of 2-4lb is normal as your body tops up its depleted glycogen stores. You don't need to drastically increase or decrease what you have been eating. Eat mindfully and keep calm.
    You might give your bodies a little protein boost this week as it repairs but otherwise, for now, carry on eating healthy, unprocessed food. Just like you have been all along, right?! Drink plenty but keep an eye on that wee, especially as race day approaches. A light yellow/straw colour is optimal.

    - Keep topping up that sleep bank. It is normal to lose a bit of sleep in the 2-3 days prior to the race. Plan for that by sleeping well now.

    Do not take up and adrenaline sports over the next three weeks :pac:

    LESS REALLY IS MORE

    WEEK T-2
    Next week (T-2), we'll do lots of work on nailing down your target range. We'll discuss the factors that may affect your choice on the day and work our way through the 'pieces of the marathon jigsaw puzzle'.
    - We'll also talk about sleep during the week ahead and suggestions for what to eat in the 3-5 days before The Day.
    - We'll be inviting novice graduates to come on board to tell us of their experiences.
    - Those of you travelling/away from home for the first time for a race will likely need some practical advice re hotel breakfasts and the timing of it all so we'll nail all that down early in the week.

    WEEK T-1
    In week T-1 we'll discuss the 26th from start to finish. The focus will be on you ENJOYING this experience. And yes, don't worry, I'll include The Tick List for countdown from the evening of the 25th, including details of the important stuff like where to meet post-race :D (Mc Grattan's in case you've been asleep for the past 15 weeks :D Singer, you're in charge of the map for this: finish line -> McGrattans)

    I'll leave you with some advice from Clearlier:

    TRUST IN THE TAPER!

    "It’ll probably need endless repeating but you have to trust the taper to deliver you to the start line ready to run, during the taper you'll have great days and awful days. You might even feel bad on the start line but you will be ready and ready to run well. One very good runner said that for his good races he always felt awful until about halfway through the race! We’re all individuals."



    And of course, jump in with anything that has not been included here. I am so bloody proud of each and every one of you guys (and I mean everyone who started this journey, including those who won't physically be on the start line on the 26th). I would be feeling a little bursting feeling in my chest and maybe a little dampness behind my eyes. But that's not allowed :p


    FURTHER READING

    http://www.runnersworld.com/for-beginners-only/how-to-taper-correctly

    http://www.runnersworld.com/race-training/why-you-should-taper-before-a-marathon

    http://runnersconnect.net/running-training-articles/how-to-taper-for-a-marathon/

    With useful follow-on links
    http://www.runnersworld.com/tag/tapering


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 53 ✭✭stepster


    Hi everyone - I dip into this thread every now and then and find it very informative and great to know there's others in the exact same boat as me! I know I'm late to the party but I suppose I just needed a little support after what was a very trying 20 miler on Saturday - my last LSR. I woke at 3.30am this morning and could not sleep and spent the next hour reading and relating to all your stories of your last big run before tapering begins.

    Here's a bit of background:

    What is your athletics background? Have you run before?What other sports have you taken part in and at what level?
    Running since Feb 2014. No sports since rugby in school 24 years ago!

    Have you raced before? If so what are your PBs? (Date and distance please!)
    Parkrun 5K PB 21.43
    Naas 10K 2014 48.00

    Do you still need to take walk breaks in your training ? (No problem if you do)
    No

    How much training do you currently do ? Distances, cross training - whatever you think is relevant to your current fitness level.
    Previous to my current training plan, I ran Parkrun most weekends and tried to get in at least 2 x 7-8K runs midweek

    How many days a week can you train?
    4

    What do you want to achieve? Dream finishing time and realistic finishing time? Or just complete it in no specified time?
    Dream time 4.15, realistic 4.30

    What marathon programme are you following/intending to use?
    Marathonrookie.com - it's a 16 week program and I started after my holidays in week 4. I have completed most of the program, missed 17 miler in week 11 due to sickness.

    My week 12 LSR last week was 18 miles and I completed it with ease, was tired getting home but felt good within an hour or two.. I consumed 2 gels and water during the run and this worked out well. Previous to this LSR I had not been taking gels but I felt I should as the distances increased, anyway no negative effects and I feel the gels worked..

    Fast forward to week 13 Saturday run 20 miles - what a difference a week makes!! I powered through the 10 mile mark, felt very good - I did not feel like taking a gel until that point so I stopped for a gel and some water - I did not take any more gels after this.. Around the 15 mile mark I started feeling nauseous - every step was a struggle and I still had a quarter of my run to go! It wasn't pretty - I struggled to finish but kept with it - out on my feet. I still had an extra 1km to walk home.. I nearly threw up but managed somehow to reach the front door..

    My time was 3.22 for the 20 miles and average pace of 10.06. I was very happy with this time, but a bit confused because my average pace the week before for the 18 miles was 10.21.

    In my head I'm wondering did I not prepare properly - I ate a mound of pasta and chicken the evening before, but still felt hungry going to bed - should I have eaten before bed? Or possibly I didn't drink enough water the day before - or possibly I was just out of sorts and just drained after all the training.. I just hope the tapering works and I can somehow manage to find the strength to finish this thing!!

    My plan for the marathon is to go with the 4.15 pacers and see how I feel - I can slow down or speed up accordingly.

    Cheers everyone and good luck!


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,636 ✭✭✭frash


    Dubgal72 wrote: »
    So over the next three weeks:
    - you will very likely find yourselves doubting your ability to complete what's ahead
    - you may start to worry that you haven't done enough

    .....

    - anxiety about taper time is strictly not allowed, ok?!!

    Looks like I was a bit premature with my earlier moan


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,324 ✭✭✭chrislad


    frash, you'll be grand. I also don't know if I will be able to keep 10:18 for the full 26.2, but I'm going to try my best. I may even try to keep to 10:00 for 20 miles, and then I can afford to drop to 11:00 for the last 6. Even if I don't get 4:30, finishing in one piece is enough. It's my first marathon. Last year, I couldn't run for 26.2 metres without getting out of breath, so being able to push myself for that distance is an achievement in itself.

    To quote Game of Thrones - 'Expect nothing, and you won't be disappointed'

    You've done enough work to get you over the line. For the likes of me, who hasn't been running that long, over the line is perfect. If I manage to get the 4:30 on the day, fantastic, it's the cherry on top of an already delicious cake :D


  • Posts: 53,068 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    I heard cake and got here as fast as I could was allowed to.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 259 ✭✭duffer247


    chrislad wrote: »
    I also don't know if I will be able to keep 10:18 for the full 26.2, but I'm going to try my best. I may even try to keep to 10:00 for 20 miles, and then I can afford to drop to 11:00 for the last 6.

    @chrislad would you not reverse that approach i.e. run conservative and then have a bonus bit of energy towards the latter part? pass a few runners that are tiring?:D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 259 ✭✭duffer247


    Nope, the hamstrings are muscles, roll away.

    Great, thanks for that.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,324 ✭✭✭chrislad


    duffer247 wrote: »
    @chrislad would you not reverse that approach i.e. run conservative and then have a bonus bit of energy towards the latter part? pass a few runners that are tiring?:D

    I don't know if I'll be able to run faster after 20 miles at a slower pace. I know for a fact that I can run slower after 20 miles at a faster pace. :D


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,038 ✭✭✭Neady83


    JacEim wrote: »
    Running after flying is NOT good!!!

    I didn't do the 20 as I wanted, BUT, I did more than the 15 that were in my plan.

    Serious serious respect for getting that kind of distance done on a treadmill. You're a martyr and a slave to the plan :) Well done :)


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,373 ✭✭✭Phoebas


    Bit jealous of all you taperers as I set off for an hour and some hill sprints before work :P

    Running up hills at 7am on a Monday morning. What kind of fecking madness is this!!!


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,447 ✭✭✭FBOT01


    duffer247 wrote: »
    @chrislad would you not reverse that approach i.e. run conservative and then have a bonus bit of energy towards the latter part? pass a few runners that are tiring?:D

    +1 to this. Start conservatively and work your way into it. Loads of time in the last 10k to use up any extra energy that you may have saved in the 20 mile warm-up. The mental benefits of being a passer rather than getting passed when the going gets tough are immense.........you might be a Rookie but that doesn't mean you have to make a Rookie Mistake ;)


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