Cecil The Lion RIP

Rhys Essien · 29-07-2015 12:11PM

Jimmy Kimmel got very emotional about the whole thing on his show last night.Video here.

http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/television/tv-news/watch-jimmy-kimmel-breaks-down-over-cecil-the-lion-on-live-tv-and-hes-not-the-only-celeb-upset-over-killing-31412295.html

Samaris · 29-07-2015 12:21PM

BattleCorp wrote: »

Regarding the Maasai being part of the ecosystem........... I think the balance of the ecosystem has been skewed since the invention of the firearm.

The lion had a fighting chance against spears and knives, but doesn't do so well against a .308 or a .300 Win Mag.

Yes, I do agree, and I meant to make that point too. But at least they were a fairly small group and the lions had a fighting chance of recovery. They also -tend- to kill the lone males and the older males rather than the breeding females, lead males or cubs. Poachers and hunters in general can be very careless about that sort of thing.

On that note, Cecil was an older male at least, and likely near the end of his reign, not that I condone the killing. Not least since as mentioned, the six cubs he fathered currently will probably be killed by the next alpha. The biggest issue is that he was deliberately lured out of the protected national park area where hunting is forbidden. Whether or not Palmer knew that, I don't know, and/or whether he removed the tracking device that should have been a pretty good indicator not to kill that lion, I don't know either.

As a conservationist and environmentalist, I don't agree with hunting and poaching. On the other hand, I also don't really like what The Internet is doing to the guy's business and life, if he thought he was following the law.

jimboblep · 29-07-2015 12:21PM

murpho999 wrote: »

What are you on about?

Also, can you show me one incident of an animal going around killing people just for fun?

You should google the lions of tsavo(think thats correct spelling) very interesting case of two male lions who were killing railway workers but not eating them

murpho999 · 29-07-2015 12:22PM

Samaris wrote: »

Is it really so unbelievable that animals too can play, and animals too can go kill things for the hell of it? Also, have you never seen a cat play with a mouse?

By the way, what do you consider "credible"? What is incredible about my examples? Would you require an animal to come and specifically rip your face off, pull a lol-face and then wander off before you'd consider it a credible possibility?

Edit: Er, also, why did you add in an extra comment into the quoted piece? I didn't say that line, not least because it doesn't entirely make sense.

Well as Abraham Lincoln said "Don't believe everything you read on the internet". A credible source would be a proper link to a genuine scientific source or credible quality news site not some random info that anyone can throw up.and I would argue that random animal attacks are very rare.
A cat playing with a mouse will eventually eat it, and it's also a method for them to tone their hunting skills.

Either way, we are suppose to be above animals and the idea of a person just killing animals for kicks and trophies is pretty sick in my opinion.

Also, I typed in your quote in error!

Samaris · 29-07-2015 12:23PM

jimboblep wrote: »

You should google the lions of tsavo(think thats correct spelling) very interesting case of two male lions who were killing railway workers but not eating them

Tsavo man-eaters, yep. I used that one too as an example, but apparently it's "not credible". :rolleyes:

Barely There · 29-07-2015 12:23PM

Samaris wrote: »

Gustave the crocodile - a 66-year old monster of a lizard, weighing about 2,000lb and over about 20ft in length (compared to 14-15 for most). Likes killing. Really likes killing. Has been seen to attack a group of humans, lay waste around him and then wander off, not bothering to eat them. The most he seems to eat is a few chunks of flesh. He's believed to have killed over 300 people, and is still active and chomping in Burundi. His last known kill was in 2008, when he grabbed a fisherman, dragged him to the water and drowned him, before abandoning the body. Just because lol, apparently.

I like the sound of Gustave.
He doesn't take any sh;t.

Samaris · 29-07-2015 12:25PM

murpho999 wrote: »

Well as Abraham Lincoln said "Don't believe everything you read on the internet". A credible source would be a proper link to a genuine scientific source or credible quality news site not some random info that anyone can throw up.and I would argue that random animal attacks are very rare.
A cat playing with a mouse will eventually eat it, and it's also a method for them to tone their hunting skills.

Either way, we are suppose to be above animals and the idea of a person just killing animals for kicks and trophies is pretty sick in my opinion.

Also, I typed in your quote in error!

You think I got -all- of these from the internet? The thing is, you can't really run a scientific experiment on whether or not animals will hunt and kill humans for fun. The humans might object, you see, so it's considered bad form even For Science.

The Tsavo man-eaters, the Abadare bull-elephant and Gustave are extremely well-known cases, particularly the first, hence why I didn't bother giving links. Go look them up though, you'll find them.

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/man-eaters-of-tsavo-11614317/?no-ist
http://adventure.nationalgeographic.com/2008/02/gustave-update/michael-mcrae-text

Pac1Man · 29-07-2015 12:26PM

Very Bored wrote: »

...some of those attacking him are going slightly over-the-top in my opinion as it wasn't a human being he killed.

I would be less annoyed if it was a human. We are a horrible species to be fair.

29-07-2015 12:28PM

Ohhhhh.

I only read the titles of the articles and genuinely thought that the dentist killed the tiger by pulling its tooth. All I saw was, "dentists kill tiger".

HeidiHeidi · 29-07-2015 12:29PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Ohhhhh.

I only read the titles of the articles and genuinely thought that the dentist killed the tiger by pulling its tooth. All I saw was, "dentists kill tiger".

Lion.

It was a lion.

Samaris · 29-07-2015 12:31PM

Lion - https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/73/Lion_waiting_in_Namibia.jpg
Tiger - http://funcrisp.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/03/12088-tiger-resting-1680x1050-animal-wallpaper.jpg

Seems to be a surprising amount of confusion over that in this thread.

jimboblep · 29-07-2015 12:31PM

Samaris wrote: »

Tsavo man-eaters, yep. I used that one too as an example, but apparently it's "not credible". :rolleyes:

Sorry didnt see yours when i replied
not credible? Despite all the studies and books that are out there about it

29-07-2015 12:32PM

HeidiHeidi wrote: »

Lion.

It was a lion.

Jokes on you. Lion was it's nickname. Cecil the Lion tiger.

P. Breathnach · 29-07-2015 12:32PM

pickarooney wrote: »

Lions are dicks.

That's very unfair.

Dicks are not supposed to post here, so lions don't have a right to reply.

Samaris · 29-07-2015 12:33PM

jimboblep wrote: »

Sorry didnt see yours when i replied
not credible? Despite all the studies and books that are out there about it

Yeah, I know. The only thing that's questionable is how many people they killed. It was proved that one of them -ate- ten and a bit people, and the other ate 24 and a bit people, but the rest of the accounts are verbal and written accounts of the attacks that left a number of other people dead without being consumed. It's -likely- it's more than 35 and probably less than 135, but we'll never be able to prove the precise number now.

P. Breathnach · 29-07-2015 12:34PM

Deleted User wrote: »

If I was called Cecil, I think I would welcome death

I'm sure he didn't know that he was called Cecil.

razorblunt · 29-07-2015 12:36PM

Rhys Essien wrote: »

Jimmy Kimmel got very emotional about the whole thing on his show last night.Video here.

http://www.independent.ie/entertainment/television/tv-news/watch-jimmy-kimmel-breaks-down-over-cecil-the-lion-on-live-tv-and-hes-not-the-only-celeb-upset-over-killing-31412295.html

Ah Kimmel can fock right off.

jonon9 · 29-07-2015 12:37PM

Barely There wrote: »

Excuse me while I don't give a **** about a lion being killed.

Than why post in a thread that you have no interest in?

Mr Freeze · 29-07-2015 12:53PM

Just looked this guy up, he was killed Rhino and everything.

How can he kill Rhino legally? I thought they were one of the most endangered species.

I hope he gets whats coming to him, which if it was still in Zimbabwe would be 2 - 5 years in prison.

Starokan · 29-07-2015 12:55PM

I am not a fan of hunting personally but I accept its a pastime of many many people throughout the world. However the Zimbabwe government surely must bear a certain responsibility here too, if i read correctly they are allowing a hunting concession to operate on the environs of a national park. The lion , in fact any lion could be lured or could simply wander into the concession at any time.

If you are going to invite wealthy individuals to hunt and take the big corporate paycheck to allow them to do so then this type of scenario was inevitable.

Walter Palmer's pictures of his various hunts for big game make me sick to my stomach but they are legal hunts sanctioned by the countries he visits, what if Walter Palmer booked and completed this hunt without any knowledge that he did anything other than what he paid for. He is a scapegoat for the false outrage of the internet warrior. Many will argue he deserves it but so to does every other hunter who legally goes to these countries or even some of your own country men and women who shoot, bait , trap, deer, pheasant , rabbit, badger etc. Just because its not an endangered species does not make it any less cruel. Walter Palmer deserves your scorn but the campaign being waged against him is being waged in the wrong place , it should be directed against the countries that allow the hunting to occur.

Most people tweeting and raging over Cecil the lions death will still sit down and tuck into a chicken dinner where the animal on their plate endured more cruelty in its short lifetime than you could imagine.

I understand this is more emotive for people given the beauty of the animal involved and the endangered nature of all big game but people need to really think through the concept of cruelty to animals and what it entails instead of simply latching onto the latest international breaking news such as Cecil's horrible death or China's Yulin festival.

29-07-2015 12:58PM

Did he kill the rhino with a bow and arrow? Illegal or not, that sh*t is bad ass.

kylith · 29-07-2015 01:12PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Jokes on you. Lion was it's nickname. Cecil the Lion tiger.

A tiger? In Africa?!

Samaris wrote: »

As a conservationist and environmentalist, I don't agree with hunting and poaching. On the other hand, I also don't really like what The Internet is doing to the guy's business and life, if he thought he was following the law.

IDK, if people find something objectionable about what their doctor gets up to in his free time then they are justified in boycotting him, and if enough people do it then the message will be sent that, for example, hunting will cost you customers and money.

I do think that the death threats shouldn't happen though.

Mr Freeze wrote: »

Just looked this guy up, he was killed Rhino and everything.

How can he kill Rhino legally? I thought they were one of the most endangered species.

I hope he gets whats coming to him, which if it was still in Zimbabwe would be 2 - 5 years in prison.

There are, unfortunately, some places in Africa (and all over the world really) where for a large enough wodge of cash to the right person you can do pretty much anything.

Samaris · 29-07-2015 01:18PM

kylith wrote: »

IDK, if people find something objectionable about what their doctor gets up to in his free time then they are justified in boycotting him, and if enough people do it then the message will be sent that, for example, hunting will cost you customers and money.

I do think that the death threats shouldn't happen though.

I don't know that I agree with that. I'd be very surprised if the vast majority of people setting out to ruin his business were actually angry customers at all. Bah, I don't and never have liked witch-hunts. He should be dealt with in the courts if he did something wrong, and dealt with severely if he knew he was breaking the law.

Beyond that, anger should be focussed on the people responsible for selling permits to kill endangered animals. Otherwise, all we have here is a scapegoat and more big animals will die in future.

shamrock55 · 29-07-2015 01:20PM

Louis theroux did a doc about hunting in south africa a few years ago, they breed all types of animals for rich fcukers to hunt, anything from small monkey to rhino, there is no money in farming anymore and this is how they make money now,its pretty pathetic if you ask me,how can it even be called "hunting", they put an animal in front of you you pull the trigger and thats that, the big man hunter then poses for photos with his "kill" ffs its laughable if it wasnt so fcuking sad

Dontfadeaway · 29-07-2015 01:20PM

Starokan wrote: »

I am not a fan of hunting personally but I accept its a pastime of many many people throughout the world. However the Zimbabwe government surely must bear a certain responsibility here too, if i read correctly they are allowing a hunting concession to operate on the environs of a national park. The lion , in fact any lion could be lured or could simply wander into the concession at any time.

If you are going to invite wealthy individuals to hunt and take the big corporate paycheck to allow them to do so then this type of scenario was inevitable.

Walter Palmer's pictures of his various hunts for big game make me sick to my stomach but they are legal hunts sanctioned by the countries he visits, what if Walter Palmer booked and completed this hunt without any knowledge that he did anything other than what he paid for. He is a scapegoat for the false outrage of the internet warrior. Many will argue he deserves it but so to does every other hunter who legally goes to these countries or even some of your own country men and women who shoot, bait , trap, deer, pheasant , rabbit, badger etc. Just because its not an endangered species does not make it any less cruel. Walter Palmer deserves your scorn but the campaign being waged against him is being waged in the wrong place , it should be directed against the countries that allow the hunting to occur.

Most people tweeting and raging over Cecil the lions death will still sit down and tuck into a chicken dinner where the animal on their plate endured more cruelty in its short lifetime than you could imagine.

I understand this is more emotive for people given the beauty of the animal involved and the endangered nature of all big game but people need to really think through the concept of cruelty to animals and what it entails instead of simply latching onto the latest international breaking news such as Cecil's horrible death or China's Yulin festival.

Mr Palmer pleaded guilty to making a false statement to the US Fish and Wildlife Service regarding the precise location of where he killed a black bear in 2008.
Palmer was placed on a one year probation and fined $2939 after it was found that he was not licensed to kill the bear in that particular area.

It's not the first time he did something he shouldn't have. He paid 35k to kill the lion, so i doubt he cares if he will be fined again.

They shouldn't be giving permits to do this.

Discodog · 29-07-2015 01:21PM

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Did he kill the rhino with a bow and arrow? Illegal or not, that sh*t is bad ass.

Bad Ass? No just incredibly cruel. Hopefully young people won't start shooting cats, birds etc with their bows, or airguns because it's Bad Ass.

29-07-2015 01:22PM

kylith wrote: »

A tiger? In Africa?!

Jokes on you again! It's actually Asia. Africa is the petname many locals have for where they live.

Cecil the Lion tiger in Africa Asia.

...

I'm not willing to admit I made a mistake, OK?!?!?!????!??! etc. etc.

Into The Blue · 29-07-2015 01:25PM

Barely There wrote: »

Excuse me while I don't give a **** about a lion being killed.

Cared enough to post that crap though..
Do you give a fück about the 6 cubs that were killed so that the lioness would go back into heat?

Discodog · 29-07-2015 01:25PM

shamrock55 wrote: »

Louis theroux did a doc about hunting in south africa a few years ago, they breed all types of animals for rich fcukers to hunt, anything from small monkey to rhino, there is no money in farming anymore and this is how they make money now,its pretty pathetic if you ask me,how can it even be called "hunting", they put an animal in front of you you pull the trigger and thats that, the big man hunter then poses for photos with his "kill" ffs its laughable if it wasnt so fcuking sad

Exactly. If you allow some hunting, even if you call it a cull, you legitimise it.

smash · 29-07-2015 01:27PM

shamrock55 wrote: »

Louis theroux did a doc about hunting in south africa a few years ago, they breed all types of animals for rich fcukers to hunt, anything from small monkey to rhino, there is no money in farming anymore and this is how they make money now,its pretty pathetic if you ask me,how can it even be called "hunting", they put an animal in front of you you pull the trigger and thats that, the big man hunter then poses for photos with his "kill" ffs its laughable if it wasnt so fcuking sad

Yep. I mentioned this in a previous thread about hunting. Remember them feeding the lions in the pen? The animals aren't even wild in the true sense.

Cecil The Lion RIP

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