The US Think They Can Extradite Gary Davis

Means Of Escape · 16-07-2015 07:36AM

end of the road wrote: »

doesn't matter. should america be able to extradite someone from ireland who sold an american citizen living here for years drugs? he's point is valid. countries need to bring in laws that stop such extraditions otherwise we will have a serious threat to national security, jurisdiction and more.

You can be sure that the extradition request by the FBI isn't based on some half assed charge that is insignificant.
If they closed down his site they know everything about his activities
He knows he's in the sh1ts and is facing federal charges and god knows what else that will see him in the clink for a long time and will do anything to avoid extradition

Aspergers or not he knew how to count money and set up his organisation

Eugene Norman · 16-07-2015 09:26AM

Noblong wrote: »

Concidering the extradition request isnt an option, they are going with the hang them in public approach. So, what now?

Your responses don't seem to be related to the texts you are quoting.

IrishTrajan · 16-07-2015 11:07AM

Eugene Norman wrote: »

Both. I'd like a European alliance with Russia and others to oppose American hegemony.

:(

hatrickpatrick · 16-07-2015 12:35PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

hard drugs are pretty much illegal everywhere.

That's irrelevant. The crime was not committed on US soil, it is the jurisdiction of the Irish courts - unless we are willing to accept US claims of jurisdiction over the entire internet. Which I for one am not.

ohnonotgmail · 16-07-2015 12:44PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

That's irrelevant. The crime was not committed on US soil, it is the jurisdiction of the Irish courts - unless we are willing to accept US claims of jurisdiction over the entire internet. Which I for one am not.

If any part of the transaction goes through a US bank they claim jurisdiction. It is how they are able to prosecute the guys from FIFA. It is up to the irish courts to decide if that is valid.

alb · 16-07-2015 12:47PM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

If any part of the transaction goes through a US bank they claim jurisdiction. It is how they are able to prosecute the guys from FIFA. It is up to the irish courts to decide if that is valid.

No part of a bitcoin transaction goes through any bank

Lemsiper · 16-07-2015 12:48PM

Yeah, people keep mentioning American banks like they've never heard of Bitcoin.

ohnonotgmail · 16-07-2015 12:53PM

alb wrote: »

No part of a bitcoin transaction goes through any bank

the irish times article mentions money laundering and creating bank accounts so it was not entirely bitcoin based

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/crime-and-law/courts/high-court/us-seeking-extradition-of-alleged-silk-road-website-administrator-1.2284945

The site, which allegedly facilitated money laundering, also had a black market directory that allowed buyers the ability to set up anonymous bank accounts and counterfeit bills, counsel said. The US prosecutor’s case against Mr Davis was based on evidence including materials seized from Ulbricht, computer servers used to host Silk Road, and purchases made by undercover agents, he added.

hatrickpatrick · 16-07-2015 12:57PM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

If any part of the transaction goes through a US bank they claim jurisdiction. It is how they are able to prosecute the guys from FIFA. It is up to the irish courts to decide if that is valid.

I know they can, I'm saying they shouldn't be able to, and national governments should legislate specifically to block such overreach by the US.

That's just my opinion though.

ohnonotgmail · 16-07-2015 01:02PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

I know they can, I'm saying they shouldn't be able to, and national governments should legislate specifically to block such overreach by the US.

That's just my opinion though.

i would have to disagree that they should not be able to. Otherwise it is open season on foreign criminals using US banks to process the proceeds of crime. At least they are making an effort to combat criminals. Unlike our criminal justice system that cant be arsed.

from the same article as above

Mr Davis, counsel submitted, should have been charged in Ireland with corresponding offences but the DPP has not investigated and had no intention of charging Mr Davis in relation to his alleged involvement with the Silk Road website.

Too much effort for them.

Smiles35 · 16-07-2015 01:12PM

Eugene Norman wrote: »

Your responses don't seem to be related to the texts you are quoting.

Nice contrubution yourself. Ace.

Egginacup · 16-07-2015 01:18PM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

If any part of the transaction goes through a US bank they claim jurisdiction. It is how they are able to prosecute the guys from FIFA. It is up to the irish courts to decide if that is valid.

And once again you demonstrate that you don't know what you're talking about.

ohnonotgmail · 16-07-2015 01:23PM

Egginacup wrote: »

And once again you demonstrate that you don't know what you're talking about.

Once again? Wow. Care to explain to the dumb masses in what way my post was incorrect?

hatrickpatrick · 16-07-2015 01:32PM

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

i would have to disagree that they should not be able to. Otherwise it is open season on foreign criminals using US banks to process the proceeds of crime. At least they are making an effort to combat criminals. Unlike our criminal justice system that cant be arsed.

from the same article as above

Too much effort for them.

If the legal systems in the countries where the crimes occurred couldn't be arsed, that sucks. However, it's still the lesser of two evils if the other alternative is giving the US jurisdiction over the entire internet because infrastructure which cannot be controlled by users happens to flow through it.

Supposing the US outlaws criticism of Obama tomorrow. Just supposing. You're saying that I, an Irish person, should be under the jurisdiction of that law for talking to another Irish person about it, because I sent an iMessage or used Google Chat, and the servers which handled those communications happen to be in California?

ohnonotgmail · 16-07-2015 01:35PM

hatrickpatrick wrote: »

If the legal systems in the countries where the crimes occurred couldn't be arsed, that sucks. However, it's still the lesser of two evils if the other alternative is giving the US jurisdiction over the entire internet because infrastructure which cannot be controlled by users happens to flow through it.

Supposing the US outlaws criticism of Obama tomorrow. Just supposing. You're saying that I, an Irish person, should be under the jurisdiction of that law for talking to another Irish person about it, because I sent an iMessage or used Google Chat, and the servers which handled those communications happen to be in California?

where did i mention giving the US jurisdiction over the entire internet?

i said, and i quote,

If any part of the transaction goes through a US bank they claim jurisdiction.

So if the proceeds of a criminal act go through a US bank they claim jurisdiction. I never mentioned the entire internet. Do not put words into my mouth to suit your own agenda.

ohnonotgmail · 16-07-2015 01:37PM

Egginacup wrote: »

And once again you demonstrate that you don't know what you're talking about.

so are you going to actually back this up or is it just drive by abuse?

knucklehead6 · 16-07-2015 01:39PM

nm wrote: »

Who's law?

If the President of Iran decides tomorrow that boards.ie has broken their blasphemy law and wants to see a moderator here extradited to Iran to face the death sentence, are you still in full support?

I mean.. as you said, they probably have proof and there is probably a reason that we didn't prosecute here but sure what of it, that's enough for you.. ship em off right?

If not, why have you given America the divine right to preside it's laws over the world?

that really depends... Do we get to pick the mod we send? That Gordon chap looks like he could take care of himself in prison... Him or Zaph, that's who I'd recommend sending.

DarkyHughes · 16-07-2015 01:46PM

johnc77 wrote: »

Not only is he an Irish citizen, Ireland has never extradited an Irish citizen to the US and they never will. He has Aspergers. The US gov would sentence him to life an extremely unfair and harsh sentence. Sending someone with aspergers to a US prision is pretty much a death sentence.
irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/gary-davis-trial-claims-wicklow-6066488

I'm pretty sure the US can do what ever it wants. What in Ireland would stop them from taking him?

end of the road · 16-07-2015 02:50PM

Means Of Escape wrote: »

You can be sure that the extradition request by the FBI isn't based on some half assed charge that is insignificant.

oh no you can't. the FBI are capible of anything. including making up things

Means Of Escape wrote: »

If they closed down his site they know everything about his activities
He knows he's in the sh1ts and is facing federal charges and god knows what else that will see him in the clink for a long time and will do anything to avoid extradition

Aspergers or not he knew how to count money and set up his organisation

none of that matters. the request needs to be thrown out by our courts for the greater good. the US can pay for the cost of a trial here if the DPP ever revisit the case

ohnonotgmail · 16-07-2015 02:53PM

end of the road wrote: »

oh no you can't. the FBI are capible of anything. including making up things

none of that matters. the request needs to be thrown out by our courts for the greater good. the US can pay for the cost of a trial here if the DPP ever revisit the case

Well lucky it is up to an irish judge to make a decision isnt it.

nxbyveromdwjpg · 16-07-2015 03:00PM

Means Of Escape wrote: »

Aspergers or not he knew how to count money and set up his organisation

What organisation did this fella set up now?

Would you not try and gain some small semblance of a clue what you're talking about before commenting?

darkpagandeath · 16-07-2015 04:08PM

nm wrote: »

What organisation did this fella set up now?

Would you not try and gain some small semblance of a clue what you're talking about before commenting?

He Moderated Illegal activity.

Wompa1 · 16-07-2015 04:12PM

Deleted User wrote: »

If you were caught with pills this weekend in Dublin and suddenly, you were being shipped off to America because some American overheard you trying to sell them on the street, I don't think you'd believe it to be fair.

What if you sent the drugs through the mail. They went into America and then onto their destination?

Wompa1 · 16-07-2015 04:15PM

DarkyHughes wrote: »

I'm pretty sure the US can do what ever it wants. What in Ireland would stop them from taking him?

They didn't get their way with the data they wanted. Granted, the case is still ongoing but nobody here has folded yet.

If you read the Wikileaks from the US Embassy in Ireland and any communications related to Ireland. It doesn't seem like Ireland folds that much to the US. With the flights in and out of Shannon there were a lot of communications on them. To me, none of which made Ireland seem weak or that we cow towed to the US. They also communicated about the protesting in Ireland and the US losing favor with the public...

DarkyHughes · 16-07-2015 04:15PM

nm wrote: »

What organisation did this fella set up now?

Would you not try and gain some small semblance of a clue what you're talking about before commenting?

Still doesn't matter if he did something illegal or not. I the US want him, you or me they'll take us.

darkpagandeath · 16-07-2015 04:16PM

Wompa1 wrote: »

What if you sent the drugs through the mail. They went into America and then onto their destination?

He facilitated Criminal activity, That's all people need to understand. Whether America has Jurisdiction over him is not really that big an Issue. That's why the courts are looking into the request. The DPP were probably informed by the Americans of this lad and that's why they did not bother doing a case as the Americans are. Seems pretty cut and dry.

Wompa1 · 16-07-2015 04:25PM

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Gonzalo Sánchez Del Lozada

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2012/sep/09/america-refusal-extradite-bolivia

Key word. NEVER

Of course they have extradited criminals. It's stupid to suggest they haven't. If a individual cases are grounds for saying never then..Russia have Snowden. Roman Polanski has been kept in multiple countries, Assange etc. etc. etc.

I wouldn't say those countries NEVER extradite criminals.

DarkyHughes · 16-07-2015 04:26PM

Wompa1 wrote: »

They didn't get their way with the data they wanted. Granted, the case is still ongoing but nobody here has folded yet.

If you read the Wikileaks from the US Embassy in Ireland and any communications related to Ireland. It doesn't seem like Ireland folds that much to the US. With the flights in and out of Shannon there were a lot of communications on them. To me, none of which made Ireland seem weak or that we cow towed to the US. They also communicated about the protesting in Ireland and the US losing favor with the public...

If they really wanted him they would take him. I'm pretty sure a F-16 doesn't care about legal mombo jombo. Where just lucky we have good relations with the US. Look at your man Mozzam Begg they really wanted him so they took him. Same when Irish-British relations went to **** in 70's & 80's they wanted Gerry Conlon so they took him. There was also the Flagstaff Hill incident when the Garda & Irish Army arrested 8 SAS men who were found in the Republic on a mission to take someone from Co.Monaghan into British jurisdiction or kill him. We wanted to question people over the Dublin & Monaghan bombings we couldn't. There was also that priest they wanted around 87 or 88 who they thought was a IRA member, luckily relations had improved somewhat by then.

Timberrrrrrrr · 16-07-2015 04:27PM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

He ALLEGEDLY facilitated Criminal activity, That's all people need to understand. Whether America has Jurisdiction over him is not really that big an Issue. That's why the courts are looking into the request. The DPP were probably informed by the Americans of this lad and that's why they did not bother doing a case as the Americans are. Seems pretty cut and dry.

FYP for you there horse, You seem to have found him guilty no matter what.

RedemptionZ · 16-07-2015 04:29PM

From what news sources are saying about this site, child porn or any of that malarkey is not allowed on the site, so saying he's assisting pedophiles is very cheap and emotive. I don't know enough about laws to know if he's commited anything by being a moderator but he should not be extradited either way.

The US Think They Can Extradite Gary Davis

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