Does anyone like the Iona Institute?

efb · 06-05-2015 01:51AM

I'm sure all their US Donors like them

iDave · 06-05-2015 07:05AM

Lolek Ltd T/A The Iona Institute to give it its full name.
Has charity status though. Not only is Quinn trying to deny some us basic rights he still owes all of us money.

Also King of Iona is a decent parody account on twitter. Worth a follow.

galljga1 · 06-05-2015 07:09AM

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

I'm sure the kids love them.

Well, they certainly love kids. They just cannot get them anymore.

TwoShedsJackson · 06-05-2015 07:45AM

RobertKK wrote: »

Sure with Iona beheading people, burning people alive, burying people alive, destroying archaeological sites going back millennia and killing Christians, it makes Isis not seem too bad when they oppose same sex marriage and abortion.

I may have gotten that the wrong way around.

I have no problem with Iona, but I do love how they raise the hackles for some people.

So because some other bunch of religious loons do terrible things elsewhere, we should ignore an 'Institute' which declares itself a charity whilst lobbying for their moral agenda, and actively attempts to repress sections of Irish society whilst using the ethos of a cult known to have covered up child abuse and facilitated the abusers, in addition to the many other failings (to put it mildly) listed by FactCheck on the first page?

haveringchick · 06-05-2015 08:03AM

No

I love the way they get right up people's noses just by being there. Equating them with ISIS is just pathetic and funny and ironic in a sad kind of way.

anncoates · 06-05-2015 08:11AM

It's somewhat touching when people reach out to AH as if it's somehow indicative of the entire population.

Pherekydes · 06-05-2015 08:22AM

haveringchick wrote: »

I love the way they get right up people's noses just by being there.

They're not just being there, though, are they?

They are lobbying to keep Ireland a 1950s' theocracy. If they were in charge we'd have obligatory church attendance, a return to selling off the children of single mothers and laundry-based slavery. Homosexuality would be recriminalised, with suitable punishment, celibacy for unmarrieds and those separated. Married women would be prevented from working and so on.

A catholic heaven.

Hell on earth for non or lapsed or cultural catholics, though.

06-05-2015 08:24AM

Cold War Kid wrote: »

Don't they get a bunch of funding from pretty fundamentalist quarters? I've no problem with moderate conservatives, no problem with catholics/christians, but big problem with fundamentalists.

They put the fun into fundamentalist.

They also put the mentalist into fundamentalist.

Ghost Buster · 06-05-2015 08:26AM

haveringchick wrote: »

I love the way they get right up people's noses just by being there. Equating them with ISIS is just pathetic and funny and ironic in a sad kind of way.

They both have siimilar goals though, just different means of achieving them.

the_monkey · 06-05-2015 08:27AM

Homophobic + mysogynistic institute.

So No, wouldn't be a fan of their religion bullsh'it peddling either

06-05-2015 08:49AM

wouldn't be a fan, however they are entitled to their views the problem is the issue of the media having to be balanced so by default they are in media debates far more than their support base warrants. I believe in a pluralist society where various views are heard.

Boards have given them massive exposure

looksee · 06-05-2015 08:53AM

RobertKK wrote: »

This dismal attempt at defence does just the opposite...they would have been better to keep quiet than offer the 'well everyone else was doing worse' argument.

PopePalpatine · 06-05-2015 08:55AM

I'm on a bus and I can't view that video you quoted, can you sum it up?

06-05-2015 09:09AM

The other thing is I don't know why they bother, despite everything marriage is enduringly popular and raising children in two parent family is enduringly popular and by far the way the majority of children are raised.

The bogy man fantasised of The Iona institute and there like of society braking down and children being raised in multi fathered families that are supported by the state and so on, hasn't happened even in the most socially liberal countries.

Society is in no danger of braking down anytime soon.

arayess · 06-05-2015 09:17AM

No

I don't like them as a group but i do like John Waters.

People hate him ( i think hate is a fair word) because of his opposition to same sex marriage but while they beat the equality drum they forget he has written extensively about men's rights regarding children for many years especially when it wasn't popular.
But that's the bandwagon these days with social media making it easy to target people in horrendous ways.

Waters waffles a lot but I like him and i think he has a good heart. I'm actually surprised he is wrapped up with Iona - him and his child out of wedlock and all that jazz...
He loses points though cos he shagged sinead o'connor...

Quinn is a very good speaker but I don't hold his views on much.

The only good thing about the Iona crowd is they annoy a lot of people . That pleases me similar to watching a punch up between two people I don't like.

Ghost Buster · 06-05-2015 09:17AM

mariaalice wrote: »

The other thing is I don't know why they bother, despite everything marriage is enduringly popular and raising children in two parent family is enduringly popular and by far the way the majority of children are raised.

The bogy man fantasised of The Iona institute and there like of society braking down and children being raised in multi fathered families that are supported by the state and so on, hasn't happened even in the most socially liberal countries.

Society is in no danger of braking down anytime soon.

You mean to say the orgies and wife swapping if contraception were legalised and the "Hello divorce, bye bye daddy" broken home epidemic never came to pass?
Its almost as if the religious conservatives are talking out their holes.

iDave · 06-05-2015 09:19AM

arayess wrote: »

I don't like them as a group but i do like John Waters.

People hate him ( i think hate is a fair word) because of his opposition to same sex marriage but while they beat the equality drum they forget he has written extensively about men's rights regarding children for many years especially when it wasn't popular.
But that's the bandwagon these days with social media making it easy to target people in horrendous ways.

Waters waffles a lot but I like him and i think he has a good heart. I'm actually surprised he is wrapped up with Iona - him and his child out of wedlock and all that jazz...
He loses points though cos he shagged sinead o'connor...

Quinn is a very good speaker but I don't hold his views on much.

The only good thing about the Iona crowd is they annoy a lot of people . That pleases me similar to watching a punch up between two people I don't like.

Waters once claimed the Occupy movement was a CIA conspiracy. And said we must be careful of what we call reason.
Hard to take this guy seriously.

smash · 06-05-2015 09:20AM

Over 14,000 supporters already. I'd urge those who don't agree with Iona to sign this petition too.

Fuseman · 06-05-2015 09:26AM

No

I think they bring valuable social perspectives to an evolving Ireland

06-05-2015 09:28AM

smash wrote: »

Over 14,000 supporters already. I'd urge those who don't agree with Iona to sign this petition too.

Can you explain why you want to take away their tax exempt charity status as long as their funding sources are fully transparent I don't see the problem.

Bannasidhe · 06-05-2015 09:30AM

RobertKK wrote: »

But history records shows the Spanish inquisition was in fact the most just justice system in Europe at the time.
The English used propaganda against their Spanish enemies and it is funny how the propaganda is still believed today.
As the saying goes, the first casualty of war is truth.

Have you read the transcripts of The Inquisition?

I have.

No fan of the Tudors but if you think the Inquisition got a bad rep because 'England' than you have fallen for a whole different set of propaganda.

Bannasidhe · 06-05-2015 09:34AM

RobertKK wrote: »

Oh please.

I have appeared as a 'talking head' in programmes such as this and when the final version was broadcast found myself disagreeing with the whole premise, including what I seemed to have stated myself.

You'll have to do better than that.

catallus · 06-05-2015 09:40AM

Isn't the Inquisition the basis for all of our current law?

Is it not the bedrock of our legal process?

Is it not what separates us from the savagery of tyrants?

Thank God for the Spanish Inquisition, as the saying goes....

It is little wonder that the cult of individualism fears it so, for it unmasks the insolence of its lawlessness!

RobertKK · 06-05-2015 09:44AM

No

PopePalpatine wrote: »

I'm on a bus and I can't view that video you quoted, can you sum it up?

The Spanish kept records of all the people who went before inquisitors, many of whom were not clergy but were trained lawyers.
Records do not back up the myth of the Spanish inquisition which was started by Protestant nations against Catholic Spain.
This happened after a war between the Catholic Hapsburg king and Protestants, where the Protestants suffered total defeat by the Catholic King.
Following year the Protestants moved their war from the battlefield to the printing presses, and printed in many languages lies about Spain, lies that many believe to this very day.

There are records in Spain where people have blasphemed to get out of the civil jails so they would be taken into the inquisition where the conditions were far superior.

Records from the time show Spain had far lower number of people killed compared to other countries in Europe.

---

The thing is, this is what the Soviets did to the Catholic church after WW2 when in 1956 the Soviets put on a play in Berlin (not based on fact) where they had Pope Pius XII doing nothing to save Jews in WW2. Despite the opposite being true, this led to the myth of Hitler's Pope, which led to Jewish Rabbi David Dalin to do research and to say the church saved hundreds of thousands of Jews, upwards of 800,000 Jews, and that he in fact did more than most to save Jews.
But a myth was born in 1956 which some still believe today.
This is what happened with the Spanish inquisition, myths come to be believed as reality.

arayess · 06-05-2015 09:46AM

No

iDave wrote: »

Waters once claimed the Occupy movement was a CIA conspiracy. And said we must be careful of what we call reason.
Hard to take this guy seriously.

You can be impressed with a guy at first but when they speak all the time you do notice some ****e comes out.
I wouldn't have anybody I liked in politics or media where I'd never at some stage cringe at what they said.

That said that tactic isn't a new thing - waters may have a point.
saddam hussein was a master of this - his agents would set up anti-saddam groups in places like london and paris. All the anti-saddam exiles would join and plot against him all while saddam would have the names on a list and go kill their relatives still in iraq.

kal7 · 06-05-2015 09:47AM

hate the use of Institute for their title, where is this seat of learning and enlightenment.

looksee · 06-05-2015 09:47AM

PopePalpatine wrote: »

I'm on a bus and I can't view that video you quoted, can you sum it up?

It involved a lot of church music, clips from opera and Monty Python, video of Spanish soldiers and processions, etc and a couple of (Spanish) academics frantically defending against the slur of the Inquisition, saying it was an enlightened operation and an example of legal tolerance and excellence. They also said that it was set up to convert Jews and 'persuade' them to take on Christianity, or burn them if they refused. They only used a little bit of torture, generally not exceeding 15 minutes (!) and only burned a few thousand people. Most communities in deeply rural spain had never come across them, and the few that did were inclined to refuse to talk to them (in spite of their reputation for fairness).

Sorry, we are going off topic here, but the attitudes of the academics and the more conservative religious groups (Iona for example) are similar in what they want to achieve and how they shoot themselves in the foot (feet?) in the process of their arguments.

RobertKK · 06-05-2015 09:50AM

No

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Oh please.

I have appeared as a 'talking head' in programmes such as this and when the final version was broadcast found myself disagreeing with the whole premise, including what I seemed to have stated myself.

You'll have to do better than that.

Maybe they did research and found your talking head to be incorrect and so couldn't insert it.

RTE should have done this with their mission to prey program, they created a program where they left the nation in no doubt an innocent priest was an evil sex abuser.
I don't think anyone believed the priest was innocent who watched that program.
It is is easy to use media to spread lies about people. Getting the truth out after it, is far harder.

smash · 06-05-2015 09:55AM

Fuseman wrote: »

I think they bring valuable social perspectives to an evolving Ireland

They're trying to hold Ireland back from evolving!

mariaalice wrote: »

Can you explain why you want to take away their tax exempt charity status as long as their funding sources are fully transparent I don't see the problem.

Their 'charity' side is a front for a lobbying organisation, a bloody dangerous one that incites hatred.

RobertKK · 06-05-2015 10:02AM

No

looksee wrote: »

It involved a lot of church music, clips from opera and Monty Python, video of Spanish soldiers and processions, etc and a couple of (Spanish) academics frantically defending against the slur of the Inquisition, saying it was an enlightened operation and an example of legal tolerance and excellence. They also said that it was set up to convert Jews and 'persuade' them to take on Christianity, or burn them if they refused. They only used a little bit of torture, generally not exceeding 15 minutes (!) and only burned a few thousand people. Most communities in deeply rural spain had never come across them, and the few that did were inclined to refuse to talk to them (in spite of their reputation for fairness).

Sorry, we are going off topic here, but the attitudes of the academics and the more conservative religious groups (Iona for example) are similar in what they want to achieve and how they shoot themselves in the foot (feet?) in the process of their arguments.

Studying records can have an unfortunate effect, like 2,500 people being executed in Spain in the period of the inquisition, while the 25,000 executed in Protestant Germany in same period is ignored, the magic of propaganda.

Does anyone like the Iona Institute?

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