Does the way we treat our elderly make you scared of getting old?

_Whimsical_ wrote: »

Well, not really. You're claiming I'm being pessimistic, claiming the corollary to my point is true therefore it's pretty safe to assume that you are not a member of any organisation that deals with these issues either for patients or carers or that you haven't seen them first hand in your own life.

I disagree with your assertion, therefore I must be either unaware of, am not a member of, do not work with, or must never have experienced these issues for myself? Y'know, I admire your passion and all, but you're not the only person that cares for people. There are literally dozens of organisations and charities in Ireland that care for the elderly, and care for them in many different ways and different respects. While I'm certainly not aware of ALL of them, I'm not going to let their good work simply be dismissed because I see a handful of organisations or some of the care provided by the State as "could do more".

We can always do more, we can always do better, but I'm not going to ignore or be dismissive of the massive amount of good work that's already being done to provide care for the elderly in society. The very fact that some of these organisations and charities even exist, is proof that society cares for the elderly. If they didn't exist, then I might take your point alright.

Of course you can. Reality is always nuanced. Example :India is a poor country, some millionaires live there, certain areas prosper.
In Ireland care is poor, though depending on what area you live and what condition you have your experience may vary. That doesn't mean that everyone, or a majority, even large minority receive good or adequate provision so the initial statement remains true on the whole.

Well you say it's poor overall, but I have yet to see you present even a shred of evidence to back up that assertion. I'm not talking anecdotes from your own personal perspective here (hell if I were to use my own personal anecdotes, like I said, the elderly are well taken care of in this country). You say they're not, so I would like to see what standard you're basing your judgement upon, and then I'd have a better idea of what you consider a poor standard of care. As far as I can tell from the various national reports from a number of different organisations and charities, we actually do provide a very good standard of care for our elderly people in Irish society overall. There are some areas where we could do with improving, but there's always room for improvement in anything, and that still doesn't suggest that we treat our elderly poorly in this country or that anyone should be afraid of becoming an elderly person in this country. One thing I am actually proud of is the level of care provided for elderly people in this country and to hear you try to say we don't do enough, it simply to me sounds like you need to widen your perspective lens beyond a few Prime Time investigations.

To prove that most of the states ill and disabled are elderly? I thought that would be obvious. I don't have figures to hand no but I suggest you google the following if you'd like to know.
Check numbers of people in residential nursing care in Ireland under 65 vs over 65. Check stroke incidence in over 65s vs under 65s. Do the same for cancers, dementia, heart failure, parkinsons, severe osteoarthritis,osteoporosis...the list could go on but I'm sure by the time you have that much done you'll have a pretty clear picture. You could also check people receiving carers allowance to care for an elderly person rather than a younger person. You could check hospital admissions for older ppl vs under 65s too.

You thought it would be obvious? Clearly it's not, which is why I asked, because as far as I understand illness and disability, there are many conditions that aren't exclusive to elderly people. You don't have the figures to hand, but you're able to make a bold statement like that, and then you want me to do your homework for you? I can tell you now that's not going to happen. I've already done my homework and I'm aware of the figures and reports from the various organisations (CSO reports, HSE reports, ESRI reports and case studies, charity organisations a few private companies providing care for the elderly). I don't have to use google. The onus is on you to provide evidence for your claims if you're going to try and make bold statements and not expect that someone is going to ask you how you're forming your opinions.

What are these many many positives?
I clearly said in my initial post that being eldery is grand even great if you are fortunate enough to be well but it's another situation if you happen not to be.

Right. Finally, you admit that being elderly is grand, great even. That's a completely different thing from experiencing any kind of illness or disablility. Experiencing any kind of illness or disablity is shítty no matter what age you are, but they are issues that aren't exclusive to ageing. Illness and disability can impact upon a person's quality of life at any age, they don't necessarily have to be elderly.

That's not even taking account of the fact that life expectancy in Ireland and the quality of life for elderly people in this country has vastly improved from what it was 20, even 30 years ago.