Yet another death happens in police custody: Freddy Gray

osarusan · 29-04-2015 12:59AM

osarusan wrote: »

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/ucr/leoka/2013/officers-feloniously-killed/felonious_topic_page_-2013

Of the people who killed police officers, 15 were white, 11 were black, and in 2 cases, race was not reported.

So white people actually kill more police than black people!

But where is the hysteria about that?

White people be dangerous yo.

crockholm · 29-04-2015 01:10AM

InTheTrees wrote: »

Detroit, DC, Oakland, Pittsburgh, Atlanta, Birmingham, etc etc.

Detroit had race riots in 1943 and 1967-white flight happened thereafter

D.C. had riots in 1968 and 1991-The cities black residents are being slowly moved out as the city gentrifies.

Oakland has had riots as recently as 2003,2009,2014 (zimmerman verdict)

Pittsburgh had riots in 1968,currently has problems with rioting black teens at the Monroeville mall.

Atlanta 1906 race riots,1992 riots,2014 (zimmerman verdict)Black capital of US.

Birmingham 1963.

etc. etc. etc.

Junkyard Tom · 29-04-2015 01:11AM

Amazingfun wrote: »

Your act is getting old. You were on your big soapbox for most your contributions to the thread, letting us all know how wrong and misleading the FBI stats are.....and now you're suddenly so naive and innocent asking for instruction and education from people you clearly despise . So I'll pass on this wondrous "opportunity", fun as it might be, but thanks for the entertainment

I don't despise anyone. If you're unable or unwilling to elucidate me as to the reasons why black people are three times as likely as whites to end up in the criminal justice system (CJS) then don't bother acting as a side-kick and using the rolleyes.

Hans Bricks wrote: »

Proportionately higher levels of poverty of overall demographic.

So the solutions are anti-poverty programs? I guess that could help. Earlier in the thread someone provided a source that showed anyone who had a conviction for drugs was denied welfare - that surely increases poverty. Maybe that should be changed.

Why does the ethnic makeup of convicted and serving felons/prisoners matter?

Because some categories of people are three times as likely as others to end up in the CJS

A few simple statistics have been provided outlining murder and poverty rates in the USA, how does this allude to rampant racism?

There's something thoroughly wrong with a society where one category of people are three times more likely to become involved with the CJS - that's an issue that that society should try to resolve imo.

InTheTrees · 29-04-2015 01:13AM

crockholm wrote: »

Detroit had race riots in 1943 and 1967-white flight happened thereafter

D.C. had riots in 1968 and 1991-The cities black residents are being slowly moved out as the city gentrifies.

Oakland has had riots as recently as 2003,2009,2014 (zimmerman verdict)

Pittsburgh had riots in 1968,currently has problems with rioting black teens at the Monroeville mall.

Atlanta 1906 race riots,1992 riots,2014 (zimmerman verdict)Black capital of US.

Birmingham 1963.

etc. etc. etc.

Good job.

And as recently as the 60's you could shoot to kill minority protesters without any fear of retribution.

Race relations in the Usa is not a pleasant story to tell and its not over yet.

crockholm · 29-04-2015 01:22AM

InTheTrees wrote: »

So lets throw in east saint Louis to make up for it.

And add Minneapolis, Jacksonville and Boston.

East St.Louis:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:,can add Cairo Il. to that list too;)

Jacksonville 1960,1964,1971,2013

Boston 1968

Minneapolis 1967, 2015 (st patricks day,half our fault) in a not traditionally very black city.More than a quarter of black people there would be Somalian.Or of Somalian heritage.

InTheTrees · 29-04-2015 01:27AM

crockholm wrote: »

East St.Louis:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:,

(Pop. 27,000) Birthplace of Tina Turner. Its across the river from St.louis in Illinois.

An absolute hell hole. I've strayed in there. There's even unpaved roads in some areas.

Manic Moran · 29-04-2015 01:31AM

circadian wrote: »

Guns aren't banned here or in Canada. The rules, however, are much stricter than in the US not to mention that I'm pretty certain you can't buy handguns or anything not specifically designed for hunting. Basically, your options are either hunting rifles or shotguns. Not assault rifles, not tactical shotguns.

Your "pretty certain" unfortunately fails in the face of reality. Handguns may be purchased by anyone over 18 with a clean record who passes a safety course. A license valid for five years is then awarded.

As for semi auto rifles, in some respects Canadian shooters are the envy of those of us South of their border given that Canada does not have the same protectionist stupidity that the US does. The Norinco M14 is a particular source of envy, as is the H&K G36. Fortunately, the IMI Tavor has recently started production on the US, so Canadians can no longer make us jealous. Unless we live in California, such as I do. Tavors are still effectively prohibited here.

Note that Canada does not have mandatory registration of rifles and shotguns. Much like the case of Ireland, people seem to think that because there is not much gun crime, there are not many guns. The truth ifs that the problem less elsewhere.

It is also to be observed that one of the iconic images of the LA riots in the 90s was of Koreans with rifles defending the shops of Koreatown. It was considered too dangerous for police to go in.

InTheTrees · 29-04-2015 01:33AM

Here's Business Insiders list of the 25 most segregated cities in the USA.

There has to be some where that there hasn't been riots...yet. Its only a matter of time though unless something changes.

http://www.businessinsider.com/most-segregated-cities-in-america-2013-11

InTheTrees · 29-04-2015 01:58AM

MadYaker wrote: »

Why the african american community as a whole don't seem to able to pull themselves out of this cycle is another question entirely. I don't know the answer to that but I suspect it's more than just "the evil white man keeping them down".

Some of the stuff coming out in regards Saint Louis County after the Ferguson riots is pretty amazing. The poor minority citizens were basically used as a cash cow by the authorities.

Its important to understand how Police are organised in the US. Every town has its own, and they are independent, and a very large part of their funding comes from fines:

"Missouri has the second-highest rate of traffic cases per person in the nation, and St. Louis County’s rate is twice as high as Missouri’s, as reported by the St. Louis Post-Dispatch. According to Brendan Roediger, an assistant professor at St. Louis University School of Law, there are more than 450,000 outstanding warrants in the St. Louis County for municipal cases. In some jurisdictions, the number of warrants well exceeds the number of residents: Country Club Hills, for example, has a population of 1,381 and more than 33,102 active warrants, amounting to a ratio of nearly 24 outstanding warrants per resident. Similarly, Wellston has a population of 2,460 and more than 15,000 outstanding warrants, adding up to a ratio of more than six to one. "

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2015/04/10/3643582/worse-ferguson-week-st-louis-countys-egregious-night-courts/

crockholm · 29-04-2015 02:02AM

InTheTrees wrote: »

Good job.

And as recently as the 60's you could shoot to kill minority protesters without any fear of retribution.

Race relations in the Usa is not a pleasant story to tell and its not over yet.

I get what you are saying.I also understand that to you,myself and a few other posters are being real dicks about this.
I grew up listening to rap,both the gangsta and social conscience/ black Power movement.I remember argueing like hell with my father over the Rodney King riots and Police brutality.Most of my Sporting idols were (are) black-even took one as a confirmation name as an hommage.

My friend,believed the same as me.When he was 16 he moved to London,in under a year he started using the N Word,and I was none too pleased about it,soon I noticed all the lads that i knew that lived there use it.I was shocked and told them to stop using it around me.When I would confront my friend about it,he would shrug it off as "you just don't understand"

I tolerated his outbursts thereafter,but would generally steer the conversation clear of such subjects.

Then I moved to Chicago.It opened my Eyes to something which felt completely different to what Chuck D had been rapping about.There,in our Community it had a siege mentality.There was a general anathema towards black people,there were pubs that would not serve them-there were pubs,black people themselves knew they shouldn't go in to.

This Place should have been semi-suburban heaven,alas 2 miles east was black ghetto that used to be Italian middle class,3 miles North east was a black ghetto that used to be Irish working/middle class.1.5 miles North was a black ghetto that used to be polish/lithuanian.A lot of the people I knew had moved here from those places and seen their property become Worth next to nothing.They sure aren't going to let it happen again.

My time there really made me question the notions that I had of black victimhood.I began to see the black male as more of the aggressor-after all-it was black people who shout "White bread" and other racial names at me for no reason.It was black males that had assaulted my friend,it was black males who had mugged his mother,it was black males who had robbed his sister-in laws flat and it was 3 black males who kicked a 16 year old into a coma in a neighbouring park simply because,in their own Words he was "just some goofy White kid".

I have my fair share of faults,but I will not hate someone just because they are black,but you can be damn sure that I will be a lot more wary of them because this is where my Life experience has lead me to.I don't mind if you judge me harshly,just don't judge me as a bigot and then say something bad about all travellers because of your own experience with them.

Egginacup · 29-04-2015 02:04AM

MadYaker wrote: »

I don't see how smashing up their city and ruining the lives of small business owners is going to help the situation?

People like you never will. That's because you can't see your nose in front of your face.
But if you think about it...state taxes and the insurance companies are going to have to foot the bill for the destruction and fcuk them because a man is dead and died in police custody.
I can guarantee you one very simple thing and it's this. If police departments who had to pay out for brutality claims had those funds come out of the local police force's pension fund and it was legally banned for that shortfall to be paid up by John and Jane Taxpayer, you'd quickly see a stop to frivolent police brutality. Not only that but police departments and their members would VERY QUICKLY shit-can any cocksucker cop who thought it was fun to bodyslam someone into the kerb just because he didn't like the fact that they said "leave me alone I'm going home" or because they wore their stupid jeans halfway off their asses.

Let the citizens of the great state of Maryland pay for the damage. And bring on the next riot.

crockholm · 29-04-2015 02:07AM

InTheTrees wrote: »

(Pop. 27,000) Birthplace of Tina Turner. Its across the river from St.louis in Illinois.

An absolute hell hole. I've strayed in there. There's even unpaved roads in some areas.

Passed through it on my way to STL once too-at high speed though:cool:

29-04-2015 02:23AM

MathDebater wrote: »

The mayor decided to give the rioters a 'space to destroy'.

http://fusion.net/story/126587/the-odd-tactic-of-giving-baltimore-protesters-space-to-destroy-property/

Genius! What could go wrong?

An actual real life Hamsterdam in Baltimore? SHEEEEEEEEEIIIIIIIITTTTT!

29-04-2015 02:27AM

darkpagandeath wrote: »

Why is the first thing people do is loot to show how outraged they are at a persons death they did not know.

I love how it's always flashy trainers and flat screen tv's. Gotta put that bread on the table, homeboy.

meepins · 29-04-2015 03:50AM

Egginacup wrote: »

Let the citizens of the great state of Maryland pay for the damage. And bring on the next riot.

Guise srsly.. I'm such a tolerant and progressive person that even in the face of this disgusting behaviour I will still justify the vermin that violently target white people, attack police officers, loot and destroy buildings in their area. What a special snowflake I am!

Depp · 29-04-2015 05:03AM

I think I've solved this problem, a foolproof plan to avoid being killed by the police, first step is to not do things that would ghet you into trouble with the police, also, if you absolutely have to do one of those things, dont run from the police when you get caught, cant stand that theres a whole city in turmoil over the death of one drug dealer with a record as long as your arm when theres stuff like the earthquake in nepal thats actually important happening in the world, rant over.

Nodin · 29-04-2015 05:11AM

Amazingfun wrote: »

The Cat hasn't explained the reason the stats are similar in the Uk. I am guessing the answer just must be "cuz evil horrible black-hating white people persecute the innocent there too" but I'd like to hear it from him/her?

Why don't you inform us?

jank · 29-04-2015 08:47AM

DocQismyJesus wrote: »

I live in Ireland now. Tbh most of you on this thread are beyond help- I suggest you read about the status of Asians in the South Africa apartheid structure it may help you understand what I'm getting at.

I'm far from a bleeding heart but you do really need to look at the cause of anger/ violence in America before you go on about it. Anyone can quote statistics from biased websites. Asking "why" things happen is much harder

Trust me race in America is far more nuanced and complicated than you guys will ever grasp.

Oh and talking about u whitening products in China actually proves my point about acceptance into dominant cultute

The reason why there are whitening products available in Asia has nothing to do with race but has everything to do with status. Traditionally those who were rich did not have to work in fields and engage in manual labour. Instead they were able to stay indoor and be out of the sun, thus those with wealth were whiter than those in the fields due to the latter getting a tan. This is common all across East Asia. Status not race is the key factor here.

Regarding stats, well I supposed its hard to argue against independent statistics when you come out with nothing yourself. Instead whataboutery is easy and can be passed off as a logical rational debate these days. The issue of crime in African american neighbourhoods needs to be discussed in the open. Anything less and most people switch off.

29-04-2015 08:53AM

Depp wrote: »

I think I've solved this problem, a foolproof plan to avoid being killed by the police, first step is to not do things that would ghet you into trouble with the police, also, if you absolutely have to do one of those things, dont run from the police when you get caught, cant stand that theres a whole city in turmoil over the death of one drug dealer with a record as long as your arm when theres stuff like the earthquake in nepal thats actually important happening in the world, rant over.

For maybe the 5th or 6th time in this thread I have to ask, what is his record.

I have seen references to arrests, none to convictions.

jank · 29-04-2015 09:02AM

Manic Moran wrote: »

Your "pretty certain" unfortunately fails in the face of reality. Handguns may be purchased by anyone over 18 with a clean record who passes a safety course. A license valid for five years is then awarded.

As for semi auto rifles, in some respects Canadian shooters are the envy of those of us South of their border given that Canada does not have the same protectionist stupidity that the US does. The Norinco M14 is a particular source of envy, as is the H&K G36. Fortunately, the IMI Tavor has recently started production on the US, so Canadians can no longer make us jealous. Unless we live in California, such as I do. Tavors are still effectively prohibited here.

Note that Canada does not have mandatory registration of rifles and shotguns. Much like the case of Ireland, people seem to think that because there is not much gun crime, there are not many guns. The truth ifs that the problem less elsewhere.

It is also to be observed that one of the iconic images of the LA riots in the 90s was of Koreans with rifles defending the shops of Koreatown. It was considered too dangerous for police to go in.

Yes, a very famous picture which nobody really minded.

http://humanevents.com/uploads/2012/12/58852252.jpg

Lt J.R. Bell · 29-04-2015 09:15AM

Depp wrote: »

I think I've solved this problem, a foolproof plan to avoid being killed by the police, first step is to not do things that would ghet you into trouble with the police, also, if you absolutely have to do one of those things, dont run from the police when you get caught, cant stand that theres a whole city in turmoil over the death of one drug dealer with a record as long as your arm when theres stuff like the earthquake in nepal thats actually important happening in the world, rant over.

That, is, like, a crazy idea. People won't buy that.ain't got no time for that. They ain't gonna take responsibility for their actions. Society owes them. The system is broke y'all.

humanji · 29-04-2015 09:23AM

MOD: As could be guessed by everyone after the very first post, this trainwreck has ended up the way these threads always do and has little do do with the actual death that happened.

Yet another death happens in police custody: Freddy Gray

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