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Gardai Investigating Voter-Registration promo

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Comments

  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,362 ✭✭✭K4t


    conorh91 wrote: »
    She didn't endorse a side.
    .
    She should have. Her rallying call may well have a negative effect on the referendum passing and encourage more No voters than Yes to vote.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,328 ✭✭✭conorh91


    K4t wrote: »
    She should have. Her rallying call may well have a negative effect on the referendum passing and encourage more No voters than Yes to vote.
    I'd doubt it.

    In any case, I'm not even coming at this from some badge-wearing, flag waving, YES-side perspective. I have in fact tried to articulate the concerns of the No campaign as best I can, for the sake of a valid debate, and have been insulted and dismissed as a religious spokesperson for so-doing.

    But I can recognize Garda-bashing when I see it, and in my opinion, this would be an example.

    Would anybody be getting worked-up if the Dublin County Returning Officer appeared at a voter-registration event? I'd doubt it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,495 ✭✭✭dublinman1990


    People here are saying that The Gardai are "encouraging" a yes vote with someone from the yes side by doing a photoshoot to say to any voter to go on the supplementary register to vote in May. I don't see that at all tbf.

    To me; it would not make a blind bit of difference if a photoshoot was to include people from both the yes and no campaign including either a Garda, a civil servant outside of the Gardai or any other official involved who is appointed for the Referendum Commission. All of these organisations have a responsibility to ensure that many potential voters as possible do not get left out whenever a referendum or election takes place which applies to anyone who is an Irish resident and who is aged 18 or over.

    The photos of the promotional tables in the lead up to this referendum is probably done in any referendum or election beforehand. Up to today I have never heard any sort of negative reaction from people of a scale in were they would go against Gardai for handing out registration forms for say the last European or Local elections.

    There is another bit of info in where the Gardai have to hand out forms for voter registration in Dublin.

    https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CDB41xGW8AENzPF.png

    Crosscare is a lay Catholic organisation in Dublin that provided a voter registration period for people living around the Dun laoghaire area who wanted to be on the supplementary register for the vote in May.

    And guess what; it says in the poster that a Garda had to be present in the handing out of the registry forms to people of any age who wanted their name to be put on the supplementary register regardless of their age even though it was held in The Boylan Centre. To be fair; I don't know what the reaction from here if a Guard was known to be present at a location in which in the organisation itself actively promotes a no vote for the marriage referendum because it is part of the Catholic Church.

    Let more mud slinging begin I say.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 15,127 ✭✭✭✭kerry4sam


    I was involved in youth politics.
    ~ I was elected as the Munster 3rd Level Representative for the youth-wing of a major Irish political party, representing all 3rd level students at National Level.
    ~ I was working at a National Level with the National Youth Committee
    aswell as
    ~ Being appointed to represent this youth wing of this Irish political party on an International Advisory Committee speaking on behalf of Education & Youth Policies with the National Youth Council of Ireland.

    I had to resign from the political party just to join as a Volunteer GardaReserve with An Garda Síochána.
    I know of other(s) who had to resign from their jobs working with Councillors and then Ministers just to sign up with an alleged apolitical organisation.

    Our Irish Police Force is either apolitical or it's not! This situation is wrong on so many levels, but I'm guessing the Gardaí involved are all paid up with their GRA subs' and will have their full support. I'm guessing in due course out GardaCommissioner will give her blessings & authorise this behaviour also.
    A line was well & truly crossed, but wait for it now, all will be just fine for these full-time Gardaí involved.

    This is not Garda-bashing, this is stating the obvious facts.

    Give this time,
    All will be well again for these full-timers,
    kerry4sam


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,624 ✭✭✭Little CuChulainn


    kerry4sam wrote: »
    I was involved in youth politics.
    ~ I was elected as the Munster 3rd Level Representative for the youth-wing of a major Irish political party, representing all 3rd level students at National Level.
    ~ I was working at a National Level with the National Youth Committee
    aswell as
    ~ Being appointed to represent this youth wing of this Irish political party on an International Advisory Committee speaking on behalf of Education & Youth Policies with the National Youth Council of Ireland.

    I had to resign from the political party just to join as a Volunteer GardaReserve with An Garda Síochána.
    I know of other(s) who had to resign from their jobs working with Councillors and then Ministers just to sign up with an alleged apolitical organisation.

    Our Irish Police Force is either apolitical or it's not! This situation is wrong on so many levels, but I'm guessing the Gardaí involved are all paid up with their GRA subs' and will have their full support. I'm guessing in due course out GardaCommissioner will give her blessings & authorise this behaviour also.
    A line was well & truly crossed, but wait for it now, all will be just fine for these full-time Gardaí involved.

    This is not Garda-bashing, this is stating the obvious facts.

    Give this time,
    All will be well again for these full-timers,
    kerry4sam

    Does carrying around that chip for so long not get uncomfortable?


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,476 ✭✭✭ardmacha


    I think the fact that the yes campaign are willing to impugn the independence of Gardai, and are not apologetic, says a lot about the tenor of the campaign.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,463 ✭✭✭marienbad


    ardmacha wrote: »
    I think the fact that the yes campaign are willing to impugn the independence of Gardai, and are not apologetic, says a lot about the tenor of the campaign.

    is it not the no campaign that is doing that ?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,476 ✭✭✭ardmacha


    marienbad wrote: »
    is it not the no campaign that is doing that ?

    The no campaign have complained about it, not caused it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,463 ✭✭✭marienbad


    ardmacha wrote: »
    The no campaign have complained about it, not caused it.

    The No side are doing it also ! So it is ok for them but not the other side ?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,810 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    Because that's the kind of thing community Gardaí do.

    What, advocate on behalf of a certain side in a referendum?
    Like how they go to old folks homes to sign forms for the elderly.

    Would they suggest that a person in the old folks home sign up to Sky or UPC?
    You say you are not attaching your own conclusions to the picture but you are.

    The photocall was organised by Yes Equality,
    The judge present was advocating a yes
    ..... and the hapless garda was being used by them.

    That is the bare facts. there is no conclusion to deduce from this.
    In one picture you are deciding that a Gardas location is a direct endorsement of that group even though all she has done is sign and stamp forms.
    • Organised by Yes side.
    • 2 People in the photo. 1 from the Yes side.
    • 1 person representing the Gardai

    And all she's there for is to sign and stamp a couple of forms!!
    You have decided that it means something.

    It must mean something, otherwise why would Yes Equality have requested her to do it? Were they just randomly walking around the city and happened upon a guard and asked them to partake in their civic duties??
    Just like in the first photo, you have decided that the Garda is endorsing one side simply because the person with her is a Yes campaigner for one of the referenda.

    I haven't decided that, that is the message that is being presented.
    Organised by Yes
    Supported by Yes person
    But don't forget to vote whatever way you decide.

    That is a conclusion you have attached to the photo. There is nothing political in the photo at all.

    So you're saying that there is absolutely no promotion of a Yes vote in that photo at all?

    You'd wonder why they bothered to organise it so.
    And of course Yes Equality aren't using it for political ends either, no?
    yesequality.ie/judge-catherine-mcguinness-urges-voters-to-register-before-deadline/

    Also, the commissioner is a woman.
    You are correct on that


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,810 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    conorh91 wrote: »
    I said, "one of those referenda".

    There will be two referenda. I have no idea how the former Supreme Court Judge will vote in the referendum regarding age for eligibility to the candidacy of the Presidency of Ireland.

    So you do have an idea how the supreme court Judge will vote in the other one then?

    It's public knowledge anyway. So i may as well tell you the judge is an advocate of a Yes vote. Invited by Yes Equality to take part in a photocall to promote a yes vote.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,947 ✭✭✭20Cent


    Never heard such whinging and moaning about trivial nonsense as from the no side in this referendum.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,801 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    Its mad to see otherwise sensible fellow yes voters so willfully blind to something like this. You cannot have uniformed public servants publicly involved in anything organised by one side of a referendum/election campaign. It would be laughable if it weren't so sinister.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,476 ✭✭✭ardmacha


    marienbad wrote: »
    The No side are doing it also ! So it is ok for them but not the other side ?

    If there is a picture of a Garda with no badges on her table, then that is just as bad. However, up to this point I haven't seen such a picture.
    20Cent wrote:
    Never heard such whinging and moaning about trivial nonsense as from the no side in this referendum.

    They should put a big yes on the side of Garda cars, and give those people interested in fair procedure whiners something to really complain about.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 11,810 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    20Cent wrote: »
    Never heard such whinging and moaning about trivial nonsense as from the no side in this referendum.

    If you think the topic is about the no or yes side then youre being misled.

    Whether the photo call was organised by the yes or no side is moot. The issue is that a member of the gardai was being used by one side.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,059 ✭✭✭✭osarusan


    It would be laughable if it weren't so sinister.

    Nothing 'sinister' about it. What an exaggeration.

    One police officer seemed to endorse the Yes campaign. We don't even know if it wasn't just an oversight on her part. The Gardai have said publicly and officially it was something that shouldn't have happened.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,801 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    osarusan wrote: »
    Nothing 'sinister' about it. What an exaggeration.

    One police officer seemed to endorse the Yes campaign. We don't even know if it wasn't just an oversight on her part. The Gardai have said publicly and officially it was something that shouldn't have happened.
    Oh no, I can accept that this was an oversight on the part of the officer involved, what's sinister is all the usually right-on yes voters saying this is grand nothing to see here! The right thing to do is to say - this is wrong, it shouldn't have happened, much like the gardai are saying. Instead you have people actually defending and attempting to legitimise it. It's a dangerous precedent and one I'm not ok with especially when it tarnishes the side I'm actually in favour of.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,457 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    Gebgbegb wrote: »
    Whether the photo call was organised by the yes or no side is moot. The issue is that a member of the gardai was being used by one side.

    To validate voter registration forms as is their job. If the no camp wanted to run a voter registration push then the Gardai would be sitting with them as well.

    Funnily the no camp aren't pushing for voter registration, why is that?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,801 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    gandalf wrote: »
    To validate voter registration forms as is their job. If the no camp wanted to run a voter registration push then the Gardai would be sitting with them as well.

    Funnily the no camp aren't pushing for voter registration, why is that?
    It is not their job to appear uniformed in photoshoots with members of s particular campaign.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,624 ✭✭✭Little CuChulainn


    Its mad to see otherwise sensible fellow yes voters so willfully blind to something like this. You cannot have uniformed public servants publicly involved in anything organised by one side of a referendum/election campaign. It would be laughable if it weren't so sinister.

    But it's already been posted that they've been involved in events organised by both sides as well as neutral events, anywhere they were required for voter registration. People are making an issue out of a couple of photos to suit their own agenda, nothing more.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,295 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    It is not their job to appear uniformed in photoshoots with members of s particular campaign.

    Do you not think that maybe the guard didn't know who this woman was and what her stance is? Maybe she just thought this was a photo shoot to promote voter registration (a good thing) and therefore posed for the picture. Either way I hope she doesn't get into trouble over this as I think she is probably innocent of any malice.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,624 ✭✭✭Little CuChulainn


    Do you not think that maybe the guard didn't know who this woman was and what her stance is? Maybe she just thought this was a photo shoot to promote voter registration (a good thing) and therefore posed for the picture. Either way I hope she doesn't get into trouble over this as I think she is probably innocent of any malice.

    http://www.avclub.com/article/police-officer-forced-counseling-taking-photo-snoo-217389

    It's getting more like the States every day. More concern about PR than real issues. At the end of the day, none of these Gardaí have broken any rules so the only thing that will possibly arise out of this is more rules restricting community engagement.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,673 ✭✭✭AudreyHepburn


    I wish I could say this kind of thing surprises me but sadly it doesn't in the slightest.

    It seems that nowadays no matter what the Gardai do some people have such serious chips on their shoulders, and usually not for any valid reason, that they will use any and all excuses to try and vilify them.

    Are the Gardai not allowed to take sides in a referendum now? Are they not citizens, not part of the electorate? Are they allowed to encourage people to vote in general? If not why and since when because this is completely new to me if it is the case.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,947 ✭✭✭20Cent


    The more people who vote the better. If the Gardai can help with events to encourage people to register then it is a good use of their time. It would be a sad precident if a university or any organisation won't be able to run events like that due to whinging from one side or the other.
    The no side are free to organise their own events. They don't seem interested in getting young people out to vote because most of them are yes voters. The no side have spent their campaign discussing anything but why they don't want gay marriage because they have no good argument. This is another example of that.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,457 ✭✭✭✭gandalf


    It is not their job to appear uniformed in photoshoots with members of s particular campaign.

    But the photo shoot was publicising an event encouraging people to register to vote?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,801 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    I wish I could say this kind of thing surprises me but sadly it doesn't in the slightest.

    It seems that nowadays no matter what the Gardai do some people have such serious chips on their shoulders, and usually not for any valid reason, that they will use any and all excuses to try and vilify them.

    Are the Gardai not allowed to take sides in a referendum now? Are they not citizens, not part of the electorate? Are they allowed to encourage people to vote in general? If not why and since when because this is completely new to me if it is the case.
    I'm not vilifying the gardai, I think this particular garda made an error of judgement and the garda press office have said as much. Gardai are of course citizens but when in uniform they represent the state which is the whole reason why they actually wear uniforms, this garda was in uniform as as such was manifestly not acting in her private capacity as a citizen. I would be equally unimpressed if David Quinn and his goons had a photo op with a group of sexy firemen but I will admit that is somewhat unlikely.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,801 ✭✭✭✭suicide_circus


    gandalf wrote: »
    But the photo shoot was publicising an event encouraging people to register to vote?
    On paper yes but in reality it was organised by the yes campaign which is why the gardai themselves have said it wasnt kosher


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,365 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    ...

    Are the Gardai not allowed to take sides in a referendum now? Are they not citizens, not part of the electorate? Are they allowed to encourage people to vote in general? If not why and since when because this is completely new to me if it is the case.

    No they are not allowed to take sides. they are meant to be apolitical. what they do in their private life is up to them. once they put the uniform on then the rules change


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,295 ✭✭✭✭Timberrrrrrrr


    Gardai will have to make a rule now that no guard can have their picture taken in public while wearing their uniform in case the person it's taken with has some affiliation with a political party or agenda.


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 6,113 ✭✭✭shruikan2553


    Gardai will have to make a rule now that no guard can have their picture taken in public while wearing their uniform in case the person it's taken with has some affiliation with a political party or agenda.

    They are often attending water protests. Apolitical my hole!


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