Ryanair Collision..Again

fr336 · 02-04-2015 12:14AM

Carnacalla wrote: »

Let's ignore all the obvious facts that we have seen and say well Ryanair is not a safe airline, EI, BA and the rest are!

It's just an ongoing fashion to hate on FR, people go in herds.

Tenger · 02-04-2015 12:29AM

In regard to the FR internal notices, I assume they did issue such, I can't believe they would not. I would love to see how the two locations compare. Early morning ex-DUB is very hectic, would love to know the lead up to the incident, and how it happened again.

strettyend wrote: »

...................Well for what its worth I am perfectly entitled to my opinion as you are yours as I'm sure your aware. Since your such an expert on aviation I would gladly like to hear the proof Ryanair are technically safer than Aer Lingus and British airways ? As a matter of interest Aer Lingus have been flying 80 odd years and have an excellent safety record........

As posted above, FR have 1600 flights per day, we have 3 incidents of ground collision in the last 6 months (I think it is 3? BCN was a couple of years ago?)
I think that the CIA incident is their only 'written off' aircraft in 25 years of operation. Statistically speaking Ryanair have an excellent safety record. This is fact, rather than media influenced perception.
You are entitled to your opinion, however you must also be able to back up that opinon with personal experience and/or facts. Safety and customer service are two very different things.

Tenger · 02-04-2015 12:31AM

Kangoo Man wrote: »

It would make you wonder what kind of pilots Ryanair are employing, when for the second time, they crash a relatively small aircraft (737), on a relatively empty taxi way at the start of the runway (not near departure gates)...

It is 100% pilot error, ATC only give direction, they're not driving/flying the plane...

Airline bashing with no basis in reality.....this incident while headline grabbing in Ireland is a tiny statistic in the scale of FR operations EU wide every day of the year.

strettyend · 02-04-2015 12:34AM

fr336 wrote: »

I don't love any airline or business, I just expect a fair throw of the dice which you're clearly not interested in. There are no suggestions that we know of - none - that FR aren't any less than 100% safe and right up there with the top fleet of airlines (indeed many of their contemporaries lag behind them in many areas)
You claim I love FR, I say you have an agenda.

I don't love any aerlines? username fr 336? I don't have any agenda with Ryanair whatsoever. My choice of airlines is aerlingus and I makes no bones about that. Reason been I have flown with them for the last 25 odd years and always found them to be friendly , courterous and very helpful. Even you could not defend Ryanair on that point and until recently their customer service was appaling with very poor reviews from customers.

fr336 · 02-04-2015 12:37AM

strettyend wrote: »

I don't love any aerlines? username fr 336? I don't have any agenda with Ryanair whatsoever. My choice of airlines is aerlingus and I makes no bones about that. Reason been I have flown with them for the last 25 odd years and always found them to be friendly , courterous and very helpful. Even you could not defend Ryanair on that point and until recently their customer service was appaling with very poor reviews from customers.

Slating their customer service is very different to picking holes in their safety record. You didn't even do that, though, you just went off on one with no basis in reality and made out it was a matter of fact that FR's safety record was becoming worrying.

Username is due to the flight route I use most often, not a lot of thought was put into it. I don't spend too much time having a love in with an airline and bashing up its rivals.

JCX BXC · 02-04-2015 12:52AM

How long till the IAA report from the October incident comes out?

Strumms · 02-04-2015 12:53AM

fr336 wrote: »

It's just an ongoing fashion to hate on FR, people go in herds.

In fairness, and you should know this but FR low fares and industry changers aside have given enough provocation, ammunition and incentive either rightly or wrongly for certain elements to jump on their backs and criticise, for the most part FR have themselves to blame and I have no sympathy. Well maybe kinda from the point of view that the media as regards reporting on aviation is akin to a blind man commentating on darts but that's another argument.

I generally loathe the BS that goes on masked as some sort of discussion in terms of these incidents. The IAA will investigate and that's what will happen, anyone bull****ting re: tower culpability vs flight crew vs poor taxiway layout etc... Either way, cocks back in who cares who is right if some concensus of correctiveness can be achieved that just makes it safer and minimises this sort of thing happening... It could be a combination of recommendations or changes that need to be implemented by FR, the DAA the tower folks or some combination of the above.

Cessna_Pilot · 02-04-2015 07:52AM

strettyend wrote: »

Why should my post be removed? is it because I don't have the same love in with Ryanair as you obviously do? Well for what its worth I am perfectly entitled to my opinion as you are yours as im sure your aware. Since your such an expert on aviation I would gladly like to hear the proof Ryanair are technically safer than aerlingus and british airways ? As a matter of interest aerlingus have been flying 80 odd years and have an excellent safety record . I know who I personally feel safer flying with . Perhaps this post should be removed because of that last sentence too !!

A quick entry of various airline names into the search box on www.avherald.com will help you out.

02-04-2015 08:38AM

Carnacalla wrote: »

How long till the IAA report from the October incident comes out?

The IAA don't issue reports, the AAIU a completely separate and independent unit do.

The answer is, when it's ready, usually a year later if workload allows.

roundymac · 02-04-2015 10:14AM

fr336 wrote: »

The public as uninformed as ever then. And the DHL comparison - how many movements do DHL have over Europe all day, daily.

The public however are the ones that buy tickets, they will be worried by some thing they don't understand.

Kangoo Man · 02-04-2015 11:08AM

Tenger wrote: »

Airline bashing with no basis in reality.....this incident while headline grabbing in Ireland is a tiny statistic in the scale of FR operations EU wide every day of the year.

I'm not airline bashing, I happen to be very proud of Ryanair as an Irish airline and one of the biggest low cost carriers in the world.

But you have to admit that 2 taxi-way crashes within 6 months in the same airport would make you question the experience of the pilots involved...

MoeJay · 02-04-2015 12:04PM

It could also point to deficiencies in taxiway infrastructure when used in conjunction with the dual runway operations that are in use in Dublin in the morning such that the risk of such a collision occurring is raised.

This, however, does not absolve the pilot in command from either refusing a clearance to mitigate such a risk or manoeuvring the aircraft in such a manner so as to similarly mitigate the risk (i.e. not moving onto taxiway A until you are certain you are clear from traffic on F1) Pilots are ultimately responsible for their own wingtip clearances at all stages regardless of ATC procedures/clearances/instructions.

Comment: - Dual Runway Ops 28/34 was instigated probably as a direct result from the airlines clamouring about the delays experienced by their departures between 0630-0800 local. This is a commercial imperative driving an operational decision.

In that sense it is conceivable that a crew who are able to depart off 34 and not be subject to a delay by using 28 may be inclined to move with more rapidity in the knowledge they will be airborne sooner (and consequently either be on time or early, as opposed to being late which brings on itself further operational pressure.) The context in which dual runway ops are conducted is inclined to shift the crew focus from merely getting airborne to getting airborne more rapidly. This is a general comment and is not directly aimed at this incident.

Lustrum · 02-04-2015 08:54PM

Kangoo Man wrote: »

But you have to admit that 2 taxi-way crashes within 6 months in the same airport would make you question the experience of the pilots involved...

Does anyone know if both captain and f/o are allowed taxi in Ryanair? I'm almost certain in Stobart that it's forbidden for f/o's to taxi, which could rule out the questioning of the experience levels on the flight deck

duskyjoe · 02-04-2015 09:08PM

B737 you can only taxi from LHS.

02-04-2015 09:34PM

fr336 wrote: »

It's just an ongoing fashion to hate on FR, people go in herds.

Most who complain about Ryanair have never actually been given a reason directly by Ryanair to hate them, indeed many you see onine have never even flown them. How in that case you can complain about Ryanair is beyond me. A good number of the stories you read about have been hyped up by the writer to get a reaction and get their 2 seconds of fame. Indeed many stories in papers have a mere thinge of truth and again are hammed up to sell papers.

Accidents happen this is the equivalent of hitting another cars mirror in very slow moving traffic indeed one lane is stopped as you are moving passed to turn at the junction.

eatmyshorts · 02-04-2015 10:41PM

duskyjoe wrote: »

B737 you can only taxi from LHS.

Its a buyers option. BA 737s can be taxied from either side.

Alaba320 · 02-04-2015 11:34PM

Lustrum wrote: »

Does anyone know if both captain and f/o are allowed taxi in Ryanair? I'm almost certain in Stobart that it's forbidden for f/o's to taxi, which could rule out the questioning of the experience levels on the flight deck

Ryanair's 737s only have a tiller on the left side. As far as I know ATRs only have 1 tiller also.

APM · 03-04-2015 04:48AM

eatmyshorts wrote: »

Its a buyers option. BA 737s can be taxied from either side.

Lufthansa 737's also, KLM and Transavia have them on their NG. There is quite a few airlines. Costs extra though. You won't find a hand-mic on the RHS either on a FR 737.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/263112/M/
http://www.jetphotos.net/viewphoto.php?id=220480

MoeJay · 03-04-2015 12:47PM

Meanwhile, new procedures are on the way (if not in already) that all departures during dual runway ops will enter either runway via E1...

smurfjed · 10-04-2015 03:44PM

http://www.aaiu.ie/sites/default/files/report-attachments/Preliminary%20Report%202015-005.pdf

Preliminary report was just issued.

A Dub in Glasgo · 10-04-2015 04:04PM

basill · 11-04-2015 02:20PM

Must say hats off to FR. Much shorter taxi times coming off R10 into T2 now we have to vacate at the end. Shame we can't taxi straight down the bravos though on the way out but maybe one day:)

Chuck Aaron · 11-04-2015 03:27PM

fr336 wrote: »

It's just an ongoing fashion to hate on FR, people go in herds.

People dislike Ryanair because of the crap customer service from the day they started to, eh now.

Tis no big secret lads.

billie1b · 11-04-2015 05:21PM

Chuck Aaron wrote: »

People dislike Ryanair because of the crap customer service from the day they started to, eh now.

Tis no big secret lads.

Never experienced crap customer service from Ryanair, but then again I did follow all the rules and didn't treat the staff like shít or take my problems out in them (if I was having any). As with every flight I get on, I board, take my seat, put in my earphones and just relax, most times get a coffee aswell. Since 1999 when I first start flying with them I never had a problem and the service was always fine, couple of delayed flights with the old 200's but its not the staffs fault

Chuck Aaron · 11-04-2015 05:37PM

billie1b wrote: »

Never experienced crap customer service from Ryanair,

You're the 1 in the billion then aren't you bill.

Lucky you.

galwayjohn89 · 11-04-2015 05:39PM

Chuck Aaron wrote: »

You're the 1 in the billion then aren't you bill.

Lucky you.

I don't know anyone who actually genuinely has a reason to complain about Ryanair (as in know personally). Yes a few of my mates bash Ryanair but they're never really that serious. Amongst my friends we'd all chose Ryanair ahead of Aer Lingus.

Chuck Aaron · 11-04-2015 05:41PM

Vuzuggu wrote: »

I don't know anyone who actually genuinely has a reason to complain about Ryanair (as in know personally). Yes a few of my mates bash Ryanair but they're never really that serious. Amongst my friends we'd all chose Ryanair ahead of Aer Lingus.

That's great news.

11-04-2015 05:45PM

Chuck Aaron wrote: »

You're the 1 in the billion then aren't you bill.

Lucky you.

Myself and immediate family and friends have all been flying with them years, and no one I know has ever had any issue with them either.

I find the people who have issue with Ryanair are the ones with the 'ah sure it'll be grand' attitude when it comes to slightly bending the rules (which, as the dogs on the street know, Ryanair don't allow).

Chuck Aaron · 11-04-2015 05:53PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Myself and immediate family and friends have all been flying with them years, and no one I know has ever had any issue with them either.

I find the people who have issue with Ryanair are the ones with the 'ah sure it'll be grand' attitude when it comes to slightly bending the rules (which, as the dogs on the street know, Ryanair don't allow).

Wouldn't it be mad altogether if people who have an issue with Ryanair think the people who don't have an issue with Ryanair haven't a bulls notion altogether.

Funny ole world we live in KKV.

sjb25 · 11-04-2015 06:48PM

Chuck Aaron wrote: »

You're the 1 in the billion then aren't you bill.

Lucky you.

Must be 2 of us in that billion never a problem with Ryanair at all

Ryanair Collision..Again

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